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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
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On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:20 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 14 2024 03:14 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 02:17 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 13 2024 18:11 BlackJack wrote:On September 13 2024 15:13 Fleetfeet wrote:
[quote]
Not really, because the "They're eating cats" came from random facebook, which was then picked up and repeated by republican talking heads. The mayor and sheriff of bumfuck Ohio both indicated that it wasn't an actual issue that was actually happening, and was fabricated.
That's what makes the republicans look like they're disgruntled racists. They were so excited that black people were finally doing something abhorrent that they forgot to fact-check that it was actually happening, first. They just assumed it was actually happening because OF COURSE IT WOULD.
Hopefully that explains the difference between those for you. So if Trump and other Republicans said immigrants in NYC were eating cats would that then mean that people in this thread would argue a) NYC actually didn't receive a large influx of immigrants because their population has remained steady b) There aren't any significant problems with the (non-existent) large influx and c) NYC Mayor Eric Adam's is retroactively made a racist for his comments that migrants are destroying NYC? Are you asking me 'if a different thing happened, would people other than you argue differently?' What does that question do other than highlight the extreme levels of whataboutism you're throwing at this? Just trying to make sense of your point. My question was why were people denying that Springfield received a large influx of Haitian migrants and there are problems related to that that have nothing to do with race. Your response is essentially because Trump and others said people are eating cats. I just don’t see how Trumps statements changes reality on the ground for whether Springfield Ohio is dealing with legitimate problems or not. My point is that the chain of information that resulted in "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" was a far cry from an NYC mayor saying there were issues with migration. I'm not questioning the validity of Springfield's issues. I'm questioning how quickly we got to "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" and how that path is anything other than racist. Saying "What about the NYC mayor?" doesn't do anything because we didn't hear about this from Springfield's mayor. We didn't hear about this from a credible source, the news feed started with a facebook post and was picked up by some idiots, then made its way to a former president. DPB (I think?) posted sources for 'eating pets' being a hoax even before the debate. oBlade's source says the AG was critical of 'media' for not using all the sources available to them, and ends with a statement that the mayor said there were no credible reports. If Republicans were interested in pointing to an immigration issue and not being racist about it, I'm sure they could have figured that out. Instead, they picked up a story about someone in Ohio eating some geese and turned it into many hatian migrants eating cats and dogs. You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face. If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. Show nested quote +On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies.
Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching.
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I'm highly confused right now. I can't find confirmation that Springfield, Ohio has seen a population increase in the last four years. Quite the opposite, it still seems to be slightly declining (although much less than over several decades). It used to have a population of over 70 000 and is at risk of dipping below 58 000.
Am I mistaking the city in this discussion with a different one, or is the following source false?
https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/springfield-oh-population-by-year
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On September 14 2024 05:31 Magic Powers wrote:I'm highly confused right now. I can't find confirmation that Springfield, Ohio has seen a population increase in the last four years. Quite the opposite, it still seems to be slightly declining (although much less than over several decades). It used to have a population of over 70 000 and is at risk of dipping below 58 000. Am I mistaking the city in this discussion with a different one, or is the following source false? https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/springfield-oh-population-by-year
The method probably has a blindspot, maybe between censuses they're just adding births and subtracting deaths. Not a single word on that page was typed by a human, it's all templates and scraped data.
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On September 14 2024 05:31 Magic Powers wrote:I'm highly confused right now. I can't find confirmation that Springfield, Ohio has seen a population increase in the last four years. Quite the opposite, it still seems to be slightly declining (although much less than over several decades). It used to have a population of over 70 000 and is at risk of dipping below 58 000. Am I mistaking the city in this discussion with a different one, or is the following source false? https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/springfield-oh-population-by-year
You know that both can be true at once right? The population of Springfield can be declining, but would be declining faster if not for an influx of immigrants.
Anyway, you also can't read, apparently:
In 2023, the population of Springfield was 58,082, a 0.02% increase year-by-year from 2022
Not that a 0.02% increase should give a serious problem. Maybe in medical facilities if the doctors are leaving or so, but not in road usage or even schools. That said, this can't be census data, because the last census was in 2020, so that website is extrapolating something somehow and that extrapolation could just be plain wrong, and Springfield is actually going through a population boom. The mayor and governor definitely seems to think so, and I'd trust an interview with him over some random website.
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On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:20 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 14 2024 03:14 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 02:17 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 13 2024 18:11 BlackJack wrote:
[quote]
So if Trump and other Republicans said immigrants in NYC were eating cats would that then mean that people in this thread would argue a) NYC actually didn't receive a large influx of immigrants because their population has remained steady b) There aren't any significant problems with the (non-existent) large influx and c) NYC Mayor Eric Adam's is retroactively made a racist for his comments that migrants are destroying NYC?
Are you asking me 'if a different thing happened, would people other than you argue differently?' What does that question do other than highlight the extreme levels of whataboutism you're throwing at this? Just trying to make sense of your point. My question was why were people denying that Springfield received a large influx of Haitian migrants and there are problems related to that that have nothing to do with race. Your response is essentially because Trump and others said people are eating cats. I just don’t see how Trumps statements changes reality on the ground for whether Springfield Ohio is dealing with legitimate problems or not. My point is that the chain of information that resulted in "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" was a far cry from an NYC mayor saying there were issues with migration. I'm not questioning the validity of Springfield's issues. I'm questioning how quickly we got to "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" and how that path is anything other than racist. Saying "What about the NYC mayor?" doesn't do anything because we didn't hear about this from Springfield's mayor. We didn't hear about this from a credible source, the news feed started with a facebook post and was picked up by some idiots, then made its way to a former president. DPB (I think?) posted sources for 'eating pets' being a hoax even before the debate. oBlade's source says the AG was critical of 'media' for not using all the sources available to them, and ends with a statement that the mayor said there were no credible reports. If Republicans were interested in pointing to an immigration issue and not being racist about it, I'm sure they could have figured that out. Instead, they picked up a story about someone in Ohio eating some geese and turned it into many hatian migrants eating cats and dogs. You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face. If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching.
Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to.
@MP
A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates.
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/
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On September 14 2024 05:49 Dan HH wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 05:31 Magic Powers wrote:I'm highly confused right now. I can't find confirmation that Springfield, Ohio has seen a population increase in the last four years. Quite the opposite, it still seems to be slightly declining (although much less than over several decades). It used to have a population of over 70 000 and is at risk of dipping below 58 000. Am I mistaking the city in this discussion with a different one, or is the following source false? https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/springfield-oh-population-by-year The method probably has a blindspot, maybe between censuses they're just adding births and subtracting deaths. Not a single word on that page was typed by a human, it's all templates and scraped data.
Ok, so at least I got the city correct? I'm not mistaken about that?
This data looks official to me:
https://datausa.io/profile/geo/springfield-oh/
It states that from 2021 to 2022 there has been a population decline of 0.588%
That is not congruent with the information that it has increased. Every single source that I can find shows a continuous decrease until 2024.
So someone is lying. I don't know who's the liar, but someone is a liar.
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On September 14 2024 05:57 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 05:49 Dan HH wrote:On September 14 2024 05:31 Magic Powers wrote:I'm highly confused right now. I can't find confirmation that Springfield, Ohio has seen a population increase in the last four years. Quite the opposite, it still seems to be slightly declining (although much less than over several decades). It used to have a population of over 70 000 and is at risk of dipping below 58 000. Am I mistaking the city in this discussion with a different one, or is the following source false? https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/springfield-oh-population-by-year The method probably has a blindspot, maybe between censuses they're just adding births and subtracting deaths. Not a single word on that page was typed by a human, it's all templates and scraped data. Ok, so at least I got the city correct? I'm not mistaken about that? This data looks official to me: https://datausa.io/profile/geo/springfield-oh/It states that from 2021 to 2022 there has been a population decline of 0.588% That is not congruent with the information that it has increased. Every single source that I can find shows a continuous decrease until 2024. So someone is lying. I don't know who's the liar, but someone is a liar.
If you think this is a population decrease you should see the census of cats and ducks.
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On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:20 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 14 2024 03:14 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 02:17 Fleetfeet wrote:
[quote]
Are you asking me 'if a different thing happened, would people other than you argue differently?'
What does that question do other than highlight the extreme levels of whataboutism you're throwing at this? Just trying to make sense of your point. My question was why were people denying that Springfield received a large influx of Haitian migrants and there are problems related to that that have nothing to do with race. Your response is essentially because Trump and others said people are eating cats. I just don’t see how Trumps statements changes reality on the ground for whether Springfield Ohio is dealing with legitimate problems or not. My point is that the chain of information that resulted in "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" was a far cry from an NYC mayor saying there were issues with migration. I'm not questioning the validity of Springfield's issues. I'm questioning how quickly we got to "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" and how that path is anything other than racist. Saying "What about the NYC mayor?" doesn't do anything because we didn't hear about this from Springfield's mayor. We didn't hear about this from a credible source, the news feed started with a facebook post and was picked up by some idiots, then made its way to a former president. DPB (I think?) posted sources for 'eating pets' being a hoax even before the debate. oBlade's source says the AG was critical of 'media' for not using all the sources available to them, and ends with a statement that the mayor said there were no credible reports. If Republicans were interested in pointing to an immigration issue and not being racist about it, I'm sure they could have figured that out. Instead, they picked up a story about someone in Ohio eating some geese and turned it into many hatian migrants eating cats and dogs. You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face. If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP Show nested quote +A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/
Thanks for the source!
It states:
"What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently."
This doesn't look like a crisis to me, more like the opposite.
Furthermore:
"In early July, days before he was tapped to be Trump's running mate, Vance read aloud a letter from Springfield officials as he quizzed Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell at a congressional hearing on whether immigration added to inflation by increasing housing costs, and whether a rising supply of new workers hurt others by holding down wages.
What was happening in Springfield was "a very real example of this particular concern, straight from the horse's mouth," Vance said.
Powell responded that those effects might be apparent in some places, but overall the rising labor supply in recent years had helped grow the economy and slow inflation. And in the long run, he said, the impact was "kind of neutral" because markets adapt."
And the article continues with the allegations of crime such as cat eating etc.
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On September 14 2024 06:03 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:20 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 14 2024 03:14 BlackJack wrote:
[quote]
Just trying to make sense of your point. My question was why were people denying that Springfield received a large influx of Haitian migrants and there are problems related to that that have nothing to do with race. Your response is essentially because Trump and others said people are eating cats. I just don’t see how Trumps statements changes reality on the ground for whether Springfield Ohio is dealing with legitimate problems or not.
My point is that the chain of information that resulted in "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" was a far cry from an NYC mayor saying there were issues with migration. I'm not questioning the validity of Springfield's issues. I'm questioning how quickly we got to "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" and how that path is anything other than racist. Saying "What about the NYC mayor?" doesn't do anything because we didn't hear about this from Springfield's mayor. We didn't hear about this from a credible source, the news feed started with a facebook post and was picked up by some idiots, then made its way to a former president. DPB (I think?) posted sources for 'eating pets' being a hoax even before the debate. oBlade's source says the AG was critical of 'media' for not using all the sources available to them, and ends with a statement that the mayor said there were no credible reports. If Republicans were interested in pointing to an immigration issue and not being racist about it, I'm sure they could have figured that out. Instead, they picked up a story about someone in Ohio eating some geese and turned it into many hatian migrants eating cats and dogs. You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face. If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/ Thanks for the source! It states: "What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently." This doesn't look like a crisis to me, more like the opposite.
Right, it all looks good when you cherry pick out one paragraph and ignore the 2 previous paragraphs of the article
"Enrollment in Medicaid and federal food assistance and welfare programs surged. So did rents and vehicle accidents, including a collision last year when a Haitian without a U.S. driver's license drove into a school bus, killing 11-year-old Aiden Clark and injuring 26 other children.
The number of affordable housing vouchers fell as landlords moved to market-based rents that were rising in the face of higher demand, a blow to existing residents relying on them."
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On September 14 2024 05:57 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 05:49 Dan HH wrote:On September 14 2024 05:31 Magic Powers wrote:I'm highly confused right now. I can't find confirmation that Springfield, Ohio has seen a population increase in the last four years. Quite the opposite, it still seems to be slightly declining (although much less than over several decades). It used to have a population of over 70 000 and is at risk of dipping below 58 000. Am I mistaking the city in this discussion with a different one, or is the following source false? https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/springfield-oh-population-by-year The method probably has a blindspot, maybe between censuses they're just adding births and subtracting deaths. Not a single word on that page was typed by a human, it's all templates and scraped data. Ok, so at least I got the city correct? I'm not mistaken about that? This data looks official to me: https://datausa.io/profile/geo/springfield-oh/It states that from 2021 to 2022 there has been a population decline of 0.588% That is not congruent with the information that it has increased. Every single source that I can find shows a continuous decrease until 2024. So someone is lying. I don't know who's the liar, but someone is a liar.
It's not exactly lying. The millions of pages of stats on these data websites are automatically generated and updated using scraping and formulas that are "good enough" in general but don't do well with edge cases.
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Sounds like on the whole, there were some negative impacts and some positive impacts. Easy to argue that with the increase in jobs and wealth generation you can mitigate or even eliminate the negative impacts you have highlighted, so saying that Springfield will benefit from immigration is not an outrageous thing to posit.
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On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:20 Fleetfeet wrote:On September 14 2024 03:14 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 02:17 Fleetfeet wrote:
[quote]
Are you asking me 'if a different thing happened, would people other than you argue differently?'
What does that question do other than highlight the extreme levels of whataboutism you're throwing at this? Just trying to make sense of your point. My question was why were people denying that Springfield received a large influx of Haitian migrants and there are problems related to that that have nothing to do with race. Your response is essentially because Trump and others said people are eating cats. I just don’t see how Trumps statements changes reality on the ground for whether Springfield Ohio is dealing with legitimate problems or not. My point is that the chain of information that resulted in "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" was a far cry from an NYC mayor saying there were issues with migration. I'm not questioning the validity of Springfield's issues. I'm questioning how quickly we got to "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" and how that path is anything other than racist. Saying "What about the NYC mayor?" doesn't do anything because we didn't hear about this from Springfield's mayor. We didn't hear about this from a credible source, the news feed started with a facebook post and was picked up by some idiots, then made its way to a former president. DPB (I think?) posted sources for 'eating pets' being a hoax even before the debate. oBlade's source says the AG was critical of 'media' for not using all the sources available to them, and ends with a statement that the mayor said there were no credible reports. If Republicans were interested in pointing to an immigration issue and not being racist about it, I'm sure they could have figured that out. Instead, they picked up a story about someone in Ohio eating some geese and turned it into many hatian migrants eating cats and dogs. You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face. If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP Show nested quote +A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/
You're to blame because you keep bringing up crazy conspiracy theories that have no basis in reality and make no sense. Randomly poping off about how you associate immigration with a very speficic minority and criminality you associate with that minority isn't a conductive way to go about a conversation. You didn't need to start biteing in a bizzare direction you could have just continued with your talk about greedflation not being real somehow. I was making an example of one politician politizing an issue in inflation with another politician politicizing an issue by yelling that a minority group was eating cats and dogs. We are talking about the situation in Springfield because white nationalists started to spread rumors about how the local Haitians were eating cats in an attempt to demonize local hatians. They used "evidence" of a black lady, who wasn't hatian and was two hours away, having a mental break involving a cat they started eating on the road. The governor of ohio, who is republican, is primarily responsible for bringing this population legally to the town and is extensively helping the situation with his charity and offical resources.
You're constantly trying to stress this massive influx of population to be an inherently bad thing and a disaster. These people are here legally and have not increased the population of the two, let alone the metro area that adults make decisions on, if you would have made a second to look up the population trend or knew anything about the problems midwest industrial towns face.
They call it the rust belt because of the massive depopulation that the area has seen in the past decades. Detriot could see an influx of a few million and benefit greatly from that with its existing infrastructure. They are knocking down houses or just giving them away because no one is around to live in them. A massive issue with Rual towns is them dieing due to young people leaving for better opportunities. These towns desperately need more population in them to help them survive and sustain the existing infrastructure in the area. Is there short term pain? Yes but the long term demographic picture, that adults use to make decisions, is wonderfully bright by any metric or study.
It would be great if we could use springfield as an example for how to handle economic migrants into this country by distributing them and providing resources for that distribution. Greg Abott isn't trafficing people it seems, it was incredibly expensive political stunt after all, but a coordinated movement of legal immigrants into the midwest would benifit the nation greatly.
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On September 14 2024 06:14 EnDeR_ wrote:
Sounds like on the whole, there were some negative impacts and some positive impacts. Easy to argue that with the increase in jobs and wealth generation you can mitigate or even eliminate the negative impacts you have highlighted, so saying that Springfield will benefit from immigration is not an outrageous thing to posit.
It's almost like some level of immigration is good and an unmitigated flow of people into the country is bad
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On September 14 2024 06:07 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 06:03 Magic Powers wrote:On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:20 Fleetfeet wrote:
[quote]
My point is that the chain of information that resulted in "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" was a far cry from an NYC mayor saying there were issues with migration.
I'm not questioning the validity of Springfield's issues. I'm questioning how quickly we got to "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" and how that path is anything other than racist. Saying "What about the NYC mayor?" doesn't do anything because we didn't hear about this from Springfield's mayor. We didn't hear about this from a credible source, the news feed started with a facebook post and was picked up by some idiots, then made its way to a former president.
DPB (I think?) posted sources for 'eating pets' being a hoax even before the debate.
oBlade's source says the AG was critical of 'media' for not using all the sources available to them, and ends with a statement that the mayor said there were no credible reports.
If Republicans were interested in pointing to an immigration issue and not being racist about it, I'm sure they could have figured that out. Instead, they picked up a story about someone in Ohio eating some geese and turned it into many hatian migrants eating cats and dogs. You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face. If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/ Thanks for the source! It states: "What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently." This doesn't look like a crisis to me, more like the opposite. Right, it all looks good when you cherry pick out one paragraph and ignore the 2 previous paragraphs of the article "Enrollment in Medicaid and federal food assistance and welfare programs surged. So did rents and vehicle accidents, including a collision last year when a Haitian without a U.S. driver's license drove into a school bus, killing 11-year-old Aiden Clark and injuring 26 other children. The number of affordable housing vouchers fell as landlords moved to market-based rents that were rising in the face of higher demand, a blow to existing residents relying on them."
Jerome Powell says that the net benefit of the migration is neutral, and I don't see why we can't take him at his word if we take everybody else at their word, too.
Can I be honest about Vance? To me it looks like the following: Vance allowed all those migrants in because he knew it'll be a net benefit to the community (or at least not a detriment). He then used that migration to push his anti-immigrants agenda by cherry-picking specific instances of crime (mouse into elephant). He does this to appeal to his racist voter block. Have his cake and eat it, too. I believe he's a two-faced snake.
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It's almost like some level of immigration is good and an unmitigated flow of people into the country is bad
Sure, but there's no government around today who would ever do that. That makes no sense, because it would ruin the country immediately. You could argue whether governments are making nonsensical moves though, but not on the scale of having an unmitigated flow of people come into your country. That's like an epic fail as a country. Why even call yourself a country at that point, your border is just makebelief.
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On September 14 2024 06:07 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 06:03 Magic Powers wrote:On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:20 Fleetfeet wrote:
[quote]
My point is that the chain of information that resulted in "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" was a far cry from an NYC mayor saying there were issues with migration.
I'm not questioning the validity of Springfield's issues. I'm questioning how quickly we got to "haitian migrants are eating people's pets" and how that path is anything other than racist. Saying "What about the NYC mayor?" doesn't do anything because we didn't hear about this from Springfield's mayor. We didn't hear about this from a credible source, the news feed started with a facebook post and was picked up by some idiots, then made its way to a former president.
DPB (I think?) posted sources for 'eating pets' being a hoax even before the debate.
oBlade's source says the AG was critical of 'media' for not using all the sources available to them, and ends with a statement that the mayor said there were no credible reports.
If Republicans were interested in pointing to an immigration issue and not being racist about it, I'm sure they could have figured that out. Instead, they picked up a story about someone in Ohio eating some geese and turned it into many hatian migrants eating cats and dogs. You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face. If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/ Thanks for the source! It states: "What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently." This doesn't look like a crisis to me, more like the opposite. Right, it all looks good when you cherry pick out one paragraph and ignore the 2 previous paragraphs of the article "Enrollment in Medicaid and federal food assistance and welfare programs surged. So did rents and vehicle accidents, including a collision last year when a Haitian without a U.S. driver's license drove into a school bus, killing 11-year-old Aiden Clark and injuring 26 other children. The number of affordable housing vouchers fell as landlords moved to market-based rents that were rising in the face of higher demand, a blow to existing residents relying on them."
Yeah a great example of the problematic nature of your posting is in that second part.
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/springfield-parents-trump-vance-stop-child-political-tool/story?id=113588136
Shortly before the ABC News presidential debate on Tuesday, the parents of a child who was killed in a bus crash caused by a Haitian immigrant in Springfield, Ohio, last year made an emotional plea for former President Donald Trump, vice presidential candidate JD Vance and others to stop using the death of their child “as a political tool.”
“They have spoken my son's name and used his death for political gain,” said Nathan Clark, who spoke at a Springfield City Commission hearing. Flanked by his wife Danielle, Clark said "My son was not murdered. He was accidentally killed by an immigrant from Haiti."
I don't want to characterize where you're getting your information but you need to take a stronger look at them and how they make you feel. If you think some level of controled migration is good you should be supporting springfield and its controlled influx of economic migrants sponsored and supported by the local government. You should be cognizant of the very real demonization of racial groups by bad actors and be appaled by a candidate that has put what normal people know are baseless racist tropes said about other migrant groups.
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On September 14 2024 06:45 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 06:07 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 06:03 Magic Powers wrote:On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:
[quote]
You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face.
If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/ Thanks for the source! It states: "What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently." This doesn't look like a crisis to me, more like the opposite. Right, it all looks good when you cherry pick out one paragraph and ignore the 2 previous paragraphs of the article "Enrollment in Medicaid and federal food assistance and welfare programs surged. So did rents and vehicle accidents, including a collision last year when a Haitian without a U.S. driver's license drove into a school bus, killing 11-year-old Aiden Clark and injuring 26 other children. The number of affordable housing vouchers fell as landlords moved to market-based rents that were rising in the face of higher demand, a blow to existing residents relying on them." Jerome Powell says that the net benefit of the migration is neutral, and I don't see why we can't take him at his word if we take everybody else at their word, too. Can I be honest about Vance? To me it looks like the following: Vance allowed all those migrants in because he knew it'll be a net benefit to the community (or at least not a detriment). He then used that migration to push his anti-immigrants agenda by cherry-picking specific instances of crime (mouse into elephant). He does this to appeal to his racist voter block. Have his cake and eat it, too. I believe he's a two-faced snake.
I'm not sure what you mean by Vance allowed them, is it up to him? The Haitians in question have the legal right to live and work in the US. One or a few of them found jobs in that town, told their friends and family that are in the US via the same program that things are good in that town and to come join them, they in turn told other friends and family, posted about it on "Haitians in the US" Facebook groups or whatever, and it snowballed.
Migrants don't uniformly disperse in their host country because it's difficult to be by yourself in a different culture with no support system, so most go to places where they already have someone and form communities.
The only thing unusual about this case is that by chance this particular snowball happened in a smaller city.
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On September 14 2024 06:45 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 06:07 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 06:03 Magic Powers wrote:On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:
[quote]
You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face.
If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/ Thanks for the source! It states: "What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently." This doesn't look like a crisis to me, more like the opposite. Right, it all looks good when you cherry pick out one paragraph and ignore the 2 previous paragraphs of the article "Enrollment in Medicaid and federal food assistance and welfare programs surged. So did rents and vehicle accidents, including a collision last year when a Haitian without a U.S. driver's license drove into a school bus, killing 11-year-old Aiden Clark and injuring 26 other children. The number of affordable housing vouchers fell as landlords moved to market-based rents that were rising in the face of higher demand, a blow to existing residents relying on them." To me it looks like the following: Vance allowed all those migrants in...
What are you referencing here? Does JD Vance have some gatekeeper powers for who gets into Ohio that I'm not aware of?
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On September 14 2024 07:32 Sermokala wrote:
I don't want to characterize where you're getting your information but you need to take a stronger look at them and how they make you feel.
I provided the source for where I copy/pasted that from. It's called Reuters. You've never heard of them?
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On September 14 2024 06:45 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 06:07 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 06:03 Magic Powers wrote:On September 14 2024 05:55 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 05:27 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 05:02 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:54 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:52 BlackJack wrote:On September 14 2024 04:35 Gorsameth wrote:On September 14 2024 04:27 BlackJack wrote:
[quote]
You just seem really fixated on the pet-eating thing whereas my question has to do with the broader discussion of how immigration is affecting the town of Springfield and people's denial of the problems they face.
If you want conclude that Springfield has had a large influx of Haitian immigrants, there are problems associated with said influx, and the problems aren't imagined just because they are black... and also Trump and others are morons then I'm happy to agree with that. It's obvious that most people in the thread seem to only want to agree with the last portion of that while sticking their head in the sand about everything else. Because the entire reason your talking about this is because of Trumps comments about illegals eating pets. The entire reason we're talking about this is because you and Serm offered the ridiculous hot take that the population of Springfield has been unchanged and I couldn't let that go. Then it just spiraled from there. So we can read the future and totally didn't know you were going to bring up illegals from Springfield? Wow, I should use this magical power to earn some money. What are you talking about? Go back and read the thread. I was in the middle of a conversation about inflation and then Serm went off a pet-eating tangent. On September 13 2024 00:49 Sermokala wrote:
Its really werid to try and "um actually" greedflation not being a real thing and a campaign prop when you have one of the candidates screaming that black people are eating dogs and cats. A bunch of the scaremongering about legal immigrants coming into Springfield is about the increased strain on public resources and housing when the population of the town hasn't increased that significantly Sermokala brought the topic up, the topic is now being discussed, and somehow I am to blame? Give me a break So it is, seems I skimmed over that. My apologies. Still an incredibly stupid thing that no one would be talking about if not for Trumps (and other Republicans) mad screeching. Yes technically true. If Trump didn't mention it at the debate there would never be a genesis to the discussion. But the discussion also never would have happened if Serm just said "Trump said immigrants are eating cats. What a moron." He had to add the claim that "the population of the town hasn't increased significantly" that I objected to. @MP A recent surge in immigration has been too fast and recent to be captured yet in population estimates. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/ Thanks for the source! It states: "What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently." This doesn't look like a crisis to me, more like the opposite. Right, it all looks good when you cherry pick out one paragraph and ignore the 2 previous paragraphs of the article "Enrollment in Medicaid and federal food assistance and welfare programs surged. So did rents and vehicle accidents, including a collision last year when a Haitian without a U.S. driver's license drove into a school bus, killing 11-year-old Aiden Clark and injuring 26 other children. The number of affordable housing vouchers fell as landlords moved to market-based rents that were rising in the face of higher demand, a blow to existing residents relying on them." Jerome Powell says that the net benefit of the migration is neutral, and I don't see why we can't take him at his word if we take everybody else at their word, too. Can I be honest about Vance? To me it looks like the following: Vance allowed all those migrants in because he knew it'll be a net benefit to the community (or at least not a detriment). He then used that migration to push his anti-immigrants agenda by cherry-picking specific instances of crime (mouse into elephant). He does this to appeal to his racist voter block. Have his cake and eat it, too. I believe he's a two-faced snake.
Nah JD vance is a two faced snake on multiple levels but this situation is much more complex than that. JD vance has never had influence to do anything. Hes a one term Senator that got parachuted in from Silicon valley who made his fame by selling out his roots by writing a book about how they're uniquely hateful and deserve the pain they go through.
Evangelical's in the US get a lot of heat for a lot of reasons but one geuine good they do in the country is charity work. They sponsor bringing in refugees and help them set up communities and assimilate into areas that have been devestated by Demographic change. Minnesota somehow is the leader in per capita reguee aceptance with the most major recent additions is the Hmong community (in a neighborhood now refered to as little mekong for how they came from the mekong delta after the vietnam war) and the newer somalian community. Governor Dewine (republican governor of Ohio) is particularly involved and is the spearhead of the Springfield community of Hatian refugees. Now you can mark them as being self interested in trying to save their local communities by providing the labor and demographic support they need to suvive but they do legitimate work to help people and are sucsessful in navigating the obvious issues that comes with setting up these communities.
JD vance is a two faced snake because hes useing a republican voteing town in a republican voteing state to exploit a situation created specifically by republican voters. Hes publically come out and said the cat eating story is not true but tells people to keep posting the memes because hes just an asshole .
On September 14 2024 07:39 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2024 07:32 Sermokala wrote:
I don't want to characterize where you're getting your information but you need to take a stronger look at them and how they make you feel. I provided the source for where I copy/pasted that from. It's called Reuters. You've never heard of them?
Where did you get the information to begin with to find that story BJ and why do you think its a positive to paint a negative light on the Hatian community in Springfield. The parents have come out publically to ask republicans to stop useing that story and their childs death as a political prop to demonize their local Hatians. Do we need to keep digging into whos responsible for the demonization initially or do you want to keep that on the down low?
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EPT
