Hi, I sing very very very very badly and never. The two are strongly related I feel (hope).
I have an abnormally tiny vocal range, starting pretty deep and ending...not far from there.
My last Singing Practice session I realised that
a) I sing badly because my vocal range is fucking tiny so I get confused when I try to sing a note that I think I should be able to sing but in actual fact I can't, so I just sing out of tune.
b) I can extend my vocal range with practice, or at least I can relax my voice in a certain way that helps me to hit a few higher notes, and I can practice those and probably get better at them and then try to increase my range.
Below I have listed the songs I compiled from Singing Practice 1 (which was like 6 months ago lol).
Note that probably all of these I can't sing many parts but they mix some achievable notes with the fact that I love the songs.
My request is that you post songs that are singable and melodic and fun that you like to sing along to. This is because I know fuck-all songs apart from the ones listed above which I spent several hours brainstorming lol.
tldr: please post some songs that you like to sing along to so i can practice singing NOTE my vocal range is low and VERY tiny but i want to practice expanding it gradually
random suggestions: i like country songs coz they are pretty low and can be really fun and funny (found this one the other day). also i like this lilly allen song Not Fair and david bowie and the cure coz i have british accent. but i like anything really except RnB
the reason i am asking for this now is because i moved into a new house and itll be empty for another few days :D
i take very strongly genetically after my father and he cant sing for SHIT either and never did except this horrible screeching to make fun of something, holy shit
Sry, clicking through theDL-site is too much of a hassle, but if your range is really deep and you like country, why not try some johnny cash? I love this song:
Singing along to songs is funny, but I think you should try singing single notes or triads (at least for warming up) and expand your range over time. Are you working on your breath, "location" of the tone and all the other stuff? That is the stuff my professional voice coach is working on with me - I'm getting lessons at my education for elementary school teacher.
nice dude. i hit C-25 with a few attempts. but generally conk out on the A-22. actually i cant get past that now lol :/ ok i can if i increase pushing power! this seems awesome to just go back and forth from like c-13 to c-25 do you know what a decent singing range is so i have an idea what im aiming for (like what note on that piano?)?
i dont know what the other stuff is , i think my range is too small to bother with anything apart from that for now.... i do sound like complete and utter crap doing in-range notes tho LOL i mean you really should hear the mp3s it is so bad.....u might tell me to just not bother
rofl i cant even bare to listen to this shit, its like im being trolled
Maybe blues / jazz would be easier for your range. Then again, the tones might be more complex and jazz doesn't come naturally to a lot of people.
Edit: I'm at around B2 - E5 on this video.. by no means have I practiced enough to be considered good... + Show Spoiler +
I'm thinking along the lines of pub chants.
Try singing along with long tones, for example just sing a C for 16 beats, then E for 16, G... Go up and down the scale, and hold each note for a long time.
Don't try to sing stuff like this yet, you're not there yet!
As you get better you'll be able to take your voice out of your throat and put it more into your mouth... if it can be described that way. This way your throat won't constrict when you sing up and down. If you feel under your jaw - where people get the double neck - above adam's apple, try singing low and high - you might notice that this part of your throat will move up and down. This is bad for the most part. Try to sing while keeping it from moving. Again start slow with long notes for practice.
You might also consider something like barbershop quartet music - sing along with the bass or baritone line. It can be tough to pick out the baritone line. You really have to listen for it at first, but you'll know when you've found it. This type of thing can also train your ear.
Wanted to mention this elephant ears technique -
When you get better you'll be able to distinguish between your "speaking voice" in singing and your "head voice." (falsetto?) I'm noticing that the more I try to filter out the head voice, the better I think I sound, because more of my actual voice is there when I'm singing. This is what makes you a good singer, if you can sing without resorting to just using the head voice for everything.
Definitely projecting your voice loud enough is a big thing to getting your voice to sound good. If there's no air, there won't be enough sound. Don't sing so loud that you strain your throat though.
So this is what I mean, maybe not head voice, but falsetto: + Show Spoiler +
Voice in the mouth is obtained when your under-jaw / throat region muscles don't move. Your range instantly improves this way, the strain in the throat is removed and you can also sing for a longer time also.
Edit: yeah, not that you shouldn't have fun and sing moderate / complex stuff, of course do that but when you're practicing you want to do something you can sing easily, like mary had a little lamb, so at least you get the sensation that you have sung an entire song, rather than tried and failed and felt frustrated and you give up. I think it's psychological more than anything. Also you will learn where a few notes are from Mary had a little Lamb rather than just going through mental overload from trying to hit notes quickly in a too-hard song.
Pick things that are not too easy, not too hard. That's where you improve the fastest. It will be tough to find that area but just practicing scales and such for now...
My vocal range isn't amazing either, but I have a really good ear and can harmonize instantly with most songs/people---did an a cappela choir for a while (vids on the internet in places but im kind of embarrassed lol)---but the one major thing I've always been kind of upset about is how basically everyone else in the choir had a larger vocal range than me and also had what was essentially a natural vibrato.
I don't have one nor do I really know how to replicate it, despite some of the videos I've watched online. I think the only thing that could improve me at this point is real singing lessons.
(I think my range on a good day is D2 - C4 ish or slightly better without falsetto)
Edit x2: I keep editing as I read through this and realize what else I want to say Regarding the head voice/speaking voice thing, supposedly people say I have a really great speaking voice but I don't hear that in my head nor do I necessarily hear it when I listen to myself. It did help me out when I used to cast (and when I stream) though
Ugh I wish I had time for vocal training
This whole post may be subtle brags or something so I'm going to spoiler it so as not to insult/annoy anyone. I feel like I'm posting it more for me for some reason.
On September 09 2014 08:21 WaveofShadow wrote: This whole post may be subtle brags or something so I'm going to spoiler it so as not to insult/annoy anyone. I feel like I'm posting it more for me for some reason.
It's how I feel about my own posting in this topic, but maybe some of it will help anyway.
Vibrato is something that comes with practice, people who sing with vibrato can also sing "straight notes" where the vibrato is removed - what remains is a steady tone.
- I can sing it decently, it is a very difficult one for me. The bit when he says "fall to pieces every time" is probably the toughest part. I'm definitely using falsetto a LOT more than Rivers does, but of course he's a badass. I think, the slower the notes change, the easier it is on your brain and voice in general. It keeps you practicing when you can sing something, maybe christmas carols would be a good thing to try to start with. That's mostly choir music - you get into vowel shapes so that you sound the same as everyone else in the choir. Or just start with the opening of a song you like, or maybe the verse. Idk, I'm no teacher
oh yeah i fuckin love the old british school hymns. we had a hymn book of like 50 of them that i took home several times but unfortunately dont have a copy anymore to extract the names.
I think trying to sing better is an admirable goal. People who practice singing a lot have clearer voices. And having a nice voice can count for a lot. It can make people more comfortable.
Edit: Just listened to a few berryz koubou songs, they sound like a good level for practice.
Interesting. I just decided to record myself a couple of times, and oh god...that was painful.
I tried singing a couple of songs both acapella and while listening to the music, and I think I sound a little bit better acapella.
I looked at that vocal range video, I can't tell if I am making the right tone or not. Perhaps I can look up some site which can tell you if you are making the right sound or not.
Also, I used to love Busted. What I Go to School For...still puts a smile on my face.
Edit: found a site where you can practice hitting certain notes. I am so tone deaf =/
wow at least i dont think im tone deaf. maybe i am lol. i feel like ive been smoking all night
cool game. yeah looks like i "search" for the notes before i hit them. also my strength of voice is clearly so weak when i try to do this game and hit single notes (maybe its because i exhausted it last night tho)
If you really want to improve in singing, I suggest if possible to find a quality vocal teacher. Trying to learn in the dark can lead to learning bad habits/techniques and usually without improvement if you don't have a music background (even if you do).
Otherwise, what I suggest for improving range is to do humming/vocal trill/lip roll exercises, there are quite a few videos of these on youtube you can follow, or you can do them yourself with a piano, eg playing the first 5 notes of a major scale up and down, and going up in key each time, or same thing with arpeggios.
There's nothing wrong with head voice and falsetto, infact, you should develop them, then bridge them and learn to also sing in mixed voice (chest+head). Your chest voice has a limit to how high it can go.
Try to have good posture, back straight, shoulders relaxed. A bad posture can really hinder you.
Other than that, any section of a song that you have trouble with, isolate it and practice it on its own. Try to find a technique for it that works. Never strain/do anything that hurts. And once again, the best thing you can do is find a quality vocal instructor.
Btw, I'm not a singer, I'm pretty awful, but these are all things I've learnt from hanging around singers and being involved in music with them, something I've left behind sadly T_T
LOOOOOOL WHY IS IT SO BAD? ITS NOT THAT BAD WHEN IM SINGING IT????
Okay, lets dive into this. The reason it sounds bad recorded and not when you are singing it boils down to the fact that what you hear is not the same as what other people hear. Not only do they hear the sound directly before it has bounced around the room, you hear your own sound significantly differently because it is also bouncing around and resonating in the chambers of the face and throat.
Moreover, you're used to your own sound, which makes you more tolerant of it even if the sound isn't that great.
a) I sing badly because my vocal range is fucking tiny so I get confused when I try to sing a note that I think I should be able to sing but in actual fact I can't, so I just sing out of tune.
It would be interesting to here you sing a given vowel sound from the bottom of your range up into a high note, just to see what is going on. If you're getting stuck in a very narrow range, the problem likely arises from not knowing how to change the resonance for higher/lower notes. You're likely only able to sing near speech level because that is the only area you're used to have natural resonance in.
If you start to lose it up in the territory of G3 to C4, then the problem is likely both muscular and resonance based. As you approach those notes (exactly where depends on the singer and his own instrument) there because a place where the same resonance/harmonic strategy doesn't work, and you have to essentially change tactics. Moreover, at lower pitches the TA muscle is the primary controller of the vocal folds, but at higher pitches the TA is unable to do so and the CT muscle takes over.
That said, of the things you want to focus on range is not the primary importance. If you have good technique, you're range will take care of itself.
PS: You're vocal range isn't that low from what I listened to. You just don't have access to passagio type notes and higher.
i take very strongly genetically after my father and he cant sing for SHIT either and never did except this horrible screeching to make fun of something, holy shit
Singing certainly has a level of genetic component, both in terms of natural musical ability (pitch, rhythm, etc.) but also in terms of the instrument everyone has. Not everyone (well, technically you could argue nobody) has the facial/nasal/throat structure to produce a shimmering Corelli B4. That said, nearly every person has the ability to sound significantly better than decent.
People that "can't sing" generally can't sing because they grew up with people that couldn't sing, and who didn't have speech habits well suited for producing good overtones. It's more environment than it is genetics, unless you want to be the next Bjorling or Plant.
a) I sing badly because my vocal range is fucking tiny so I get confused when I try to sing a note that I think I should be able to sing but in actual fact I can't, so I just sing out of tune.
No.
That is a PART of it, but probably the least significant part. Even if you were perfectly on pitch you still wouldn't sound good. More importantly, even if you're was spot in it's unlikely you could stay on pitch because your technique and support isn't there.
The two biggest things that jump out are you're lack of support and lack of resonance/overtones. Support essentially refers to you're breathing and use of air. It's tricky to define but roughly it's the maintaining of the required pressure below the chords that allows you to phonate with the same sense of ease that you would have at the beginning of your easiest note. The hard part, of course, is getting it right. I'll let someone infinitely more qualified than me lay out the practical side of it:
Singing is communication. Ideally, we should be able to pour our soul into the music, imbue it with great emotion and human truth, convey the intention and power of the text as it reflects the depth of human experience as we understand it, and as it is revealed to us in the moment we communicate it. This is a very creative work that we should learn to experience along with the listener, stepping back and witnessing this moment of “revelation” almost as a spectator, which in turn, I believe, enriches further our ability to be an effective oracle of this truth.
Breathing on the other hand is absolutely NOT CREATIVE. If your breathing becomes random and chaotic, unexpected and uncontrolled, you will more than likely not sing well. As much as our expression is creative, our breathing is machine-like. It is paramount you develop a very clear blueprint, not just intellectually, but in your muscle memory, in your intentional blueprint of singing, of how to breathe and support the voice. This becomes even more crucial if, like myself, you are an emotional type of person with the tendency to let the emotions impact your breathing. Out of control emotion in the breathing mechanism can lead to rigidity, pushing, and vocal instability.
So first and foremost think of yourself as a breathing machine!
If you vocalize for 30 minutes per day, you should get into the habit of doing prolonged breathing exercises for the same amount of time. I have said this to my students, and they can choose at their peril to ignore this advice. If you discount the importance of focusing the mind and practicing breathing, you do so at your own peril. I told you!
Your diaphragm is a dome with a base right around the lower rib area. When it flattens, you inhale, and it assumes a flat position right around your solar plexus area. So your diaphragm does not go down to your navel. It doesn’t push on the pelvic area. It is connected to your lower ribs, and the action of traditional respirazione costo-diaframmatica involves exactly those areas.
When you breathe the lower abs should be a floor for the incoming breath. You should not push out below the navel; quite the contrary, you should contract in order to open the rib cage. The movement down of the diaphragm as you inhale should correspond contemporaneously to a movement out of the entire circumference of the torso around the lower ribs and upper abdomen.
Place your hands flat on your chest right below the breasts, directly pointing at each other, with your elbows in a straight line with the hands, with the tip of the middle fingers touching. When you inhale, expand the rib cage so as to separate the middle fingers. Ideally when you are singing the fingers will stay apart like this. Keeping this flexible rib expansion is truly one of the few things you can actually control. You will notice that in order to expand your ribs this way, your lower abs must be in. If the lower abs go out you will notice how your ribs collapse and your fingers come back together. The tradition calls for a high rib cage, not a collapsed one; a noble posture on stage, leading from the breastbone, not from the navel.
So, when you breathe in you should feel a real, significant, and for some dramatic expansion of the upper abdomen/lower ribs. The sternum will feel like a fulcrum of energy, almost as if the breath energy is now controlled by the sternum. As you breathe in, there is a sense of the muscles attached to the bottom ribs, and below them, and between them, all coming to a real feeling of elastic stretch. The torso feels like it is elongating upward, and the abs are propping it up. You can think of your torso like a cone. The lower you go, and the narrower it gets (at least that is the feeling, alas the heavier ones among us have other work to do to make the feeling correspond to the look as well). You will notice when breathing this way a certain elasticity is produced in the transverse muscles connecting the sides of your lower ribs to the navel area, this feeling of cone.
Here are 3 exercises to practice with:
1) Through a very small opening in the lips, or through a narrow straw (it is important that the breath have a difficulty in entering into the mouth), inhale slowly for 30-60 seconds. As you do this, you will begin to feel a sense of “tug” or elasticity in the ribs and in the muscles attached to them directly below.
2) Through an identical small opening in the lips, or through a narrow straw, exhale for 30-60 seconds. While you do this, keep your ribs expanded. If your ribs stay expanded your lower abs will necessarily be in, and you will begin to feel how the abs attached to ribs and the flanks begin to contract to propel the breath out. If your diaphragm delays its ascent as it should, you will notice how the stomach stays out as well at the same level of the sternum (not bulging forward).
3) Inhale deeply, and then suspend your breath with an open glottis for 60 seconds. Because the glottis is open, the breath in theory could move in and out, but it doesn’t because you are staying flexibly open. Walk around and think of an aria. Sing it in your head as you keep this breath suspension. If you can go 2 minutes that is great. The idea is to condition yourself to not have to expel the breath rapidly while singing. Your support is more about suspension and not so much about expulsion of air
.
As far as resonance goes, this is the hardest to get right by yourself, and why a teacher is so invaluable. I have the same problem as you in that I don't have a teacher. It's really not good because not only can you develop all kinds of bad habits, you cannot get immediate feedback to correct a mistake. With a good teacher you can be singing, he/she can hear a problem and have you correct it in real time. This is hard to do solo because as we already discussed you cannot hear correctly you're own voice. You can try something new, be recording it thinking you've finally got that gorgeous high note, then play it back only to realize you were a screeching banshee. That said, it isn't impossible to learn without a teacher, but it is undeniable more difficult.
I highly recommend two things:
1)Recording yourself frequently and often, trying to understand how a good sound to everyone else sounds in your own head 2)A decent real time spectral analyzer. This is the closest you can come to having the ability to correct your sound in real time. Using one you can see what harmonics are being strengthened and if it isn't what you need you can try different tactics. It also let's you play around to try and find good resonance. As an example, let's say you want a good classic sounding SF dominant B4. You could sing that note, and try playing with the sensations in your face/throat to find what results in the desired peak between 2500-3500Hz resulting from strengthening formants 3-5 that gives high notes that SF dominant ring.
I'll talk a little more about resonance later, but it can be hard without getting too technical.
On September 09 2014 18:02 nekotrap wrote: Other than that, any section of a song that you have trouble with, isolate it and practice it on its own. Try to find a technique for it that works. Never strain/do anything that hurts. And once again, the best thing you can do is find a quality vocal instructor.
I agree, on all points. The practicing 2 seconds over and over and over (or even half a second...) is what makes enemies of roommates. But it's necessary!
It hasn't been mentioned yet: breathe from the stomach / diaphragm, not the shoulders. Your belly button should expand outward and your shoulders should remain relatively level throughout the breath. The bottom of your lungs is the area that can hold the most air, so breath from there.
Also when you take big breaths, something I used to do is breathe deeply into the stomach, and then extend the inhale into the chest / shoulder region. This is bad because it seems like you're increasing the size of the breath, but what you're actually doing is moving air into the upper part from the lower part of the lungs, and you end up with a smaller breath!
Iron & Wine Started listening to this guy in 2007 or 2008, great stuff all around. + Show Spoiler +
Iron & Wine - Bird Stealing Bread Many versions of this one, this is my favorite. I have a recording from Bonnaroo 2005. Unfortunately it's not on youtube, but this version is identical - just the vocals are a bit tough to hear here.
i hit C-25 with a few attempts. but generally conk out on the A-22.
I have no idea what C-25 or A-22 is. I'm familiar with the nomenclature going from C0, B0...B4, C5; but not this double sigit classification
EDIT: It seems those numbers are midi based. I think 25 corresponds to C1 sharp, and 22 to A1 sharp. However, that still doesn't quite make sense as those are VERY low tones, and thus A would be the much harder to hit note than the C
EPT
