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11589 Posts
I think Foolish is obviously spewing bullshit in his defense of Marv and his mischaracterization of meta from Marv and myself.
He's relying on the fact that townies are usually lazy and don't know enough to refute his bullshit, but I know for a fact that Marv plays differently as town in some games than others. I've seen everything from FiveTouch and his syllo-like town play to his weak and meager appearance on Fruity to his angry and indignant performance in TTABE. Identifying Marv on his he types is not the way to catch scum-marv, it's how he pushes his reads.
Foolish needs to die today. Kill him, realize vivax is 100% his mafia scum buddy, and then lynch/shoot him in the wake of it. I know this is all I've been saying for a while now but I am certain this is the case now.
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On March 14 2013 11:19 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2013 11:14 iamperfection wrote:On March 14 2013 11:13 Vivax wrote: Riddle me this:
Foolishness wakes up a nice day and marv is pushing him to the gallows with his horde of enthusiastic fanboys
He finds a nice nuke in front of his door and decides to target his 100 % scumread yamato with it instead of marv.
Why would he as scum not shoot town marv? because that would be claiming scum imo Marv claimed check on Foolish, everyone wanted to lynch Foolish, how would be care about claiming scum? Explain how it'd be a scumclaim, and explain how it's not a scumclaim when I do it. That's a huge inconsistency in arguments you show there. Seriously iamp you're making me doubt you're town currently. Look at the filter you quoted and tell me it looks like marv from this game please. to say the lynch was 100% definitely going to be on foolish is simply not true. And you don't treat players equally.
for one i think your stupid/crazy
i dont think foolish is so thats why it would be a scum claim for him. you dont kill the leader of the town just because you think he is mafia you push his lynch and try to prove it. Foolish has not proven that marv is mafia and when you combine that with his apathy tward the lynch and not caring about the comings and goings in the thread that makes me think he is mafia
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Iamp, what do you think of Vivax being mafia if Foolish flips red?
I want to know how much effort I need to put into reading his filter and showing the hard defenses and ridiculous opinions to get him lynched next.
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11589 Posts
On March 14 2013 12:06 Promato wrote: Iamp, what do you think of Vivax being mafia if Foolish flips red?
I want to know how much effort I need to put into reading his filter and showing the hard defenses and ridiculous opinions to get him lynched next. That was me.
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Digesting. One small initial thought.
I think Foolishness's post reads well. I also think that he's not being entirely truthful. The read on marv feels legitimate, but him being a batman-posting/unlynchable/1-shot vigi? That's bs. I don't trust that at all. Makes me not trust the post as a whole, because if he's actually coming clean here and making a big towncase, he's not doing a good job of it when he's also hiding/altering information. Can I prove that he's lying? Not really. Does it seem that it is? Yeah. It feels like he's crafting a role to explain all of his behavior, and that doesn't pass the smell test with me.
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Town needs clarity and leadership moving forward. Not just for Day2, but the rest of the game.
As long as both Foolishness/Marv are alive, they are just going to be gunning at each other (as both are each others strongest scum reads).
Im taking a stand with Marv. For all the reasons I said before.
Vivax needs to pull his thumb out of his ass. He supports Foolish (cos Foolish has a town read on him) and knocks Marv (cos Marv has a bad town/scum read). Thats essentially emotions guiding his play, instead of logic. He has also admitted to not reading the thread before commenting.
Lynch Foolish, and keep medic'n Marv. Thats our best chance to win this game.
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This game...seriously...supersoft...wtf + Show Spoiler +
Don't listen to supersoft. Ugh. Lynch foolish. I'm actually pissed right now. I know I played bad earlier, but seriously...
I'm gonna attack part of foolish's "case" cause I don't have time to do the whole thing, but it doesn't really matter. I'll get my point across. Responses in the quote are blue.
On March 14 2013 08:07 Foolishness wrote:Okay this really needs to be my last post for a while cause I have a research paper due tomorrow. I will try to explain everything here. To make it easier for the people who have trouble reading I have decided to keep the analysis in a simple Q&A format. Okay, it's definitely clear that yamato77 is mafia, but what of your other reads?I will talk about marvellosity in a bit. After the nuke incident I believe that Crossfire is mafia. His nuke against me was an incredibly rash thing to do, especially after people in the thread were saying to hold off on killing me one more day (the same people who include a mod-confirmed townie). It makes sense from a mafia perspective. I just nuked one of their teammates so they are screwed, since dodging a nuke is near-impossible. They see this and realize that I'm on the right track in figuring them out (say for example I'm correct about marvellosity) so they nuke me immediately to prevent me from causing further damage. I myself, as mafia in past games, have done this many times. Some person comes out in the thread and kills a teammate or posts a big analysis that's very bad for our team, I shoot them immediately to stop them from doing further damage. Also consider the fact that crossfire was in no danger of getting killed at the moment. If he was about to get lynched I can see sending out a nuke as a last ditch effort to survive or make something happen (hey I just kinda did it, though my motivation is way different). It was completely out of the blue, just as yamato's day vigi was completely out of the blue. Yeah you obviously aren't reading the thread where I explained I thought sloosh was going to kill me...+ Show Spoiler +On March 14 2013 03:47 Crossfire99 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2013 03:42 slOosh wrote: Ah mah gash so much information.
Crossfire, explain clearly what you thought when you received your NUKE and the thought process leading up to deciding how to use it. I figured you were planning on killing me today with your post earlier, so I knew I had to use the nuke before you did something to me. Foolish was my top scum read, plus I saw that he nuked yamato who I believe is town. I also saw that people seemed to be just voting foolish because everyone knew he had to die, so I figured I would help everyone out by nuking scum. This will allow us to lynch another scum and have better discussion. I analyzed this guy day 1 but didn't come up with anything conclusive. On one hand he hadn't done anything to exhibit being mafia, but nothing striking to say he was for sure town either. With his nuke shot we now know where his agenda is and what side of the town he's on. I brought up some of his posts before; I would like to reemphasize a few of them now to build the case stronger: Show nested quote +On March 12 2013 12:22 Crossfire99 wrote: So I'm off to bed. It sucks wbg wasn't scum and was just a survivor, but it helps. I'll have to take a more thorough look at some people tomorrow when I have time. He made this post after wbg flipped. I find this post incredibly unnatural and forced. He knew he needed to post something but wasn't sure what, so he says something incredibly generic that adds nothing of value that everyone already knew. It was just a fluff post. Townies don't make fluff posts.Watch out there, pot, it looks like you're calling the kettle black. + Show Spoiler +On March 11 2013 13:14 Foolishness wrote:And it is so on this brightest of white days that I stroll into Personality Town. I clutch the assignment paper in my pocket as I walk into the main parts of the town. The paper that was handed to me not moments ago from the gate guard Greymist. Though I had arrived late to the town, I had already knew exactly where I was proceeding to; a destination known, but not known for I had only just arrived and getting my bearings down would take some effort. But on the right side of the street I came across a wonderful grove; full of vibrant trees that radiated through the yard. I stopped for a moment to take in the scene. I was not the only one so moved by the scenery, as many people buzzed through their way through the many trees. Not a minute had passed before a fine gentleman approached the grove as well. Though I gave him no inclination to, he stood beside me and struck up conversation. "They are cherry pickers you see," he said, pointing at the people wandering in and out of the grove. "Cherry pickers?" I asked. "Yes," BloodyC0bbler replied. "But they only pick cherries. Ask them to pick from the apple trees, and you will be met with resistance." "That must make it difficult to accomplish anything." "Aye. You best be moving on. If you stare too long you too will succumb to the ripe taste of the cherry. And then we will have lost another soul." "But what about you?" I questioned him. "I am the shepherd of these people. It is my job to lead them down the path of the scumhunt; to steer them away from the cherry trees. They are my responsibility." Without another word I departed the poor man and made my way down the street. And I wondered about the shepherd as I walked. Surely his cause is noble, but is that all there is too it? For a few minutes I pondered this question as I walked, until I came across a man sitting on a bench. "Excuse me," I asked the man, "could you tell me where I can find the house of Vivax?" "Ahhh, the house of Vivax you say? Well I could not know where anything is in this town. You see I am blind, and I have not interest where anything is in this town during my stay," Ver replied. "Blind?!?!" I was shocked at this finding. "But how can you possibly hope to accomplish anything?" "Oh ho ho sir! You only think to see with your eyes. But you have other senses with which you can see. You must learn to use all your senses in this town, not just what you see with your eyes. And then you will see! You will see that there is much to learn from your other sense. Why I have learned so much in this short time without my eyes. Sometimes, your eyes bias your mind, and you see things that are not really there. You only see them because your mind wants to. I do not have such issues. And thus, what I see is truly......pure." Truly pure. I was at a loss for words from his short speech. What could I say to that? I gave a quick goodbye and went on my way, pondering his vision about seeing; seeing what is right in front of you, seeing without your eyes. Was I seeing things that weren't really there? Was I just seeing them because my mind wanted to see them? I ducked into a coffee shop and parked myself at a table. I looked back through notes of the case. Except this time, I did not read with my eyes, but I read with my mind. And I saw something different this time. I saw what couldn't be seen with my eyes. I saw exactly what I needed to see. It was beyond what I saw the first time, the first time with my eyes. I saw a depth that was previously not there. I saw all the motivation (or lack of it), all of the ineptitude, all through a hidden agenda. It was...pure. With the knowledge of my mind lingering in my head, I packed up my things and continued on my way; destination in hand, more determined than ever. ##Vote: Vivax + Show Spoiler + On March 11 2013 13:26 Foolishness wrote:Do you read with your eyes, or do you read with your mind? + Show Spoiler + On March 14 2013 05:36 Foolishness wrote: I sneakily crept through the second story window. It was a difficult maneuver, having previously gotten to the roof and needing to hang off the ledge to get access inside. But it was always a favorable choice; people always expect break-ins to be on the first floor. I was above and beyond that.
I took a moment to take in my surroundings. I was in a guest bedroom, the neatness of the scene made that apparent. From looking into the first floor before my entry it was quite apparent that the boss was not a tidy person. Though I did not expect him to be, one who is so conceited and selfish need not care about public perception and generally perceived "good" qualities. I approached the door to the bedroom, and stopped for a few minutes to listen. I could faintly hear music off in the background but it seemed eons away. There did not seem to be any movement so I slowly turned the knob to open the door.
"SCREEEEK!" the door screamed back at me. I halted in my tracks, hand still on the knob as I listened. Faint music could still be heard but my mind was not processing it, I was only listening to the noises that mattered. After it was clear that was no disturbance I took a deep breath and pulled on the door once more. Luckily the door stayed silent this time, and I made a wide enough gap for me to slip through.
The hallway was dark, not that that was unexpected. There was a faint light radiating across the carpet a distance ahead. As I moved towards it, the music grew in volume but my mind was not listening to it. I stopped at an intersection and waited before proceeding. Again there were no disturbances. I turned to the right and proceeded down my path. I stopped at the door to the room of my goal. Appropriately shaded a dark red, perhaps in forbearance to the events about to take place. But I could not help but notice the detail and construct of it all, the beautiful square design, the way the golden handle brought life to the red door, almost as if saying that it is within this room that life happens.
With the philosophical moment passed, I stood up and readied the knife in my hand. There was no need to be sneaky anymore; there was a job to finish, dead or alive. I hesitated before giving the golden handle a nice twist in the clockwise direction. I gave the door a little push and it almost seemed to open itself; as if inviting me to experience the true essence of life.
"I've been expecting you," he said from his chair. He was already facing me; it seemed he knew his fate had already been decided. "How cliche," I replied. "Unfortunately your time is at an end. Like the red of your door your hands have been stained."
He stood up and made his way over to me. I was alert, ready for any trick that might be up his sleeve. But he was not in a trickster mood. I felt that he was just playing his part, trying to play it cool and not show his true colors.
"But are you sure you are making the right choice good sir?" Apparently his trickery was only with words, the same trickery he used on the rest of the town. There was no need to delay this further with meaningless words. I put the knife straight into his chest. "You don't understand, I am the legend, you can never hope to outwit me." "I...I...I don't understand. Just who are you?!?!" marvellosity said his last words. "I AM THE GOD DAMN BATMAN!" And I plunged the knife further into his chest.
I don't care if you're "unlynchable as long as you tell a story" (trololololol), you don't have to make such fluffy stories or the other post.Show nested quote +On March 12 2013 11:19 Crossfire99 wrote: Uh is there anything specific you guys want me to focus on to make sure I spend some time on before the lynch? I'm trying to catch up, but need to know what would be the most helpful. The other thing I find very disturbing is that before getting lynched he asks the town what he should do last minute. I don't find this consistent with a townie player. In my experience when inactive townies are about to die (like in his situation) they post something like, "oh shit sorry guys, I know I sucked, but I'm pretty sure X and Y are mafia" and then they give a sentence or two on their reasoning. I've never seen a townie ASK the town what they should do. Townies don't need to ask each other what to do, they already know what to do! Find mafia and post cases! Yeah way to cherry pick from my filter. Here let me help you out there. + Show Spoiler + On March 12 2013 11:00 Crossfire99 wrote: Sorry I played so terribly. I deserve to be lynched. Watch vivax because he pegged me as town even though i played like crap. Watch out for dandel. he might be scum but i'm not sure cause i've only been scum when i've played with him. On March 12 2013 11:00 Crossfire99 wrote:That's all i got with the 1 minute i had. Sorry town. On March 12 2013 11:02 Crossfire99 wrote: Am I dead? I only checked the vote thread and saw a lot of votes for me, so I assumed I'm dead. On March 12 2013 11:04 Crossfire99 wrote: Oh, but isn't it 10pm est now? On March 12 2013 11:05 Crossfire99 wrote: Whatever I'll try and catch up real fast to update my reads in case i die. On March 12 2013 11:19 Crossfire99 wrote: Uh is there anything specific you guys want me to focus on to make sure I spend some time on before the lynch? I'm trying to catch up, but need to know what would be the most helpful. On March 12 2013 11:25 Crossfire99 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2013 08:41 supersoft wrote:new alternative to Crossfire: Dandel Ion
On March 12 2013 08:35 marvellosity wrote: you've had all day to read. and if the deadline is earlier you still wouldn't have pushed us towards any lynch.
*shrug* that's true, but i was lazy and i miscalculated the time i'd need to find a proper target. 1 hour wasn't enough i guess... Did anything come of this? I can't find him following up on the dandel thought at all which is really weird especially if he thinks dandel is a better alternative to me. On March 12 2013 11:26 Crossfire99 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2013 11:20 iamperfection wrote:On March 12 2013 11:19 Crossfire99 wrote: Uh is there anything specific you guys want me to focus on to make sure I spend some time on before the lynch? I'm trying to catch up, but need to know what would be the most helpful. saying who you think is scum and why would probably be the best place to start...... No duh. But it could be useful to know whether people want me to spend 10-15 minutes analyzing someone to figure out their alignment rather than skim over the entire thread and just post cursory thoughts while catching up. I'm not the fastest analyzer. On March 12 2013 11:28 Crossfire99 wrote: I would vote for viv if only cause he pegged me as town when no one should have. On March 12 2013 11:31 Crossfire99 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2013 11:20 VisceraEyes wrote: If you're serious about putting in effort, some thoughts on wherebugsgo vs Yamato would be a plus. Ok. I'll spend some time looking at that right now cause they seem like the only viable lynch targets so far. On March 12 2013 11:48 Crossfire99 wrote:Yeah I am unsure on Yamato, so I don't want to lynch him. There's some good and bad. It's good that he calls out super. It's good that he wants to lynch bugs. It's good that he claimed his kill of kurumi. It was bad that he actually killed kurumi. It's weird that he want from instantly voting me at the very beginning of the game, to me only be a possibility of a lynch later on + Show Spoiler +On March 12 2013 02:02 yamato77 wrote: The delay for my role was built in.
As for my Marv read... Hm. Gonna have to reread his filter closely.
Super, I will say, is being especially useless and obviously lurky.
Nothing has changed about Bugs.
Not sold on Cross/Stutters, but the possibility exists there. Not good lynches.
Sloosh needs more attention for being a useless pile of lurking shit, , to don't lynch me. He'll have to be looked into more. I definitely still want to lynch wbg cause he's done nothing but attack kurumi even when he knew he was modconfirmed town, plus he just trolled the thread when called out and doesn't even care about doing anything. I'm keeping my vote on wbg. So in conclusion we can be certain that crossfire is mafia as well. His actions with the nuke are clearly anti-town, and he's done nothing to warrant town behavior, especially on day 1 and night 1.
marvellosity has yet to provide a case against me (and he refuses to do so). One sentence is not a case. Read through his filter and ask yourself if he's really helping the town, or if he's pushing an agenda. I'm going to let someone a lot better than me answer this one, who was in a remarkably similar situation with foolish being scum in Parallel World Mafia (some of the quote doesn't apply but I'll leave it in for completeness's sake).
On December 19 2012 05:20 syllogism wrote: @Foolishness Short cases are often best. I know a lot of players love to write stories describing how everything about someone's play is indicative of the person being mafia or town, but in reality a lot of it is just fluff. You have been useless and wrong about everything so far. Town foolishness it not useless and rarely this wrong.
You made a completely nonsensical attack on Marvel early on and your explanation for it is not satisfactory. You have ignored role based reasons for believing someone is town; it doesn't matter if the evidence isn't conclusive, it's still evidence. In addition you have mostly ignored players who you should have been suspicious, BH/Mementoss in particular. Overall your interest in the game can be, at best, characterized as superficial.
You left your vote on Yamato despite being asked to move it by confirmed town Sandroba and it made no sense at all to leave it there based on your explanation of your role. You didn't have a read on Yamato and you claimed your role could potentially kill him. There is no way a town aligned person with your role would use it on a person they've no read on, and if you were town aligned you certainly would have a mafia read on someone. Finally you keep getting lynched to no-lynch world and there is basically no good explanation for this other than mafia not wanting you to get lynched.
The only reason I'm bothering to type even this up is because I know you've previously been, as mafia, annoyed due to being lynched/suspected when there is "no case" against you (ptp3?). Just because no one bothers to articulate a case "comprehensive" case against you doesn't mean there are no good reasons for lynching you. The main purpose when making a case is to convince everyone else, not the subject of the case.
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On March 14 2013 12:12 austinmcc wrote: Digesting. One small initial thought.
I think Foolishness's post reads well. I also think that he's not being entirely truthful. The read on marv feels legitimate, but him being a batman-posting/unlynchable/1-shot vigi? That's bs. I don't trust that at all. Makes me not trust the post as a whole, because if he's actually coming clean here and making a big towncase, he's not doing a good job of it when he's also hiding/altering information. Can I prove that he's lying? Not really. Does it seem that it is? Yeah. It feels like he's crafting a role to explain all of his behavior, and that doesn't pass the smell test with me.
This is extremely true Austin thank god you're town, with sloosh all slushy we needed a "townie boy scout"
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On March 14 2013 12:06 Promato wrote: Iamp, what do you think of Vivax being mafia if Foolish flips red?
I want to know how much effort I need to put into reading his filter and showing the hard defenses and ridiculous opinions to get him lynched next. i never talk about associations becasue they are stupid.
Vivax i think is town because he is fitting the crazy all over the place stuff that he does when he is town. DOnt really see what foolish flip has to do with it one way or the other.
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Well, since Yamato is going to be nuked today by a North Korean nuke...
##Vote: Yamato ##Sloosh's Vote: Yamato
Once again, my plan is to lynch Yamato. He is scum and lynching him will get scum down to 2 KP. It can't get more simpler than that.
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On March 14 2013 12:37 cDgCorazon wrote: Well, since Yamato is going to be nuked today by a North Korean nuke...
##Vote: Yamato ##Sloosh's Vote: Yamato
Once again, my plan is to lynch Yamato. He is scum and lynching him will get scum down to 2 KP. It can't get more simpler than that. Why steal sloosh's vote? Is he scum? If you're certain of Yamato being scum, you should have stolen his vote and made him vote for himself.
I wish today was a double lynch...
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On March 14 2013 12:40 Crossfire99 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2013 12:37 cDgCorazon wrote: Well, since Yamato is going to be nuked today by a North Korean nuke...
##Vote: Yamato ##Sloosh's Vote: Yamato
Once again, my plan is to lynch Yamato. He is scum and lynching him will get scum down to 2 KP. It can't get more simpler than that. Why steal sloosh's vote? Is he scum? If you're certain of Yamato being scum, you should have stolen his vote and made him vote for himself. I wish today was a double lynch... Its not clear if Corazon stole the vote.
Essentially someone played a power which handed sl0osh vote to Corazon.
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Okay. I have reread Marv's filter and still read him as green. He is too engaged and active in this game. He is active, he is calling people out and he is speaking his mind. I know his thoughts. Furthermore, his defense against being a scumspect is almost equally aggressive as it was in MTG 2, where Dandel and I got our tunnel on.
Foolishness' giant post looks sincere, and honestly, I don't think any scum has the patience or the imagination to come up with an outrageous roleclaim and a farfetched "trap" to explain his behaviour.
So for all you MUST LYNCH FOOLISHNESS OR MARV people: no we mustn't. We must lynch scum today and atm I don't think either of them are scum.
So Acro, who should we lynch today? I answer you:
Cora
Cora has not been playing a townie game. I have some experience with Cora's recent town meta, having just played Duel and hosted NMM37, in both of which he was town.
Cora's scumspects First off, Yamato. Cora's first post at Yamato is this, half an hour into the game:
On March 10 2013 13:40 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2013 13:39 yamato77 wrote:On March 10 2013 13:37 VisceraEyes wrote: That would be...the most disappointing ever. Wtf is this post English too hard Don't post stupid shit about grammar. Who is scum Yamato? Your meta tends to be that everyone should have the scum team down 100% five minutes in the game. Have you found the scumteam yet? This is a preposterous question that doesn't have a proper answer. No matter how Yamato answers, Cora can follow up with pressure: it is not an answer meant to figure out Yamato's alignment, it is a question meant to nail Yamato to the stake whichever way he answers, which is exactly what happens.
From this point onwards, Cora just keeps hammering Yamato with more leading questions for the first 2 pages of his filter. Now getting D1 reads can be tricky and making up a random scumread on someone to spark conversation and gauge their reaction would be fine, but the scumread on Yamato never really evolves and nowhere in his filter do I get the idea that Cora has even considered the possibility that Yamato might be town.
Interestingly, when Yamato takes the shot, he actually completely ignores it and goes after Mocsta for a while. The singlemost important moment in Yamato's play this game, and Cora has "no comment" until hours later. He was clearly around at the time: + Show Spoiler [omgus mocsta] +On March 11 2013 10:43 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2013 10:13 Mocsta wrote:
@Corazon Now that Yamato has taken a Day2 shot, I expect you to put your money where your mouth is, and make a judgment on his alignment and follow through accordingly.
##Vote: cDgCorazon Really Mocsta? Are you caught up? You're playing lazy this game =P Show nested quote +On March 11 2013 05:59 cDgCorazon wrote: Hmmm...guess who has decided to lurk now that other targets are being hunted? Yamato and Acro...
##Vote: Yamato
Gonna start scumhunting? I'm putting my money where my mouth is. I still think Yamato is mafia and I am going to keep saying so until he does something to convince me otherwise.
Yet his first mention of the shot is 3 hours later, after other people have given their opinion: the first important moment in the game, and with someone who Cora thought was scum in any case, and he waits until other people have commented (BC, Marv, Sloosh, VE) to have an opinion about it, or even mention it! + Show Spoiler [yamato case] +On March 11 2013 13:37 cDgCorazon wrote:Alright, here it is: Why Yamato is Scum (Extended Version)Original Case:+ Show Spoiler +On March 10 2013 14:02 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2013 13:44 yamato77 wrote:On March 10 2013 13:43 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 10 2013 13:41 yamato77 wrote:On March 10 2013 13:40 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 10 2013 13:39 yamato77 wrote:On March 10 2013 13:37 VisceraEyes wrote: That would be...the most disappointing ever. Wtf is this post English too hard Don't post stupid shit about grammar. Who is scum Yamato? Your meta tends to be that everyone should have the scum team down 100% five minutes in the game. Have you found the scumteam yet? You're a buzzkill Not fighting with aggressive people this game just finding mafia So you have backed off of your position on this from N0 of Duel Mafia? What position are you talking about? I think you've played with me once for a full game, and you think you know EXACTLY how I play? Lol. The position I'm talking about is when you basically accused me of having no scum reads 3 hours into Duel Mafia and basically told me that I needed to have 100% scum reads 3 hours into the game or I am scum. I know a general feeling of how you play. You're aggressive as town. You don't give a fuck if you die or not, as long as your top scumread dies with you: Show nested quote +On March 05 2013 12:56 yamato77 wrote: Let the double lynch [Yamato and Hapa] happen
I doubt Hapa flipping mafia would change Adam's mind about me anyway, and I don't really want to be in another one of these things. The fact that you have decided to back way down from posts like this and play more passive is a bit suspicious. However, I'm going to assume the personality of whoever you are is influencing your play right now. I'll take a look later to see what kind of Yamato (or whoever you are) is going to come into town. 1. His initial reaction to my case.Yamato's first reaction to my case is basically calling it stupid. Why did he call it stupid? Show nested quote +On March 10 2013 16:44 yamato77 wrote: I'm calling you out for having a bad excuse for a scum read; me.
A case being stupid just because it is against you is not a legitimate defense. He basically refused to answer my main points: 2. He is playing absolutely nothing like his town meta The usual town Yamato is active, fearless, and does not care about anyone else's opinions. This should be ridiculously obvious from his duel with Hapa from Duel Mafia. As you can see from the quote in my original argument, he did not care if he died, as long as his top scumread went down with him. He was spot on in his duel with Hapa and that should have fueled his confidence even higher from this game (Marv said in Obs QT how Yamato was being a bit cocky at the beginning from getting the scumteam in the game before Duel Mafia). A town Yamato would be riding this wave of confidence. Instead, what have we seen from Yamato so far? A whole different game. His game has been far from aggressive. He's been timid, crumbled under pressure, run away from challenges, and has gone hiding while the town deliberates who to lynch. 3. Lurking and lack of scum huntingYamato's filter has been a lot of 1-liners and shitting up the thread. He's been attacking players, but not following through on them. His initial attacks on VE were based on one very weak point, yet he continued to call VE scum without expanding on that point. His other scumhunting contributions have been wondering whether Kurumi is the next coming of Chezinu, and that bugs might be scum (without any explanation) His defense of me was basically backing down and trying to avoid confrontation with my argument. His whole defense was that my read was wrong because it was on him. I don't think so. Ever since then, he basically disappeared from the thread, only to reenter to: 4. His kill (?) of KurumiI honestly don't understand this move. If he knew Kurumi was town and if Yamato was town, Yamato would not have gone on to kill Kurumi. Anyone who would kill a townie cannot possibly be town. Is that bad logic? Another possibility is that he is lying, but what would he gain from that? Could he be trying to cover for someone else? Either way, there is no town motivation in either his check/kill of Kurumi or claim of what happened to Kurumi. These are the reasons I think Yamato is scum and that he needs to be lynched. I, Corazon, the King of Hearts, decree that Yamato must be lynched, or this town shall feel my wrath! Why was he not all over Yamato for shooting a confirmed townie at first? Because he wasn't sure how a townie would react to this unexpected situation, and needed to see some townies react.
The case against Mocsta is even worse. It's basically a straight up OMGUS. Just look at Cora's filter. And I've already shown how horrid the cherrypicking in his case against me was.
He is not figuring people out and his suspicions aren't real suspicions, but rather just ad hominem attacks of arguments why he is scum.
Defensiveness I layed that out in the nightpost, and Marv pointed out some extra points about it here. Basically, Cora is not looking townie and is deflecting any aggression. He doesn't explain himself, or his behaviour.
+ Show Spoiler [bit from night reads] +On March 13 2013 11:37 Acrofales wrote:Here dere be scumCora: Tunnels Yamato all game. However, unlike Duel or NMM 37 where he tunneled incessantly, the read seems forced. Show nested quote +On March 10 2013 13:40 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 10 2013 13:39 yamato77 wrote:On March 10 2013 13:37 VisceraEyes wrote: That would be...the most disappointing ever. Wtf is this post English too hard Don't post stupid shit about grammar. Who is scum Yamato? Your meta tends to be that everyone should have the scum team down 100% five minutes in the game. Have you found the scumteam yet? This seemed like throwaway D1 pressure at the time, but Cora just went on and on about it. The fact that it was a meta read in the first place stuck out, because, as I said earlier: it's from a player who I distinctly recall saying all meta cases are terrible in Duel mafia. He then gets extremely paranoid about dying when Kurumi posts fake shots in the vote thread, and is extremely defensive about his contributions this game, which, at the time were minimal. When he gets pressured himself, he doesn't explain his thoughts, but deflects and avoids answering. First with the deflection from Mocsta where he says other people asked him that before and Mocsta was just sheeping, and then later with Marv: Show nested quote +On March 12 2013 08:32 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 12 2013 08:00 marvellosity wrote:Corazon, can you tell me the difference between these 2 quotes please? They seem to be contradictory points: On March 10 2013 16:19 cDgCorazon wrote:
You aren't scumhunting, you're just throwing shit around. There's no need to do that. We find scum and lynch them. The fact that you are murking the water up means that you are not trying to scumhunt, which would make you not town.
On March 10 2013 16:41 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 10 2013 16:39 yamato77 wrote: Your argument is that I'm scum because I refused to argue with you.
Not exactly a strong one. No, it's the fact that you are not playing as abrasive as your usual town meta is. Why are you bringing this up almost 48 hours after the fact? If you wanted to call me out for it you should have then, not now. Yamato's normal town play is abrasive but purposeful. His play and reads this game has been all over the place. Many calls of scum, only a small percentage of them have been followed through with actual evidence. Who cares WHEN it is asked? He just seems really keen on dodging questions, not answering them.
+ Show Spoiler [Marv's caselet] +On March 14 2013 08:10 marvellosity wrote:Anyway, this isn't a full on case, but more of a caselet on Corazon. I know I said I'd do it tomorrow but I'm impatient as always. I'm just going to point out posts that have a trend and theme in his play. It's not even all the posts, I can do way more, but just some highlights for the dear reader. Show nested quote +On March 11 2013 06:20 cDgCorazon wrote:
I think Strongandbig's argument is very good. It's very convincing, but we are still a long time away from the deadline. Other than that, I've just seen a lot of nonsense and posts that I cannot understand.
I was the first one to start scum hunting, don't accuse me of not doing that...
Also, it's a bit frustrating to try and scumhunt and then have 5 people complain that no one has scumhunted... I'm doing things!. Corazon has a lot of posts like this in his filter. Show nested quote +On March 11 2013 08:06 cDgCorazon wrote:
The thing is, Oats' meta is not the main part of the case. BnS laid out many reasons as to why he thinks Oats is scum and I just made a comment that I liked his case and that it had a lot of valid points in it.
Let me ask you this Marv: Would you rather I...
Say "I agree with SnB" and just vote for Oats?
or
Say "I think it's a good case but I'm going to continue to scumhunt and push my top scum read"
If you prefer #1 it would be such a glaring scumtell. I'm really concerned about my appearance!Show nested quote +On March 11 2013 10:43 cDgCorazon wrote:
I'm putting my money where my mouth is. I still think Yamato is mafia and I am going to keep saying so until he does something to convince me otherwise. This is my tunnel and I'm gonna fucking do it at the expense of doing anything else in the thread!Show nested quote +On March 12 2013 06:57 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 12 2013 06:48 marvellosity wrote:On March 12 2013 06:47 cDgCorazon wrote: I really don't understand why we aren't voting for Yamato. His scumhunting has been a bunch of accusations without any follow up. He still hasn't given any reasoning why VE is scum besides the one post early on in the game. Everyone has just called me scum for attacking him and are just attacking me, not my argument (everyone besides Moc).
He also refuses to answer my questions about the number of shots he has and why there was a delay between the reveal and the kill. It looks really fishy to me. you are joking, right? He made one post saying that VE was "acting suspicious" and then made a bunch of other posts saying "VE is scum lynch him". Did I miss something? His only saving grace is that he said Kurumi or Bugs was scum and now that he decided Kurumi was a good vig target he's going after bugs. Taking an opinion of the majority of the thread and going after bugs along with everyone else is lazy town play at best. As I've said before, something is off about Yamato. He needs to die. Yes, this is still my tunnel guys! Just gonna keep on doing this thang!Show nested quote +On March 13 2013 13:04 cDgCorazon wrote: You can sit here and mislynch me all you want. My death will only confirm Yamato and Mocsta being scum.
Martyr myself to not confirm anything!Show nested quote +On March 14 2013 05:59 cDgCorazon wrote:On March 14 2013 05:50 strongandbig wrote: - youre not reading the thread, yamato isnt going to die - you're criticizing the town for no reason without helping to remedy the situation (ie, you're criticizing the town for "not staying on task" while talking about someone who is not at all the main or even a lynch candidate) - you're mischaracterizing acro's reasoning about you - you're also focusing on a player's interactions with you and trying to discredit those interactions, while calling it a reason he's scum
those are all things scum do Well then why does everyone sit around and make 30 pages of shit debating whether the nukes are fake? I'm pushing my top scumread, it's not my fault that you won't agree with me. Yamato is still my top scum read and my flip will only confirm that even more.If you didn't notice I had a whole part about his vote on Bugs. I would not have a problem with him voting for Vivax (someone he had a scum read on earlier). The fact that he decided to vote for bugs looks really obvious that he's just trying to sheep off of everyone. I never tried to discredit his reasoning, I just pointed out that his random decision that I was his top scum read was timed with everyone else's attack on me. Now that I'm not talked about for awhile, he stops pushing me, even though he thinks I should "die with fire", or however he phrased it. Still tunnelling! Still martyring and talking about confirming mafia in a mythical world!
Anyway, those ones are fun. These are the REAL excellent ones. Witness: Show nested quote +On March 11 2013 11:06 cDgCorazon wrote:
What else am I supposed to say? You didn't ask any questions, you just came to conclusions. Not only were you lazy and basically lied about my stance on a Yamato lynch, you basically said "Corazon is scum beacuse..." and put it in question form, basically saying you do not care about my answer and that you are going to sit here and use your vote on me as an excuse to not scumhunt and post silly pictures of whatever you posted before.
Your vote is fucking stupid. Asking for the same reply I give everyone else, just with a reply to your quote, is just you trying to look like you are scumhunting. Do you really think I am scummier than Yamato or anyone else who has been discussed as possible scum so far? The trend here is - surely I'm not the ABSOLUTE scummiest?Show nested quote +On March 11 2013 12:18 cDgCorazon wrote:
Moc if you think you are scumhunting, you better look it up in the dictionary. You're piggybacking off of Vivax and Marv's arguments and you're only calling Prome's posts unreadable because he is basically saying you are playing bad.
You REALLY think Yamato is [not - sic] scummier than me? Just think about it... This guy really isn't EVEN SCUMMIER than me?Show nested quote +On March 13 2013 13:56 cDgCorazon wrote: Moc your case is:
Corazon is tunneling Yamato Corazon is worried about his image (based off YOUR interpretation of my posts)
In what world is that enough to want to lynch me now? There isn't ANYONE else scummier than me? He even said this one himself. Show nested quote +On March 14 2013 06:19 cDgCorazon wrote: I'm sticking to my guns: Yamato is scum.
There's no way I've been the least productive player this game. There must be SOMEONE scummier than me? Guys? Please???This is absolutely classic survival instincts, bleeding through loud and clear. He's not arguing that he's townie, he's arguing that there's someone else who's scummier so we should leave him, for now. This is in no way a townie mindset. This is in addition to the fact he's basically completely refused to comment on anything to do with Foolishness, despite being given numerous opportunities to do so. Corazon has absolutely no idea how to deal with the impending lynch of his mafia-buddy. This is pretty apparent.
Cora is not playing the game: he is not trying to figure out other players. He is acting like scum and should die like scum.
Vote for Cora!
##vote Cora
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Acro if you really think I am playing like scum just give my NMM 33 filter a quick look over. Does it look anything like what I am playing?
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On March 14 2013 13:14 cDgCorazon wrote: Acro if you really think I am playing like scum just give my NMM 33 filter a quick look over. Does it look anything like what I am playing? I cant believe you said that.
NMM33 was your first game ever.
You were outed as scum 1hr into Day1, and was saved by a townie defending you; which gave you town cred to ride to the bitter end.
Since, then you have played a few newbies; and a few non-newbies. There has been a *CLEAR* shift in your style since NMM34 (your first town game) as well.
Hence, pointing out scum play in NMM33 is barely applicable to you; because you have grown significantly as a player (& it was your very first game)
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If you guys want to sit here and lynch me, so be it. I'll take my hands off the wheel if it's so obvious I'm scum.
I've defended myself over and over and if you all can't see that, then there's no use trying to fight you all.
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On March 14 2013 13:21 cDgCorazon wrote: If you guys want to sit here and lynch me, so be it. I'll take my hands off the wheel if it's so obvious I'm scum.
I've defended myself over and over and if you all can't see that, then there's no use trying to fight you all. '
Why do you think that the prerequisite for you being town is defending yourself? That makes no sense. Also martyring yourself isnt all that helpful for town.
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Then stop making stupid cases and lynch Yamato?
That's a novel idea.
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I have skimmed your filter in NMM 33, but it's hard to get a proper impression without reading more. At first glance you seem more dogged and pushy here than in NMM 33, however as Mocsta said, it was your first game ever.
I don't have time to really read that game right now, I might tomorrow. In the meantime there are Yamato, Prom, Marv and DI who know that game far better than I do. I trust them to do a better job than I ever could of any meta analysis of your scum play.
Prom, Yamato, Marv, DI: what do you think of Cora?
I'm off to bed.
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Acro might be scum.................. thoughts? Yes this is scummy cause im asking questions. Deal with it.
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