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Active: 601 users

[I] Flare TvZ

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
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Gnarly
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States151 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-23 18:56:34
November 23 2009 06:03 GMT
#1
--- Nuked ---
Heyoka
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Katowice25012 Posts
November 23 2009 06:07 GMT
#2
This is an interesting idea, but it seems like it wouldn't be nearly effective enough for the mana it costs

It might be worth messing around with at some point to see if you can really hit enough overlords to make it relevant
@RealHeyoka | ESL / DreamHack StarCraft Lead
SoMuchBetter
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Australia10606 Posts
November 23 2009 06:10 GMT
#3
you dont have the gas to spare going 2 port wraith.
plus zerg has more than enough detection as it is, and spore colonies will literally end the game for your strategy
AUSSIESCUM
TeamLiquid eSTROgeneral #1 • RIP
Piy
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Scotland3152 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-23 06:14:14
November 23 2009 06:13 GMT
#4
in that game boxers wraith control wasn't good enough. He 3 raxed behind his nat wall, which was kinda weird, and didn't do enough damage with wraiths. If he'd expoed with mass turret he might have been better off, but I dunno. 2 port at that level requires incredible wraith micro to get a win. Or the other player to go hydras of course.

EDIT: oh and this wouldn't work at all.
My. Copy. Is. Here.
caldo149
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States469 Posts
November 23 2009 06:22 GMT
#5
I remember in one mission of the Zerg campaign the Terran would keep blinding my Overlords 0_o It was just a big nuisance but it wasn't that hard to get another one to switch.

If you can make Flare work in an actual game then good for you but it seems like you could be doing better things with your actions and attention. If you'll notice in that replay Boxer lost a ton of SCVs and didn't really build enough of them to begin with which really hurt his already poor economy from going 2 port.
Hellions are my homeboys
Ganfei
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Taiwan1439 Posts
November 23 2009 06:42 GMT
#6
Problem is that at that point the Z will just bring 20 overlords along. I usually bring 5-6 along when I'm playing against cloaked wraith and I've seen a lot of other people do that too. Having not seen this particular replay I can't know if the Z did that but most of the time when there's enough wraith to start sniping OL's the Z just brings a bunch more OL's
You are crushing me like a cheese sandwich
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
November 23 2009 06:44 GMT
#7
What what games I have seen with 2port wraiths, the build is extremely precarious and if you screw up during the mnm transition you just lose. It requires extremely good wraith micro and really sharp timings to work. There's just a reason why so many Terran players have lost with the build with only Leta ever really making it work with consistency. Researching flare and using medics to blind overlords just doesn't really make a lot of sense because the wraiths are not supposed to be used for a very extended period of time. You have to do a lot of damage with the wraiths and buy tons of time with them, but it's not the wraiths that deliver the killing blow, and the wraiths lose their effectiveness more and more as the game goes on. Even if you somehow had perfect flare micro with your medics, it doesn't fit in with the build at all.
Gnarly
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States151 Posts
November 23 2009 07:06 GMT
#8
--- Nuked ---
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
November 23 2009 07:11 GMT
#9
You specifically talked about 2port builds, and linked flare usage with cloaked wraiths.

What are you on about.
Gnarly
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States151 Posts
November 23 2009 07:16 GMT
#10
--- Nuked ---
MuffinDude
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States3837 Posts
November 23 2009 07:17 GMT
#11
I would rather use the energy on healing than using it on flare.
Zerg can be so abusive sometimes | third member of the "loli is not a crime club" PM konadora to join!
hellokitty[hk]
Profile Joined June 2009
United States1309 Posts
November 23 2009 07:21 GMT
#12
If the zerg has competant micro, 2 port wraith is nearly impossible to pull off.
One old school game boxer flared a ton of observers (obviously using a dropship and loading meds!), then beat a massive carrier fleet with cloacked wraiths. But that was still an oldschool game.
People are imbeciles, lucky thing god made cats.
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
November 23 2009 07:28 GMT
#13
iono what if he brings 10 stacked overlords T_T
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
November 23 2009 07:36 GMT
#14
On November 23 2009 16:21 hellokitty[hk] wrote:
If the zerg has competant micro, 2 port wraith is nearly impossible to pull off.
One old school game boxer flared a ton of observers (obviously using a dropship and loading meds!), then beat a massive carrier fleet with cloacked wraiths. But that was still an oldschool game.


He didn't beat it. He picked off a few. The other player still had mass amounts of carriers and still won. It was just a pimp move, that's all.

Realize that Zerg will just bring a ton of overlords, and your medics wlil be low on energy, which the current MM transition already relies on the absolute minimum number of medics as it is to get a decent fighting force. Flare would just DRAIN the hell out of medic energy.
randombum
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States2378 Posts
November 23 2009 07:37 GMT
#15
Why do you start a new start thread every week involving some crazy idea that almost everybody disagrees with?

There are many things that would make this idea fail, but one thing others haven't mentioned is that it would actually be rather difficult to flare overlords before engaging with wraiths. If you suicide the medic in to get that one overlord near the mutas, he can A bring more overlords or B snipe the medic first. If you try to flare all the overlords in the middle of battle then you are not microing your wraiths well, not to mention making your wraiths completely exposed if you happen to miss an ovie with flare. Also, it's really hard to keep a ground unit that is slower than a flying unit together.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42685 Posts
November 23 2009 08:04 GMT
#16
On November 23 2009 16:37 randombum wrote:
Why do you start a new start thread every week involving some crazy idea that almost everybody disagrees with?

ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Ilikestarcraft
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Korea (South)17727 Posts
November 23 2009 08:12 GMT
#17
someone i remember on tl thought of a really cute idea. When zerg goes 2 hatch all in muta into fast guards if your tech is late to use flare on zerg's ol and go cloak wraiths to kill the guards. Can get a few kills because zergs never bring more than like 2-3 ol.
"Nana is a goddess. Or at very least, Nana is my goddess." - KazeHydra
ZERG_RUSSIAN
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
10417 Posts
November 23 2009 11:08 GMT
#18
On November 23 2009 16:06 Gnarly wrote:
I am not talking strictly 2port > flore, actually, not even that at all. I'm talking about flare in TvZ. No build order at all, so please get off the 2port > flare discussion that shouldn't be here.

I just watched a replay, described it, and then I get to my conclusion, in which is the whole point of this thread, the use of flare in tvz.

Why else would you want to blind overlords in TvZ? Wraiths are your only cloaked unit as a terran.
I'm on GOLD CHAIN
ZERG_RUSSIAN
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
10417 Posts
November 23 2009 11:09 GMT
#19
And bitch, please, don't talk about slapping boxer for how he plays.
I'm on GOLD CHAIN
endy
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Switzerland8970 Posts
November 23 2009 11:19 GMT
#20
Boxer is the Emperor.

He knows how to use flare, and if he didn't it is because he felt it was not effective enough due to the mana amount required. If you wanna see Boxer using flare, watch the Pimpest Plays 2006 video iirc, he uses 6 medics to flare 6 obs, then raped the shit out of 12 carriers with 12 cloaked wraith.

(I used flare vs Z when playing 2v2 on fast money maps, my friend going for DTs )
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