On November 15 2009 01:23 maleum wrote: This part makes sense.
It's about the manner in which you do so.
On November 15 2009 01:28 Boundz(DarKo) wrote: So? It's not like he does it with manner. One has to ask - is it really contributing to the community? I know I hate that prick and couldn't care less about his actions in korea, as long as he stays there he is their problem not ours. I say: Let them have his freckly manners!
Ding ding ding. This is where the problem really lays. Most of you hate Idras guts and then argue why he should not be in this. Let me tell you something; I don't like the kid at all. I dislike the way he behaves and represents gamers. He does not treat tournament admins with any sort of respect. However simply disliking him is no reason for people to come in here and argue why he should not be part of TSL. When concerning TSL we are always trying to think about the bigger picture.
But here comes it. Fact of the matter: Idra is a foreigner. By the ideology of which we run TSL - that is a tournament for foreigners - he is part of it.
Why start this topic in the first place? Why produce this silly inconsistent rules when you can just announce what you want in your tourney. I mean i get it: chinese ppl bad, koreans bad, pros even worse, american pro in korea good, korean guy in america good but not while he visit his home country for christmas or whateverrr...
On November 15 2009 01:36 ZlyKiss wrote: Why start this topic in the first place? Why produce this silly inconsistent rules when you can just announce what you want in your tourney. I mean i get it: chinese ppl bad, koreans bad, pros even worse, american pro in korea good, korean guy in america good but not while he visit his home country for christmas or whateverrr...
The rules are perfectly consistent as has been explained before. If you want to open up your tournament to Korean amateurs, Korean progamers, by all means go ahead, but why is it so hard to see that this is not what we want? I don't know how else to explain it. If TSL was meant as a tournament for Koreans it wouldn't even exist right now because we would be competing with national TV channels budgeting hundreds of thousands. At least try to show some understanding for what we are trying to do here.
well, at first when reading the OP post it seemed to me that these rules made no sense and were made specificaly to not allow nongim to play. Actually if you read the responses of the mods in thread it seems much more logical. So I agree that nongmin should no be allowed to play.
I can not agree only with the part of letting idra play. He has been in Korea for very very long time. Trains with pro gamers, and is a pro gamer himself. The comparison between him Nazgul, Rekrul and Leg is not good, because all three of them were long retired when TSL1 was held. Also I dont think that Idra by any means has helped the community. Of course the best way he could have done that is actually winning something in Korea. He hasnt won a single game. Besides this, he is constantly being BM in tourneys and in almost in every single thread in TL. I dont see the way he is helping the community. Remember when Leg and Naz were in Korea? Everybody was cheering for them and they were people who actualy helped the community become what is it now. Idra on the other hand brings only drama and scandals after him. This is not good.
On November 15 2009 01:43 Holgerius wrote: I don't get how you staff people can remain so calm and well-mannered in your responses. Impressive. TSL is in good hands.
We've all been trolled by Hot_Bid so many times that we've become cold, emotionless automatons.
On November 12 2009 11:28 Sorrow wrote: this brings up the question in mind:
why the fuck is idra still allowed to enter, even granted as an exception? what's there to "except" for idra?
i mean, the dude's obviously been immersed in much more progaming scene than any of the other contestants, eligible or ineligible. so why is he still allowed?
On November 12 2009 11:28 bEsT[Alive] wrote: If you are to hold all the players to the same criteria then IdrA, ret and a few others wouldn't allowed to play based on condition number 2. I say let the man play.
A player is eligible to play in the TSL if: He grew up in a location without a professional StarCraft scene;
Ok so he grew up outside Korea but he is still affiliated with a pro team and he is still in korea, I think nongmin should be allowed to play or idra and ret should not. Just my view.
Here's what I don't get. Nongmin would have been allowed to play if he had stayed in the US for the duration of the tournament.
"He currently resides in a location without a professional StarCraft scene AND is not affiliated with a professional StarCraft team".
Looking at the INTENT behind this rule, it's to stop a flood of Amateur Korean players from entering. By Amateur Koreans, I mean players who've had special training from a pro/semi-pro team and are affiliated with them in some way. However, Nongmin is NOT an amateur korean player. That is, he hasn't had any special training. He hasn't practiced with pro-teams. He's not affiliated with any team. So why isn't he allowed to play if we look at this on a case by case basis?
I think based on these rules, if we look at the intent behind them, granting Idra an exception is much more of a stretch BECAUSE he's had special training, and he's been affiliated with a pro-team for over a year now.
I understand the ruling but the second that a non-korean becomes a licensed pro gamer the game should change.
Idra will be able to dominate TSL2 fairly easily this time around.
I think excluding people who are not pro gamers and allowing those who are regardless of which type of criteria you setup makes for a double standard.
Teamliquid shouldn't have a problem saying "we support non-koreans in korea and the non-korean scene(excluding chinese lag)" and keep it that simple.
I agree with alot of people here that the opening post was presented in a way that regardless of your feeling towards nongminzerg (I have no clue who he is) you end up feeling like "fuck don't pussy out just say 'we don't want koreans or chinese in our tournaments' " which for different reasons IS the reality.
yes, I am afraid that letting Idra play is definately a double standart ( a thing tl has never did), and I am afraid that Idra being friend with many of the staff members is in fact the main reason he is in.
I can't understand how people dont see idra as a unfair advantage on the non korean scene.. he has been playing in korea professionaly now for 2 years?? I dont get it
On November 15 2009 06:28 Lz wrote: too me.. im friends with idra and everything
I can't understand how people dont see idra as a unfair advantage on the non korean scene.. he has been playing in korea professionaly now for 2 years?? I dont get it
I agree with this (and I mean Nongmin should be allowed to play, not that IdrA shouldn't be), but Kollsen will beat IdrA anyway. + Show Spoiler +
I agree with alot of people here that the opening post was presented in a way that regardless of your feeling towards nongminzerg (I have no clue who he is) you end up feeling like "fuck don't pussy out just say 'we don't want koreans or chinese in our tournaments' " which for different reasons IS the reality.
This is where I was getting to. I think above all this tournament is to promote FOREIGN players, and any other rule i.e. That the players shouldn't be affiliated with any pro teams come secondary to that. That overrides everything else.
What I don't understand is why teamliquid even needs to explain itself?
If you don't want chinese or koreans then just say that then when you feel like making a special 'exception' for whatever reason you can just say "This is my house and I fucking want too" which is how teamliquid always has been rather then trying to justify this and that which in the end will only make people realize the truth which is "This is our fucking house and we choose".
On November 15 2009 06:28 Lz wrote: too me.. im friends with idra and everything
I can't understand how people dont see idra as a unfair advantage on the non korean scene.. he has been playing in korea professionaly now for 2 years?? I dont get it
apparently being a progamer is acceptable if you aren't of the wrong race USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST
On November 15 2009 07:03 AttackZerg wrote: What I don't understand is why teamliquid even needs to explain itself?
If you don't want chinese or koreans then just say that then when you feel like making a special 'exception' for whatever reason you can just say "This is my house and I fucking want too" which is how teamliquid always has been rather then trying to justify this and that which in the end will only make people realize the truth which is "This is our fucking house and we choose".
You guys aren't going soft are you?
When you're going to run a tournament with a sponsor providing 23 000 dollars in price money I think it's quite appropritate to be as professional as possible.
On November 14 2009 17:13 daz wrote: Its really stupid to let idra play. Hes a progamer and has been one for a year. Just because hes failed to make it anywhere doesn't mean we should let him into 'amateur' tournaments. I mean why don't we just let failed korean pros in as well? Because of the colour of their skin? I see the "grew up in an area without a proscene" rule but seriously it is completely irrelevant how he got to BECOME a pro, all that matters is that he is one now. It was understandable when the guy had just gotten to Korea but hes been there for over a year now playing professionally full-time and it's ridiculous to keep letting him into these tournaments. Seriously when you make the rules like this you make it seem more like racism then enforcing fair play. "Professional gamers are allowed to participate as long as they are not of a certain race." Fucking ridiculous.
Thanks for your valuable contribution. Do both of us a favor and remove yourself from the site ran by racists making fucking ridiculously stupid decisions.
I love the site I just hate that decision you made, and it's not only you guys its everyone else who runs foreigner tournaments and still lets Idra play. Obviously I don't think you guys are really racists but it's almost like you're going out of your way to make it appear that you are.
On November 15 2009 07:03 AttackZerg wrote: What I don't understand is why teamliquid even needs to explain itself?
If you don't want chinese or koreans then just say that then when you feel like making a special 'exception' for whatever reason you can just say "This is my house and I fucking want too" which is how teamliquid always has been rather then trying to justify this and that which in the end will only make people realize the truth which is "This is our fucking house and we choose".
You guys aren't going soft are you?
When you're going to run a tournament with a sponsor providing 23 000 dollars in price money I think it's quite appropritate to be as professional as possible.
Yet allowing IdrA, a person with affiliations to a pro team and someone who moved to korea to play professionally, and not letting someone who was born there but never had anything to do with a pro team and also moved out of korea is professional...
On November 15 2009 07:03 AttackZerg wrote: What I don't understand is why teamliquid even needs to explain itself?
If you don't want chinese or koreans then just say that then when you feel like making a special 'exception' for whatever reason you can just say "This is my house and I fucking want too" which is how teamliquid always has been rather then trying to justify this and that which in the end will only make people realize the truth which is "This is our fucking house and we choose".
You guys aren't going soft are you?
When you're going to run a tournament with a sponsor providing 23 000 dollars in price money I think it's quite appropritate to be as professional as possible.
EPT
Impressive. TSL is in good hands. 
