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In-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 180

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Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-06-01 20:12:57
June 01 2015 19:59 GMT
#3581
After ~15 days (May 17th to June 1st), we have risen from 75,689,138 to 78,893,601 combined subscriptions

A difference of 3,204,463
Average Growth of subscribers is 544,093.80
Growth Percentage is 4.23%


5 least popular guides (bottom being the least popular):
  1. Shadow Shaman (Middle) (1,131)
  2. Brewmaster (Middle) (1,109)
  3. Warlock (Middle) (930)
  4. Windranger (Middle) (630)
  5. Alchemist (Middle) (455)


5 most popular guides (top being the most popular):
  1. Lifestealer (Jungle)
  2. Sven
  3. Necrophos
  4. Juggernaut
  5. Phantom Lancer (previously rank 6)


Notable Growths in Subscriptions:
  • Sven (1,074,975 -> 1,110,434)
  • Juggernaut (1,001,930 -> 1,037,624)
  • Phantom Lancer (957,562 -> 995,241)
  • Bounty Hunter (933,473 -> 972,026)
  • Queen of Pain 689,451 -> 722,652)
  • Zeus (567,367 -> 611,098)
  • Leshrac (Middle) (71,409 -> 123,225)
  • Lina (Middle) (28,660 -> 73,256)
  • Gyrocopter (Middle) (11,663 -> 47,700)


Newly Released Guides:




    Associated Reddit Topic - n/a
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    Last Edited: 2015-06-01 20:06:51
    June 01 2015 20:00 GMT
    #3582
    • Growth of Subscribers still manages to jump to a 3 million growth (residue of 6.84)
    • Growth Rate Percentage at a steady 4.237%. This is a regular spot since January (from 5.15, lowest: 3.19)

    • 13.31% of last month's unique players [10,669,979] are subscribed to the Lifestealer (Jungle) Guide
    • 10.25% of last month's unique players [10,669,979] are subscribed to the Sven Guide
    • 10.00% of last month's unique players [10,669,979] are subscribed to the Necrophos Guide
    • 9.63% of last month's unique players [10,669,979] are subscribed to the Juggernaut

    • Four guides are currently swimming towards the 1 million mark: Phantom Lancer (995,241) Nyx Assassin (Middle) (986,898), Bounty Hunter (972,026), Sand King (969,499),

    • Top 16 guides are approx. 900k subscribers or higher each (up to 1 million+ in a guide)
    • Top 31 guides are approx. 800k subscribers or higher each
    • Top 48 guides are approx. 700k subscribers or higher each
    • Top 67 guides are approx. 600k subscribers or higher each
    • Top 94 guides are approx. 500k subscribers or higher each
    • Top 110 guides are approx. 400k subscribers or higher each
    • Top 122 guides are approx. 300k subscribers or higher each
    • Top 130 guides are approx. 200k subscribers or higher each
    • Top 137 guides are approx. 100k subscribers or higher each
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Sn0_Man
    Profile Blog Joined October 2012
    Tebellong44238 Posts
    June 01 2015 20:00 GMT
    #3583
    last month player numbers is now 10,773,024 btw not that it's a huge deal
    LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    June 01 2015 20:01 GMT
    #3584
    On June 02 2015 04:34 TheYango wrote:
    Early game needs wand and SR.


    Are you sure SR is BEFORE treads?
    I see a lot of sticks, not magic wand; thoughts?
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    June 01 2015 20:01 GMT
    #3585
    On June 02 2015 05:00 Sn0_Man wrote:
    last month player numbers is now 10,773,024 btw not that it's a huge deal


    I just posted that so no one breaks up the two posts; let me update it now.
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    June 01 2015 20:07 GMT
    #3586
    On June 02 2015 05:00 Sn0_Man wrote:
    last month player numbers is now 10,773,024 btw not that it's a huge deal


    It's updated properly, before it was copy-pasted.
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    BluemoonSC
    Profile Blog Joined November 2010
    SoCal8933 Posts
    June 02 2015 18:24 GMT
    #3587
    On June 02 2015 05:01 Torte de Lini wrote:
    Show nested quote +
    On June 02 2015 04:34 TheYango wrote:
    Early game needs wand and SR.


    Are you sure SR is BEFORE treads?
    I see a lot of sticks, not magic wand; thoughts?


    im not sure about the SR thing but I can comment a little on the wand

    more recently with the change to stick requiring a circlet instead of a recipe, I've been starting with 2 branches and a circlet + tangoes (if they aren't pooled to me). then go for standard mid items (bottle, boots, etc).

    I've tried the build up several times and tbh I like it if I know im going to be fighting.
    LiquidDota Staff@BluemoonGG_
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    June 03 2015 11:44 GMT
    #3588
    On June 03 2015 03:24 BluemoonSC wrote:
    Show nested quote +
    On June 02 2015 05:01 Torte de Lini wrote:
    On June 02 2015 04:34 TheYango wrote:
    Early game needs wand and SR.


    Are you sure SR is BEFORE treads?
    I see a lot of sticks, not magic wand; thoughts?


    im not sure about the SR thing but I can comment a little on the wand

    more recently with the change to stick requiring a circlet instead of a recipe, I've been starting with 2 branches and a circlet + tangoes (if they aren't pooled to me). then go for standard mid items (bottle, boots, etc).

    I've tried the build up several times and tbh I like it if I know im going to be fighting.


    I can add it. I'm all for Wand.
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    June 03 2015 11:44 GMT
    #3589
    Naga -> Octarine Core?
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    Last Edited: 2015-06-03 11:54:48
    June 03 2015 11:47 GMT
    #3590
    Shadow Demon
    New Skill Build: Q W E E E R E W W W R Q Q Q (1. Shadow Poison 2. Soul Catcher 3. Disruption)
    Added Veil of Discord to Extension Items
    Added Glimmer Cape to Situational Items
    Moved Eul's Scepter of Divinity to Extension Items
    Removed Shiva's Guard
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Pyromaniacal
    Profile Joined June 2015
    United States3 Posts
    June 03 2015 12:12 GMT
    #3591
    I, after looking over the bristle build, somewhat disagree. Bristle is a hero played in too many different ways to have a general build. In a tanky build, going something like vanguard into ac into skadi is viable, but a carry bristle may do better with armlet mek into heart. Armlet is one of the best bristle items, providing the strength of a Reaver, damage of a Sacred Relic, and some health and armor to boot. All for less than either, with really good buildup. A more of a utilityback may buy medallion/solar crest into a Shivas into maybe a skull basher/abyssal. In general, I'd say Bristles core items are treads and BKB. 3 subcategories of situational, damage, tank, and utility, with some overlap, but bristles build depends on the game. That's my opinion.
    Battle not with Monsters, lest ye become one. Especially not pub players.
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    Last Edited: 2015-06-03 12:31:24
    June 03 2015 12:18 GMT
    #3592
    On June 03 2015 21:12 Pyromaniacal wrote:
    I, after looking over the bristle build, somewhat disagree. Bristle is a hero played in too many different ways to have a general build. In a tanky build, going something like vanguard into ac into skadi is viable, but a carry bristle may do better with armlet mek into heart. Armlet is one of the best bristle items, providing the strength of a Reaver, damage of a Sacred Relic, and some health and armor to boot. All for less than either, with really good buildup. A more of a utilityback may buy medallion/solar crest into a Shivas into maybe a skull basher/abyssal. In general, I'd say Bristles core items are treads and BKB. 3 subcategories of situational, damage, tank, and utility, with some overlap, but bristles build depends on the game. That's my opinion.


    I agree, like many heroes, Bristleback offers a variety of ways to play. Sadly, a guide can't encompass them all nor provide the option for the players.

    When players subscribe to a guide, they want to know the conventional way that he's played, that's up to interpretation and sadly this is the way we interpret with our best attempt to provide alternative items for key scenarios or potential ways Bristleback can be served up in a game.

    What you're suggesting is a bit too elaborate for the project's intention, on top of that, I don't see as much variability in higher-leveled matches.

    Right now, the guide hosts about 13 items in Situational, Extension and Luxury Items; which is a spectrum of what you're suggesting at different levels of purchasing power/time in the game.

    Bristelback

    [image loading]


    If I break it down to your suggestion, then there is no direction for players, just purely choices/options.
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    ahswtini
    Profile Blog Joined June 2008
    Northern Ireland22213 Posts
    June 03 2015 13:23 GMT
    #3593
    On June 03 2015 20:44 Torte de Lini wrote:
    Naga -> Octarine Core?

    100%

    also why is shivas luxury for bristle, shudnt it be situational, especially given ac is already "core"
    "As I've said, balance isn't about strategies or counters, it's about probability and statistics." - paralleluniverse
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    Last Edited: 2015-06-03 22:15:15
    June 03 2015 13:54 GMT
    #3594
    ed
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    Velzi
    Profile Joined June 2012
    Finland659 Posts
    Last Edited: 2015-06-03 14:12:01
    June 03 2015 14:10 GMT
    #3595
    For bristleback i would move shivas and HH to situational and remove blademail completely (imo its garbage on bb). There is no reason to have both basher and abyssal somewhere, just remove basher. MKB should be situational too, u dont need it every game. Theres no lifesteal anywhere, satanic aint that bad honestly. Skadi could be mentioned as well (luxury i guess). so what i would have keep starting,early game and core same except no ac and rest:

    situational: Solar Crest, CG, Pipe (defensive) / HH, MKB (offensive)

    extension: AC/Shiva, HoT/Skadi

    Luxury: Satanic, Abyssal, MS, BoT 2

    So the idea is u start by building ur core first, then get situational item like HH/CG/Pipe if needed, then 2 extension items (most of the time it should be AC+HoT imo) and after that Luxury items, unless MKB/Solar Crest is needed.

    thoughts?

    E: i dont really know where SnY stands as pub bb, u have to play it as solo offlaner/ dual offlaner 99% of the time and as offlaner i would rather have something else than SnY.
    Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you to their level and then beat you with experience. http://www.dotabuff.com/players/115305822 https://yasp.co/players/115305822
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    June 03 2015 17:04 GMT
    #3596
    [image loading]

    Phantom Lancer

    1 million
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
    BluemoonSC
    Profile Blog Joined November 2010
    SoCal8933 Posts
    June 03 2015 17:57 GMT
    #3597
    On June 03 2015 23:10 Velzi wrote:
    For bristleback i would move shivas and HH to situational and remove blademail completely (imo its garbage on bb). There is no reason to have both basher and abyssal somewhere, just remove basher. MKB should be situational too, u dont need it every game. Theres no lifesteal anywhere, satanic aint that bad honestly. Skadi could be mentioned as well (luxury i guess). so what i would have keep starting,early game and core same except no ac and rest:

    situational: Solar Crest, CG, Pipe (defensive) / HH, MKB (offensive)

    extension: AC/Shiva, HoT/Skadi

    Luxury: Satanic, Abyssal, MS, BoT 2

    So the idea is u start by building ur core first, then get situational item like HH/CG/Pipe if needed, then 2 extension items (most of the time it should be AC+HoT imo) and after that Luxury items, unless MKB/Solar Crest is needed.

    thoughts?

    E: i dont really know where SnY stands as pub bb, u have to play it as solo offlaner/ dual offlaner 99% of the time and as offlaner i would rather have something else than SnY.


    im gonna agree with you on blademail being trash, but heart is a garbo item and has been for the past couple patches
    LiquidDota Staff@BluemoonGG_
    Belisarius
    Profile Joined November 2010
    Australia6233 Posts
    Last Edited: 2015-06-03 21:46:00
    June 03 2015 21:37 GMT
    #3598
    idk I've never really understood the distinction between "Luxury" and "Extension" on farming heroes. They're both just "what you buy after you have your core". It's not even that luxuries come after extension, because in most cases it becomes highly situational. For that PL guide, for example, both basher and Skadi can be valid quite early.

    I can kind of understand a luxury tab on a support just to denote the "you will probably never get to buy this" nature of stuff like Sheep, but heroes with farm priority are going to hit their luxuries pretty regularly.
    Pyromaniacal
    Profile Joined June 2015
    United States3 Posts
    June 03 2015 21:50 GMT
    #3599
    On June 03 2015 21:18 Torte de Lini wrote:
    Show nested quote +
    On June 03 2015 21:12 Pyromaniacal wrote:
    I, after looking over the bristle build, somewhat disagree. Bristle is a hero played in too many different ways to have a general build. In a tanky build, going something like vanguard into ac into skadi is viable, but a carry bristle may do better with armlet mek into heart. Armlet is one of the best bristle items, providing the strength of a Reaver, damage of a Sacred Relic, and some health and armor to boot. All for less than either, with really good buildup. A more of a utilityback may buy medallion/solar crest into a Shivas into maybe a skull basher/abyssal. In general, I'd say Bristles core items are treads and BKB. 3 subcategories of situational, damage, tank, and utility, with some overlap, but bristles build depends on the game. That's my opinion.


    I agree, like many heroes, Bristleback offers a variety of ways to play. Sadly, a guide can't encompass them all nor provide the option for the players.

    When players subscribe to a guide, they want to know the conventional way that he's played, that's up to interpretation and sadly this is the way we interpret with our best attempt to provide alternative items for key scenarios or potential ways Bristleback can be served up in a game.

    What you're suggesting is a bit too elaborate for the project's intention, on top of that, I don't see as much variability in higher-leveled matches.

    Right now, the guide hosts about 13 items in Situational, Extension and Luxury Items; which is a spectrum of what you're suggesting at different levels of purchasing power/time in the game.

    Bristelback

    [image loading]


    If I break it down to your suggestion, then there is no direction for players, just purely choices/options.



    I understand that you need some direction to give players, but what I want is first off, Blade mail should ONLY EVER be bought against huskar to counter life break. Never otherwise. Second, generally, Bristle needs some kind of strength/health item, and some armor item. Placing AC as core, not my personal favorite choice. Its very good, lots of armor, the debuff to enemies, its not bad by any stretch. But something like an Armlet Mek combo is amazing on bristle, and going mek to give you essentially 250 more EHP on top of the decent armor it and armlet give you. I'd almost insist you put that in, because it is strong, especially if you mind your health in a fight. But something I would add is that if you are going for an AC, don't get a medallion. You don't need it. Crest for the miss chance, if you want to go the whole way, but that can be very greedy. I'd also say butterfly as a 5-6 slot item is good, providing strong attack speed, armor, damage, and the best evasion in the game. Lastly, I think getting a wand is overkill, naked stick and a basilius are the same cost and are more reliable, plus the armor and damage from basilius are slightly better. I'd love to keep talking, I use the guides you do regularly, and I truly appreciate what you do.
    Battle not with Monsters, lest ye become one. Especially not pub players.
    Torte de Lini
    Profile Blog Joined September 2010
    Germany38463 Posts
    Last Edited: 2015-06-03 21:58:57
    June 03 2015 21:58 GMT
    #3600
    On June 04 2015 06:37 Belisarius wrote:
    idk I've never really understood the distinction between "Luxury" and "Extension" on farming heroes. They're both just "what you buy after you have your core". It's not even that luxuries come after extension, because in most cases it becomes highly situational. For that PL guide, for example, both basher and Skadi can be valid quite early.

    I can kind of understand a luxury tab on a support just to denote the "you will probably never get to buy this" nature of stuff like Sheep, but heroes with farm priority are going to hit their luxuries pretty regularly.


    • Starting Items, Early Game and Core Items are to be bought in the order the items are placed.

    • Situational is, typically meant to replace/interchange with Core Items depending on the line-up, scenario. Sometimes items like MKB are in situational and are to be considered after Core Items (for example)

    • Extension Items are choices. They are ordered by price (situational as well, before it was by priority). They are usually the next logical step.

    • Luxury Items are your end-all be-all and are to either wrap up your six-slots or where you start sacrificing some previously bought items to buy them.


    I try to double it up to break up layout/itemization; so it's not an overwhelming choice but still a systematic order.

    For Phantom Lancer; he's going to be getting almost everything there (if he doesn't six-slot first); so we can be flexible (especially if the user can identify skipping Extension for Luxury Items).
    https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
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