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On February 14 2014 04:40 Cyro wrote:People have different standards for quiet :D Since kepler is so goddamn stupid with throttling unless you flash an unofficial bios, i have to run my windforce cooler at like 3000rpm to maintain a 40c delta on the gpu when case is hot from combined cpu+gpu load so that it doesn't cut my GPU clocks from like 1293 to ~1200 which sounds like a tornado compared to cpu fans at 1300rpm (and they're whispers at 600rpm)
You know, now that I think about it, the fans on NH-D14 aren't PWM fans unless they updated those. SE2011 edition has the PWM version fans. I don't know about current stock of shipping regular NH-D14.
I think maybe "not loud or quiet" is the category for it at full speeds, which is what you get without direct voltage control from the mobo or using the adapters. Most high-end stock graphics cards are plenty louder, yeah... never mind some of the historical models. FX 5800 Ultra?
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From a design/animation/audio visual perspective, Ars Technica had a decent article on the new Mac Pro from that angle; however, they are expensive and there are some drawbacks to what options are available even if you spring for a $10k model. (An update suggests some of the issues mentioned may be related to software tweaks in the various software offerings.)
4k can buy a lot of PC horsepower, although I'm not sure if it would include snagging decent Xeons, ECC ram, and other "workstation" grade components - something that becomes desirable in the working world. (Not talking random acts of photoshop, but serious blender/maya/AutoCAD diving.)
For the games you listed, $4k of computer is overkill. (Mine can do all of them well, and was only $1200 thanks to the help of the wonderful people in this thread.
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On February 14 2014 07:53 skyR wrote:
4k display or 3x 27" (1440p) displays
4770k
16gb or 32gb RAM
256gb SSD
gtx 760
would be the gists of it. Of course you don't have to spend crazy on the displays but the computer itself would just come to about under $1500 so you have lots left over...
You basically buy a Mac for Apple's support. Have a problem? Don't worry, just take it to the Apple store. Some people just don't want to or can't deal with troubleshooting and RMA'ing.
If I build a PC i'd probably go for 2x25 inch Asus Monitors (1920 x 1080) Res
The extra RAM is always good for the image procesing in animation and rendering.
I don't know if SSD is a good option, but it starts really fast your computer right? I don't mind wating tho.
and about the GPU i know nothing on the matter.
But I can build something similar for 1500?
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You'd be using the SSD as a scratch disk as well so it's not just about application load times.
A 4770k configuration I posted would be about $1500, yes. If you want something similar to the Mac Pro with Xeons, FirePros, PCIe SSDs, etc then you'll have to spend a lot more.
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On February 14 2014 08:22 never_Nal wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2014 07:53 skyR wrote:
4k display or 3x 27" (1440p) displays
4770k
16gb or 32gb RAM
256gb SSD
gtx 760
would be the gists of it. Of course you don't have to spend crazy on the displays but the computer itself would just come to about under $1500 so you have lots left over...
You basically buy a Mac for Apple's support. Have a problem? Don't worry, just take it to the Apple store. Some people just don't want to or can't deal with troubleshooting and RMA'ing. If I build a PC i'd probably go for 2x25 inch Asus Monitors (1920 x 1080) Res The extra RAM is always good for the image procesing in animation and rendering. I don't know if SSD is a good option, but it starts really fast your computer right? I don't mind wating tho. and about the GPU i know nothing on the matter. But I can build something similar for 1500?
IMO
If you have the money to invest in your build, big capacity SSD
If you have some money to invest in your build, smaller capacity SSD with big capacity HDD
If you are on a tight budget, HDD (you can always get an SSD later...but then you might have to reinstall the OS and all that fun stuff)
It's not only starting your computer, its pretty much everything goes faster as the read/write speeds are increased by a lot with an SSD. But the thing is, SSDs are quite pricier/mb compared to HDD.
The GPU he suggested is quite recent and will be useful on the long run. 
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I'm not sure im understading.
4770k
16gb or 32gb RAM
256gb SSD
gtx 760
This is a core build right?
So from here I should be adding, case, cooling system, power supply, motherboard?
I could upgrade the SSD for extra capacity and buy and extra HDD for File storage, not applications.
isn't the GTX 780 better than the 760?
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Yes, that's the core. You'd be adding a motherboard (eg. Gigabyte Z87X-D3H), heatsink (eg. Noctua NH-U14S), case (eg. Fractal Design Define R4), and power supply (eg. Rosewill Capstone 450).
Yes, the GTX 780 is better than a GTX 760 but you mentioned you won't be playing any games besides Blizzard titles which are not graphically intensive at all and a GTX 760 is already overkill for Blizzard titles.
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United Kingdom20326 Posts
Indeed, i'm not sure about WoW etc and how it runs (will maybe know in future)
4930k + 4 780ti's is "better" than a 4770k and 760, but it's hardly a typical (or even acceptable) build for such tasks
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On February 14 2014 09:42 Cyro wrote:
Indeed, i'm not sure about WoW etc and how it runs (will maybe know in future)
4930k + 4 780ti's is "better" than a 4770k and 760, but it's hardly a typical (or even acceptable) build for such tasks
Isn't a 4960X + 4 780 Ti's better than a 4930k + 4 780 Ti's?
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Yes but you're paying like $500 more for 3mb of cache...
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United Kingdom20326 Posts
And 5930k will beat them both by like 40% anyway in a couple quarters 
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So I'm looking to buy a pre-built system (I don't have the time or patience to build my own), and was wondering what key specs I should be looking for.
I have a budget of ~$2,000 USD. Buying in the US. Willing to buy from any well known company. Computer will be used for gaming and streaming. Wide range of games played from indies to SC2 and newer.
The current build I'm looking at is from ibuypower.com based on their Paladin series, With the spec below currently at around $1700. I was hoping to see if you folks could lead me down a path on if these options are good and if not where you would suggest upgrading, or if it is better to buy somewhere else. Any help is appreciated as I just have not been able to keep up on the new hardware.
Current Build Specs:
+ Show Spoiler +i7 4820K Processor (4x 3.70GHz/10MB L3 Cache)
Asetek 550LC Liquid CPU Cooling System [SOCKET-2011]
16GB DDR3-1866 ADATA XPG V2
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780 - 3GB (single card)
ASUS P9X79 LE -- 2x USB 3.0
850 Watt - AZZA Dynamo 850W
2 TB WD Black HARD DRIVE -- 64M Cache, 7200rpm, 6.0Gb/s
Win 7 Pro
Build Link: http://www.ibuypower.com/Store/Intel-Extreme-Paladin
Any thoughts or opinions are much appreciated. Feel free to even show a better build within the price at this company or at another that you trust.
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You sure you don't wanna build it yourself? pre-builts are generally overpriced for what they are, or they have things in them you don't want or need. 850W for a single GPU is waaaay overkill, you could SLI with that. 16 Gb of RAM is also overkill, etc.
Win 7? This is 2014, you'll be wanting Win 8.
There isn't even an SSD in that rig.
Building a computer yourself only takes a couple hours, the hardest part is finding the right parts at the right price.
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The majority of games (like 99%) don't make use of a core i7 so you'll just be wasting money over an i5 and you don't want to be wasting money on an overclocking system if you're not going to be building / overclocking yourself.
850w is also unnecessary, a typical system is never going to go above 200-300w under load.
You want something like a core i5 4670 (not a core i5 4670k) with a H87 / H81 / B85 motherboard, a GTX 760 or better, a quality 500w unit (I guess that'd be a Corsair CX500 or Corsair TX650 at Ibuypower).
Games also will never make use of more than 2GB so... not sure what you plan on doing with the other 14GB. 8GB of RAM is plenty for everyone that isn't running VMs, editing videos, etc.
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Why not 4670k, only difference really is that he has the possibility in the long run to o/c if he changes his mind (i took the K variant because that was the one on sale tbh lol)
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I should have added this PC will probably need to last me 5+ years. (Kid on the way, as well as buying a house soon, etc...) Sorry that slipped my mind, but it probably is important.
Would that make any difference in getting an i5 over an i7, or any of your suggestions in a nod towards possible "future-proofing" the system?
Or even if I should look into Win 8 over Win 7? I can always upgrade to Win 8 later on as needed, but everything I've seen so far still suggests Win 7 for gaming heavy rigs.
I've been told IBuyPower.com is a good company for cost to power ratio, but would you suggest a different company by chance?
As for no SSD, I don't find the cost vs. storage to be worth it to me. I tend to leave my PC on nearly 24/7, so boot times are not an issue for me. And I can deal with my games taking longer to load as well. Nothing has ever made me shudder at load times with my current 5400RPM 1TB drive (WD Green i think). I'd rather get an better CPU/GPU now and upgrade with a cheap SSD later if needed.
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Yeah SSD-wise i went the same road. I'm thinking they'll become more affordable by the end of the year (random wishful thinking).
And to be honest, if youve got a decent HDD and and cpu/gpu/ram, youll be alright for quite a while.
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United Kingdom20326 Posts
Games also will never make use of more than 2GB so..
For the record, Planetside 2 uses quite a bit more (i've seen 3.4gb on that process alone, though i don't actively monitor it much)
I should have added this PC will probably need to last me 5+ years. (Kid on the way, as well as buying a house soon, etc...) Sorry that slipped my mind, but it probably is important.
That doesn't change the fact that the build is terrible, lga2011 is unsuited, the 4820k is significantly worse than the 4770k. You don't need 850w (thus 850w psu is worse than a cheaper or higher quality option), 16gb of RAM is a bad choice unless you are really sure you need/want more than 8, and in the end - you're paying $1700 for a build that will perform worse than something that's a lot cheaper.
If you have $1700 to spend in the next five years, period, then you should definately cut costs and cycle parts - an expensive build is exactly what you DO NOT want. For example, i5 and ~gtx760 (i5 is as good as i7 in many tasks, you won't have need for a 780 on 1080p60hz) in order to buy far superior parts in the future.
If you insist on a powerful build though, 4670k (4770k is only important if ~15% performance gains in some tasks are important to you - at which point the assumption is made that you are both overclocking and cycling parts on new releases if 15% is so crucial)
+ A single GPU with an appropriate power supply, SSD, HDD, as much RAM as you need (for most people 4gb isn't enough to be comfortable, so 8gb is taken) etc will serve you best.
Win7 vs 8 is choice. I prefer 7 right now. SSD - it's just hard to say no to a good SSD, given that 120gb is very affordable and they're like 5x->100x faster than the best HDD's, at the very very least, they maintain performance without having to defragment them all of the time. They can't really be replaced, as in won't age significantly now and will still be pretty much "the best" in 5 years, or at least still leagues better than any HDD
I don't know why Ibuypower is trying to sell the enthusiast socket quad cores to gamers. They don't make any sense unless you want 3-4 way crossfire/sli and by that point you'd probably want a 6-core if you had lga2011 anyway.
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Based on what all you guys are saying this seems to be a better option, and save me a lot of money. Though my knowledge of MoBos is very bland.
http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/saved/1FV3PC
~$1,200 - most of the key components here.
+ Show Spoiler +Intel® Core™ i7-4770K 3.50 GHz 8MB Intel Smart Cache LGA1150
2TB (2TBx1) SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 64MB Cache 7200RPM HDD
8GB (4GBx2) DDR3/1866MHz Dual Channel Memory (ADATA XPG V2)
GIGABYTE Z87X-HD3 ATX
Corsair CX500 500W 80 PLUS BRONZE
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 770 2GB GDDR5 16X PCIe 3.0
Also, thanks for all current/future help and thoughts. It is very much appreciated you took the time.
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United Kingdom20326 Posts
On February 15 2014 03:41 CornMuscles wrote:Based on what all you guys are saying this seems to be a better option, and save me a lot of money. Though my knowledge of MoBos is very bland. http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/saved/1FV3PC~$1,200 - most of the key components here. + Show Spoiler +Intel® Core™ i7-4770K 3.50 GHz 8MB Intel Smart Cache LGA1150
2TB (2TBx1) SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 64MB Cache 7200RPM HDD
8GB (4GBx2) DDR3/1866MHz Dual Channel Memory (ADATA XPG V2)
GIGABYTE Z87X-HD3 ATX
Corsair CX500 500W 80 PLUS BRONZE
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 770 2GB GDDR5 16X PCIe 3.0 Also, thanks for all current/future help and thoughts. It is very much appreciated you took the time.
That's much better, they have terrible selection for PSU's, probably inflated prices on some RAM etc, missing a lot of mobo's* - make sure you get a decent 760/770 model (aftermarket cooler like windforce)
*I don't know of the hd3 and it's not on Sin's VRM list
would still reccomend 4670k and building yourself (also upgrading in future), but depends what you want
If you're bothered for every bit of performance and want OC, in the end i wouldn't take that mobo or cooling. Cooling is super important for i7, however buying from somewhere like this your choices for mobo+cooling and the prices of them are somewhat limited. It's a big waste of money if you don't want to OC like right away and learn stuff about your system, but then again if you're not that bothered for performance you can save a sizable fraction of the build cost without the low end cooler that's thrown in, or the low end z87 board (instead of h81 etc) - or 4770k over 4670k
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EPT
