EPTComputer Build Resource Thread - Page 942
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When using this resource, please read FragKrag's opening post. The Tech Support forum regulars have helped create countless of desktop systems without any compensation. The least you can do is provide all of the information required for them to help you properly. | ||
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Myrmidon
United States9452 Posts
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
On February 21 2012 11:05 Shauni wrote: And yeah, it's pretty amazing, i saw the price on newegg for the toughpower XT and was like WHOA. It's actually worth buying here, since it's modular and a damn stable PSU with good parts (and 88% efficiency!). The rivals at similar pricing is Fractal Design Tesla, 650W, CORSAIR CX 600W, XFX 550W Core, but I think it makes sense to pick Toughpower XT since it's modular. Corsair CX, Fractal Design Tesla, and XFX Core aren't even in the same league as a Toughpower XT fyi. | ||
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Shauni
4077 Posts
On February 21 2012 11:16 skyR wrote: Corsair CX, Fractal Design Tesla, and XFX Core aren't even in the same league as a Toughpower XT fyi. That's what I implied. Or, now that I reread it, it seems like I said they were equal besides the unit being modular. I didn't mean it like that. It's still a bit strange that not many buys those units here, despite the attractive price. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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jnkw
Canada347 Posts
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Wabbit
United States1028 Posts
I personally use an anti-static wrist-strap as it gives me more peace of mind than having to touch the case as often as possible. EDIT: If you really want thermal paste, get one of these, I'd probably get the cheapest: Shin-Etsu MicroSI X23-7783D (hard to apply/spread, but probably the best) Arctic MX-2 (MX-4 is more expensive) Noctua NT-H1 Tuniq TX-2 (TX-3 and TX-4 are more expensive) Thermalright Chill Factor III These are just some of the best ones that I've seen in a few reviews.There are other good ones. | ||
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jnkw
Canada347 Posts
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Medrea
10003 Posts
The difference between all grades of thermal compound is like 1C and several household materials like chapstick perform just as well. Just dont last as long obviously. | ||
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Wabbit
United States1028 Posts
On February 22 2012 04:03 Medrea wrote: Just use whatever is with the cooler itself. The difference between all grades of thermal compound is like 1C and several household materials like chapstick perform just as well. Just dont last as long obviously. That's not really true. If you're quoting the HardwareSecrets reviews, their testing methodology is quite flawed (as it also is for the CPU cooler tests themselves). Every other review I have ever read about thermal compounds shows quite a bit more difference between some of the good stuff (such as the ones I listed) and the lower-end crap (sometimes up to 10*C EDIT: though usually about 5*C or less). But even the good stuff costs $5-10 per tube at most. | ||
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FragKrag
United States11567 Posts
On February 22 2012 04:03 Medrea wrote: Just use whatever is with the cooler itself. The difference between all grades of thermal compound is like 1C and several household materials like chapstick perform just as well. Just dont last as long obviously. You're over exaggerating a bit. Super high-end cooling like Indigo Extreme will be a lot better than any normal thermal compound. However, most of the time, a solid compound like MX-2 will do just as well as any other thermal compound for its price. | ||
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Medrea
10003 Posts
This is a thermal conductor we are talking about here. It is just to fill cracks, most of the surface area is supposed to be in contact with the cooler itself. The only way I can see 5C being wrangled is if the cooler contact plating is shit and you have to goop on a large amount of paste to fill the cracks. And its not just hardware secrets. There is like a half dozen other reputable sources that have verified the same thing. Total degrees difference between way upper and default thermal compounds are fairly minimal. Before we start recommending enthusiast thermal compounds, the builder has to have already exhuasted other options. No less then a totally lapped CPU, custom loop phase change water cooling, full case fans with an expensive case, and then we can talk about the impact thermal pastes will have on end user experience. | ||
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Wabbit
United States1028 Posts
On February 22 2012 07:00 Medrea wrote: And its not just hardware secrets. There is like a half dozen other reputable sources that have verified the same thing. Total degrees difference between way upper and default thermal compounds are fairly minimal. Such as all of these, right? While it's usually less than 4*C, it can be more between the best stuff and the worst stuff. And if he asked about what would be the best, why not just straight up recommend some of the best when it costs $5-10 just like the worst junk? Even with varying testing methodologies and application methods and whatever other factors, there are still some that always come out on top. And there are some extreme examples as well - for example, if we believe X-Bit labs then the paste CoolerMaster used to give with the 212+ and some of their other low-end coolers was complete crap - not sure if they since changed it. http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=150&Itemid=62&limit=1&limitstart=9 http://hardwarelogic.com/articles.php?id=5379&page=3 http://www.hwreviewlabs.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=64&showall=1 http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/thermal-interface-roundup-1_12.html http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/thermal-interface-roundup-2_7.html (this is supposedly pastes that are bundled with coolers, the CoolerMaster stuff has me worried) http://skinneelabs.com/2011-tim-results/2/ There's a reason stuff like Indigo Extreme, MX-4, Shin-Etsu x23 and some others have the good reputation they have among hardware enthusiasts. Now for most people, this analysis and research is extremely unnecessary when they most likely have something that's in the middle and wouldn't care or matter for 2*C lower temps. But that's why people come to tech support forums - for getting TL;DR recommendations from the enthusiast people | ||
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Medrea
10003 Posts
I dunno I could be just wrong here. Over the 20 years Ive assembled computers Ive never seen a thermal compound account for much. The only times Ive ever seen a large difference is when ive used too much. And then Ive noticed that the expensive ones usually cover for me better. | ||
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AnDa1120
Canada472 Posts
Yeah so, I don't know what to do. If you guys can give me a solution that would be great. EDIT: Sorry I realized that there was a thread for simple answers just now. My bad. >< | ||
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FragKrag
United States11567 Posts
On February 22 2012 07:00 Medrea wrote: 10C difference? lol no. Not even close. Not even 5C. This is a thermal conductor we are talking about here. It is just to fill cracks, most of the surface area is supposed to be in contact with the cooler itself. The only way I can see 5C being wrangled is if the cooler contact plating is shit and you have to goop on a large amount of paste to fill the cracks. And its not just hardware secrets. There is like a half dozen other reputable sources that have verified the same thing. Total degrees difference between way upper and default thermal compounds are fairly minimal. Before we start recommending enthusiast thermal compounds, the builder has to have already exhuasted other options. No less then a totally lapped CPU, custom loop phase change water cooling, full case fans with an expensive case, and then we can talk about the impact thermal pastes will have on end user experience. Lapping the CPU, custom water cooling, full case fans, and expensive cases all either require more effort or cost exorbitantly more than a $10 tube of thermal paste. That said, there's no reason to get better thermal paste for most people anyways | ||
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BlackJack
United States10574 Posts
My computer is a Dell XPS420, about 4 years old Processor: Intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q6600 2.4 GHz Memory: 3GB I'm not sure what other specs are relevant. Any help? Thanks | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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iKill[ShocK]
Vietnam3530 Posts
edit: i do want to max out every game @ 1920x1080 because it pleases my e-peen. | ||
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Ahzz
Finland780 Posts
What I want to do: I want to be able to run SC2 with ultra graphics, preferrably with 1600x1200 or 1920x1200 resolution if possible. I also want to be able to play D3 with good graphics and skyrim as well. I want to be able to stream while doing all this. Where do I live? Helsinki, Finland. I think verkkokauppa.com has the best deals around here, but I really don't know. At least it's really trustworthy. Do I plan on overclocking? I have no experience with overclocking, only that I've heard that 'it can fail' and that I usually need to tune my own heatsinks, fans etc for the GPU's to be handle the overclocking, as well as that there are no guarantees in the possible age of the parts if I overclock. I want to be able to use this computer for a few years at least before I upgrade, so if overclocking decreases my computers age, I do not wish to do it. Keep in mind I know barely anything about overclocking, so if I'm terrible wrong please point it out!  How much do I want to spend? Preferrably something like 500€ would be ideal, but I can stretch it to a maximum of about 700€ish. Based on the component resources as in the OP, I selected these parts: ASRock Z68 Pro3 Intel Z68 LGA1155 ATX motherboard Intel Core i5 2400 3.1 GHz LGA1155 -processor, boxed Kingston HyperX 8 GB (2x4 GB) DDR3 1600 MHz CL9 XMP T1 Series Asus EAH6870 DC/2DI2S/1GD5 Radeon HD 6870 1GB GDDR5 Western Digital Caviar Blue 500GB SATA2 7200RPM 16MB WD5000AAKS total price so far (in verkkokauppa.com): 666,50€ I know that I wont be using two GPU's, and I know that 8gb of ram might be an overkill, but I really only save 20€ or something if I go for 4gb, so I might as well go with this? Is this an overkill for what im trying to do? The OP said that 6850 or so gpu would be fine in general with 1920x1200 ultra gfx sc2, but might have some points when it slows down? I don't especially mind if I have to lower a few settings to 'high' from 'ultra' if it means that I end up saving a lot. Also, based on the price of the components so far, it feels like I must be overkilling somewhere over here. Just adding a psu, case, dvd drive and an os would easily take the price up to 800€ or more, and I don't feel like a computer really should be that expensive What I still need: a PSU that fits my needs, a case where the components fit, and some ideas where I can find windows 7 with this haha. I also tried to look for computer setups that are already built etc, but it seems like they usually cheat the customer by putting in some lame ass 50€ GPU, making it a bad computer overall I think. Any help is appreciated | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
On February 22 2012 11:30 iKill[ShocK] wrote:+ Show Spoiler + 560 ti 448 cores good buy at its price point? edit: i do want to max out every game @ 1920x1080 because it pleases my e-peen. Maxing out every game involves doing SLI / CrossfireX. And even than.. good luck. On February 22 2012 18:20 Ahzz wrote:+ Show Spoiler + Hello, I'm looking for a decent rig setup without having to spend too much money in it. What I want to do: I want to be able to run SC2 with ultra graphics, preferrably with 1600x1200 or 1920x1200 resolution if possible. I also want to be able to play D3 with good graphics and skyrim as well. I want to be able to stream while doing all this. Where do I live? Helsinki, Finland. I think verkkokauppa.com has the best deals around here, but I really don't know. At least it's really trustworthy. Do I plan on overclocking? I have no experience with overclocking, only that I've heard that 'it can fail' and that I usually need to tune my own heatsinks, fans etc for the GPU's to be handle the overclocking, as well as that there are no guarantees in the possible age of the parts if I overclock. I want to be able to use this computer for a few years at least before I upgrade, so if overclocking decreases my computers age, I do not wish to do it. Keep in mind I know barely anything about overclocking, so if I'm terrible wrong please point it out! How much do I want to spend? Preferrably something like 500€ would be ideal, but I can stretch it to a maximum of about 700€ish. Based on the component resources as in the OP, I selected these parts: ASRock Z68 Pro3 Intel Z68 LGA1155 ATX motherboard Intel Core i5 2400 3.1 GHz LGA1155 -processor, boxed Kingston HyperX 8 GB (2x4 GB) DDR3 1600 MHz CL9 XMP T1 Series Asus EAH6870 DC/2DI2S/1GD5 Radeon HD 6870 1GB GDDR5 Western Digital Caviar Blue 500GB SATA2 7200RPM 16MB WD5000AAKS total price so far (in verkkokauppa.com): 666,50€ I know that I wont be using two GPU's, and I know that 8gb of ram might be an overkill, but I really only save 20€ or something if I go for 4gb, so I might as well go with this? Is this an overkill for what im trying to do? The OP said that 6850 or so gpu would be fine in general with 1920x1200 ultra gfx sc2, but might have some points when it slows down? I don't especially mind if I have to lower a few settings to 'high' from 'ultra' if it means that I end up saving a lot. Also, based on the price of the components so far, it feels like I must be overkilling somewhere over here. Just adding a psu, case, dvd drive and an os would easily take the price up to 800€ or more, and I don't feel like a computer really should be that expensive What I still need: a PSU that fits my needs, a case where the components fit, and some ideas where I can find windows 7 with this haha. I also tried to look for computer setups that are already built etc, but it seems like they usually cheat the customer by putting in some lame ass 50€ GPU, making it a bad computer overall I think. Any help is appreciated Overclocking moderately doesn't drastically decrease the life of the component. Components aren't made to last a measly three to four years fyi, they can easily last past a decade. You have to be a huge idiot and pump tons of voltage into the components to drastically reduce their life from a decade to a year. You also need a core i5 2500k to overclock. Non-K suffix processors such as the core i5 2400 have a limited multiplier so you can't really overclock them. You would also need to buy an aftermarket heatsink since the Intel provided heatsink sucks for overclocking. Overclocking the GPU involves nothing but increasing the clock speed and maybe voltage if you want too go higher. Fans automatically adjust their speed and we don't really have power hungry cards equipped with shitty heatsinks anymore. If you are not overclocking than you want a H61 or H67 motherboard instead. The price difference between a 6850 and 6870 isn't that big, it's similar to the difference between 2x2gb and 2x4gb. A 6850 can handle Starcraft II smoothly on ultra at 1080p. Slowdowns will happen in large engagements during late game and that will be the CPU's fault. You just need a quality ~400w to ~500w power supply for such a configuration. Kingston HyperX isn't great since it runs at 1.65v. You want 1.5v memory since that's what is recommended for the processor. If you don't have the budget, just get a single 4gb module now and add another later. | ||
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