EPTBalance Patch 5.0.11 PTR Patch Notes - Page 3
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depressed1
51 Posts
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Charoisaur
Germany15918 Posts
Only thing I really dislike is the sensor tower change which seems really uncalled for and I'm not sure what's the point of the Raven changes. This won't make them less dominant in TvT as they are cheaper now and still disable tanks for long enough to win a fight | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15918 Posts
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angry_maia
311 Posts
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tigera6
3340 Posts
The main change about Raven is that the Turret will be much less impactful, you can only drop 2 instead of 4 now. It make it much less useful to mass Raven, because you can only Disable so many units before becoming sitting ducks, so the lower cost and produce time does nothing to lategame Raven build, it helps only for early game for detection and some defensive capability. | ||
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hwjdts224
13 Posts
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Vindicare605
United States16056 Posts
On December 08 2022 17:53 hjpalpha wrote: i doubt we will do that, not a fan of it at all
in general i really dislike these changes, they look like they were written by 2 zergs and a toss and fuck over terran pretty hard Creep is easily the biggest reason why Zerg is so damn strong, Queens are second and hey they spread creep. Nerfing it is an across the board nerf to the race and shouldn't be discounted. Nothing in these notes is going to affect Terran's ability to push Zerg in the midgame where they are already at their strongest in the match up, and the new Raven changes potentially can make them even stronger. Yea, Zerg got a lot of late game buffs in the match up, but I wouldn't be convinced that it's the end of Terran as we know it just yet. After all, Maru was the only Terran that was consistently beating the top Zergs in late game anyway. Other than him, every Terran that was winning was winning primarily in the midgame. | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16056 Posts
On December 08 2022 18:06 tigera6 wrote: This is what you get for Maru winning G5L, Clem winning E5L and Bunny beating Serral, now we only need to see the return of Pride and Glittering Ash, that would make me laugh so hard. Considering the guys who are part of the committee are Zerg and Protoss, this should not be that shocking. The last patch was about taking the Skytoss - Queen Walk in PvZ, and now they are dealing with PvT and ZvT. It's on brand for SC2 so bad. I keep trying to tell you guys. Zerg isn't allowed to not be dominant because without them the Europeans will never win anything. | ||
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Spirral
62 Posts
Zergling Fixed an issue where Zerglings could not receive queued Morph to Baneling commands. Oh. My. God. For 12 years I thought it was an intended feature. Took them 12 years to fix this bug? :D | ||
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Creager
Germany1890 Posts
On December 08 2022 19:20 Vindicare605 wrote: It's on brand for SC2 so bad. I keep trying to tell you guys. Zerg isn't allowed to not be dominant because without them the Europeans will never win anything. Wait what, are you trying to imply that outside of Korea Terran never really has been relevant competitively? I can't deny that I'm still a tiny little bit butthurt about TLO's betrayal of the steel lifting family and to even do it with this lame 'creativity' excuse of his and then still not delivering results!!!!! Shame on you, Dario, you were the chosen one, supposed to bring balance to EU, not join them filthy non-Terrans!!!! But regarding the changes, some like creep nerf and shield battery nerf look good on first glance, snipe cancel change might be good, but why increase Observer speed lol, to me seems like another variation of 'yeah let's give P a freepass to be lazy with army/unit control' to me, see HT auto attack or parking. | ||
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Die4Ever
United States17665 Posts
On December 08 2022 20:43 Creager wrote: Wait what, are you trying to imply that outside of Korea Terran never really has been relevant competitively? I can't deny that I'm still a tiny little bit butthurt about TLO's betrayal of the steel lifting family and to even do it with this lame 'creativity' excuse of his and then still not delivering results!!!!! Shame on you, Dario, you were the chosen one, supposed to bring balance to EU, not join them filthy non-Terrans!!!! But regarding the changes, some like creep nerf and shield battery nerf look good on first glance, snipe cancel change might be good, but why increase Observer speed lol, to me seems like another variation of 'yeah let's give P a freepass to be lazy with army/unit control' to me, see HT auto attack or parking. maybe observer speed buff, and raven reduced cost, are both trying to combat creep spread? | ||
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Creager
Germany1890 Posts
On December 08 2022 20:50 Die4Ever wrote: maybe observer speed buff, and raven reduced cost, are both trying to combat creep spread? Why would that be needed when creep spread itself can be directly nerfed (and has been before)? Doesn't make sense. | ||
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Die4Ever
United States17665 Posts
On December 08 2022 20:56 Creager wrote: Why would that be needed when creep spread itself can be directly nerfed (and has been before)? Doesn't make sense. idk but maybe they're thinking that fighting back and forth over the creep spread, adding counterplay, is more exciting than just making the creep spread out more slowly | ||
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Creager
Germany1890 Posts
On December 08 2022 21:02 Die4Ever wrote: idk but maybe they're thinking that fighting back and forth over the creep spread, adding counterplay, is more exciting than just making the creep spread out more slowly Yeah, well I see several problems with this as this creates effects outside of ZvX matchups, it follows the 'power creep' philosophy as making stuff move faster should not really be how to tackle things unless desperately needed (like with Brood Lords, for instance, this buff makes a lot more sense) and the way I see it Protoss never really had much issue with getting their observers sniped constantly and thus indefinitely blocking the Robo production queue. | ||
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Die4Ever
United States17665 Posts
On December 08 2022 21:08 Creager wrote: Yeah, well I see several problems with this as this creates effects outside of ZvX matchups, it follows the 'power creep' philosophy as making stuff move faster should not really be how to tackle things unless desperately needed (like with Brood Lords, for instance, this buff makes a lot more sense) and the way I see it Protoss never really had much issue with getting their observers sniped constantly and thus indefinitely blocking the Robo production queue. I agree, this patch might have too many buffs in it | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16056 Posts
On December 08 2022 20:43 Creager wrote: Wait what, are you trying to imply that outside of Korea Terran never really has been relevant competitively? I can't deny that I'm still a tiny little bit butthurt about TLO's betrayal of the steel lifting family and to even do it with this lame 'creativity' excuse of his and then still not delivering results!!!!! Shame on you, Dario, you were the chosen one, supposed to bring balance to EU, not join them filthy non-Terrans!!!! But regarding the changes, some like creep nerf and shield battery nerf look good on first glance, snipe cancel change might be good, but why increase Observer speed lol, to me seems like another variation of 'yeah let's give P a freepass to be lazy with army/unit control' to me, see HT auto attack or parking. The observer speed thing is a revert of a previous pointless change they made to Protoss. Artosis has a video ranting about how it was the dumbest change he's ever seen. The larger model size is their way of attacking that same "issue" of low level Terrans not being able to kill observers by making them easier to see with the shimmer I suppose. It's completely ridiculous and I don't know why they think it's an issue that needs addressing but the important thing is that the Observer speed "buff" in this patch is simply a revert back to what it was for years and years previously. As for the whole "Terran is only viable in Korea" that's not the point I'm making with my rants about Zerg. Terran is doing better now in the foreign pro scene than in any previous point in SC2's history except for VERY early WoL. They're frequently competitive now but not "Best in the World" or "World Champion" competitive. That level of competitive for foreigners has been reserved for Zerg players only, and has been for years. Whenever Zerg looks like it might start to struggle even a little bit, they IMMEDIATELY get buffed because Blizz can't allow it for Foreign pros to not have their best race be competitive with the Korean elite players. Meanwhile when Zerg is dominant, like they were for years and arguable still are, Blizzard is PAINFULLY slow in nerfing them even when the level of dominance they display like in 2019 is unlike anything the other races have ever demonstrated outside of again early WoL. It's a consistent pattern. Blizz has been doing it for years. The question is why? But I'm convinced the answer is because of Zerg's untouchable place as the only race that has ever had success for foreigners at the top top level. Blizzard doesn't want to change that. | ||
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MJG
United Kingdom920 Posts
On December 08 2022 18:13 Charoisaur wrote: Does anyone know what the Carrier changes mean? If Interceptors got less priority will all units now auto-target Carriers? Seems like a buff vs Marines or Hydras who want to target Interceptors. and what's the third change? I think this change was made to make Corruptors and Vikings easier to control against Carriers, but it's honestly just a crutch for bad players to lean on because any half-decent player already knows to target-fire against Carriers... | ||
Poopi
France12783 Posts
On December 08 2022 21:35 Vindicare605 wrote: The observer speed thing is a revert of a previous pointless change they made to Protoss. Artosis has a video ranting about how it was the dumbest change he's ever seen. The larger model size is their way of attacking that same "issue" of low level Terrans not being able to kill observers by making them easier to see with the shimmer I suppose. It's completely ridiculous and I don't know why they think it's an issue that needs addressing but the important thing is that the Observer speed "buff" in this patch is simply a revert back to what it was for years and years previously. As for the whole "Terran is only viable in Korea" that's not the point I'm making with my rants about Zerg. Terran is doing better now in the foreign pro scene than in any previous point in SC2's history except for VERY early WoL. They're frequently competitive now but not "Best in the World" or "World Champion" competitive. That level of competitive for foreigners has been reserved for Zerg players only, and has been for years. Whenever Zerg looks like it might start to struggle even a little bit, they IMMEDIATELY get buffed because Blizz can't allow it for Foreign pros to not have their best race be competitive with the Korean elite players. Meanwhile when Zerg is dominant, like they were for years and arguable still are, Blizzard is PAINFULLY slow in nerfing them even when the level of dominance they display like in 2019 is unlike anything the other races have ever demonstrated outside of again early WoL. It's a consistent pattern. Blizz has been doing it for years. The question is why? But I'm convinced the answer is because of Zerg's untouchable place as the only race that has ever had success for foreigners at the top top level. Blizzard doesn't want to change that. But we have rising foreign stars that play other races, such as Clem for terran and MaxPax for protoss. MaxPax doesn't want to show himself so you can't market him, but Clem can be the poster boy! The only thing preventing them is probably the fact that if you make terran as strong as the other two races and/or stronger, Maru will simply win everything and he is a KR player. | ||
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Athenau
569 Posts
On December 08 2022 18:10 Charoisaur wrote: Well after thinking a bit, changes don't seem to bad. 13.5 range to cancel snipe seems quite large, so it won't be easy to cancel it and Broodlings got less life span, EMP change seems like a buff and a nerf at the same time since the upgrade was quite expensive. Only thing I really dislike is the sensor tower change which seems really uncalled for and I'm not sure what's the point of the Raven changes. This won't make them less dominant in TvT as they are cheaper now and still disable tanks for long enough to win a fight 13.5 range is tiny. Snipe range is 10, so if you start a snipe at max range, the target unit only has to move 3.5 units away. To put it in perspective, even a queen (on creep) can walk out of snipe range if the Zerg reacts quickly. | ||
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Argonauta
Spain4906 Posts
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