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On November 10 2020 14:37 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On November 10 2020 13:58 FataLe wrote:On November 10 2020 12:26 LTCM wrote:On November 10 2020 10:53 Baffels wrote:
How long has it been since a foreign terran won a premier tournament? 1 day. foreign terrans are broken i just wonder is serral in real big slump right now ? ;Oo
Oh! A player that was better than everyone else is no longer better than EVERYONE, he loses to 1 specific player every once in a... wait. That was last year. This year he loses to about 3 more players. Serral only wins vs nearly everyone.
What a big slump! How was he unable to keep top class for 3 years straight? He would have been the first one to do it, so why didn't he?
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Serral may be in a 'slump', but his passionate fanbois certainly aren't 
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On November 10 2020 16:12 RKC wrote:Serral may be in a 'slump', but his passionate fanbois certainly aren't
I am not a passionate fanboy. I am more nerdy and annoying than that.
I am passionate about word meanings.
Serral is not in a "big slump". He is simply not the best any more. The benchmark can't be "the best there is" when talking about slumping. Serral was peaking and had a slow descent.
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Slump? Dunno. Maybe a bit. He certainly lost his calm demeanor ^^
But I'd say arguable still among the three best Zerg on the planet at this moment.
Depending on how the season finals fare, Clem might be clawing his way in the top three Terrans.
Also curious to see if Astrea has global impact or just clowNA
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On November 10 2020 17:06 Harris1st wrote:
Slump? Dunno. Maybe a bit. He certainly lost his calm demeanor ^^
But I'd say arguable still among the three best Zerg on the planet at this moment.
Depending on how the season finals fare, Clem might be clawing his way in the top three Terrans.
Also curious to see if Astrea has global impact or just clowNA
He played great matches on GSL also
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not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players.
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On November 11 2020 07:00 Anc13nt wrote:
not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players.
except when he loses 0-3 to Cure
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On November 11 2020 07:28 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2020 07:00 Anc13nt wrote:
not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players. except when he loses 0-3 to Cure
Low effort bait, try again.
Serral is doing better than ever against koreans in 2020, better than 2018 as a whole(not only his period of invincibility), even if slightly(71% to 69/70%).
His win ratio against foreigners, instead, dropped by 11% and it is now lower than his wr against koreans.
Serral is even less clutch this year than he was in 2019 but he is not slumping at all.
He is performing worse, my two cents is that he has lost too often by not playing to his strenght.
If Serral is slumping, how would you call, for example, Dark's performance in comparison?
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On November 11 2020 08:01 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2020 07:28 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 07:00 Anc13nt wrote:
not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players. except when he loses 0-3 to Cure Low effort bait, try again. Serral is doing better than ever against koreans in 2020, better than 2018 as a whole(not only his period of invincibility), even if slightly(71% to 69/70%). His win ratio against foreigners, instead, dropped by 11% and it is now lower than his wr against koreans. Serral is even less clutch this year than he was in 2019 but he is not slumping at all. He is performing worse, my two cents is that he has lost too often by not playing to his strenght. If Serral is slumping, how would you call, for example, Dark's performance in comparison?
Well, Serral still beats the players he's supposed to beat but vs the other top players he loses more often than not.
Dark is also slumping, his fans don't make excuses for him unlike for Serral.
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On November 11 2020 17:50 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2020 08:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 11 2020 07:28 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 07:00 Anc13nt wrote:
not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players. except when he loses 0-3 to Cure Low effort bait, try again. Serral is doing better than ever against koreans in 2020, better than 2018 as a whole(not only his period of invincibility), even if slightly(71% to 69/70%). His win ratio against foreigners, instead, dropped by 11% and it is now lower than his wr against koreans. Serral is even less clutch this year than he was in 2019 but he is not slumping at all. He is performing worse, my two cents is that he has lost too often by not playing to his strenght. If Serral is slumping, how would you call, for example, Dark's performance in comparison? Well, Serral still beats the players he's supposed to beat but vs the other top players he loses more often than not. Dark is also slumping, his fans don't make excuses for him unlike for Serral.
This year Serral has lost 6 bo3+ to Reynor, 3 to Clem, twice to Elazer, once to Rogue, Cure, Zest, Hurricane and Lambo.
He is losing more often, especially in ZvZ and against non koreans but he still is over 70%; unlike you said, he dropped series against players he wouldn't have lost against in the past.
Serral loses more often than not against the other top players? False. In 2020, he has a losing record against Reynor(3-6) and Elazer(1-2) whereas he is at least even against every korean he played more than once and Rogue is the only one who beat him in their single encounter.
Serral won three tournaments in 2020(Season Finals and StayAtHomeStoryCupx2).
That's not a slump by any standard, maybe only by Serral's.
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On November 11 2020 21:23 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2020 17:50 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 08:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 11 2020 07:28 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 07:00 Anc13nt wrote:
not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players. except when he loses 0-3 to Cure Low effort bait, try again. Serral is doing better than ever against koreans in 2020, better than 2018 as a whole(not only his period of invincibility), even if slightly(71% to 69/70%). His win ratio against foreigners, instead, dropped by 11% and it is now lower than his wr against koreans. Serral is even less clutch this year than he was in 2019 but he is not slumping at all. He is performing worse, my two cents is that he has lost too often by not playing to his strenght. If Serral is slumping, how would you call, for example, Dark's performance in comparison? Well, Serral still beats the players he's supposed to beat but vs the other top players he loses more often than not. Dark is also slumping, his fans don't make excuses for him unlike for Serral. This year Serral has lost 6 bo3+ to Reynor, 3 to Clem, twice to Elazer, once to Rogue, Cure, Zest, Hurricane and Lambo. He is losing more often, especially in ZvZ and against non koreans but he still is over 70%; unlike you said, he dropped series against players he wouldn't have lost against in the past. Serral loses more often than not against the other top players? False. In 2020, he has a losing record against Reynor(3-6) and Elazer(1-2) whereas he is at least even against every korean he played more than once and Rogue is the only one who beat him in their single encounter. Serral won three tournaments in 2020(Season Finals and StayAtHomeStoryCupx2). That's not a slump by any standard, maybe only by Serral's.
Hmm.. dunno. The level of overall competition with stuff like the split Masters Events has gone down severly IMO.
Which means winrates are highly inflated. Maybe one should only count the Season finals or sth.
My point beeing, 2020 is not comparable to other years in terms of winrate.
And his record vs top competition is more in the fifities
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On November 11 2020 21:23 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2020 17:50 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 08:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 11 2020 07:28 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 07:00 Anc13nt wrote:
not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players. except when he loses 0-3 to Cure Low effort bait, try again. Serral is doing better than ever against koreans in 2020, better than 2018 as a whole(not only his period of invincibility), even if slightly(71% to 69/70%). His win ratio against foreigners, instead, dropped by 11% and it is now lower than his wr against koreans. Serral is even less clutch this year than he was in 2019 but he is not slumping at all. He is performing worse, my two cents is that he has lost too often by not playing to his strenght. If Serral is slumping, how would you call, for example, Dark's performance in comparison? Well, Serral still beats the players he's supposed to beat but vs the other top players he loses more often than not. Dark is also slumping, his fans don't make excuses for him unlike for Serral. This year Serral has lost 6 bo3+ to Reynor, 3 to Clem, twice to Elazer, once to Rogue, Cure, Zest, Hurricane and Lambo. He is losing more often, especially in ZvZ and against non koreans but he still is over 70%; unlike you said, he dropped series against players he wouldn't have lost against in the past. Serral loses more often than not against the other top players? False. In 2020, he has a losing record against Reynor(3-6) and Elazer(1-2) whereas he is at least even against every korean he played more than once and Rogue is the only one who beat him in their single encounter. Serral won three tournaments in 2020(Season Finals and StayAtHomeStoryCupx2). That's not a slump by any standard, maybe only by Serral's.
He was still stronger at the start of the year but now he has lost the last 4 series to Reynor, lost twice to Clem (and especially the 2nd time he looked almost outclassed in some of the games) and recently lost 0-3 to Cure.
I think that can be called a slump for a top player (not only for Serral)
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Big congratulations to Clem for the first premier title! That was an incredible performance
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On November 11 2020 21:46 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2020 21:23 Xain0n wrote:On November 11 2020 17:50 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 08:01 Xain0n wrote:On November 11 2020 07:28 Charoisaur wrote:On November 11 2020 07:00 Anc13nt wrote:
not sure if Serral is slumping. I think it's just Reynor and Clem improved. Serral is still doing well against the Korean players. except when he loses 0-3 to Cure Low effort bait, try again. Serral is doing better than ever against koreans in 2020, better than 2018 as a whole(not only his period of invincibility), even if slightly(71% to 69/70%). His win ratio against foreigners, instead, dropped by 11% and it is now lower than his wr against koreans. Serral is even less clutch this year than he was in 2019 but he is not slumping at all. He is performing worse, my two cents is that he has lost too often by not playing to his strenght. If Serral is slumping, how would you call, for example, Dark's performance in comparison? Well, Serral still beats the players he's supposed to beat but vs the other top players he loses more often than not. Dark is also slumping, his fans don't make excuses for him unlike for Serral. This year Serral has lost 6 bo3+ to Reynor, 3 to Clem, twice to Elazer, once to Rogue, Cure, Zest, Hurricane and Lambo. He is losing more often, especially in ZvZ and against non koreans but he still is over 70%; unlike you said, he dropped series against players he wouldn't have lost against in the past. Serral loses more often than not against the other top players? False. In 2020, he has a losing record against Reynor(3-6) and Elazer(1-2) whereas he is at least even against every korean he played more than once and Rogue is the only one who beat him in their single encounter. Serral won three tournaments in 2020(Season Finals and StayAtHomeStoryCupx2). That's not a slump by any standard, maybe only by Serral's. He was still stronger at the start of the year but now he has lost the last 4 series to Reynor, lost twice to Clem (and especially the 2nd time he looked almost outclassed in some of the games) and recently lost 0-3 to Cure. I think that can be called a slump for a top player (not only for Serral)
This happened the 13th of August, so you are speaking of the last three months. Since then, Serral placed 2nd in Douyu Cup, 3rd in both WCS Europe and was stopped in ro8 in both Kings of Battle and DH Fall's Season Finals; he defeated Maru, Trap, Inno and Clem twice.
I agree that this is Serral's worst streak against top tier players and also his worst streak of tournament results since his pre-ascension era; a slump, however, is much worse than that. I see no early elimination in groupstages, no desolating level of play, no worrying win percentage.
On November 11 2020 21:38 Harris1st wrote:
Hmm.. dunno. The level of overall competition with stuff like the split Masters Events has gone down severly IMO.
Which means winrates are highly inflated. Maybe one should only count the Season finals or sth.
My point beeing, 2020 is not comparable to other years in terms of winrate.
And his record vs top competition is more in the fifities
The only reason for which 2020 is not comparable to other years is cross server online play; I don't agree about the general level of competition being lower.
There have actually been more events with koreans in 2020 and while a united WCS event would be harder than the sum of its regional competitions, DH EU became much harder since Reynor improved further and Clem skyrocketed to the top tier.
As for Serral, your impression is just wrong if you are speaking of 2020 as a whole; even excluding the 10-1 against koreans in bo1 and adding his results against Reynor, Clem and Elazer, his win ratio is above 60% in games and 68% in series.
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Northern Ireland27477 Posts
Serral's slump, or whatever one wants to call is still a better 2020 overall than Clem who is on a tear.
Weirdly perception of Serral's level might actually be improved if we had a lot of high quality offline international tournies, where his solidity in all 3 matchups and general consistent level of performance would be rewarded.
As it is he's trapped in either losing to Reynor or Clem and he's been supplanted, or if he wins it's par for the course and when he wins to top Korean competition it's got the cross-server asterix against it.
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Wonderful performance by Clem and Astrea. Clem's TvZ is such a feast for the eyes. I wonder if Astrea will do as well as Neeb and Clem in the season finals, and show that foreigners (outside of the beasts Reynor and Serral) are now definitely as good as top koreans.
The preview of the next Aligulac ranking has no korean players in the top 3, as Clem is now ahead of Maru.
Is the young French the best terran in the world right now?
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On November 12 2020 00:54 WombaT wrote:
Serral's slump, or whatever one wants to call is still a better 2020 overall than Clem who is on a tear.
Weirdly perception of Serral's level might actually be improved if we had a lot of high quality offline international tournies, where his solidity in all 3 matchups and general consistent level of performance would be rewarded.
As it is he's trapped in either losing to Reynor or Clem and he's been supplanted, or if he wins it's par for the course and when he wins to top Korean competition it's got the cross-server asterix against it.
Serral's slump is somewhat of a myth. He still barely loses to Reynor, usually just by one game, who got infinitely better this year.
Ppl seem to forget zerg has been nerfed non stop for 3 years, while other races have been buffed non stop.
The amount of nerfs that zerg got in a row is like never before.
They got strategies taken away, opening taken away, spells taken away, while other races got new builds, new strats, and buffs to their defense.
Zerg backbone, ( creep, queens, banelings) all got nerfed a bunch of time.
Every other zerg is also doing alot worse than before, and iits only going to get worse with time. Reynor is the only one doing better, and its only because he got much better.
But i mean Clem got alot better+ got buffs and zerg got nerfs, so the difference becomes huge.
Im just wondering, if it turns out Zergs is obviously underpowered., who is left to balance the game? I dont think theres anyone left.
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On November 12 2020 06:18 Snakestyle11 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2020 00:54 WombaT wrote:
Serral's slump, or whatever one wants to call is still a better 2020 overall than Clem who is on a tear.
Weirdly perception of Serral's level might actually be improved if we had a lot of high quality offline international tournies, where his solidity in all 3 matchups and general consistent level of performance would be rewarded.
As it is he's trapped in either losing to Reynor or Clem and he's been supplanted, or if he wins it's par for the course and when he wins to top Korean competition it's got the cross-server asterix against it.
Serral's slump is somewhat of a myth. He still barely loses to Reynor, usually just by one game, who got infinitely better this year. Ppl seem to forget zerg has been nerfed non stop for 3 years, while other races have been buffed non stop. The amount of nerfs that zerg got in a row is like never before. They got strategies taken away, opening taken away, spells taken away, while other races got new builds, new strats, and buffs to their defense. Zerg backbone, ( creep, queens, banelings) all got nerfed a bunch of time. Every other zerg is also doing alot worse than before, and iits only going to get worse with time. Reynor is the only one doing better, and its only because he got much better. But i mean Clem got alot better+ got buffs and zerg got nerfs, so the difference becomes huge. Im just wondering, if it turns out Zergs is obviously underpowered., who is left to balance the game? I dont think theres anyone left.
 Premier Tournaments
Zerg won 9 out of 16 premier tournaments so far this year. 56%
Zerg won 10 out of 17 premier tournaments last year. 59%
Zerg won 9 out of 15 premier tournaments two years ago. 60%
If this horrible trend continues, zerg might win just barely over half of the tournaments next year. What a travesty to the zerg race that would be.
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Im just wondering, if it turns out Zergs is obviously underpowered., who is left to balance the game? I dont think theres anyone left.
As long as Clem is so much better than every other EU terran, I don't think you should worry. It isn't like Reynor and Serral never take series of him either.
If Terran ends up winning too much on (50%+ of premiers) this patch and map pool, it should be pretty easy to balance TvZ with bigger and more open maps and removing Submarine.
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Serral is definitely slumping. Serral's a good enough player that even in a slump he's a contender in any tournament he enters, but for almost two years Serral was the favorite to win almost anything he entered. Hopefully he gets back into top form ahead of Katowice.
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EPT
