EPTTY & Stats on the Future and Decline of Korean SC2 - Page 3
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Kinky
United States4126 Posts
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[Phantom]
Mexico2170 Posts
Proleague fell because blizzard butchered their management of StarCraft. When they finally transitioned to BW from SC2 Blizzard had already screwed the scene too much so interest for SC2 didn't compare to BW at the top. That coupled with the rise of league in Korea, it was clear sc2 proleague was not going to last. Not saying the match fixing helped, but it would have happened anyway. | ||
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RealityTheGreat
China564 Posts
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Mizenhauer
United States1971 Posts
On August 29 2020 01:25 [Phantom] wrote: Why do people blame the life matchfixing scandal with the fall of proleague? Proleague fell because blizzard butchered their management of StarCraft. When they finally transitioned to BW from SC2 Blizzard had already screwed the scene too much so interest for SC2 didn't compare to BW at the top. That coupled with the rise of league in Korea, it was clear sc2 proleague was not going to last. Not saying the match fixing helped, but it would have happened anyway. Maybe because the KeSPA commissioner said it was impossible to get sponsors after the matchfixing scandal??? (and, yes proleague would have ended eventually, but it ended at that exact moment because of life/prime/bbyong) | ||
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Jerubaal
United States7684 Posts
On August 27 2020 15:45 jpg06051992 wrote: It's always going to be niche. SC2 is chess which only the tactical and the astute appreciate, then you have things like Fortnite/PubG/whatever that appeal to the brainless masses. My ignorant opinion is that the casual players are driving the pro scene rather than vice versa. SC2, imo, is a waaay better spectator sport than Dota 2, but people like to play Dota 2 with their friends, so that keeps their interest. | ||
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CicadaSC
United States2039 Posts
Foreigners should not be allowed to play in GSL and ESL Circuit. Currently because of covid19 there are not many foreigners competing in GSL besides Special but in a normal season there could be 3+ on any season and i think players like Prince and any other korean semi pros would benefit from this. there is no WCS Challenger like NA/EU has for semi pros to make money so GSL is all theyve got. Solar and many other koreans think this system is unfair since 2018. Please change. https://twitter.com/sc2_solar/status/1073116274144595968?lang=en | ||
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AssyrianKing
Australia2146 Posts
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[Phantom]
Mexico2170 Posts
On August 29 2020 10:37 Jerubaal wrote: My ignorant opinion is that the casual players are driving the pro scene rather than vice versa. SC2, imo, is a waaay better spectator sport than Dota 2, but people like to play Dota 2 with their friends, so that keeps their interest. A long time ago I did a comparison of the ratios of viewers compared to playerbase in sc2, dota 2 and League. The number was way, way higher for SC2 . I don't remember the exact numbers maybe I'll look for it in the future it must be around somewhere but I remember it being like 5 times bigger for Starcraft. But yeah, basically those games have massive viewerships because the playership is massive, but more people watched sc2 compared to the playerbase (and this was a few years ago, I think In the Hearth of the swarm era when sc2 had bigger numbers). I think part of it was that, even though there was a lot of shit thrown to developers for certain design decisions, they made sc2 from the ground up to be a great spectator esport, and they succeded. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada18017 Posts
On August 28 2020 01:03 deacon.frost wrote: In the top 3 best payed athletes are 2 football players(yes, Ronaldo and Messi), #1 being Roger Federer. (so much for the Tennis) Then it follows with Neymar(football), LeBron James(basketball), Stephen Curry(basketball), Kevin Durant(basketball),Tiger Woods(golf), Kirk Cousin(american football) and Carson Wentz(amrican football) From the top 10 best payed athletes on the earth 8 are from team games. Source - forbes best payed athletes for 2020. Even if you add the next 10 we're adding 5 team sport athletes. Tyson Fury(fighting), Russel Westbrook(basketball), Lewis Hemilton(F1), Rory McIlroy(golf), Jared Goff(american football), Conor McGregor(fighting), James Harden(basketball), Giannis Antetokounmpo(basketball), Anthony Joshua(box) and Deontay Wilder (box) Soooooo, nope? I'm sorry for butchered names and if I added wrong sport to some person. So, from top 20 we have 8 being 1v1, with heavier focus on team games at the top. And I briefly scanned the next 20 and unless I made an error(which is possible) there are 7 non-team athletes. 5 of them from Tennis  Link to them articlez: https://www.forbes.com/athletes/#1e1a6e2755ae IN 2018 Floyd Mayweather made $285 million. https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2018/06/13/full-list-the-worlds-highest-paid-athletes-2018/#18d2c5c77d9f he is way past his prime. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27477 Posts
On August 29 2020 13:49 [Phantom] wrote: A long time ago I did a comparison of the ratios of viewers compared to playerbase in sc2, dota 2 and League. The number was way, way higher for SC2 . I don't remember the exact numbers maybe I'll look for it in the future it must be around somewhere but I remember it being like 5 times bigger for Starcraft. But yeah, basically those games have massive viewerships because the playership is massive, but more people watched sc2 compared to the playerbase (and this was a few years ago, I think In the Hearth of the swarm era when sc2 had bigger numbers). I think part of it was that, even though there was a lot of shit thrown to developers for certain design decisions, they made sc2 from the ground up to be a great spectator esport, and they succeded. That would make sense to me, both me 7 year old and my girlfriend both were able to quite enjoy watching Starcraft, I was just watching GSL or something on my phone while doing something else and both times we ended up watching together (with some brief explanation). They were able to at least get a feel for what was happening, and casters tend to do a good job here too. Despite actually playing WC3 DoTA and having an idea of the mechanics I have close to zero idea what’s going on when watching a MOBA. Lots of spells and visual cues for said spells to know. Plus it’s interactions between two whole teams of players as well. | ||
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Poaktree
165 Posts
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AbouSV
Germany1278 Posts
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coverpunch
United States2093 Posts
It remains a shock that Brood War developed a sustained pro-gaming scene at all and that it happened in South Korea, which involves a special confluence. The comparison to tennis should also note the paradox of consistency in results. In the 2010s, tennis actually got a nice boost because the top 4 men have remained very consistent - Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, and Murray. Women's tennis has suffered after the Williams sisters because the top women have very inconsistent results. It gets exacerbated in infrastructure that the top men can hire support staff and get ad deals because their results are fairly predictable but the women have a tougher time because the results are inconsistent and nobody wants to be Anna Kournikova. | ||
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Boblington
2 Posts
Also long cool downs are dumb. Big maps with big cool downs is a waiting game. | ||
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Xamo
Spain886 Posts
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On August 27 2020 21:37 LTCM wrote: I've come to accept why a region lock was needed years and years ago. No one has ever answered me why region lock was left in place for 2019 and now 2020. And then as icing on the cake, Apollo will tell you, "we are considering the possibility of removing region lock for 2021". How is it a possibility... Should be 100% final and approved already. Shame on blizzard and now ESL. You cannot boast everyone else by continuing to choke hold kr. Region lock was always a crap shoot. | ||
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MoonyD
Australia191 Posts
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sertman
United States540 Posts
We can bemoan the lack of popularity of Starcraft without insinuating that it's just too hard for your regular plebian gamer. | ||
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October34th
7 Posts
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Harris1st
Germany7440 Posts
On August 29 2020 10:58 CicadaSC wrote: if we want to see korean amateurs rise up we need to region lock Korea i think. similar to what we did in foreign scene. Foreigners should not be allowed to play in GSL and ESL Circuit. Currently because of covid19 there are not many foreigners competing in GSL besides Special but in a normal season there could be 3+ on any season and i think players like Prince and any other korean semi pros would benefit from this. there is no WCS Challenger like NA/EU has for semi pros to make money so GSL is all theyve got. Solar and many other koreans think this system is unfair since 2018. Please change. https://twitter.com/sc2_solar/status/1073116274144595968?lang=en I don't think region locking Korea would change anything. Foreigners that mostly play in GSL (SpeCial, Scarlett, Astrea, Sortof, Jake, ... ) are Tier 2 foreigners. They really don't make a difference cause they are Ro24 or Ro16 fodder at best and don't even make the cut at worst. What could make a difference would be challenger tournaments with a really flat payout curve and maybe seeds into Ro16 or even the "Code A" giving out some price moneys | ||
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