• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 13:25
CEST 19:25
KST 02:25
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments0[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence10Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12
Community News
BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch0Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups4WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments1SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia8Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues29
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.15 PTR Patch Notes #1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy SpeCial on The Tasteless Podcast
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around
Brood War
General
Soulkey on ASL S20 BW General Discussion ASL20 General Discussion ASL TICKET LIVE help! :D NaDa's Body
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group D [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Ro16 Group C BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Borderlands 3 Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread UK Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
i'm really bored guys
Peanutsc
I <=> 9
KrillinFromwales
The Personality of a Spender…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2531 users

4.11.3 Patch (Adept revert) + Community Update

Forum Index > SC2 General
124 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Next All
Brutaxilos
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States2629 Posts
December 18 2019 09:36 GMT
#1
Multiplayer Changes: https://starcraft2.com/en-us/news/23230078
Adept

Resonating Glaives upgrade effects reverted. The Resonating Glaives upgrade will now increase the attack speed of Adepts by 45%.


Infestor

Microbial Shroud radius increased from 3 to 3.5.
Microbial Shroud energy cost reduced from 100 to 75.
Removed the Hive research requirement from Microbial Shroud.




Community Update: https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/sc2/t/community-update-december-17-2019/6602

Hey everyone,

It’s been a few weeks since the 2019 post-BlizzCon changes went live, and before the year comes to a close, we’d like to take some time to review the changes we’ve made and the resulting games we’ve seen so far. Some notable tournaments we’ve been paying attention to include Nation Wars, WESG qualifiers, and of course, HomeStory Cup XX.

One of the hot topics of 2019 was the Nydus Worm, and based on the games we’ve seen so far, we feel pretty good about its level of use and its effectiveness when used. Nydus and Nydus/Swarm Host usage has generally decreased in ZvP, which we believe is caused by both changes to the Nydus Worm and the map pool. And when Nydus Worms are used in the matchup, we feel a lot better about the new level of difficulty by which Protoss has to fight them. Meanwhile, while we’re seeing less direct Nydus aggression in ZvT, we do see increased Nydus/Swarm Host usage, which we attribute to a spike in the popularity of mech play.

Another popular topic of discussion in 2019 was the strength of Infestor/Brood Lord and the resulting passive endgames it caused. With the changes made to both these units in the post-BlizCon patch, we believe the late-games that we see are a lot more dynamic, and small decisions in the late-game feel more impactful to the end result of the game.

In general, when it comes to balance, especially late-game balance, we believe it’ll take quite a bit more time before we can come to any definitive conclusions. Not only are sample sizes small, the styles players are using are more divergent from each other than usual, reflective of a meta after a big patch. For now, our focus is on the end-game dynamics of each matchup with special focus on units that we changed recently including the Liberator, Thor, Lurker, and Infestor. With that said, we’d like to make two design-motivated adjustments.

Adept

  • Resonating Glaives upgrade effects reverted. The Resonating Glaives upgrade will now increase the attack speed of Adepts by 45%.

We tried a new version of the Resonated Glaives upgrade with the goals of moving it away from the front-line pusher and emphasizing the coolness of the Shade Projection ability. However, it ran into some oddities in practice. For example, in the heat of battle, it took away from the interesting mind-game of whether the Shade would be canceled, because the Adept user is so highly incentivized to finish their Shade. It also created awkward scenarios where Adept users are encouraged to Shade onto themselves in the middle of a fight. For these reasons, we’d like to revert this change to the Adept.

Infestor

  • Microbial Shroud radius increased from 3 to 3.5
  • Microbial Shroud energy cost reduced from 100 to 75.
  • Removed the Hive research requirement from Microbial Shroud.

As a general rule, we try to tune new skills and abilities to be on the strong side when we initially introduce them to promote experimentation. With Microbial Shroud, we probably didn’t go far enough, leading to its low use in tournament games. The changes introduced here are geared towards increasing accessibility and moderating the effectiveness of enemy area-of-effect abilities against Shrouds.

Both changes should go live with an upcoming update on Tuesday, December 17, PST. Let us know what you think on any community site, thanks for your feedback, and happy holidays!

-StarCraft II Team
Facebook Twitter Reddit
Jangbi favorite player. Forever~ CJ herO the King of IEM. BOMBERRRRRRRR. Sexy Boy Rogue. soO #1! Oliveira China Represent!
IDontKnowDoYou
Profile Joined December 2019
1 Post
Last Edited: 2019-12-17 20:10:25
December 17 2019 20:09 GMT
#2
To quote my good friend Alarak: "Oh dear ... I had expected so much more".
Elentos
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
55553 Posts
December 17 2019 20:11 GMT
#3
Adept revert is surprisingly fast, but not unexpected and definitely called for. I'm sure the Shroud buff will please Penev.
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
Durnuu
Profile Joined September 2013
13320 Posts
December 17 2019 20:31 GMT
#4
Shroud hype
BUNNYYYYYYYYY https://i.imgur.com/BiCF577.png
NspFancy
Profile Joined May 2016
Korea (South)21 Posts
December 17 2019 21:42 GMT
#5
Pls buff zerg !
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany15977 Posts
December 17 2019 22:50 GMT
#6
Finally some Zerg buffs
Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
Fango
Profile Joined July 2016
United Kingdom8987 Posts
December 18 2019 01:50 GMT
#7
It's about time they gave zerg something to use in lategame
Zest, sOs, PartinG, Dark, and Maru are the real champs. ROOT_herO is overrated. Snute, Serral, and Scarlett are the foreigner GOATs
Snakestyle11
Profile Joined December 2018
191 Posts
December 18 2019 02:44 GMT
#8
Thats actually a Zerg nerf and might trick zerg into wasting energy on shroud.
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
December 18 2019 03:25 GMT
#9
Jesus I can't beleive they are buffing shroud, I have literaly never seen a single zerg lose a game once they start using it.
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
tigon_ridge
Profile Joined March 2019
482 Posts
December 18 2019 03:38 GMT
#10
I would love to see zerg get the ability to permanently mind control a worker, like in BW. It was always very entertaining when it happened, so I don't know why the dev team decided to leave that out of SC2. Please incorporate to SC2. It probably won't get used much at all in tournaments, but crowds would literally stain their pants if they ever see Serral control zerg armies with terran units sprinkled in.
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
December 18 2019 04:30 GMT
#11
On December 18 2019 12:38 tigon_ridge wrote:
I would love to see zerg get the ability to permanently mind control a worker, like in BW. It was always very entertaining when it happened, so I don't know why the dev team decided to leave that out of SC2. Please incorporate to SC2. It probably won't get used much at all in tournaments, but crowds would literally stain their pants if they ever see Serral control zerg armies with terran units sprinkled in.


You can neural a worker and build a town hall tho, dosen't really work vs Terran since a cc take longer to build that the neural so you need to chain neural but vs P you can do it
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
Ben...
Profile Joined January 2011
Canada3485 Posts
December 18 2019 04:37 GMT
#12
I'm glad they're reverting the adept change. I'm a bit surprised they did it so quickly, but it was blatantly obvious that adepts were significantly worse with the glaives change. They were useless defensively, and only basically only useful for coin flip all-ins where you hoped the opponent would be caught off guard by them. At least now they will have some of their utility in early-midgame PvZ back.
"Cliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide" -Tastosis
Mahanaim
Profile Joined December 2012
Korea (South)1002 Posts
December 18 2019 04:42 GMT
#13
We're going to regret the Shroud buff.
Celebrating Starcraft since... a long time ago.
Woosixion
Profile Joined February 2012
120 Posts
December 18 2019 04:43 GMT
#14
On December 18 2019 12:25 Nakajin wrote:
Jesus I can't beleive they are buffing shroud, I have literaly never seen a single zerg lose a game once they start using it.


Triggered.

On December 18 2019 11:44 Snakestyle11 wrote:
Thats actually a Zerg nerf and might trick zerg into wasting energy on shroud.


Damnit man lmao

Whats logic behind the adept revert though, cause it was useless if they canceled shade? I thought that was the point. A canceled shade shouldnt be just as strong as a finished shade, theres' gotta be SOME drawback.

Oh wait, no there doesnt. This is Protoss we're talking here.





User was warned for this post.
the only way out is through...
ZigguratOfUr
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Iraq16955 Posts
December 18 2019 06:14 GMT
#15
On December 18 2019 13:30 Nakajin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2019 12:38 tigon_ridge wrote:
I would love to see zerg get the ability to permanently mind control a worker, like in BW. It was always very entertaining when it happened, so I don't know why the dev team decided to leave that out of SC2. Please incorporate to SC2. It probably won't get used much at all in tournaments, but crowds would literally stain their pants if they ever see Serral control zerg armies with terran units sprinkled in.


You can neural a worker and build a town hall tho, dosen't really work vs Terran since a cc take longer to build that the neural so you need to chain neural but vs P you can do it


In BW you get separate supply which is pretty big. Though even then you only saw it in pro games once in a blue moon.
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6956 Posts
December 18 2019 08:23 GMT
#16
On December 18 2019 12:25 Nakajin wrote:
Jesus I can't beleive they are buffing shroud, I have literaly never seen a single zerg lose a game once they start using it.


Can't tell if you are serious or not ^^
I have never seen shroud used in a pro game, ever
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
RandomPlayer
Profile Joined April 2012
Russian Federation394 Posts
December 18 2019 08:51 GMT
#17
Finally zerg winrate will get to 100%, much needed buff :D

To be honest, something should be nerfed in order to match the buff.
WaesumNinja
Profile Joined February 2012
210 Posts
December 18 2019 09:47 GMT
#18
On December 18 2019 17:51 RandomPlayer wrote:To be honest, something should be nerfed in order to match the buff.


...why? That spell is hardly used yet and I'm not sure why it's locked behind an upgrade to begin with. Comparing shroud with infested terran it's a straight up nerf.
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
December 18 2019 09:56 GMT
#19
On December 18 2019 17:23 Harris1st wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2019 12:25 Nakajin wrote:
Jesus I can't beleive they are buffing shroud, I have literaly never seen a single zerg lose a game once they start using it.


Can't tell if you are serious or not ^^
I have never seen shroud used in a pro game, ever


Well I never said I had seen a zerg win a game after using it
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
sneakyfox
Profile Joined January 2017
8216 Posts
December 18 2019 10:07 GMT
#20
It's fine to Buff The Shroud to see how it works in top games, but still... they are actually buffing zerg casters here, which seems crazy considering their current level of power.

That said, there can still be many changes and they are not saying this is the final update.

For now, our focus is on the end-game dynamics of each matchup with special focus on units that we changed recently including the Liberator, Thor, Lurker, and Infestor.


I really think they should add the Viper to that list.
"I saw what sneakyfox wrote on TL.net and it made me furious" - PartinG
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 16h 35m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
UpATreeSC 209
JuggernautJason130
ProTech91
Codebar 36
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 25389
Horang2 1794
Bisu 1599
EffOrt 661
Mini 409
Hyuk 292
Larva 208
Soulkey 112
hero 97
Rush 90
[ Show more ]
ggaemo 88
Hyun 38
Aegong 34
ToSsGirL 26
Yoon 21
scan(afreeca) 16
Sexy 8
IntoTheRainbow 8
sas.Sziky 1
Dota 2
Gorgc7450
qojqva3443
XcaliburYe169
Fuzer 46
League of Legends
Trikslyr61
Counter-Strike
ScreaM1097
fl0m893
Other Games
gofns22858
tarik_tv21410
FrodaN1298
Beastyqt549
Lowko329
RotterdaM261
Hui .236
ArmadaUGS123
C9.Mang075
QueenE57
mouzStarbuck40
NeuroSwarm30
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Reevou 1
• intothetv
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki6
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2451
• WagamamaTV475
League of Legends
• Nemesis3878
• TFBlade666
Other Games
• imaqtpie274
• Shiphtur215
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
16h 35m
Zoun vs Classic
Map Test Tournament
17h 35m
Korean StarCraft League
1d 9h
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
1d 14h
RSL Revival
1d 16h
Reynor vs Cure
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Online Event
2 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
LiuLi Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-10
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL World Championship of Poland 2025
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.