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NonY
8751 Posts
On January 17 2019 16:10 showstealer1829 wrote: And this is why Ladder qualification was, is and will forever be a completely stupid fucking idea baiting out the cheaters seems like a bonus, not a drawback. how do you conclude in any way that ladder qualifiers are bad from all of this? | ||
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Aegwynn
Italy460 Posts
On January 18 2019 05:40 NonY wrote: baiting out the cheaters seems like a bonus, not a drawback. how do you conclude in any way that ladder qualifiers are bad from all of this? 1-) Ladder isn't %100 fair for everyone 2-) You only caught few people and assume no one else did anything? How naive. 3-) Cheating definitions are pretty gray since everyone has freedom to play however they want. Everyone have right to throw their games. Unlike tournaments, for most players on the ladder there is nothing on the line. 4-) Why not simply organize an open qualifier / league instead of wasting time with this kind of bshits? Is that enough? There is simply not a single reason favoring ladder qualifications. | ||
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Aegwynn
Italy460 Posts
For what ? He can play however he wants. Can't people just go and play ladder with a clear mind to have fun without having to explain every single game he played to the audience / authorities? This system is just sad. | ||
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brickrd
United States4894 Posts
On January 18 2019 08:02 Aegwynn wrote: 1-) Ladder isn't %100 fair for everyone 2-) You only caught few people and assume no one else did anything? How naive. 3-) Cheating definitions are pretty gray since everyone has freedom to play however they want. Everyone have right to throw their games. Unlike tournaments, for most players on the ladder there is nothing on the line. 4-) Why not simply organize an open qualifier / league instead of wasting time with this kind of bshits? Is that enough? There is simply not a single reason favoring ladder qualifications. 1) tournaments aren't 100% fair either. bracket luck exists and bo3/bo5 don't always show the stronger player. nothing is "100% fair." even in mirrored games like chess someone has to play first. 2) ??? nony didn't say "no one else did anything;" you made that up. 3) yes, definitions are gray - that's why blizzard has a team of people to gather evidence and make a ruling. people manipulated the system, so they were disqualified. this is basic procedural stuff and no problem has occurred other than "cheaters are going to cheat." as for your point about people "having something on the line," people have thrown games and clearly given up in tournaments too. heard of Naniwa rage-throwing games? heard of matchfixing? 4) because variety is fun. more importantly: because SC2 needs an audience to thrive, and an audience who plays the game on ladder is a more engaged audience. seeing pros play on ladder forms a connection between playing the game and watching the game. since SC2 has existed the excitement of watching has been about emulating professional players, this entire game is a tryhard fantasy. you are entitled to dislike this format, but your arguments are not strong. | ||
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NonY
8751 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8989 Posts
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ZHANGYANG01
2 Posts
BUT just hope ladder qualification can be moved next time. | ||
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ydobon
1 Post
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Vanillatoss
76 Posts
On January 18 2019 08:15 Aegwynn wrote: For what ? He can play however he wants. Can't people just go and play ladder with a clear mind to have fun without having to explain every single game he played to the audience / authorities? This system is just sad. He still can play whatever he wants and however he wants... nobody banned him from playing right? But if you want to compete in a tournament.. you have to follow the rules. Its simple as that. Like in football.. you can play whoever, wherever, however you want... sure! And noone will call any fauls or penalties. But only when you play with your friends. They can however bench you for whatever reason. On the other hand, playing in tournament, you cant do that. You have to follow the set or rules cause if you dont then you are simply out  | ||
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MrExplorer
1 Post
baiting out the cheaters seems like a bonus, not a drawback. how do you conclude in any way that ladder qualifiers are bad from all of this? Encouraging or setting traps for players to cheat is never a good thing. You don't want to promote bad behavior, particularly when it's potential rolemodels for younger generations. This is not just catching cheaters, it's enticing it. It looks bad for viewers, players, the tournament, the Starcraft scene, and sponsors. No one has won from this occurance, and no one would like this to happen again. | ||
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Aegwynn
Italy460 Posts
On January 18 2019 20:11 Vanillatoss wrote: He still can play whatever he wants and however he wants... nobody banned him from playing right? But if you want to compete in a tournament.. you have to follow the rules. Its simple as that. Like in football.. you can play whoever, wherever, however you want... sure! And noone will call any fauls or penalties. But only when you play with your friends. They can however bench you for whatever reason. On the other hand, playing in tournament, you cant do that. You have to follow the set or rules cause if you dont then you are simply out The things that you wrote are completely irrelevant and not answering any of my points. I didn't say he got banned i said he had to waste his time posting on forums explaining how he played his personal ladder games. Does it seem convenient and logical to you? And ladder isn't a tournament, not even close. Unlike a real tournament, two people can agree on anything between them simply because there is no spectator/referee and one of the players don't even care about the result. | ||
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lechatnoir
392 Posts
And as it has been pointed out a lot already cheating in this format and in this way is *really* dumb because it is rather obvious from replays and IPs. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16062 Posts
On January 19 2019 02:32 lechatnoir wrote: Aegwynn, when people are playing ladder DURING A TIME THE LADDER RACE IS ON, have enough MMR to be in contention and the necessary skill... they fall under the rules that were quoted either in this thread or in the other one. So no, they can't play ladder any way they like on that specific day because that influences the outcome. Isn't that obvious? And as it has been pointed out a lot already cheating in this format and in this way is *really* dumb because it is rather obvious from replays and IPs. and this is the problem with the ladder qualifier. Puck did nothing wrong and got accused because he queued games at a time the ladder qualifier went on. Is he not allowed to play the game how he wants just because some of his opponents are in contention for qualifiying? | ||
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Aegwynn
Italy460 Posts
On January 19 2019 02:32 lechatnoir wrote: Aegwynn, when people are playing ladder DURING A TIME THE LADDER RACE IS ON, have enough MMR to be in contention and the necessary skill... they fall under the rules that were quoted either in this thread or in the other one. So no, they can't play ladder any way they like on that specific day because that influences the outcome. Isn't that obvious? And as it has been pointed out a lot already cheating in this format and in this way is *really* dumb because it is rather obvious from replays and IPs. Charoisaur already responded to your first question. So no, it isn't obvious. Secondly, i think completely the opposite, people have to be really stupid to get caught wintrading. I think its first time these chinese guys doing it and didn't think people would look their match history. It is extremely easy to wintrade with totally normal looking games. I can just tell you in advance that i will 2 base roach all-in you and thats it. | ||
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