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On November 28 2018 05:23 NinjaNight wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 05:06 Locutos wrote:
Maru lost against 2 players in the same championships with Serral. Also lost to Serral 1 - 0. Serral lost to no one. None. not a single person. Anyone. Zero people. Get it, guys?? DO YOU GET IT?!? N-o o-n-e b-e-a-t S-E-R-R-A-L!
PS: (after February ;D ) Obviously. We all know this, but it's not sufficient. Maru's reign of dominance was prior to this time and against a stronger field over a prolonged period. Also, in these championships Maru unfortunately went up against his weakest link - TvP against sOs and Stats (and being against sOs really compounds the issue) while Serral avoided his weakness ZvT.
This is not true. Serral 3-0'ed Innovation in the GSL vs. the World tournament. And beat Inno, Taeja and Bunny and uThermal in the HSC which at least by initial appearances featured a brand new patch that looks initially more favorable to Terrans vs. Zerg if the performance of the other Zergs vs Terran is an indicator.
And again, in GSL vs the World and Blizzcon where both players were entered, Serral beat everyone he faced and won the tournament. Maru... did not. Serral did his part. It's not Serral's fault that he didn't face Maru, it's Maru's fault.
Maru could have made those finals and taken that money away from Serral. Without question in those tournaments Serral outperformed Maru by beating everyone and winning first place!
If anything, Serral's performance at this last HSC underscores some of his really admirable attributes as a player. He's really adaptable. He adapted within games and within matches. Adapted well enough to a new, arguably unfavorable, patch, to win even if he had some close matches. Muta play didn't work out for him, he went back to hydra. Ultras didn't seem to be the best initial Hive tech choice? Switch back to Broodlords and vipers (but tech switch back to ultra when suitable). Ditto in Blizzcon finals vs. Stats, after winning a couple of games with swarmhost builds, Stats adjusted and forced it to mach point, and Serral went back to Broodlords and won game 7. After losing a couple of quick games to proxy 3 rax in HSC finals, goes pool first and endures playing from a bit behind but goes on to win.
In comparison from what we've seen Maru can be lacking in this department. The first game he lost to sOs at Blizzcon showed so very clearly that sOs had prepared for him like reading a book (not just that he lost but a whole bunch of things happened that should have made clear how prepared sOs was from liberator snipe, widow mine sniping etc.) that the danger should have been very clear and he could have played in base standard and beaten sOs with his very superior macro game, but didn't adapt.
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On November 28 2018 09:01 Starcloud wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 06:23 SetStndbySmn wrote:
You're still proceeding with your argument based on long held sentiment. Firstly Serral faced 0 foreigners at blizzcon. Zero.
Maru's path GSLCodeS: Forte/Leenock(group) -> Neeb/Reynor(group) -> GuMiho -> Zest -> TY
Serral's path in blizzcon: SoS/Zest(group) ->Dark -> Rogue -> Stats.
I really don't think a trivial extra group with Forte, Leenock, and Dear who have a near 0% chance of preventing a player of Maru or Serral's caliber from advancing, makes code S any harder. The difficulty of these paths are pretty similar in difficulty. So similar in difficulty that Serral and Maru's simultaneous presence in the tournament gives the edge to blizzcon easily. Yup, well said there. In fact, one could easily argue that Serrals path to victory was even harder than Maru´s on that occasion. I still cant buy this;
Including the Ro32 of GSL in order to compare it to Blizzcon is misleading because Blizzcon had no Ro32. What counts for the toughness of a tournament is not the particular path of one player but the strength of the overall field so that the winner has to overcome very hard competition at some point in the tournament. I'm not arguing that Blizzcon is a lesser tournament like some try to, but saying Blizzcon is even harder than GSL is just objectively wrong if you compare the field of players in those tournaments from Ro16 on.
SetStndbySmn's idea that Maru and Serral being simultaneously at Blizzcon makes it th hardest tournament is also misleading because as far as we can say Maru wasn't in top shape anymore at Blizzcon.
On November 28 2018 09:01 Starcloud wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2018 05:34 NinjaNight wrote:
Maru won GSL Code S, the hardest tournament in existence, multiple times which was unprecedented. Serral wasn't at GSL Code S so unfortunately we can only speculate, but the point is Maru's achievement was incredible and could be considered as good or better than what Serral has done.
Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 00:25 NinjaNight wrote:
Wtf? GSL Code S is clearly harder than Blizzcon. Maru's problem at Blizzcon is he ran into his kryptonite, sOs, his protoss teammate who just has his number. It's similar to how Nadal is Federer's kryptonite and beat him all the time, but Federer is still the best ever.
Again, let's see Serral start competing in the GSL Code S tournaments and see how he does.
And I'm not even trying to argue that Maru is better. I'm not claiming who is better. I'm saying you're all jumping to conclusions and assuming that Serral is better and assuming that Serral absolutely had a better year when you shouldn't be.
But well, Serral hasnt had any kryptonite, now has he ? Instead he demolished sOs more easily than Has. Still havent read any clear facts or even well based justifications that Code S is more hard than Blizzcon, because that simply isnt true. Same goes with GSL vs. the World. Preparing or not preparing doesnt imo mean that much, besides that should also weigh the scale towards Serral, who hasnt had that many opportunities to prepare all of his opponents all the time, and still has crushed everybody. And losing to sOs.....or even Stats, how can you not calculate those defeats since Serral also played him both tournaments and won both. And also, so that people dont forget, Serral also beat Maru then in that one match, adding to his resume. Doesnt that count too ? So, all in all, Maru failed 3 times when he was against Serral (Stats, sOs, Serral) in tournaments, while Serral won all of them. If you want to be a "purist" and look it at that way. How can you say Maru was better ? In the end, either way we look at the results, these can only lead to one clear conclusion; Serral was, by far, the best player of 2018 ^^.
Serral was not confronted with top terran material, so little do we know if this would've been doable for him.
Including the loss to sOs in the comparison is also misleading because that compares a Maru out of top form with Serral in his top form. Maru's period of dominance lasted from march to septembre while Serral's began with GSL vs the World in August.
Serrals score vs Koreans is 15-0 in his prime, and Maru's is 18-2. Comparing this streaks doesn't say much about who is the better player. One rather has to compare the achievements made in their respective periods of dominance. And I still think that Maru's 3 GSLs are more impressive that Serral's two comparable tournament victories.
Including the Serral-Maru Bo1 Showmatch in this argument is just silly. This just shows that Serral is a great player who can take a Map of Maru. Nobody would've ever doubted that.
I made the hassle and compared the aligulac points of each opponent in the streaks of Maru and Serral at the time when they played them. But funnily we don't get clarity from that either because the average of Maru's oppenents is 2585 and of Serral's opponents 2586. That one point difference can easily be dismissed due to the overall upwards trend of aligulac points which doesn't reflect an objective upward trend in skill.
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On November 28 2018 16:21 nanaoei wrote:
plot armour
This really is the best way to describe Serral. He narrowly keep escaping death to continue the cool foreigner/bonjwa storyline.
The 0-3 to Neeb was just a dream sequence
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On November 28 2018 06:39 Kurao wrote:A cool series, personally I was cheering for INno so it was a little disappointing to see him not being able to close it out, but at the same time very well played by Serral as well. The first game on Lost and Found was definitely my favorite (no bias  )
Finnish guy cheering for the korean against a finnish? shame on you!
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France12953 Posts
All this overshadows the fact that french players still perform like shit 
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On November 28 2018 19:59 Poopi wrote:All this overshadows the fact that french players still perform like shit
Inno is french now!
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On November 28 2018 19:59 Poopi wrote:All this overshadows the fact that french players still perform like shit
Weird thing is that france was the top foreigner nation not so long ago but the best players kind of... dodged the pressure?
Just imagine how much on top france could be by now if Lilbow would've continued, Stephano and Marinelord wouldn't have taken their hiatus and Dayshi actually would've gone on full tryhard mode. Add Dns and Clem and this would be a terrifying lineup.
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On November 28 2018 14:06 fronkschnonk wrote:
Serrals score vs Koreans is 15-0 in his prime, and Maru's is 18-2. Comparing this streaks doesn't say much about who is the better player. One rather has to compare the achievements made in their respective periods of dominance. And I still think that Maru's 3 GSLs are more impressive that Serral's two comparable tournament victories.
This is really what it comes down to for me, but I think their achievements are close enough that we don't really know who was better during their respective time of dominance and hopefully they'll be in top form together next year!
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On November 28 2018 14:06 fronkschnonk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 09:01 Starcloud wrote:On November 28 2018 06:23 SetStndbySmn wrote:
You're still proceeding with your argument based on long held sentiment. Firstly Serral faced 0 foreigners at blizzcon. Zero.
Maru's path GSLCodeS: Forte/Leenock(group) -> Neeb/Reynor(group) -> GuMiho -> Zest -> TY
Serral's path in blizzcon: SoS/Zest(group) ->Dark -> Rogue -> Stats.
I really don't think a trivial extra group with Forte, Leenock, and Dear who have a near 0% chance of preventing a player of Maru or Serral's caliber from advancing, makes code S any harder. The difficulty of these paths are pretty similar in difficulty. So similar in difficulty that Serral and Maru's simultaneous presence in the tournament gives the edge to blizzcon easily. Yup, well said there. In fact, one could easily argue that Serrals path to victory was even harder than Maru´s on that occasion. I still cant buy this; Including the Ro32 of GSL in order to compare it to Blizzcon is misleading because Blizzcon had no Ro32. What counts for the toughness of a tournament is not the particular path of one player but the strength of the overall field so that the winner has to overcome very hard competition at some point in the tournament. I'm not arguing that Blizzcon is a lesser tournament like some try to, but saying Blizzcon is even harder than GSL is just objectively wrong if you compare the field of players in those tournaments from Ro16 on. SetStndbySmn's idea that Maru and Serral being simultaneously at Blizzcon makes it th hardest tournament is also misleading because as far as we can say Maru wasn't in top shape anymore at Blizzcon. Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 09:01 Starcloud wrote:On November 27 2018 05:34 NinjaNight wrote:
Maru won GSL Code S, the hardest tournament in existence, multiple times which was unprecedented. Serral wasn't at GSL Code S so unfortunately we can only speculate, but the point is Maru's achievement was incredible and could be considered as good or better than what Serral has done.
On November 28 2018 00:25 NinjaNight wrote:
Wtf? GSL Code S is clearly harder than Blizzcon. Maru's problem at Blizzcon is he ran into his kryptonite, sOs, his protoss teammate who just has his number. It's similar to how Nadal is Federer's kryptonite and beat him all the time, but Federer is still the best ever.
Again, let's see Serral start competing in the GSL Code S tournaments and see how he does.
And I'm not even trying to argue that Maru is better. I'm not claiming who is better. I'm saying you're all jumping to conclusions and assuming that Serral is better and assuming that Serral absolutely had a better year when you shouldn't be.
But well, Serral hasnt had any kryptonite, now has he ? Instead he demolished sOs more easily than Has. Still havent read any clear facts or even well based justifications that Code S is more hard than Blizzcon, because that simply isnt true. Same goes with GSL vs. the World. Preparing or not preparing doesnt imo mean that much, besides that should also weigh the scale towards Serral, who hasnt had that many opportunities to prepare all of his opponents all the time, and still has crushed everybody. And losing to sOs.....or even Stats, how can you not calculate those defeats since Serral also played him both tournaments and won both. And also, so that people dont forget, Serral also beat Maru then in that one match, adding to his resume. Doesnt that count too ? So, all in all, Maru failed 3 times when he was against Serral (Stats, sOs, Serral) in tournaments, while Serral won all of them. If you want to be a "purist" and look it at that way. How can you say Maru was better ? In the end, either way we look at the results, these can only lead to one clear conclusion; Serral was, by far, the best player of 2018 ^^. Serral was not confronted with top terran material, so little do we know if this would've been doable for him. Including the loss to sOs in the comparison is also misleading because that compares a Maru out of top form with Serral in his top form. Maru's period of dominance lasted from march to septembre while Serral's began with GSL vs the World in August. Serrals score vs Koreans is 15-0 in his prime, and Maru's is 18-2. Comparing this streaks doesn't say much about who is the better player. One rather has to compare the achievements made in their respective periods of dominance. And I still think that Maru's 3 GSLs are more impressive that Serral's two comparable tournament victories. Including the Serral-Maru Bo1 Showmatch in this argument is just silly. This just shows that Serral is a great player who can take a Map of Maru. Nobody would've ever doubted that. I made the hassle and compared the aligulac points of each opponent in the streaks of Maru and Serral at the time when they played them. But funnily we don't get clarity from that either because the average of Maru's oppenents is 2585 and of Serral's opponents 2586. That one point difference can easily be dismissed due to the overall upwards trend of aligulac points which doesn't reflect an objective upward trend in skill.
That's not it tho, Maru won one other tournament(very big) whereas Serral won other five.
And you had to add a 25-0 against non-koreans to the same streak.
It's true that comparing Serral and Maru isn't as easy as if they were both playing GSL, but i see an advantage and it's Serral's.
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On November 28 2018 23:37 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 14:06 fronkschnonk wrote:On November 28 2018 09:01 Starcloud wrote:On November 28 2018 06:23 SetStndbySmn wrote:
You're still proceeding with your argument based on long held sentiment. Firstly Serral faced 0 foreigners at blizzcon. Zero.
Maru's path GSLCodeS: Forte/Leenock(group) -> Neeb/Reynor(group) -> GuMiho -> Zest -> TY
Serral's path in blizzcon: SoS/Zest(group) ->Dark -> Rogue -> Stats.
I really don't think a trivial extra group with Forte, Leenock, and Dear who have a near 0% chance of preventing a player of Maru or Serral's caliber from advancing, makes code S any harder. The difficulty of these paths are pretty similar in difficulty. So similar in difficulty that Serral and Maru's simultaneous presence in the tournament gives the edge to blizzcon easily. Yup, well said there. In fact, one could easily argue that Serrals path to victory was even harder than Maru´s on that occasion. I still cant buy this; Including the Ro32 of GSL in order to compare it to Blizzcon is misleading because Blizzcon had no Ro32. What counts for the toughness of a tournament is not the particular path of one player but the strength of the overall field so that the winner has to overcome very hard competition at some point in the tournament. I'm not arguing that Blizzcon is a lesser tournament like some try to, but saying Blizzcon is even harder than GSL is just objectively wrong if you compare the field of players in those tournaments from Ro16 on. SetStndbySmn's idea that Maru and Serral being simultaneously at Blizzcon makes it th hardest tournament is also misleading because as far as we can say Maru wasn't in top shape anymore at Blizzcon. On November 28 2018 09:01 Starcloud wrote:On November 27 2018 05:34 NinjaNight wrote:
Maru won GSL Code S, the hardest tournament in existence, multiple times which was unprecedented. Serral wasn't at GSL Code S so unfortunately we can only speculate, but the point is Maru's achievement was incredible and could be considered as good or better than what Serral has done.
On November 28 2018 00:25 NinjaNight wrote:
Wtf? GSL Code S is clearly harder than Blizzcon. Maru's problem at Blizzcon is he ran into his kryptonite, sOs, his protoss teammate who just has his number. It's similar to how Nadal is Federer's kryptonite and beat him all the time, but Federer is still the best ever.
Again, let's see Serral start competing in the GSL Code S tournaments and see how he does.
And I'm not even trying to argue that Maru is better. I'm not claiming who is better. I'm saying you're all jumping to conclusions and assuming that Serral is better and assuming that Serral absolutely had a better year when you shouldn't be.
But well, Serral hasnt had any kryptonite, now has he ? Instead he demolished sOs more easily than Has. Still havent read any clear facts or even well based justifications that Code S is more hard than Blizzcon, because that simply isnt true. Same goes with GSL vs. the World. Preparing or not preparing doesnt imo mean that much, besides that should also weigh the scale towards Serral, who hasnt had that many opportunities to prepare all of his opponents all the time, and still has crushed everybody. And losing to sOs.....or even Stats, how can you not calculate those defeats since Serral also played him both tournaments and won both. And also, so that people dont forget, Serral also beat Maru then in that one match, adding to his resume. Doesnt that count too ? So, all in all, Maru failed 3 times when he was against Serral (Stats, sOs, Serral) in tournaments, while Serral won all of them. If you want to be a "purist" and look it at that way. How can you say Maru was better ? In the end, either way we look at the results, these can only lead to one clear conclusion; Serral was, by far, the best player of 2018 ^^. Serral was not confronted with top terran material, so little do we know if this would've been doable for him. Including the loss to sOs in the comparison is also misleading because that compares a Maru out of top form with Serral in his top form. Maru's period of dominance lasted from march to septembre while Serral's began with GSL vs the World in August. Serrals score vs Koreans is 15-0 in his prime, and Maru's is 18-2. Comparing this streaks doesn't say much about who is the better player. One rather has to compare the achievements made in their respective periods of dominance. And I still think that Maru's 3 GSLs are more impressive that Serral's two comparable tournament victories. Including the Serral-Maru Bo1 Showmatch in this argument is just silly. This just shows that Serral is a great player who can take a Map of Maru. Nobody would've ever doubted that. I made the hassle and compared the aligulac points of each opponent in the streaks of Maru and Serral at the time when they played them. But funnily we don't get clarity from that either because the average of Maru's oppenents is 2585 and of Serral's opponents 2586. That one point difference can easily be dismissed due to the overall upwards trend of aligulac points which doesn't reflect an objective upward trend in skill. That's not it tho, Maru won one other tournament(very big) whereas Serral won other five. And you had to add a 25-0 against non-koreans to the same streak. It's true that comparing Serral and Maru isn't as easy as if they were both playing GSL, but i see an advantage and it's Serral's.
Yeah, but the one other big tournament he won was also harder to win than all WCS-Tournaments.
And if you add 25-0 for Serral against non-koreans, you also have to add Maru's 15-0 (or 15-1, if you include the showmatch vs Serral) to his streak.
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On November 28 2018 23:37 Xain0n wrote:
That's not it tho, Maru won one other tournament(very big) whereas Serral won other five.
And you had to add a 25-0 against non-koreans to the same streak.
It's true that comparing Serral and Maru isn't as easy as if they were both playing GSL, but i see an advantage and it's Serral's.
Look at the player pool of Serral's rivals in a WCS Tournament, and compare that with Maru's player pool of rivals in GSL. So to say look at Circuit without Serral and GSL without Maru. GSL is a whole lot harder/better.
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On November 29 2018 00:32 kajtarp wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 23:37 Xain0n wrote:
That's not it tho, Maru won one other tournament(very big) whereas Serral won other five.
And you had to add a 25-0 against non-koreans to the same streak.
It's true that comparing Serral and Maru isn't as easy as if they were both playing GSL, but i see an advantage and it's Serral's.
Look at the player pool of Serral's rivals in a WCS Tournament, and compare that with Maru's player pool of rivals in GSL. So to say look at Circuit without Serral and GSL without Maru. GSL is a whole lot harder/better.
I agree on this(as i have been saying since the beginning of the discussion) but i don't agree that GSL being harder nullifies Serral's WCS wins to the point that his 7 tournaments become less worth than Maru's 4.
In addiction to this, Serral's streak and stats(not to mention earnings) are objectively better even if we take into consideration his results against koreans only.
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On November 28 2018 06:05 RadgeRayden wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 05:59 Xain0n wrote:
The form Dave4 is using is humurous but probably could appear disrespectful.
He is saying that while the poll shows a significant majority of pro-Serral votes, the actual posts in this discussion are even(and i'd add that the pro-Maru posters are in higher number or so it appears to me); this means that either many of the pro-Maru users didn't vote in the poll or that they simply are very vocal.
One could even say it's somewhat disrespectful considering we're on a thread about a serral victory. Imagine if you graduate and people come out of nowhere to tell you your university isn't even that good. Like, c'mon.
It's more similar to someone graduating and people come out of nowhere to tell you "wow you graduated from the best university in the world, you're a genius" and then others stepping in with "wait this other university is just as good/ slightly better"
Serral fans started this with all the goat/bonjwa crap
Personally in terms of achievements I think Maru is clearly ahead of Maru (3 GSLs are just more impressive than 2 weekenders (3 if you count HSC))
But the thing that speaks for Serral is his unbeaten streak which is incredibly impressive. Maybe if Serral had competed in GSL his achievements could rival Serrals but that's on him for not playing in GSL. He could have if he wanted.
As it is imo Serral showed higher dominance but Maru has better achievements.
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On November 29 2018 02:19 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 06:05 RadgeRayden wrote:On November 28 2018 05:59 Xain0n wrote:
The form Dave4 is using is humurous but probably could appear disrespectful.
He is saying that while the poll shows a significant majority of pro-Serral votes, the actual posts in this discussion are even(and i'd add that the pro-Maru posters are in higher number or so it appears to me); this means that either many of the pro-Maru users didn't vote in the poll or that they simply are very vocal.
One could even say it's somewhat disrespectful considering we're on a thread about a serral victory. Imagine if you graduate and people come out of nowhere to tell you your university isn't even that good. Like, c'mon. It's more similar to someone graduating and people come out of nowhere to tell you "wow you graduated from the best university in the world, you're a genius" and then others stepping in with "wait this other university is just as good/ slightly better" Serral fans started this with all the goat/bonjwa crap Personally in terms of achievements I think Maru is clearly ahead of Maru (3 GSLs are just more impressive than 2 weekenders (3 if you count HSC)) But the thing that speaks for Serral is his unbeaten streak which is incredibly impressive. Maybe if Serral had competed in GSL his achievements could rival Serrals but that's on him for not playing in GSL. He could have if he wanted. As it is imo Serral showed higher dominance but Maru has better achievements.
Maru is indeed clearly ahead of Maru and don't even make me think at how Serral's achievements could rival Serral's if he played GSL! I laughed alot xD
Again, thinking WCS is worth nothing is out of place.
It would have been too audacious for Serral to play in Korea after 2017(I don't think he would have become the champion he is now) and would have made little to no sense to move there mid-year. Next year should be perfect!
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[QUOTE]On November 29 2018 02:59 Xain0n wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 29 2018 02:19 Charoisaur wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 28 2018 06:05 RadgeRayden wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 28 2018 05:59 Xain0n wrote:
The form Dave4 is using is humurous but probably could appear disrespectful.
He is saying that while the poll shows a significant majority of pro-Serral votes, the actual posts in this discussion are even(and i'd add that the pro-Maru posters are in higher number or so it appears to me); this means that either many of the pro-Maru users didn't vote in the poll or that they simply are very vocal.
[/QUOTE]
One could even say it's somewhat disrespectful considering we're on a thread about a serral victory. Imagine if you graduate and people come out of nowhere to tell you your university isn't even that good. Like, c'mon.
[/QUOTE]
It's more similar to someone graduating and people come out of nowhere to tell you "wow you graduated from the best university in the world, you're a genius" and then others stepping in with "wait this other university is just as good/ slightly better"
Serral fans started this with all the goat/bonjwa crap
Personally in terms of achievements I think Maru is clearly ahead of Maru (3 GSLs are just more impressive than 2 weekenders (3 if you count HSC))
But the thing that speaks for Serral is his unbeaten streak which is incredibly impressive. Maybe if Serral had competed in GSL his achievements could rival Serrals but that's on him for not playing in GSL. He could have if he wanted.
As it is imo Serral showed higher dominance but Maru has better achievements.
[/QUOTE]
Maru is indeed clearly ahead of Maru and don't even make me think at how Serral's achievements could rival Serral's if he played GSL! I laughed alot xD
Again, thinking WCS is worth nothing is out of place.
It would have been too audacious for Serral to play in Korea after 2017(I don't think he would have become the champion he is now) and would have made little to no sense to move there mid-year. Next year should be perfect!
[/QUOTE
We have Neeb having made Ro4 in GSL, Scarlett Ro8 before him. Foreigners have had way better results against too Koreans, like Showtime, who beat Dark, and Special... The gap is closing. So 4 straight wcs is a damn great achievement. Alongside a GSL vs the world + Blizzcon + HSC full of too Koreans + top4 alongside Maru in IEM + 3rd in WESG(beating Classic 3 -0)??? Best StarCraft year of a player EVER, with no doubt.
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On November 29 2018 02:19 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2018 06:05 RadgeRayden wrote:On November 28 2018 05:59 Xain0n wrote:
The form Dave4 is using is humurous but probably could appear disrespectful.
He is saying that while the poll shows a significant majority of pro-Serral votes, the actual posts in this discussion are even(and i'd add that the pro-Maru posters are in higher number or so it appears to me); this means that either many of the pro-Maru users didn't vote in the poll or that they simply are very vocal.
One could even say it's somewhat disrespectful considering we're on a thread about a serral victory. Imagine if you graduate and people come out of nowhere to tell you your university isn't even that good. Like, c'mon. It's more similar to someone graduating and people come out of nowhere to tell you "wow you graduated from the best university in the world, you're a genius" and then others stepping in with "wait this other university is just as good/ slightly better" Serral fans started this with all the goat/bonjwa crap Personally in terms of achievements I think Maru is clearly ahead of Maru (3 GSLs are just more impressive than 2 weekenders (3 if you count HSC)) But the thing that speaks for Serral is his unbeaten streak which is incredibly impressive. Maybe if Serral had competed in GSL his achievements could rival Serrals but that's on him for not playing in GSL. He could have if he wanted. As it is imo Serral showed higher dominance but Maru has better achievements.
no matter how you put it, the second group stepping in still feels unnecessary since we are on serral's graduation party. Why don't you do it on Maru's university where it belongs?
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On November 29 2018 05:52 RadgeRayden wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2018 02:19 Charoisaur wrote:On November 28 2018 06:05 RadgeRayden wrote:On November 28 2018 05:59 Xain0n wrote:
The form Dave4 is using is humurous but probably could appear disrespectful.
He is saying that while the poll shows a significant majority of pro-Serral votes, the actual posts in this discussion are even(and i'd add that the pro-Maru posters are in higher number or so it appears to me); this means that either many of the pro-Maru users didn't vote in the poll or that they simply are very vocal.
One could even say it's somewhat disrespectful considering we're on a thread about a serral victory. Imagine if you graduate and people come out of nowhere to tell you your university isn't even that good. Like, c'mon. It's more similar to someone graduating and people come out of nowhere to tell you "wow you graduated from the best university in the world, you're a genius" and then others stepping in with "wait this other university is just as good/ slightly better" Serral fans started this with all the goat/bonjwa crap Personally in terms of achievements I think Maru is clearly ahead of Maru (3 GSLs are just more impressive than 2 weekenders (3 if you count HSC)) But the thing that speaks for Serral is his unbeaten streak which is incredibly impressive. Maybe if Serral had competed in GSL his achievements could rival Serrals but that's on him for not playing in GSL. He could have if he wanted. As it is imo Serral showed higher dominance but Maru has better achievements. no matter how you put it, the second group stepping in still feels unnecessary since we are on serral's graduation party. Why don't you do it on Maru's university where it belongs?
Well if that's how they feel then they really shouldn't put a poll asking if Serral is a bonjwa/best player of 2018/GoAT because that is naturally going to spark discussion that concerns the other guy who has a legitimate claim to being the best player of the year.
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What's even the problem with people discussing the performances of the top SC2 players of the year? Those are valid discussions and can be discussed everywhere where those players are rated somehow.
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meh you're both right I just dislike that it has to be so heated but whatevs
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EPT
