EPTStarCraft II Balance Revamp 2018 - Page 4
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KarlSiegt
Italy35 Posts
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FrkFrJss
Canada1205 Posts
On September 10 2018 17:03 deacon.frost wrote: Protoss get a reasonable buff to early game and a slight nerf to carriers which are worse against sworms of units(stormu!!!) but better against armored units. (also moar HP and shorter build time) And as a bonus - Colossus change is neat  I don't see it as a nerf, but maybe I'm missing something The early/mid game buffs are the sentry hallucination and guardian shield buff as well as the robotics facility cost reduction. Carriers and tempests were pretty significantly nerfed. Carriers not having graviton catapult is really quite large, because instead of swarming out, they lazily launch. This significantly reduces the engagement dps, which is where most of the initial damage takes place. A carrier's interceptors are its damage, so it's like saying that for the first second of engage marine shoots at 1/4 damage that gradually increases over time until it stops shooting at an enemy at which point the cycle begins again. Part of the issue is that interceptors are very easily taken out when launched one at a time, and now, the interceptors will be made even slower. So it means that not only does a carrier take longer to fully enter the fight, a depleted carrier takes much longer to rejoin the fight. We're talking about 48 seconds versus 88 seconds to fully stock a new carrier. Now, once the interceptors are out, then the carrier is very scary, but when a Protoss carrier fleet engages, it is much weaker for the first second and a bit of the engage. The health buff is nominal, as carriers were already pretty tanky, and the cost build time is fairly nice, but it's a lot less useful when your very expensive unit can't actually get its damage in until after it's half dead, and then after the interceptors are dead, it takes a minute or so to become fully useful again. The dps buff is only good with 0/0 carriers against 3+ armour units or more. if the difference between enemy armour and unit attack is 2 or less, then attacking twice does the same thing. For instance, a corruptor has base 2 armour. 2x5 minus 2x2 armour is 6 damage. 1x8 damage minus 1x2 armour is 6 damage. On even upgrades, the carrier does slightly worse. Tempests were heavily nerfed because its health got reduced by 40% (450 total versus 275), and its cost got reduce by a negligible amount (50 m, 25 g). At the point in time that a person gets tempests, being able to build an extra probe for every tempest, or an adept for every two tempest, or an extra tempest for every seven tempest, is not really that big of a deal. The supply buff only means that you can have five tempest for every four you used to. The speed buff is nice in that the tempest don't lag behind, but tempest were almost always behind the army anyways, so if your tempest were being sniped off, you were probably dead anyways (or the enemy had a better surround). The nexus change is more of a change than a buff/nerf. You can recall a smaller amount of units more often. This change might mean that you'll see more recalled harassment, but also that you might be less aggressive since you can't recall all your units at once.The MS buff is a late game buff that will not likely make a huge difference. HT nerf is a decently significant nerf against taking out high energy ghosts or caster units. The one thing that is much better is the disruptor. I think everyone can agree that this change is a decent buff to the midgame. I am unsure as to how much this will improve Protoss. I don't doubt that it will help them. But, I think most people also agreed before the disruptor change that it was not op. The colossus change is nice, and it's good when your army is retreating, but it doesn't seem like that huge of a buff unless like 10 marines were chasing your lone colossus in which case...nice I guess? I feel like most people would either be fast enough to stim and kill the colossus or just back off and avoid being kited by the colossus. So all told, we got two early game buffs that is yet to see how it will change the game. (Halluc reduction doesn't really impact much, and guardian shield increase is nice, but I'm not sure how significant it will be. Robotics could be significant, but we will see how much earlier we can get WP and whatnot out). We will also see how much the recall change hurts/buffs Protoss. We got 2 pretty large nerfs to the carrier and tempest, a moderate nerf to the HT, and other random buffs and nerfs that won't really change anything. Perhaps Protoss did not get "nerfed into the ground," but we definitely weren't buffed overall (Unless the disruptor and robotics proves to be that big of a metagame shifting change). TL;DR Early game - nominal buff Mid game - big buff Late game - Heavy Nerf | ||
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DBooN
Germany2727 Posts
On September 10 2018 15:45 hiroshOne wrote: I don't understand. They are nerfing Hydras and say hat they do that to open Zerg to other compositions, but in the same time they do nothing to make Mutas viable for example. Which other composition do they mean? We have nothing other than Hydras. Mutas are wrecked by one Thor, and Thor gets buffs. Protoss has problems with that only if not scouted... That's horrible change, especially that Hydras were weak in HP always. Thors are clearly nerfed against Mutas. | ||
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Deleted User 329278
123 Posts
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AxiomBlurr
786 Posts
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deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On September 10 2018 18:03 FrkFrJss wrote: ... TL;DR Early game - nominal buff Mid game - big buff Late game - Heavy Nerf If there is a micro trick to keep the interceptors out as it is in BW(feel free to fix me if my memory is bad) then this is a nerf to the bad players, good players will go around it. Yeah, I thought corruptors have more armor, my bad there. | ||
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FrkFrJss
Canada1205 Posts
On September 10 2018 18:24 deacon.frost wrote: Nony did a big video or post about carrier leash micro, and then Blizzard changed it to be like or more similar to BW. So yes, good players will micro the carrier to keep attacking units in the leash range (and carriers can keep moving), and lower level players will definitely struggle a bit more. If there is a micro trick to keep the interceptors out as it is in BW(feel free to fix me if my memory is bad) then this is a nerf to the bad players, good players will go around it. Yeah, I thought corruptors have more armor, my bad there. | ||
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HomoDeus
Netherlands12 Posts
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HolydaKing
21254 Posts
On September 10 2018 18:34 HomoDeus wrote: To many changes at the same time. Will be interesting tbh. Gonna take a while until things are figured out 100% again, but that's fun for the players, isn't it? | ||
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masonwalkersc2
4 Posts
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Lexender
Mexico2623 Posts
On September 10 2018 15:45 hiroshOne wrote: I don't understand. They are nerfing Hydras and say hat they do that to open Zerg to other compositions, but in the same time they do nothing to make Mutas viable for example. Which other composition do they mean? We have nothing other than Hydras. Mutas are wrecked by one Thor, and Thor gets buffs. Protoss has problems with that only if not scouted... That's horrible change, especially that Hydras were weak in HP always. Damn I knew you are zerg whiner but still, this is another level. Thors lost 1 armor and have lower splash, 2 things that make them weaker vs mutas, while gaining a bonus vs massive in single target mode, something that has no effect on mutas. | ||
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Creager
Germany1889 Posts
On September 10 2018 18:52 HolydaKing wrote: Will be interesting tbh. Gonna take a while until things are figured out 100% again, but that's fun for the players, isn't it? I, personally, don't like that approach, I prefer a settled environment where I can improve on aspects of my play rather than having to forcefully relearn unit stats and counters/behaviours every year. | ||
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medium_AI
Norway42 Posts
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DSK
England1110 Posts
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sneakyfox
8216 Posts
On September 10 2018 18:03 FrkFrJss wrote: Tempests were heavily nerfed because its health got reduced by 40% (450 total versus 275), and its cost got reduce by a negligible amount (50 m, 25 g). At the point in time that a person gets tempests, being able to build an extra probe for every tempest, or an adept for every two tempest, or an extra tempest for every seven tempest, is not really that big of a deal. The supply buff only means that you can have five tempest for every four you used to. The speed buff is nice in that the tempest don't lag behind, but tempest were almost always behind the army anyways, so if your tempest were being sniped off, you were probably dead anyways (or the enemy had a better surround). I'm not sure this really is a nerf to Tempest. When they become this fast and have that ridiculous range they will be impossible to fight for so many units. Above all it seems they become even more specialized as "giant killers". What are BCs, BLs, Carriers, and obviously Ultras going to do against them? They might also be used to snipe bases since they can now run away. Also, it is clearly intended as a buff for Has. | ||
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Kikirik1
45 Posts
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GrandSmurf
Netherlands462 Posts
Early game - nominal buff Mid game - big buff Late game - Heavy Nerf if this is true i might actually play the game again. | ||
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bObA
France300 Posts
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algue
France1436 Posts
Give it the Overseer's Contaminate, replace the energy of the ability by a cooldown | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16647 Posts
however it happened... its great to see this modification to the Widow Mine! ... and good call by whoever proposed it. | ||
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