EPTThe pheonix can be focused down to remove the effect
StarCraft II Multiplayer - Major Design Changes - Page 33
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nonoes
24 Posts
The pheonix can be focused down to remove the effect | ||
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nonoes
24 Posts
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Liquid`Snute
Norway839 Posts
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MockHamill
Sweden1798 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:08 Liquid`Snute wrote: wtf is this entangle stuff? broodlord infestor hello ?? Not if it is single target. Obviously the energy cost should be decently high though or this will be too strong. | ||
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KingCobra90
Russian Federation6 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:01 Kerdinand wrote: You do realize that the ability "Graviton beam" is there since Wings of Liberty, right? I'm not a fan of Entangle either, but your argument doesnt really seem valid. 1 phoenix disable 1 not big unit and himself 1 infestor disable 4 carriers and run away under ground seems totally valid  | ||
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Sapphire.lux
Romania2620 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:08 Liquid`Snute wrote: wtf is this entangle stuff? broodlord infestor hello ?? Yeah. As long as the only working counters to BL are air units (vikings) then we can't have that. Though i would like to see a big buff to thors instead of a nerf to entangle. | ||
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Quineotio
Australia128 Posts
On September 01 2017 19:42 Creager wrote: They're somehow going for some kind of WC3'ish approach now with all that ability nonsense, which I personally do not like, at all. My overall fear is the reworks won't end, though, because they artificially want to keep the game "fresh" and "interesting" and further milk their fanbase with microtransactions, simply a neverending story. Sadly, I personally feel the game's quality isn't improving, but deteriorating. I don't like all the abilities either. It's too hard to control a big army with so many casters, especially as the casters are so strong. It feels like spellcasters dominate engagements to such an extent that you can't really begin fighting with the main armies until you've done the spellcaster dance. I have faith that they'll eventually stop patching. They have lots of experience with BW, which hasn't changed in a long time. It makes sense to go for the same thing with sc2. The thing I'm liking about the changes they're making is that they seem to be targeting fundamental problems. In the past they've taken more of a minimalist approach - making the best of the flawed design. I'm looking forward to a balanced and FUN sc2, which will probably take a couple more years, judging by the changes they're making. | ||
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Quineotio
Australia128 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:20 Sapphire.lux wrote: Yeah. As long as the only working counters to BL are air units (vikings) then we can't have that. Though i would like to see a big buff to thors instead of a nerf to entangle. The air in sc2 has always been a bit off to me. I think it's because the air units stack so it just becomes a blob of shit. And they cover up the ground battle. And they ignore terrain. I like mutas, but I feel sorry for protoss when zerg build a lot of them. Why don't they just make entangle a slow? | ||
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Sapphire.lux
Romania2620 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:30 Quineotio wrote: They have lots of experience with BW, which hasn't changed in a long time. It makes sense to go for the same thing with sc2. The people that were in charge of SC2 had 0 experience with BW. In fact, i suspect they tried more to make their mark on the new game rather then creating an improvement, change for the sake of change sort of thing. | ||
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Quineotio
Australia128 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:35 Sapphire.lux wrote: The people that were in charge of SC2 had 0 experience with BW. In fact, i suspect they tried more to make their mark on the new game rather then creating an improvement, change for the sake of change sort of thing. What I mean is, Blizzard are well aware of what an rts looks like when it doesn't get changed and players find their own balance. Like, they're aware that the previous game in the series hasn't been updated and yet is the oldest esport. I'm sure they'd LOVE to have sc2 in a state where they don't need to patch it any more. | ||
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Kerdinand
Germany113 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:16 KingCobra90 wrote: 1 phoenix disable 1 not big unit and himself 1 infestor disable 4 carriers and run away under ground seems totally valid I know, I know. I was just referring to the "a 7 second stun has no place in sc2" part. | ||
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seemsgood
5527 Posts
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ejozl
Denmark3559 Posts
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reneg
United States859 Posts
On September 01 2017 22:30 ejozl wrote: Actually the Infestor lost the Infested Terran ability, I did not know this. This is what happens when we have a unit with 4 abilities like the Viper grrrr... Yea...I feel the main issue here is that there are just SO MANY abilities. Every single unit is getting its own (especially on the protoss side of things), and there are so many just pure spellcasters (viper, infestor, high templar). | ||
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Quineotio
Australia128 Posts
On September 01 2017 22:44 reneg wrote: Yea...I feel the main issue here is that there are just SO MANY abilities. Every single unit is getting its own (especially on the protoss side of things), and there are so many just pure spellcasters (viper, infestor, high templar). Spellcasters are a way they've tried to balance the races. Maybe if they can get the other unit interactions in a better state they can scale back on the casters. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17976 Posts
On September 01 2017 20:35 Sapphire.lux wrote: i also saw David Kim running from the grassy knoll. The people that were in charge of SC2 had 0 experience with BW. In fact, i suspect they tried more to make their mark on the new game rather then creating an improvement, change for the sake of change sort of thing. i saw David Kim running from the grassy knoll carrying an automatic weapon. Rob Pardo eliminated the 12 limit on groups. Pardo was behind the protoss warp-in mechanic. so um, ya. During his giant 6 hour interview i posted when he left Blizz he mentions both of these mechanics in SC2 and his role in making them a reality. Pardo was lead designer of SC2. Then Pardo was the boss of the lead designer of SC2 for years. i will say this... Pardo > Browder and Pardo > Kim. But, Blizz had much bigger fish to fry. Considering the miniscule amount of money RTS brings in for every company we're pretty damn lucky guys as good as Browder and Kim were willing to work on an RTS game. I'm sure they've both got better things to do and bigger money projects to pursue and i wish them well. | ||
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Sapphire.lux
Romania2620 Posts
On September 01 2017 23:15 JimmyJRaynor wrote: i saw David Kim running from the grassy knoll carrying an automatic weapon. Rob Pardo eliminated the 12 limit on groups. Pardo was behind the protoss warp-in mechanic. so um, ya. During his giant 6 hour interview i posted when he left Blizz he mentions both of these mechanics in SC2 and his role in making them a reality. Pardo was lead designer of SC2. Then Pardo was the boss of the lead designer of SC2 for years. i will say this... Pardo > Browder and Pardo > Kim. But, Blizz had much bigger fish to fry. Considering the miniscule amount of money RTS brings in for every company we're pretty damn lucky guys as good as Browder and Kim were willing to work on an RTS game. I'm sure they've both got better things to do and bigger money projects to pursue and i wish them well. SC2 i one of the best selling games on PC plus whatever the expansion sold (if we could find the expansion + dlc sales it would be even higher on the list). This line of we should be tankful they made a rts at all is ridiculous really. From what i can find only the original Starcraft sold more, from the golden era of RTS as some say. With all due respect, Dustin Browder was under very heavy criticism for many of his decisions with WOL, the direction of the game, and with HOTS, so i would expect nothing from a legend such as Pardo but to deflect some of the attention. We're getting off topic though. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17976 Posts
compared to the other money Blizz makes on everything else RTS makes tiny amounts of cash. From 2010 to 2016, through a full game release and 2 expansions RTS represented ~1% of ATVI's revenue. We're on our 4th multiplayer lead due to the fact that RTS doesn't bring in enough cash; Pardo, Browder, and Kim all moved on to bigger things. Its ironic how people scream for Browder's and Kim's firing and, in fact, they're firing us. with SC2 on its 4th multiplayer leader... i will say its lead to a rather schizophrenic development journey the past 7 years. The game has always been fun to play though. | ||
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washikie
United States752 Posts
further entangle will make infestors much better against drops than they currently are as it stands sometimes you can escape a fungle with a medivac, there is no way to escape entangle if you are over land. Most concerning of all i'm not sure how Terran is expected to play late game mech tvz at all. lets just think about the changes in totality. -raven no longer massable: the balance of late game mech tvz so far has revolved around terrans ability to transition into mass air with ravens. This was perhaps to strong and created very long turtle games however without ravens how in the world does Terran mech combat a late game zerg army? -viper parasitic bomb change: overall this is a buff to the viper, parasitic bombs rarely stacked heavily to begin with, essentially all this change does is make an already efficient unit even more efficient and better at trading. -entangle, ontop of all the other changes to the air vs air balance zerg now gains a way to neutralize several air units immediately and prevent any damage contribution form them, In many ways this ability seems even stronger than fungal on air which with proper splitting could be mitigated. -terran receives a a small buff to cyclone anti air: honestly I dont think the change has significance in the late game. -Brood lords exist: the reason Terran must go air at some point in mech tvz is how terrible an all ground mech army is vs broolords. if you want to make mech air unplayable at least give mech players some alternative way to handle a broodlord army. Terran mech is not bio, its not acceptable to say that the counter is killing the zerg before they get there, terran mech in its current state is not really strong enough to push into a zerg before they get brood lords and the units to protect them. Maybe the added gas income can fix this dynamic, and allow mech players to actualy push out on the map, but im not to hopeful about this. even so I dont think its a great mechanic for the slow turtle composition to be 100% about doing one big pre broodlord timing attack that decides the game outright. does any one remember wol tvp with fondness? that would be the dynamic this creates, Terran turtles and uses new gas mining mule to make a really big deathball---> terran does one really big push with said deathball that instantly decides the game. I'm not thrilled about that being the future of one of sc2s traditionally best matchups. And it will be if bio proves to week with all the nerfs. | ||
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hiroshOne
Poland425 Posts
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