1)While the evidence may be weak, it's there. Blizzard claims they found no evidence of Vindicta hacking. There are undetectable hacks nowadays. The same people have been at it over and over and over hacking away and blizzard can't detect it. Avilo at least has some form of evidence.
How do you know there are undetectable hacks now? Have you actually seen someone using them (and by that I mean watched someone implementing the hack on their computer; not just played against someone allegedly using a hack)? Do you know how to obtain them? Not trolling; genuinely curious.
Feels like the case against him should be rescrutinized. Because either we've been wrongfully condemning him this entire time because despite hotkey analysis for his MC game it was actually someone else (which is incredible), or Blizzard got something wrong here.
There is no middle ground with the way they've phrased it. A known cheater was on his account according to them. So clearly we totally fucked up a year ago when we called him a cheater using hotkey analysis. Wouldn't that undermine the entirety of the anticheat efforts we've put in over the past 7 years?
1)While the evidence may be weak, it's there. Blizzard claims they found no evidence of Vindicta hacking. There are undetectable hacks nowadays. The same people have been at it over and over and over hacking away and blizzard can't detect it. Avilo at least has some form of evidence.
How do you know there are undetectable hacks now? Have you actually seen someone using them (and by that I mean watched someone implementing the hack on their computer; not just played against someone allegedly using a hack)? Do you know how to obtain them? Not trolling; genuinely curious.
There have been undetectable maphacks since 2012. I do not link or support the use of hacks by any means. All i will tell you is that the internet is someones best friend when they really want something.
On March 31 2017 01:04 billynasty wrote: I agree that Avilo couldve handled this situation better, but he was justifiably upset about the same guy who cost him a spot a year ago was being allowed to play again. The intent of Avilo wasnt to cause harm to the event, it was him being upset that he had to play vs this guy. If the PC Police wants to punish Avilo for his response, then here is Kaelaris last night being racist on stream, about how people in Korea eat dogs: If the PC police goes after players, then shouldnt it go after official ESL casters too?
You call out PC police, but then say someone is racist for commenting that they eat dog meat in Korea? You realise they litterally do eat dog meat in Korea right?
That's not the breed they eat so it really wasn't factually correct. Besides, it is a situation that tends to cause friction: a minority of people in a group do a thing that a larger number of people within the group disapprove of. Saying the group as a whole does the thing is then a bit of a faux pas. He even says it in a defensive tone which makes it clear that he disapproves of it, which then reflects poorly on Korea. If you guys aren't picking up on any of these kinds of things, and think that as long as one person in Korea still eats dog then this remark should never be considered problematic because it's a fact, then you should really sit back and try to start making these observations. Anyway, it was just a joke.
billynasty has the wrong idea trying to make this into a political issue. There's a limit to how much people are willing to be treated like shit. Avilo crosses that line. There's nothing more to it. Again there's a real lack of nuance trying to equate Avilo's verbal abuse toward admins and Blizzard employees to Kaeleris's joke by saying they're both things that intolerant people oppose.
avilo is a poor losser. Always he makes excuses for everyone who fucking outplays him... i fucking destroyed 2-0 mech vs mech avilo in heart of the swarm, still I was named as stream cheater... why? because your style is too easy to outplay in early and mid game by high level players? (I was grand master in wings of liberty and heart of the swarm).
Like if you are not stream cheater, you are a hacker or you are extremally lucky or I don't know , bad build whatever.
These are just arguments from someone so narcicist and egocentrical who can't see anybody more than himself to admit he is worse in certain situations than others.
Worst part of this is that he does insult and call everyone stream cheater or hacker for making a circle for their "fans" how follow all this circle avilo does just to get more money from their ignorant people on the stream... Stop donate money and applauding the circle avilo just does to get more "viewership by troll circle". Same garbage did Idra player... People waste time, money and life in such idiocy in those characters called as "Avilo".
1)While the evidence may be weak, it's there. Blizzard claims they found no evidence of Vindicta hacking. There are undetectable hacks nowadays. The same people have been at it over and over and over hacking away and blizzard can't detect it. Avilo at least has some form of evidence.
How do you know there are undetectable hacks now? Have you actually seen someone using them (and by that I mean watched someone implementing the hack on their computer; not just played against someone allegedly using a hack)? Do you know how to obtain them? Not trolling; genuinely curious.
There have been undetectable maphacks since 2012. I do not link or support the use of hacks by any means. All i will tell you is that the internet is someones best friend when they really want something.
When I look online (and, to be fair, I (i) have no idea where to look as I don't know or care to know anything about game hacking; and (ii) only briefly looked after reading your response), everything I see is prior to the LOTV update that disabled most hacking.
I understand not wanting to promote hacking, but it's hard to trust unsubstantiated claims like "There have been undetectable maphacks since 2012." There have been pages and pages of discussion on this issue and, despite this exact question being raised repeatedly, not once have I seen someone provide actual evidence of the current existence of a working hack (again, I'm referring to evidence of the actual hack file itself, not just suspicious in-game footage).
EDIT: After looking a little deeper, I do see some discussion about current hacks on some message boards, but, again, no actual proof a working hack exists. It's mostly just hearsay about a couple of supposedly working private hacks that no one seems to be able to obtain. I'm not saying it's impossible; I'm only saying I'd like to see evidence.
Before you guys talk shit, watch the replays.. I watched them, I've watched a ton of starcraft and those games were fishy. Game 1 2 and 3. Game 1 ToD was like "he hasn't checked Avilo for a 4th, he could get a snipe here." He checks the fourth when CC lands, and starts planetary. He sends one empty dropship for the "scout", just seemed super fishy. He only lost game one because he got super frustrated when he tried to kill fourth, got stopped and he suicides into Avilo forces.
I watched game 2 and 3 both were multiple instances of being fishy
I'm not an Avilo fanboy either, and I do think this attitude/character is annoying and childish, but in this instance the guy really does look like a hacker.
Should be a wake up for Avilo to change the way he is, nobody takes him serious even when it really is a serious instance.
On March 31 2017 01:04 billynasty wrote: I agree that Avilo couldve handled this situation better, but he was justifiably upset about the same guy who cost him a spot a year ago was being allowed to play again. The intent of Avilo wasnt to cause harm to the event, it was him being upset that he had to play vs this guy. If the PC Police wants to punish Avilo for his response, then here is Kaelaris last night being racist on stream, about how people in Korea eat dogs: https://clips.twitch.tv/EnticingObservantCoffeeFailFish If the PC police goes after players, then shouldnt it go after official ESL casters too?
You call out PC police, but then say someone is racist for commenting that they eat dog meat in Korea? You realise they litterally do eat dog meat in Korea right?
That's not the breed they eat so it really wasn't factually correct. Besides, it is a situation that tends to cause friction: a minority of people in a group do a thing that a larger number of people within the group disapprove of. Saying the group as a whole does the thing is then a bit of a faux pas. He even says it in a defensive tone which makes it clear that he disapproves of it, which then reflects poorly on Korea. If you guys aren't picking up on any of these kinds of things, and think that as long as one person in Korea still eats dog then this remark should never be considered problematic because it's a fact, then you should really sit back and try to start making these observations. Anyway, it was just a joke.
billynasty has the wrong idea trying to make this into a political issue. There's a limit to how much people are willing to be treated like shit. Avilo crosses that line. There's nothing more to it. Again there's a real lack of nuance trying to equate Avilo's verbal abuse toward admins and Blizzard employees to Kaeleris's joke by saying they're both things that intolerant people oppose.
On March 31 2017 01:04 billynasty wrote: I agree that Avilo couldve handled this situation better, but he was justifiably upset about the same guy who cost him a spot a year ago was being allowed to play again. The intent of Avilo wasnt to cause harm to the event, it was him being upset that he had to play vs this guy. If the PC Police wants to punish Avilo for his response, then here is Kaelaris last night being racist on stream, about how people in Korea eat dogs: https://clips.twitch.tv/EnticingObservantCoffeeFailFish If the PC police goes after players, then shouldnt it go after official ESL casters too?
You call out PC police, but then say someone is racist for commenting that they eat dog meat in Korea? You realise they litterally do eat dog meat in Korea right?
That's not the breed they eat so it really wasn't factually correct. Besides, it is a situation that tends to cause friction: a minority of people in a group do a thing that a larger number of people within the group disapprove of. Saying the group as a whole does the thing is then a bit of a faux pas. He even says it in a defensive tone which makes it clear that he disapproves of it, which then reflects poorly on Korea. If you guys aren't picking up on any of these kinds of things, and think that as long as one person in Korea still eats dog then this remark should never be considered problematic because it's a fact, then you should really sit back and try to start making these observations. Anyway, it was just a joke.
billynasty has the wrong idea trying to make this into a political issue. There's a limit to how much people are willing to be treated like shit. Avilo crosses that line. There's nothing more to it. Again there's a real lack of nuance trying to equate Avilo's verbal abuse toward admins and Blizzard employees to Kaeleris's joke by saying they're both things that intolerant people oppose.
NonY, you should run for president
No, he just insulted everyone. Again. So he lost his Seed, but still can play the open bracket.
On March 30 2017 13:47 THERIDDLER wrote: Wait isn't blizzard contradicting themselves? the fact that vindicta was confirmed hacker should offset avilo's rude behaviour towards him.
On March 31 2017 03:05 kaboombaby wrote: So is Nero 100% absolved by this?
Feels like the case against him should be rescrutinized. Because either we've been wrongfully condemning him this entire time because despite hotkey analysis for his MC game it was actually someone else (which is incredible), or Blizzard got something wrong here.
There is no middle ground with the way they've phrased it. A known cheater was on his account according to them. So clearly we totally fucked up a year ago when we called him a cheater using hotkey analysis. Wouldn't that undermine the entirety of the anticheat efforts we've put in over the past 7 years?
No, certainly not 100% absolved.
The way I read that was they were saying he wasn't hacking in the tournament itself, and maybe he was not hacking under that name on the ladder very recently...but that other people were hacking on that account recently...and that he may have been hacking on other accounts recently.
They were a little vague on how they worded that stuff, but its basically 'He wasn't hacking right now, but he's been hacking'
On March 31 2017 04:04 lastprobeALIVE wrote: Before you guys talk shit, watch the replays.. I watched them, I've watched a ton of starcraft and those games were fishy. Game 1 2 and 3. Game 1 ToD was like "he hasn't checked Avilo for a 4th, he could get a snipe here." He checks the fourth when CC lands, and starts planetary. He sends one empty dropship for the "scout", just seemed super fishy. He only lost game one because he got super frustrated when he tried to kill fourth, got stopped and he suicides into Avilo forces.
I watched game 2 and 3 both were multiple instances of being fishy
I did watch all the replays, the only people who would think anything was fishy are the simple minded avilo fanboys.
Avilo certainly shouldn't have started flaming Kaelaris on Reddit, and yes that probably does have something to do with his punishment.
However I strongly feel having watched it unfold at the time that Kaelaris shouldn't have been openly disparaging towards Avilo on an official Blizzard stream. Even if he has a reputation for calling people cheats, if he does it in an official tournament then the matter has to be looked into with an un-biased opinion. This is just how investigations take place and having an official Blizzard representative basically shoot the whole thing down before any investigation could take place was completely wrong.
Much of the blame from this whole situation must reside with ESL, if your running a tournament then you aught to be able to officiate it properly, they clearly couldn't, with just one guy to record results and no one able to investigate the claims. As this is sub-contacted out from Blizzard then questions also need to be asked if they are correct in choosing someone like ESL to run such a tournament on their behalf.
ESL seem to have somewhat of a monopoly over certain games and tournaments and seem to be constantly failing to deliver on multiple levels, whether it be in-adequate staffing, poor scheduling, late starts, or not even correctly labeling streams as if often the case with CS:GO ESA weekly that they also produce now.
Opinion seems to be divided of Kaelaris, in my opinion he had a good run in SC2 during HotS but has clearly moved on, he's doing well for himself in other games and good luck to him. However he clearly isn't really into SC2 anymore, this was evident by him having very little awareness of the features of current maps and also basically forgetting how to observe. I hope he does well in other games, he was good in HotS but perhaps for future SC2 events ESL should consider getting people who are still active when it comes to SC2.
On March 30 2017 21:17 ReachTheSky wrote: If blizzard refuses to reverse their ban on Avilo, they are literally saying to the community the following: 1:good manners > good gameplay, even though people don't tune in to watch how nice some acts, viewers tune in to see good game play. Perhaps this should be called the world morals series to see who can be morally correct on a more frequent basis than their opponent. 2:we prefer to conditionally enforce rules, play favorites, turn a blind eye when it comes to the in-crowd when it comes to enforcing policy and like to avoid giving equal opportunities, even to underdogs. 3:we don't value the community, we value what the oldboys club/old guard thinks over all because they(oldboys club) want to keep their status as progamers and are afraid to face avilo in a televised match should he qualify and crush them. 4:we don't value integrity, fair competition, equal opportunity, equal treatment among all our players. Even though the one being pentalize has promoted their championship game the longest out of all the remaining players via publicly access streams.
Reverse the ban.
Its disgusting how we have people on this forum who throw people under the bus dismissing everything they have to say just because "they feel like it" on a forum dedicated to playing a game
so you are the arbiters of who gets to qualify or not, your opinions more important than being gm skill, oic how it is.
all avilo wants is to play mech in starcraft 2 and have blizzard listen but its hard when you keep reaching out for 6 years and get nothing in return, it makes you bitter
and now we have these SJW people who overrule being grandmaster because they are "offended" and justify censorship and silencing simply due to "feelings"
on a spectrum the priority of feelings should never take precedence over competance, avilo earned that spot through his qualifications and has earned it rightfully
and thats not even considering avilo was upset because he was playing a legitimate HACKER and so was justified being upset IN THE FIRST PLACE
On March 31 2017 04:04 lastprobeALIVE wrote: Before you guys talk shit, watch the replays.. I watched them, I've watched a ton of starcraft and those games were fishy. Game 1 2 and 3. Game 1 ToD was like "he hasn't checked Avilo for a 4th, he could get a snipe here." He checks the fourth when CC lands, and starts planetary. He sends one empty dropship for the "scout", just seemed super fishy. He only lost game one because he got super frustrated when he tried to kill fourth, got stopped and he suicides into Avilo forces.
I watched game 2 and 3 both were multiple instances of being fishy
I did watch all the replays, the only people who would think anything was fishy are the simple minded avilo fanboys.
ToD thought Nero's movements in game where dodgy, Ruff also said it was strange, and although I've not seen it, apparently UThermal has watched replays and has stated his thinks Nero's actions were odd too. So just your regular Avilo fanboys.....
On March 31 2017 04:04 lastprobeALIVE wrote: Before you guys talk shit, watch the replays.. I watched them, I've watched a ton of starcraft and those games were fishy. Game 1 2 and 3. Game 1 ToD was like "he hasn't checked Avilo for a 4th, he could get a snipe here." He checks the fourth when CC lands, and starts planetary. He sends one empty dropship for the "scout", just seemed super fishy. He only lost game one because he got super frustrated when he tried to kill fourth, got stopped and he suicides into Avilo forces.
I watched game 2 and 3 both were multiple instances of being fishy
I did watch all the replays, the only people who would think anything was fishy are the simple minded avilo fanboys.
ToD thought Nero's movements in game where dodgy, Ruff also said it was strange, and although I've not seen it, apparently UThermal has watched replays and has stated his thinks Nero's actions were odd too. So just your regular Avilo fanboys.....
I stand by my original statement.
On March 31 2017 20:38 FoxDog wrote: Its disgusting how we have people on this forum who throw people under the bus dismissing everything they have to say just because "they feel like it" on a forum dedicated to playing a game
and now we have these SJW people who overrule being grandmaster because they are "offended" and justify censorship and silencing simply due to "feelings"
and thats not even considering avilo was upset because he was playing a legitimate HACKER and so was justified being upset IN THE FIRST PLACE
And I rest my case.
Forget rules, forget an investigation that proved there was no hacking involved. The almighty Conman avilo has spoken so he MUST be believed
Noone believes this disingenuous blizzard investigation and their PR talk. I could quote my own post but ReachTheSky even added a 4th option that's even more believable. Nero's just using a VPN or some other tool to mask his own IP.
Also did you see the recent thread that popped up? Map hacks are definitely back, there's no doubt this Juggernaut guy is a maphacker.
EPT
