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On December 05 2016 15:12 LongShot27 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2016 05:52 Charoisaur wrote:On December 05 2016 05:26 LongShot27 wrote:On December 05 2016 01:41 SeriousLus wrote:On December 04 2016 06:51 ZAiNs wrote:On December 04 2016 06:30 lastride wrote:
So the korean sc scene that basically created esports is now dead. Mindblowing. I guess the koreans prefer watching lol, that kart game and overwatch who appeals to 12 years olds.
User was warned for this post Don't understand what was warn-worthy in this post. just TL mods being how they always are.. stating facts gets u banned.. when a progamer says the same thing as us, all is good.. weird logic User was banned for this post.Terrible history and constant negativity You guys seriously banned someone for stating something that is true. Why are you acting like thought police. Some people don't agree with you. Can you not deal with that? Are you seriously going to keep banning people for saying things like Proleague is going to end, GSL is going to end and all the Korean Teams are gonna disband? Well you can't for 2 of them because we were right. why does it matter if you are right or wrong? what do you gain by constantly stating how dead the game is in an sc2 forum? do you want to ruin the experience for the people who are still passionate about the game? also this should be in website feedback. Because when people stick their heads in the sand and go "NANANANA the game is fine" instead of going "you know what that's correct, we either need to address the issues as a community or give up" you're part of the problem
What if I enjoy the game and know there is plenty of room from my side to adress before complaining about the game is broken?
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Can we say sc2 is dead? or are we still being delusional?
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On December 05 2016 16:05 SuperFanBoy wrote:
Can we say sc2 is dead? or are we still being delusional?
Too soon.
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On December 05 2016 03:38 Pr0wler wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2016 23:10 duke91 wrote:On December 04 2016 18:57 makmeatt wrote:On December 04 2016 18:53 duke91 wrote:On December 04 2016 18:47 SlammerSC2 wrote:
I think the best option at this point is to remake Broodwar in the SC2 engine and use that as the live game. The only reason i dont really watch broodwar streamers is because of the graphics. 99% prefer BW as it is right now. Look at how many viewers BW streamers get. Why should we pamper the miniscule SC2 scene who mostly never gave a fuck about BW because of graphics? I can't believe how entitled this demand is. times change, so do people. 67k viewers today for ASL for a RO24 Again why should Korea give in demands towards some SC2 foreigners who a) never achieved anything in BW, never did anything positive to the BW scene b) Blizzard forced the transition towards SC2 and robbed 4 years of highest level BW c) SC2 killed proleague which was build up through hard work throughout the years. It is usually in history that those who lose a destructive, pointless war should not demand war reparations. You either watch BW despite the graphics, or forever stay with SC2. Don't demand anything to the detriment of people who are actually passionate about BW for so many years, who sticked with it for so long Indeed times have changed. May you should change as well and accept BW as it is. Hahahah, I had a good laugh with that post. First of all take it easy, there is no war. Many people love BW as much as SC2. And play one of the two for some reason(for example no widescreen resolution in BW is killing it for me. Also I'm old and slow now... even for SC2.). The Koreans killed their own BW and SC2 scenes, foreigners had nothing to do with that. They did it with the countless matchfixing scandals and with dumb decisions. Basically KeSPA never adapted to anything(as expected from a government organization). For example,last season when WCS was region-locked, they didn't create smaller tournaments for the players bellow top 50. They never created tournaments for younger/amateur players in both BW or SC2. Lack of new/young players was a problem in BW and they never adressed it. They just switched the games. I really hope now when SC2 Proleague is discontinued, KeSPA picks up BW again.  But I have my doubts.
dont you realize that that Blizzard had everything to do with 1/BW IP right 2/create sc2 3/force the game down the throat 4/dictate league structure, map pool, region lock and whatnot
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On December 05 2016 03:38 Pr0wler wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2016 23:10 duke91 wrote:On December 04 2016 18:57 makmeatt wrote:On December 04 2016 18:53 duke91 wrote:On December 04 2016 18:47 SlammerSC2 wrote:
I think the best option at this point is to remake Broodwar in the SC2 engine and use that as the live game. The only reason i dont really watch broodwar streamers is because of the graphics. 99% prefer BW as it is right now. Look at how many viewers BW streamers get. Why should we pamper the miniscule SC2 scene who mostly never gave a fuck about BW because of graphics? I can't believe how entitled this demand is. times change, so do people. 67k viewers today for ASL for a RO24 Again why should Korea give in demands towards some SC2 foreigners who a) never achieved anything in BW, never did anything positive to the BW scene b) Blizzard forced the transition towards SC2 and robbed 4 years of highest level BW c) SC2 killed proleague which was build up through hard work throughout the years. It is usually in history that those who lose a destructive, pointless war should not demand war reparations. You either watch BW despite the graphics, or forever stay with SC2. Don't demand anything to the detriment of people who are actually passionate about BW for so many years, who sticked with it for so long Indeed times have changed. May you should change as well and accept BW as it is. Hahahah, I had a good laugh with that post. First of all take it easy, there is no war. Many people love BW as much as SC2. And play one of the two for some reason(for example no widescreen resolution in BW is killing it for me. Also I'm old and slow now... even for SC2.). The Koreans killed their own BW and SC2 scenes, foreigners had nothing to do with that. They did it with the countless matchfixing scandals and with dumb decisions. Basically KeSPA never adapted to anything(as expected from a government organization). For example,last season when WCS was region-locked, they didn't create smaller tournaments for the players bellow top 50. They never created tournaments for younger/amateur players in both BW or SC2. Lack of new/young players was a problem in BW and they never adressed it. They just switched the games. I really hope now when SC2 Proleague is discontinued, KeSPA picks up BW again. But I have my doubts.
No, there were a lot amateur-level tournaments at BW's height. There were women's leagues where Tossgirl ran dominant. There were high school leagues where TY/BaBy first emerged into the spotlight. There were the Courage tournaments where amateurs would compete for a progaming license and thus a chance to get drafted into a pro team. Even up until the last ones in 2011, these Courage tournaments had a decent player count, though diminished compared to previous years. Even in BW's twilight year, OGN sponsored the My Starleague where amateur players competed for a seed to compete with pros in what would become the Jin Air OSL.
So really, KeSPA did try to engage the amateur BW scene to a degree. It was going to be hard to have the same level of amateur engagement in SC2 when the switch resulted in a huge glut of both KeSPA and existing eSF players competing for the same limited Korean audience and tournaments. On top of that, money and scheduling may have been an issue even during the hard region lock this year. Perhaps KeSPA wanted to focus its time and resources on Proleague to give it a chance to survive considering how it was a key pillar in supporting the remaining teams.
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On December 05 2016 17:14 Arceus wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2016 03:38 Pr0wler wrote:On December 04 2016 23:10 duke91 wrote:On December 04 2016 18:57 makmeatt wrote:On December 04 2016 18:53 duke91 wrote:On December 04 2016 18:47 SlammerSC2 wrote:
I think the best option at this point is to remake Broodwar in the SC2 engine and use that as the live game. The only reason i dont really watch broodwar streamers is because of the graphics. 99% prefer BW as it is right now. Look at how many viewers BW streamers get. Why should we pamper the miniscule SC2 scene who mostly never gave a fuck about BW because of graphics? I can't believe how entitled this demand is. times change, so do people. 67k viewers today for ASL for a RO24 Again why should Korea give in demands towards some SC2 foreigners who a) never achieved anything in BW, never did anything positive to the BW scene b) Blizzard forced the transition towards SC2 and robbed 4 years of highest level BW c) SC2 killed proleague which was build up through hard work throughout the years. It is usually in history that those who lose a destructive, pointless war should not demand war reparations. You either watch BW despite the graphics, or forever stay with SC2. Don't demand anything to the detriment of people who are actually passionate about BW for so many years, who sticked with it for so long Indeed times have changed. May you should change as well and accept BW as it is. Hahahah, I had a good laugh with that post. First of all take it easy, there is no war. Many people love BW as much as SC2. And play one of the two for some reason(for example no widescreen resolution in BW is killing it for me. Also I'm old and slow now... even for SC2.). The Koreans killed their own BW and SC2 scenes, foreigners had nothing to do with that. They did it with the countless matchfixing scandals and with dumb decisions. Basically KeSPA never adapted to anything(as expected from a government organization). For example,last season when WCS was region-locked, they didn't create smaller tournaments for the players bellow top 50. They never created tournaments for younger/amateur players in both BW or SC2. Lack of new/young players was a problem in BW and they never adressed it. They just switched the games. I really hope now when SC2 Proleague is discontinued, KeSPA picks up BW again. But I have my doubts. dont you realize that that Blizzard had everything to do with 1/BW IP right 2/create sc2 3/force the game down the throat 4/dictate league structure, map pool, region lock and whatnot
KeSPA didn't switch for 2 years. Back then Blizzard still owned the BW IP and nobody forced KeSPA to switch games. I think that the decision to kill BW in it's current state and to switch games was theirs.
Region lock was good for the foregn scene. The problem is that KeSPA didn't make smaller tournaments for the weaker players. After all, they are a national federation and should make effort to preserve the scene. On the other hand sucking the Blizzard/Riot tit is easier.
BTW in this instance we can clearly see why eSports can never be "like the real sports". I can't imagine any sports federation just shutting down the sport when the money are gone. No money in Judo... Well fuck judo we switch to boxing. Kind of funny, right ?
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On December 05 2016 16:05 SuperFanBoy wrote:
Can we say sc2 is dead? or are we still being delusional?
Yes you can but the post will probably be edited once mods login on tl
On the other hand, it's pretty hard to not think about it when you have a progamer like Firecake who dedicated a whole video discussing the same concerns
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On December 05 2016 16:05 SuperFanBoy wrote:
Can we say sc2 is dead? or are we still being delusional?
You guys are acting like vultures, waiting for any occasion to shout "gaem is daed, told you so! HAHA!".
The game is not in good shape, but your attitude isn't fixing anything. That is, if you actually care for the game instead of just wanting to feel good about yourself being right about the daedness of the game.
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Well, glad to see things are still jolly around here.
I think that it´s time to acknowledge that "mistakes were made". A lot of people complaining about "dead game" are just hurt and sad because they see that all the SC2 scene is falling apart, that people warned about it, and that still no serious action or course-change was taken by Blizzard.
Yes it might be annoying people complaining about dead game, but it pretty much is a fact by now, get over it and, if you feel like playing the game, then please do.
Back to the topic the thread is discussing, I hope the MVP players find success on their future careers, whichever those may be, it was a joy to watch them play.
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On December 05 2016 16:05 SuperFanBoy wrote:
Can we say sc2 is dead? or are we still being delusional?
Dead games dont fill arenas.
What you can say is, the Korean infrastructure for a game they didn't like in the first place has collapsed and if Age of Empires still has a competitive scene then I'm pretty sure we do too.
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On December 06 2016 02:42 Espartaquen wrote:
Well, glad to see things are still jolly around here.
I think that it´s time to acknowledge that "mistakes were made". A lot of people complaining about "dead game" are just hurt and sad because they see that all the SC2 scene is falling apart, that people warned about it, and that still no serious action or course-change was taken by Blizzard.
Yes it might be annoying people complaining about dead game, but it pretty much is a fact by now, get over it and, if you feel like playing the game, then please do.
Back to the topic the thread is discussing, I hope the MVP players find success on their future careers, whichever those may be, it was a joy to watch them play.
No, most of comments (if not all) about game being dead is made by people glad that SC2 is having hard time. At least from what I've seen so far.
And it is not dead, if you honestly believe so then I don't know... I'm having hard time to not insult you in my mind somehow
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On December 05 2016 16:05 SuperFanBoy wrote:
Can we say sc2 is dead? or are we still being delusional?
super delusional. Though not dead, just one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel and no one wants to say "watch your step"
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On December 06 2016 06:59 aQuaSC wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2016 02:42 Espartaquen wrote:
Well, glad to see things are still jolly around here.
I think that it´s time to acknowledge that "mistakes were made". A lot of people complaining about "dead game" are just hurt and sad because they see that all the SC2 scene is falling apart, that people warned about it, and that still no serious action or course-change was taken by Blizzard.
Yes it might be annoying people complaining about dead game, but it pretty much is a fact by now, get over it and, if you feel like playing the game, then please do.
Back to the topic the thread is discussing, I hope the MVP players find success on their future careers, whichever those may be, it was a joy to watch them play. No, most of comments (if not all) about game being dead is made by people glad that SC2 is having hard time. At least from what I've seen so far. And it is not dead, if you honestly believe so then I don't know... I'm having hard time to not insult you in my mind somehow
yeah that's not true at all. Hundreds if not thousands of people have been trying to get people to support the game by watching a dozen streams at a time, writing articles, telling people how they can help the game, telling "pros" who treat the community like shit that they have no right to do so and they get banned or told to shut up because they're "detrimental to the community". BW elitists exist, but if you think they are the majority, you're the problem.
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On December 06 2016 07:23 LongShot27 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2016 06:59 aQuaSC wrote:On December 06 2016 02:42 Espartaquen wrote:
Well, glad to see things are still jolly around here.
I think that it´s time to acknowledge that "mistakes were made". A lot of people complaining about "dead game" are just hurt and sad because they see that all the SC2 scene is falling apart, that people warned about it, and that still no serious action or course-change was taken by Blizzard.
Yes it might be annoying people complaining about dead game, but it pretty much is a fact by now, get over it and, if you feel like playing the game, then please do.
Back to the topic the thread is discussing, I hope the MVP players find success on their future careers, whichever those may be, it was a joy to watch them play. No, most of comments (if not all) about game being dead is made by people glad that SC2 is having hard time. At least from what I've seen so far. And it is not dead, if you honestly believe so then I don't know... I'm having hard time to not insult you in my mind somehow yeah that's not true at all. Hundreds if not thousands of people have been trying to get people to support the game by watching a dozen streams at a time, writing articles, telling people how they can help the game, telling "pros" who treat the community like shit that they have no right to do so and they get banned or told to shut up because they're "detrimental to the community". BW elitists exist, but if you think they are the majority, you're the problem.
Oh, okay. Maybe I was reading wrong threads, my bad.
Also I differentiate people criticizing things from those happily asking if they can finally say it.
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Sc2 is going to the way of golf and tennis which is to say you'll have a couple of big tournaments that will draw in huge crowds then for the rest you'll have small number of watchers what it will come down to is players who are personable and good enough to sell products in ads.
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On December 05 2016 21:04 HsDLTitich wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2016 16:05 SuperFanBoy wrote:
Can we say sc2 is dead? or are we still being delusional? You guys are acting like vultures, waiting for any occasion to shout "gaem is daed, told you so! HAHA!". The game is not in good shape, but your attitude isn't fixing anything. That is, if you actually care for the game instead of just wanting to feel good about yourself being right about the daedness of the game.
This is a post worth quoting
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how much shit must happen that blizzard changes something ?
make sc2 free to play ? or it will day in the next 2-3 years
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On December 07 2016 00:57 Tobivankenobi94 wrote:
how much shit must happen that blizzard changes something ?
make sc2 free to play ? or it will day in the next 2-3 years
F2P ladder + remove macro mechanics.
No these two things imo succesfully stopping new players to play sc2 including me.
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On December 07 2016 01:30 heronn wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2016 00:57 Tobivankenobi94 wrote:
how much shit must happen that blizzard changes something ?
make sc2 free to play ? or it will day in the next 2-3 years F2P ladder + remove macro mechanics. No these two things imo succesfully stopping new players to play sc2 including me.
So like a Moba with less teamplay and heroes, but more deathball onemove game deciders?
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On December 07 2016 01:37 duke91 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2016 01:30 heronn wrote:On December 07 2016 00:57 Tobivankenobi94 wrote:
how much shit must happen that blizzard changes something ?
make sc2 free to play ? or it will day in the next 2-3 years F2P ladder + remove macro mechanics. No these two things imo succesfully stopping new players to play sc2 including me. So like a Moba with less teamplay and heroes, but more deathball onemove game deciders?
The game would draw so many players if Blizzard introduced lanes, or just a single map for ladder
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EPT
