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SeriousLus
169 Posts
On December 04 2016 06:51 ZAiNs wrote: Don't understand what was warn-worthy in this post. just TL mods being how they always are.. stating facts gets u banned.. when a progamer says the same thing as us, all is good.. weird logic User was banned for this post.Terrible history and constant negativity | ||
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maartendq
Belgium3115 Posts
On December 04 2016 07:52 RoninKenshin wrote: I wonder if SC2 could gain more popularity in the future without the teams. I've always thought that Kespa's way of doing things was too damaging to the scene; not letting players stream, not cooperating with other organizations, not allowing talent to play in certain tournaments, pushing teams to emphasize Proleague over individual tournaments, and basically keeping a restrictive leash over everyone. Brood War was diminishing significantly during the transition period (don't get me wrong, it was still popular and I know there were many factors including Blizzard pushing the transition), but I think the freedom of the players after the Kespa leash was... unleashed... allowed the scene to bloom to what it is now. Obviously people love Brood War too, but people love Starcraft 2 as well. I truly hope that the same can happen to Starcraft 2, and that it could have a second wind. Either that or Warcraft 4 comes out I guess. The problem with SC2 getting it's second wind is that it is almost completely dependent on Blizzard funding the prize pools whereas Brood War is self-sustaining (and rapidly regaining popularity if streaming numbers on tl.net are anything to go by). If Blizzard were to cancel WCS the foreign SC2 scene would be in shambles relatively quickly. Personally I've had more fun watching ASL season 1 VODS than I have watching SC2 for the past two and a half years. A single mistake will snowball a game out of control in SC2 but in BW there are a number of ways to actually stage a comeback. | ||
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RealityIsKing
613 Posts
On December 05 2016 00:58 Taf the Ghost wrote: SC2 in Korea was mostly killed because you had to pay for the game itself. SC:BW was played off 1 copy per computer. Though the big killer was LoL coming out fairly soon after SC2 launched while being F2P. Pretty much everyone was playing LoL from 2011 through 2016. That's why there is so much talent in competitive teams. Newflash: Koreans were allowed to play SC2 without paying in PC Bangs. SC2's gameplay simply didn't capture most of BW's audience. | ||
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Deleted User 26513
2376 Posts
On December 04 2016 23:10 duke91 wrote: 67k viewers today for ASL for a RO24 Again why should Korea give in demands towards some SC2 foreigners who a) never achieved anything in BW, never did anything positive to the BW scene b) Blizzard forced the transition towards SC2 and robbed 4 years of highest level BW c) SC2 killed proleague which was build up through hard work throughout the years. It is usually in history that those who lose a destructive, pointless war should not demand war reparations. You either watch BW despite the graphics, or forever stay with SC2. Don't demand anything to the detriment of people who are actually passionate about BW for so many years, who sticked with it for so long Indeed times have changed. May you should change as well and accept BW as it is. Hahahah, I had a good laugh with that post. First of all take it easy, there is no war. Many people love BW as much as SC2. And play one of the two for some reason(for example no widescreen resolution in BW is killing it for me. Also I'm old and slow now... even for SC2.). The Koreans killed their own BW and SC2 scenes, foreigners had nothing to do with that. They did it with the countless matchfixing scandals and with dumb decisions. Basically KeSPA never adapted to anything(as expected from a government organization). For example,last season when WCS was region-locked, they didn't create smaller tournaments for the players bellow top 50. They never created tournaments for younger/amateur players in both BW or SC2. Lack of new/young players was a problem in BW and they never adressed it. They just switched the games. I really hope now when SC2 Proleague is discontinued, KeSPA picks up BW again.  But I have my doubts. | ||
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Advantageous
China1350 Posts
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fronkschnonk
Germany622 Posts
On December 05 2016 02:28 RealityIsKing wrote: Newflash: Koreans were allowed to play SC2 without paying in PC Bangs. SC2's gameplay simply didn't capture most of BW's audience. You still would have to login with your own account to play, wouldn't you? I don't know really - just wondering. For your secont statement: It's hard to cover that for real because kespa switch was halfheartedly and way too late to make the transition as successful as possible riding the hype train. We'll never know what would've happened if kespa would've switched 2010 but that fact also makes your argument a mere speculation. Don't get me wrong though: It would've been way cooler if kespa/blizz/pros had tried some kind of cooperational coexistence of BW and SC2. Having specialists of each game in each team and making proleague a mixed competition. I think this could have worked much better for korea. Even cooperations between pure SC2 and pure BW Teams would've been possible. | ||
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hitthat
Poland2350 Posts
On December 05 2016 05:00 fronkschnonk wrote: We'll never know what would've happened if kespa would've switched 2010 but that fact also makes your argument a mere speculation. I know what would have happened. They would enrage me 2 years earlier. | ||
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LongShot27
United States2084 Posts
On December 05 2016 01:41 SeriousLus wrote: just TL mods being how they always are.. stating facts gets u banned.. when a progamer says the same thing as us, all is good.. weird logic User was banned for this post.Terrible history and constant negativity You guys seriously banned someone for stating something that is true. Why are you acting like thought police. Some people don't agree with you. Can you not deal with that? Are you seriously going to keep banning people for saying things like Proleague is going to end, GSL is going to end and all the Korean Teams are gonna disband? Well you can't for 2 of them because we were right. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
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Charoisaur
Germany16103 Posts
On December 05 2016 05:26 LongShot27 wrote: You guys seriously banned someone for stating something that is true. Why are you acting like thought police. Some people don't agree with you. Can you not deal with that? Are you seriously going to keep banning people for saying things like Proleague is going to end, GSL is going to end and all the Korean Teams are gonna disband? Well you can't for 2 of them because we were right. why does it matter if you are right or wrong? what do you gain by constantly stating how dead the game is in an sc2 forum? do you want to ruin the experience for the people who are still passionate about the game? also this should be in website feedback. | ||
KadaverBB
Germany25658 Posts
On December 05 2016 05:26 LongShot27 wrote: You guys seriously banned someone for stating something that is true. Why are you acting like thought police. Some people don't agree with you. Can you not deal with that? Are you seriously going to keep banning people for saying things like Proleague is going to end, GSL is going to end and all the Korean Teams are gonna disband? Well you can't for 2 of them because we were right. Again, take your moderation concerns to Website Feedback. It's not that difficult  | ||
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PharaphobiaSC
Czech Republic457 Posts
Also there could be so much other things for them to make. - Recruit your marine - Invite your friend to SC2 and get 50% off etc... - Something like hybrid proleague they have 4 computer setup anyway so it could be SC2 match, BW match etc etc... Like nowadays its SC2 vs BW, but it all could be just StarCraft family :^) And that makes me sad | ||
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hitthat
Poland2350 Posts
On December 05 2016 06:12 PharaphobiaSC wrote: Like nowadays its SC2 vs BW, but it all could be just StarCraft family :^) I can only talk for myself. I'm sure you doesnt want to read this, but it wasnt option in 2012, it is not option now. Back than when PL was switching I wouldnt consider SC2 any way more atractive than LoL and DotA2. Since than quality of games improved a lot and watching it becoming borderline entertaining for me but it still was in no way BW2 I really wanted. Hell, some games I watched I would even consider awsome. Yet I still treat SC2 as completely different franchise even when its official continuation of BW. Seeing korean BW amatour scene contributing from collapse of SC2 SPL in Korea makes it hard to feel sorry. Actually if I knew earlier that some of the greatest players of the past would go back to playing BW after SPL department (as they did) I would actively cheer for it to die. Sellfish? Yes. But admit, many of you would do wish it to other scenes if it would be about the benefits of SC2. The games are too much different. | ||
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PharaphobiaSC
Czech Republic457 Posts
On December 05 2016 06:56 hitthat wrote: I can only talk for myself. I'm sure you doesnt want to read this, but it wasnt option in 2012, it is not option now. Back than when PL was switching I wouldnt consider SC2 any way more atractive than LoL and DotA2. Since than quality of games improved a lot and watching it becoming borderline entertaining for me but it still was in no way BW2 I really wanted. Hell, some games I watched I would even consider awsome. Yet I still treat SC2 as completely different franchise even when its official continuation of BW. Seeing korean BW amatour scene contributing from collapse of SC2 SPL in Korea makes it hard to feel sorry. Actually if I knew earlier that some of the greatest players of the past would go back to playing BW after SPL department (as they did) I would actively cheer for it to die. Sellfish? Yes. But admit, many of you would do wish it to other scenes if it would be about the benefits of SC2. The games are too much different. Nonono I think you missed my point. I'm not saying the games are similar I'm just talking about "let the players" choice. It's not like this and that should be BW2 no.. BW is BW, SC2 is SC2, but as COMMUNITIES we could exists together as "StarCraft" | ||
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Jj_82
Swaziland419 Posts
On December 04 2016 06:42 papaz wrote: Well, it did, for about six years. For a video game it's quite alright!Very hard. Gaming market has changed too much at this point. On top of that they couldn't even convince the BW crowd that SC2 is what they should switch to. I love RTS and I hope Blizzard one day can make an RTS that brings in the big crowd. | ||
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Jj_82
Swaziland419 Posts
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JuanDi
45 Posts
On December 04 2016 06:42 papaz wrote: Very hard. Gaming market has changed too much at this point. On top of that they couldn't even convince the BW crowd that SC2 is what they should switch to. I love RTS and I hope Blizzard one day can make an RTS that brings in the big crowd. The problem with SC2 is that it is too hard to get into. I mean, since it is 1v1 it is harder to learn because you have to do everything. In games like LoL and OW you play alongside your friends and they can walk you through it. SC2 doesn't have too much of that (for the competitive scene, arcade and co-op are another story), so getting new players is hard. I think maybe encouraging things like archon mode or some form of teamplay would be the way to get the game bringing in the gigantic crowds other eSports have, but that goes against the identity of the game, and I think if there's a small-medium scene that's enough for a game like SC2, since it is quite niche tbh. I mean, it is too demanding for it to please anyone. The korean BW scene has kept up even without the team infrastructure, so the scene won't die that easily. Also the olimoleague has grown considerably, the VSL teamleague also had a fair amount of success, and Basetradetv is looking to help the koreans with more online tournaments specifically for them, so the scene is already bouncing back quite nicely. Maybe not to the BIG stage as before, but it is healthy enough to last for a fair amount of time after this. | ||
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On December 05 2016 05:26 LongShot27 wrote: You guys seriously banned someone for stating something that is true. Why are you acting like thought police. Some people don't agree with you. Can you not deal with that? Are you seriously going to keep banning people for saying things like Proleague is going to end, GSL is going to end and all the Korean Teams are gonna disband? Well you can't for 2 of them because we were right. They've always said that TL isn't a democracy and they're not entitled to respect freedom of speech. It's their website, they do what they want. If they don't like you, you're out, I learned that lesson myself a few years ago :D. | ||
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jalstar
United States8198 Posts
On December 05 2016 02:28 RealityIsKing wrote: Newflash: Koreans were allowed to play SC2 without paying in PC Bangs. SC2's gameplay simply didn't capture most of BW's audience. Not until January 2014, which was far too late. | ||
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LongShot27
United States2084 Posts
On December 05 2016 05:52 Charoisaur wrote: why does it matter if you are right or wrong? what do you gain by constantly stating how dead the game is in an sc2 forum? do you want to ruin the experience for the people who are still passionate about the game? also this should be in website feedback. Because when people stick their heads in the sand and go "NANANANA the game is fine" instead of going "you know what that's correct, we either need to address the issues as a community or give up" you're part of the problem | ||
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