|
How about making a solid league (like WCS premier) for non-Koreans that supported by Blizzard and let first-tier tournaments open?
|
On August 28 2016 19:44 Musicus wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 19:34 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 19:32 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 19:25 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 19:13 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:43 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:37 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:30 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:23 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:06 QzYSc2 wrote:
[quote]
im sure he will weep for maru with his $$$ bills. whats next, ban chinese teams from DOTA and korean teams (MVP) because they have no personality! (they just won the international). I always thought sc2 players were more intelligent people than MOBA players but this thread clearly proves the opposite. WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason. Of course I support WCS, it's how Blizzatd supports the scene and sc2 would not be doing as well as it is without WCS. I still think it has to be improved and dislike this year's system a lot. Still it's not as bad as you make it out to be, I don't think they reserve half of the spots for a single country at the International. Anyway, I'm not sure what about me saying that DH and IEM should be open and that Korea needs more tournaments made you so angry. WCS =/= supporting sc2. its a tournament format. MONEY supports the scene. you can spend money differently, in different formats tournaments. The fact that you're okayish with region locking WCS tournaments specifically against 1 country simply because they are better at the game is why you're stupid. I already told you that I dislike the current system = yes I want them to spend the money differently. But any WCS is better than no WCS. Well I'm done talking to you, work on your manners before you try to have a dicussion. i'll refrain from calling your statements stupid if that hurt your feelings. i dont know your motive for supporting region locking korea specifically, but so far ive seen: 1) they are too good 2) they have no personality (faceless) 3) koreans have infrastructure i can give an argument for any of them, please pick one. ( or make up your own argument, you havent given me one yet, just simply said ban koreans without a reason ) Okay, if we can talk like normal people why not. Firstly you should point out where I "simply said ban koreans without a reason". Secondly the only legion rock I am fine with, is a soft region lock, where a person lives and practices in the region he competes in, just as any foreigner that played in GSL lived and practiced there. Imo WCS should be long ongoing leagues again just as GSL and IEMs, DHs and any other international tournament should be open for anybody. We need enough money and tournaments in Korea that most Koreans won't even think about going abroad to play in WCS, unless they are past their prime maybe (just as when Allen Iverson left the NBA to go play overseas). Sadly it's hard to have that much money and tournaments in Korea, since sc2 just isn't that popular there anymore. you said region locking is okay'ish. without a reason. so that means you said banning koreans is okay ish, without providing further reasoning. i hope that clarifies it. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2016_WCS_Summer_Circuit_Championshipplease explain to me where the KR qualifiers are. Every significant existing sc2 scene has a qualifier except KR. please explain why Polish players, French players, Dutch players, Chinese players, can play in an AMERICAN tournament, if you have to 'live and practise in the region he competes in', and why SPECIFICALLY KOREANS not. so by your logic, WCS summer circuit championships would have only AMERICANS As I already said, I don't like this year's WCS, I would definitely like to WCS EU and AM back. Also add a WCS Asia region (China, Taiwan etc.), while WCS Korea is GSL/SSL. Where is the German qualifier in GSL? It's an offline qualifer, so basically a Korean qualifer where you have to live there to compete in it, which is absolutely fine imo. Should just be the same for WCS then too. thats the difference, people can live in america, fly just to korea to compete in GSL without applying for korean citizenship and go home. Thus your argument is invalid. But back then it was an open online qualifier for WCS, so that was also way easier to take part in than to fly to NA or EU and play offline. Not sure if that many Korean teams could've afforded that trip and would've been willing to send their players. While possible, no foreigner ever just flew to Korea, played the qualfier and flew back, in practice they all committed to living there. Although there was a time when there were seeds for foreigners, which was stupid, but it was what the Koreans wanted and Koreans also got seeds to MLG and stuff in return.
whatever happened in the past is the past, now is the present. whether someone can afford it is irrelevant,how difficult it was is also irrelevant, making rules about it is relevant. because rules are facts, difficulty and hardships are subjective.
|
On August 28 2016 19:29 QzYSc2 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 19:23 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 19:04 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:54 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 18:21 VormannLeiss wrote:
I wanna share a little story, which happend exactly 10 years ago in Broodwar. My brother - Dashwriter - qualified for the WCG 2006 as one of the three spots for Germany. The scene in Germany was pretty stacked back than with players like Mondragon, Fisheye, iNfernal and others. My brother trained like a mad man to be able to qualify for WCG main event just once in his career. After qualifying he trained even harder, because he wanted to show good results in Monza. He finished the group stage as second and moved on to the single elimination tournament, where he played JulyZerg in the first round. He lost 0-2, but my brother asked for a third game just for fun. He also lost this game, but he told me in the third game he had a small glimpse of hope, that he could win. For him this event was a once in a lifetime experience. He was doing his national service back then, so he had the time to play a lot the game he already played for 8 years at this point. It wasn't his career or anything - he did all of it in his free time.
The difference in skill between my brother and JulyZerg was so tremendously high, because of all the infrastructure the Koreans had - the money, the tournaments, the training and so on.
I know 10 years has passed since this events and its a different game that is played today. But I think that the foreign scene is still behind in infrastructure to compete with the experience of Korean eSports environments.
I'm really looking forward to Blizzcon, but I won't be to sad if the difference is still big - it was only one year and I definitely think that the Foreigners can reach the level of the best Koreans, if they can build up a good training environment. That's really neat. Thanks for sharing that story. I too am also looking forward to Blizzcon. Yes, the Koreans are probably going to win, but it'll be nice to see the top 8 of each region go against each other and see how far apart they are. On August 28 2016 18:43 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:37 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:30 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:23 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:06 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:00 Musicus wrote:
WCS being (kinda) region locked is fine and good imo, it just sucks that WCS swallowed up IEM and DH. They should've stayed open tournaments and we also need more tournaments in Korea.
But that's kinda off-topic and I'm pretty sure uThermal agrees with this, he will be more sad than most that Maru won't be at BlizzCon, so I don't see why people are shitting on him. Foreigners did indeed improve this year. I'm just not sure if this trend will keep going or if it's just a short term occurrence due to LotV still being new. im sure he will weep for maru with his $$$ bills. whats next, ban chinese teams from DOTA and korean teams (MVP) because they have no personality! (they just won the international). I always thought sc2 players were more intelligent people than MOBA players but this thread clearly proves the opposite. WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason. Of course I support WCS, it's how Blizzatd supports the scene and sc2 would not be doing as well as it is without WCS. I still think it has to be improved and dislike this year's system a lot. Still it's not as bad as you make it out to be, I don't think they reserve half of the spots for a single country at the International. Anyway, I'm not sure what about me saying that DH and IEM should be open and that Korea needs more tournaments made you so angry. WCS =/= supporting sc2. its a tournament format. MONEY supports the scene. you can spend money differently, in different formats tournaments. The fact that you're okayish with region locking WCS tournaments specifically against 1 country simply because they are better at the game is why you're stupid. I already told you that I dislike the current system = yes I want them to spend the money differently. But any WCS is better than no WCS. Well I'm done talking to you, work on your manners before you try to have a dicussion. i'll refrain from calling your statements stupid if that hurt your feelings. i dont know your motive for supporting region locking korea specifically, but so far ive seen: 1) they are too good 2) they have no personality (faceless) 3) koreans have infrastructure i can give an argument for any of them, please pick one. ( or make up your own argument, you havent given me one yet, just simply said ban koreans without a reason ) What you said was "WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason," and then you proceeded to call the poster in question stupid. I would actually like to hear your arguments for each one of them as I have yet to hear an effective argument as to why Koreans should be allowed in the WCS tournament system itself. Dreamhacks/IEMs, yes, but WCS itself. Also, I would like to hear your opinion on the topic of money and foreigners (though this does have to do with infrastructure). yes, twice. apparently the 2nd time was the nail in the coffin and he couldnt discuss any longer. an effective argument for why they should be allowed? because it's 2016 and we shouldnt be racist anymore. Whats YOUR argument? and i dont know what you're asking specifically about 'topic of money and foreigners'. So that is your answer to the three arguments that people have put up supporting WCS? What I mean is, what is your response to the idea that the foreign scene needs more money in order to grow competitively? i dont feel like responding seriously to someone who hasnt even given me his own stance yet on the topic with arguments and then requesting an significant amount of time and thought of my own, you know, just incase of trolls.
That's unfortunate. I thought you had read through at least the past few pages of this thread. If you had, you might have seen my opinion posted in my rather lengthy responses. I do believe I was fairly clear in my stance in those posts.
That being said, my view is that I support WCS in its current iteration--though with a few caveats. I think that there should be a few more global tournaments, and I think a third season of GSL/SSL is preferable. Also, I do feel like tournaments should not be obliged to lock against Koreans in order to stay within the WCS system. They should be able to have whoever they want in their tournaments and still be supported by Blizzard.
I feel that in the past foreigners were unable to gain a sufficient amount of money through tournaments despite having a good work ethic (like Scarlett or Snute or Bunny) and being very good players.
Thus, in order to remedy the lack of money going towards foreigners, I think it is necessary that Blizzard region lock (against the Koreans) WCS so that at least temporarily, the money can give more opportunities to foreign players.
Ideally the foreign scene could set up a system like in Korea, where they play in team houses and have coaches, but in lieu of that option, I think injecting money is a somewhat favourable alternative.
On August 28 2016 19:46 Thouhastmail wrote:
How about making a solid league (like WCS premier) for non-Koreans that supported by Blizzard and let first-tier tournaments open?
I think this is definitely one way to go about doing things. Though, I still think a number of tournaments should limit Koreans based purely off of giving a bit more opportunity to Koreans. Last year was a good example of foreigners doing well in WCS, but in almost all other tournaments, Koreans still dominated, and I think there should be some tournaments that are foreigner primary.
|
On August 28 2016 19:49 FrkFrJss wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 19:29 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 19:23 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 19:04 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:54 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 18:21 VormannLeiss wrote:
I wanna share a little story, which happend exactly 10 years ago in Broodwar. My brother - Dashwriter - qualified for the WCG 2006 as one of the three spots for Germany. The scene in Germany was pretty stacked back than with players like Mondragon, Fisheye, iNfernal and others. My brother trained like a mad man to be able to qualify for WCG main event just once in his career. After qualifying he trained even harder, because he wanted to show good results in Monza. He finished the group stage as second and moved on to the single elimination tournament, where he played JulyZerg in the first round. He lost 0-2, but my brother asked for a third game just for fun. He also lost this game, but he told me in the third game he had a small glimpse of hope, that he could win. For him this event was a once in a lifetime experience. He was doing his national service back then, so he had the time to play a lot the game he already played for 8 years at this point. It wasn't his career or anything - he did all of it in his free time.
The difference in skill between my brother and JulyZerg was so tremendously high, because of all the infrastructure the Koreans had - the money, the tournaments, the training and so on.
I know 10 years has passed since this events and its a different game that is played today. But I think that the foreign scene is still behind in infrastructure to compete with the experience of Korean eSports environments.
I'm really looking forward to Blizzcon, but I won't be to sad if the difference is still big - it was only one year and I definitely think that the Foreigners can reach the level of the best Koreans, if they can build up a good training environment. That's really neat. Thanks for sharing that story. I too am also looking forward to Blizzcon. Yes, the Koreans are probably going to win, but it'll be nice to see the top 8 of each region go against each other and see how far apart they are. On August 28 2016 18:43 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:37 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:30 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:23 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:06 QzYSc2 wrote:
[quote]
im sure he will weep for maru with his $$$ bills. whats next, ban chinese teams from DOTA and korean teams (MVP) because they have no personality! (they just won the international). I always thought sc2 players were more intelligent people than MOBA players but this thread clearly proves the opposite. WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason. Of course I support WCS, it's how Blizzatd supports the scene and sc2 would not be doing as well as it is without WCS. I still think it has to be improved and dislike this year's system a lot. Still it's not as bad as you make it out to be, I don't think they reserve half of the spots for a single country at the International. Anyway, I'm not sure what about me saying that DH and IEM should be open and that Korea needs more tournaments made you so angry. WCS =/= supporting sc2. its a tournament format. MONEY supports the scene. you can spend money differently, in different formats tournaments. The fact that you're okayish with region locking WCS tournaments specifically against 1 country simply because they are better at the game is why you're stupid. I already told you that I dislike the current system = yes I want them to spend the money differently. But any WCS is better than no WCS. Well I'm done talking to you, work on your manners before you try to have a dicussion. i'll refrain from calling your statements stupid if that hurt your feelings. i dont know your motive for supporting region locking korea specifically, but so far ive seen: 1) they are too good 2) they have no personality (faceless) 3) koreans have infrastructure i can give an argument for any of them, please pick one. ( or make up your own argument, you havent given me one yet, just simply said ban koreans without a reason ) What you said was "WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason," and then you proceeded to call the poster in question stupid. I would actually like to hear your arguments for each one of them as I have yet to hear an effective argument as to why Koreans should be allowed in the WCS tournament system itself. Dreamhacks/IEMs, yes, but WCS itself. Also, I would like to hear your opinion on the topic of money and foreigners (though this does have to do with infrastructure). yes, twice. apparently the 2nd time was the nail in the coffin and he couldnt discuss any longer. an effective argument for why they should be allowed? because it's 2016 and we shouldnt be racist anymore. Whats YOUR argument? and i dont know what you're asking specifically about 'topic of money and foreigners'. So that is your answer to the three arguments that people have put up supporting WCS? What I mean is, what is your response to the idea that the foreign scene needs more money in order to grow competitively? i dont feel like responding seriously to someone who hasnt even given me his own stance yet on the topic with arguments and then requesting an significant amount of time and thought of my own, you know, just incase of trolls. That's unfortunate. I thought you had read through at least the past few pages of this thread. If you had, you might have seen my opinion posted in my rather lengthy responses. I do believe I was fairly clear in my stance in those posts. That being said, my view is that I support WCS in its current iteration--though with a few caveats. I think that there should be a few more global tournaments, and I think a third season of GSL/SSL is preferable. Also, I do feel like tournaments should not be obliged to lock against Koreans in order to stay within the WCS system. They should be able to have whoever they want in their tournaments and still be supported by Blizzard. I feel that in the past foreigners were unable to gain a sufficient amount of money through tournaments despite having a good work ethic (like Scarlett or Snute or Bunny) and being very good players. Thus, in order to remedy the lack of money going towards foreigners, I think it is necessary that Blizzard region lock (against the Koreans) WCS so that at least temporarily, the money can give more opportunities to foreign players. Ideally the foreign scene could set up a system like in Korea, where they play in team houses and have coaches, but in lieu of that option, I think injecting money is a somewhat favourable alternative. Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 19:46 Thouhastmail wrote:
How about making a solid league (like WCS premier) for non-Koreans that supported by Blizzard and let first-tier tournaments open? I think this is definitely one way to go about doing things. Though, I still think a number of tournaments should limit Koreans based purely off of giving a bit more opportunity to Koreans. Last year was a good example of foreigners doing well in WCS, but in almost all other tournaments, Koreans still dominated, and I think there should be some tournaments that are foreigner primary.
i don't care if there were 10 global events with koreans, and 1 wcs summer circuit championship that specifically bans koreans. The point is that it's wrong. You just dont lock out a specific race just because they're too good. You dont call sc2 a competitive game when you ban a certain region because they're too competitive. Matter of principle.
I'm not gonna argue whether snute scarlett etc. works hard or not, you shouldnt either. How do you judge whether gumiho works harder or scarlett? you been to their houses? seen their lifestyles? Even then, working hard is only merely a factor. People in africa work hard yet earn %1 of your income?
let me ask you, whose fault is it, the koreans or the non-koreans, that the non-koreans cannot win against the koreans?
|
On August 28 2016 20:06 QzYSc2 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 19:49 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 19:29 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 19:23 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 19:04 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:54 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 18:21 VormannLeiss wrote:
I wanna share a little story, which happend exactly 10 years ago in Broodwar. My brother - Dashwriter - qualified for the WCG 2006 as one of the three spots for Germany. The scene in Germany was pretty stacked back than with players like Mondragon, Fisheye, iNfernal and others. My brother trained like a mad man to be able to qualify for WCG main event just once in his career. After qualifying he trained even harder, because he wanted to show good results in Monza. He finished the group stage as second and moved on to the single elimination tournament, where he played JulyZerg in the first round. He lost 0-2, but my brother asked for a third game just for fun. He also lost this game, but he told me in the third game he had a small glimpse of hope, that he could win. For him this event was a once in a lifetime experience. He was doing his national service back then, so he had the time to play a lot the game he already played for 8 years at this point. It wasn't his career or anything - he did all of it in his free time.
The difference in skill between my brother and JulyZerg was so tremendously high, because of all the infrastructure the Koreans had - the money, the tournaments, the training and so on.
I know 10 years has passed since this events and its a different game that is played today. But I think that the foreign scene is still behind in infrastructure to compete with the experience of Korean eSports environments.
I'm really looking forward to Blizzcon, but I won't be to sad if the difference is still big - it was only one year and I definitely think that the Foreigners can reach the level of the best Koreans, if they can build up a good training environment. That's really neat. Thanks for sharing that story. I too am also looking forward to Blizzcon. Yes, the Koreans are probably going to win, but it'll be nice to see the top 8 of each region go against each other and see how far apart they are. On August 28 2016 18:43 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:37 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:30 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:23 Musicus wrote:
[quote]
Of course I support WCS, it's how Blizzatd supports the scene and sc2 would not be doing as well as it is without WCS. I still think it has to be improved and dislike this year's system a lot.
Still it's not as bad as you make it out to be, I don't think they reserve half of the spots for a single country at the International.
Anyway, I'm not sure what about me saying that DH and IEM should be open and that Korea needs more tournaments made you so angry. WCS =/= supporting sc2. its a tournament format. MONEY supports the scene. you can spend money differently, in different formats tournaments. The fact that you're okayish with region locking WCS tournaments specifically against 1 country simply because they are better at the game is why you're stupid. I already told you that I dislike the current system = yes I want them to spend the money differently. But any WCS is better than no WCS. Well I'm done talking to you, work on your manners before you try to have a dicussion. i'll refrain from calling your statements stupid if that hurt your feelings. i dont know your motive for supporting region locking korea specifically, but so far ive seen: 1) they are too good 2) they have no personality (faceless) 3) koreans have infrastructure i can give an argument for any of them, please pick one. ( or make up your own argument, you havent given me one yet, just simply said ban koreans without a reason ) What you said was "WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason," and then you proceeded to call the poster in question stupid. I would actually like to hear your arguments for each one of them as I have yet to hear an effective argument as to why Koreans should be allowed in the WCS tournament system itself. Dreamhacks/IEMs, yes, but WCS itself. Also, I would like to hear your opinion on the topic of money and foreigners (though this does have to do with infrastructure). yes, twice. apparently the 2nd time was the nail in the coffin and he couldnt discuss any longer. an effective argument for why they should be allowed? because it's 2016 and we shouldnt be racist anymore. Whats YOUR argument? and i dont know what you're asking specifically about 'topic of money and foreigners'. So that is your answer to the three arguments that people have put up supporting WCS? What I mean is, what is your response to the idea that the foreign scene needs more money in order to grow competitively? i dont feel like responding seriously to someone who hasnt even given me his own stance yet on the topic with arguments and then requesting an significant amount of time and thought of my own, you know, just incase of trolls. That's unfortunate. I thought you had read through at least the past few pages of this thread. If you had, you might have seen my opinion posted in my rather lengthy responses. I do believe I was fairly clear in my stance in those posts. That being said, my view is that I support WCS in its current iteration--though with a few caveats. I think that there should be a few more global tournaments, and I think a third season of GSL/SSL is preferable. Also, I do feel like tournaments should not be obliged to lock against Koreans in order to stay within the WCS system. They should be able to have whoever they want in their tournaments and still be supported by Blizzard. I feel that in the past foreigners were unable to gain a sufficient amount of money through tournaments despite having a good work ethic (like Scarlett or Snute or Bunny) and being very good players. Thus, in order to remedy the lack of money going towards foreigners, I think it is necessary that Blizzard region lock (against the Koreans) WCS so that at least temporarily, the money can give more opportunities to foreign players. Ideally the foreign scene could set up a system like in Korea, where they play in team houses and have coaches, but in lieu of that option, I think injecting money is a somewhat favourable alternative. On August 28 2016 19:46 Thouhastmail wrote:
How about making a solid league (like WCS premier) for non-Koreans that supported by Blizzard and let first-tier tournaments open? I think this is definitely one way to go about doing things. Though, I still think a number of tournaments should limit Koreans based purely off of giving a bit more opportunity to Koreans. Last year was a good example of foreigners doing well in WCS, but in almost all other tournaments, Koreans still dominated, and I think there should be some tournaments that are foreigner primary. i don't care if there were 10 global events with koreans, and 1 wcs summer circuit championship that specifically bans koreans. The point is that it's wrong. You just dont lock out a specific race just because they're too good. You dont call sc2 a competitive game when you ban a certain region because they're too competitive. Matter of principle. I'm not gonna argue whether snute scarlett etc. works hard or not, you shouldnt either. How do you judge whether gumiho works harder or scarlett? you been to their houses? seen their lifestyles? Even then, working hard is only merely a factor. People in africa work hard yet earn %1 of your income? let me ask you, whose fault is it, the koreans or the non-koreans, that the non-koreans cannot win against the koreans?
First of all, calm down. This isn't an attack on your person. I'm not saying they Koreans don't work hard; what I'm saying is that foreigners also work hard, but without the resources specific to Korea; they cannot compete at the same level.
What Blizzard is trying to do is raise the overall competitiveness of the entire SC2 scene. If both foreigners and Koreans can push each other to greater levels, then everyone wins.
Now, as for the morality of region locking, Blizzard is not saying that Koreans cannot compete in WCS tournaments. Instead, they want those Koreans to reside within WCS specific regions in order to compete there.
The obvious counter is that Blizzard is being racist by banning the Korean region regardless of whether or not Koreans can actually compete in WCS.
However, consider this: the GSL and SSL are region-locked tournaments. They don't come out and directly say it, but the qualifiers are all off-line. I do not believe there is any part of the GSL or the SSL that is online. In other words, you have to be in Korea to compete in Korea. With the format of GSL and SSL, it becomes expensive to compete there if you do not also reside there.
Blizzard can region-lock WCS because Korea has its own WCS. It doesn't need another league.
That's how the morality of the region locking is still fine within WCS itself. Of cours, Blizzard does have tougher restrictions, but those are more of a side issue.
|
On August 28 2016 20:26 FrkFrJss wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 20:06 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 19:49 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 19:29 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 19:23 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 19:04 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:54 FrkFrJss wrote:On August 28 2016 18:21 VormannLeiss wrote:
I wanna share a little story, which happend exactly 10 years ago in Broodwar. My brother - Dashwriter - qualified for the WCG 2006 as one of the three spots for Germany. The scene in Germany was pretty stacked back than with players like Mondragon, Fisheye, iNfernal and others. My brother trained like a mad man to be able to qualify for WCG main event just once in his career. After qualifying he trained even harder, because he wanted to show good results in Monza. He finished the group stage as second and moved on to the single elimination tournament, where he played JulyZerg in the first round. He lost 0-2, but my brother asked for a third game just for fun. He also lost this game, but he told me in the third game he had a small glimpse of hope, that he could win. For him this event was a once in a lifetime experience. He was doing his national service back then, so he had the time to play a lot the game he already played for 8 years at this point. It wasn't his career or anything - he did all of it in his free time.
The difference in skill between my brother and JulyZerg was so tremendously high, because of all the infrastructure the Koreans had - the money, the tournaments, the training and so on.
I know 10 years has passed since this events and its a different game that is played today. But I think that the foreign scene is still behind in infrastructure to compete with the experience of Korean eSports environments.
I'm really looking forward to Blizzcon, but I won't be to sad if the difference is still big - it was only one year and I definitely think that the Foreigners can reach the level of the best Koreans, if they can build up a good training environment. That's really neat. Thanks for sharing that story. I too am also looking forward to Blizzcon. Yes, the Koreans are probably going to win, but it'll be nice to see the top 8 of each region go against each other and see how far apart they are. On August 28 2016 18:43 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:37 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:30 QzYSc2 wrote:
[quote]
WCS =/= supporting sc2. its a tournament format. MONEY supports the scene. you can spend money differently, in different formats tournaments. The fact that you're okayish with region locking WCS tournaments specifically against 1 country simply because they are better at the game is why you're stupid.
I already told you that I dislike the current system = yes I want them to spend the money differently. But any WCS is better than no WCS. Well I'm done talking to you, work on your manners before you try to have a dicussion. i'll refrain from calling your statements stupid if that hurt your feelings. i dont know your motive for supporting region locking korea specifically, but so far ive seen: 1) they are too good 2) they have no personality (faceless) 3) koreans have infrastructure i can give an argument for any of them, please pick one. ( or make up your own argument, you havent given me one yet, just simply said ban koreans without a reason ) What you said was "WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason," and then you proceeded to call the poster in question stupid. I would actually like to hear your arguments for each one of them as I have yet to hear an effective argument as to why Koreans should be allowed in the WCS tournament system itself. Dreamhacks/IEMs, yes, but WCS itself. Also, I would like to hear your opinion on the topic of money and foreigners (though this does have to do with infrastructure). yes, twice. apparently the 2nd time was the nail in the coffin and he couldnt discuss any longer. an effective argument for why they should be allowed? because it's 2016 and we shouldnt be racist anymore. Whats YOUR argument? and i dont know what you're asking specifically about 'topic of money and foreigners'. So that is your answer to the three arguments that people have put up supporting WCS? What I mean is, what is your response to the idea that the foreign scene needs more money in order to grow competitively? i dont feel like responding seriously to someone who hasnt even given me his own stance yet on the topic with arguments and then requesting an significant amount of time and thought of my own, you know, just incase of trolls. That's unfortunate. I thought you had read through at least the past few pages of this thread. If you had, you might have seen my opinion posted in my rather lengthy responses. I do believe I was fairly clear in my stance in those posts. That being said, my view is that I support WCS in its current iteration--though with a few caveats. I think that there should be a few more global tournaments, and I think a third season of GSL/SSL is preferable. Also, I do feel like tournaments should not be obliged to lock against Koreans in order to stay within the WCS system. They should be able to have whoever they want in their tournaments and still be supported by Blizzard. I feel that in the past foreigners were unable to gain a sufficient amount of money through tournaments despite having a good work ethic (like Scarlett or Snute or Bunny) and being very good players. Thus, in order to remedy the lack of money going towards foreigners, I think it is necessary that Blizzard region lock (against the Koreans) WCS so that at least temporarily, the money can give more opportunities to foreign players. Ideally the foreign scene could set up a system like in Korea, where they play in team houses and have coaches, but in lieu of that option, I think injecting money is a somewhat favourable alternative. On August 28 2016 19:46 Thouhastmail wrote:
How about making a solid league (like WCS premier) for non-Koreans that supported by Blizzard and let first-tier tournaments open? I think this is definitely one way to go about doing things. Though, I still think a number of tournaments should limit Koreans based purely off of giving a bit more opportunity to Koreans. Last year was a good example of foreigners doing well in WCS, but in almost all other tournaments, Koreans still dominated, and I think there should be some tournaments that are foreigner primary. i don't care if there were 10 global events with koreans, and 1 wcs summer circuit championship that specifically bans koreans. The point is that it's wrong. You just dont lock out a specific race just because they're too good. You dont call sc2 a competitive game when you ban a certain region because they're too competitive. Matter of principle. I'm not gonna argue whether snute scarlett etc. works hard or not, you shouldnt either. How do you judge whether gumiho works harder or scarlett? you been to their houses? seen their lifestyles? Even then, working hard is only merely a factor. People in africa work hard yet earn %1 of your income? let me ask you, whose fault is it, the koreans or the non-koreans, that the non-koreans cannot win against the koreans? First of all, calm down. This isn't an attack on your person. I'm not saying they Koreans don't work hard; what I'm saying is that foreigners also work hard, but without the resources specific to Korea; they cannot compete at the same level. What Blizzard is trying to do is raise the overall competitiveness of the entire SC2 scene. If both foreigners and Koreans can push each other to greater levels, then everyone wins. Now, as for the morality of region locking, Blizzard is not saying that Koreans cannot compete in WCS tournaments. Instead, they want those Koreans to reside within WCS specific regions in order to compete there. The obvious counter is that Blizzard is being racist by banning the Korean region regardless of whether or not Koreans can actually compete in WCS. However, consider this: the GSL and SSL are region-locked tournaments. They don't come out and directly say it, but the qualifiers are all off-line. I do not believe there is any part of the GSL or the SSL that is online. In other words, you have to be in Korea to compete in Korea. With the format of GSL and SSL, it becomes expensive to compete there if you do not also reside there. Blizzard can region-lock WCS because Korea has its own WCS. It doesn't need another league. That's how the morality of the region locking is still fine within WCS itself. Of cours, Blizzard does have tougher restrictions, but those are more of a side issue.
First of all, i am calm. I'm not korean myself so i don't know why you would think i assume its a personal attack. i just wish you would stop subjective topics to pretend its an argument.
Because it's a waste of time to argue all day about whether red or blue is the better color, same about how hard each player works every day.
stop trying to present your thoughts, assumptions and speculations as facts.
just statements like:
'What Blizzard is trying to do is raise the overall competitiveness of the entire SC2 scene. If both foreigners and Koreans can push each other to greater levels, then everyone wins. '
you cannot prove this. EVEN IF the foreigners are getting better, you cannot possibly pretend its the only factor is the region locking and money. lotv a completely different game compared to, -HotS to WoL-.
and as far the GSL SSL point, same reply to musicus.
On August 28 2016 19:34 QzYSc2 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 19:32 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 19:25 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 19:13 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:43 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:37 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:30 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:23 Musicus wrote:On August 28 2016 18:06 QzYSc2 wrote:On August 28 2016 18:00 Musicus wrote:
WCS being (kinda) region locked is fine and good imo, it just sucks that WCS swallowed up IEM and DH. They should've stayed open tournaments and we also need more tournaments in Korea.
But that's kinda off-topic and I'm pretty sure uThermal agrees with this, he will be more sad than most that Maru won't be at BlizzCon, so I don't see why people are shitting on him. Foreigners did indeed improve this year. I'm just not sure if this trend will keep going or if it's just a short term occurrence due to LotV still being new. im sure he will weep for maru with his $$$ bills. whats next, ban chinese teams from DOTA and korean teams (MVP) because they have no personality! (they just won the international). I always thought sc2 players were more intelligent people than MOBA players but this thread clearly proves the opposite. WCS supporters, you are stupid beyond reason. Of course I support WCS, it's how Blizzatd supports the scene and sc2 would not be doing as well as it is without WCS. I still think it has to be improved and dislike this year's system a lot. Still it's not as bad as you make it out to be, I don't think they reserve half of the spots for a single country at the International. Anyway, I'm not sure what about me saying that DH and IEM should be open and that Korea needs more tournaments made you so angry. WCS =/= supporting sc2. its a tournament format. MONEY supports the scene. you can spend money differently, in different formats tournaments. The fact that you're okayish with region locking WCS tournaments specifically against 1 country simply because they are better at the game is why you're stupid. I already told you that I dislike the current system = yes I want them to spend the money differently. But any WCS is better than no WCS. Well I'm done talking to you, work on your manners before you try to have a dicussion. i'll refrain from calling your statements stupid if that hurt your feelings. i dont know your motive for supporting region locking korea specifically, but so far ive seen: 1) they are too good 2) they have no personality (faceless) 3) koreans have infrastructure i can give an argument for any of them, please pick one. ( or make up your own argument, you havent given me one yet, just simply said ban koreans without a reason ) Okay, if we can talk like normal people why not. Firstly you should point out where I "simply said ban koreans without a reason". Secondly the only legion rock I am fine with, is a soft region lock, where a person lives and practices in the region he competes in, just as any foreigner that played in GSL lived and practiced there. Imo WCS should be long ongoing leagues again just as GSL and IEMs, DHs and any other international tournament should be open for anybody. We need enough money and tournaments in Korea that most Koreans won't even think about going abroad to play in WCS, unless they are past their prime maybe (just as when Allen Iverson left the NBA to go play overseas). Sadly it's hard to have that much money and tournaments in Korea, since sc2 just isn't that popular there anymore. you said region locking is okay'ish. without a reason. so that means you said banning koreans is okay ish, without providing further reasoning. i hope that clarifies it. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2016_WCS_Summer_Circuit_Championshipplease explain to me where the KR qualifiers are. Every significant existing sc2 scene has a qualifier except KR. please explain why Polish players, French players, Dutch players, Chinese players, can play in an AMERICAN tournament, if you have to 'live and practise in the region he competes in', and why SPECIFICALLY KOREANS not. so by your logic, WCS summer circuit championships would have only AMERICANS As I already said, I don't like this year's WCS, I would definitely like to WCS EU and AM back. Also add a WCS Asia region (China, Taiwan etc.), while WCS Korea is GSL/SSL. Where is the German qualifier in GSL? It's an offline qualifer, so basically a Korean qualifer where you have to live there to compete in it, which is absolutely fine imo. Should just be the same for WCS then too. thats the difference, people can live in america, fly just to korea to compete in GSL without applying for korean citizenship and go home. Thus your argument is invalid.
|
Completly agree with Musicus here.
GSL has effectively been region locked to residents of Seoul since the beginning of Sc2. You have to qualify in offline events and then have regular offline matches for about 3-4 months. And since blizzard massively supports those Korean events with money, I am okay with providing tournaments and money for people without this opportunity, too.
You might not agree with me here, but it is a reasonable argument why people who live in Korea are specifically locked from those events.
And so I am happy to see the best players from different nations, who cannot easily compete in GSL, SSL and Proleague clash it out between themselves in WCS once in a while and make a living out of it. Also more money means more motivation, and more importantly the chance to go fulltime. So it is a reasonable statement to say foreign scene has gotten better, if thats true we'll see at blizzcon.
What I am certainly not okay with, is that blizzard only helps funding offline tournaments with region lock. Dreamhacks, IEMs, and other external tournaments should be open for everyone and show the viewers the best Starcraft there is..
IIRC homestory cup as an example decided not to be part of the WCS system, didn't get Blizzard money anymore and now struggles to get enough prize money for Koreans to come over.
Hopefully the success of a rather small event like the Shoutcraft Kings (with thankfully Blizzard still funds) will promt them to change things next year.
|
Just make the system back to what it was last year. I have zero interest in watching foreigner only tournaments and having only two seasons of starleagues doesnt really give me too many alternatives to watch the BEST players there are. Proleague is basically over and so far we have only had two starleague champions?...
Probably the most boring year of starcraft for me so far which is a shame considering how good LotV is.
|
On August 28 2016 20:47 Insidioussc2 wrote:
Completly agree with Musicus here.
GSL has effectively been region locked to residents of Seoul since the beginning of Sc2. You have to qualify in offline events and then have regular offline matches for about 3-4 months. And since blizzard massively supports those Korean events with money, I am okay with providing tournaments and money for people without this opportunity, too.
You might not agree with me here, but it is a reasonable argument why people who live in Korea are specifically locked from those events.
And so I am happy to see the best players from different nations, who cannot easily compete in GSL, SSL and Proleague clash it out between themselves in WCS once in a while and make a living out of it. Also more money means more motivation, and more importantly the chance to go fulltime. So it is a reasonable statement to say foreign scene has gotten better, if thats true we'll see at blizzcon.
What I am certainly not okay with, is that blizzard only helps funding offline tournaments with region lock. Dreamhacks, IEMs, and other external tournaments should be open for everyone and show the viewers the best Starcraft there is..
IIRC homestory cup as an example decided not to be part of the WCS system, didn't get Blizzard money anymore and now struggles to get enough prize money for Koreans to come over.
Hopefully the success of a rather small event like the Shoutcraft Kings (with thankfully Blizzard still funds) will promt them to change things next year.
Agree mostly with this. WCS seems reasonable, but banning the most competitive region from the premier weekend tourneys such as Dreamhacks, IEMs....... yeah I just can't wrap my head around that one.
|
On August 28 2016 19:46 Thouhastmail wrote:
How about making a solid league (like WCS premier) for non-Koreans that supported by Blizzard and let first-tier tournaments open?
Many would be way happier with this I think, although if koreans are willing to move there they should still be allowed in wcs, just as foreigners can play gsl.
|
On August 28 2016 21:05 KrOmander wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 20:47 Insidioussc2 wrote:
Completly agree with Musicus here.
GSL has effectively been region locked to residents of Seoul since the beginning of Sc2. You have to qualify in offline events and then have regular offline matches for about 3-4 months. And since blizzard massively supports those Korean events with money, I am okay with providing tournaments and money for people without this opportunity, too.
You might not agree with me here, but it is a reasonable argument why people who live in Korea are specifically locked from those events.
And so I am happy to see the best players from different nations, who cannot easily compete in GSL, SSL and Proleague clash it out between themselves in WCS once in a while and make a living out of it. Also more money means more motivation, and more importantly the chance to go fulltime. So it is a reasonable statement to say foreign scene has gotten better, if thats true we'll see at blizzcon.
What I am certainly not okay with, is that blizzard only helps funding offline tournaments with region lock. Dreamhacks, IEMs, and other external tournaments should be open for everyone and show the viewers the best Starcraft there is..
IIRC homestory cup as an example decided not to be part of the WCS system, didn't get Blizzard money anymore and now struggles to get enough prize money for Koreans to come over.
Hopefully the success of a rather small event like the Shoutcraft Kings (with thankfully Blizzard still funds) will promt them to change things next year. Agree mostly with this. WCS seems reasonable, but banning the most competitive region from the premier weekend tourneys such as Dreamhacks, IEMs....... yeah I just can't wrap my head around that one.
That'd be like blizzard telling the foreigners "look, we know you guys will never be on equal footing with Koreans in weekend tournaments and other events, so we made this little charity league for you guys so you can at least feel a little better about yourselves".
|
I'll never understand how mental blocks can get this severe in competition. But seeing how a few people improved since the change, I guess its true.
|
Y'know, the more I think about this change, the more it makes sense. Koreans dominating every tournament wasn't healthy any more than it would be healthy to let MLB teams into Little League. You don't learn much of anything, in terms of game mechanics and strategy, from playing in tournaments. Tournaments teach you how to bear up under stress and make good adjustments in the moment. They don't make you an abstractly better player. Practice time makes you a better player. They do, however, give a benchmark of where you are as a player, and give you insight on how to best leverage your practice time. The problem is, losing in the Ro32 to PartinG doesn't tell you much of anything. "I couldn't beat someone who has a much better practice environment." Yeah, pretty useless. Losing in the Ro4 to Nerchio, in contrast, could teach you a lot. Maybe your gamesense was off. Maybe your build order left you at a disadvantage. All that will help you practice and help you improve. Basically, what this change means is that there actually is a foreign scene now.
The few comments I see which say that foreigners should just up and move to Korea are a little comical. So if anyone who isn't Korean wants to play good Starcraft, they need to develop their skills enough that they're confident making the move, gather enough money and support to do it, and learn enough of the language to be able to effectively communicate, only to risk being rejected by an established system? Yeah, sure sounds like we're promoting equal barriers to entry, here.
|
On August 28 2016 22:52 Acritter wrote:
Losing in the Ro4 to Nerchio, in contrast, could teach you a lot. Maybe your gamesense was off. Maybe your build order left you at a disadvantage.
But those are the same things that cause you to lose no matter who you play against. So in the end what you're implying is that if a foreign pro loses to a Korean pro they either think they did nothing wrong, they can't see what they did wrong or they don't think it matters what they did wrong. All of those things would be very bad.
|
This is not desirable for me, yet necessary to keep the foreign scene living.
I don't watch any of foreign tourneys non-Koreans participate due to the level of play being lower than GSL and SSL. I miss 2014/2015 when Korean played outside of Korea and the standard level of games were very high.
However, what's important for SC2 is not about giving a fair chance to every progamer; its all about expanding and sustaining the fan base when it comes to games or anything marketable. There are quite a number of people who cheer for foreign pros and who would no longer be interested in SC2 if non-Koreans die out. That will globally shrink SC2's pie. Not a good situation for all of us.
This is capitalism, guys. Even if a female athlete is lazy and not achieving anything much but is hot, she has a better chance at TV commercial ads and appearance at TV shows than her counterpart hard-working female athletes who do better in tourneys. Mind you, I'm not calling foreign gamers lazy, I admire their dedications despite not having the same environment as Koreans, but it is undeniable that the team practice system creating the massive skill difference is always accompanied by more practice and dedication. In other words Koreans do work harder even if foreigners are not lazy.
It saddens me to see that those Koreans who definitely worked harder were forced to retire. However, letting the last foreign pro retire would damage the SC2 scene to a much greater extent. I support the current system more than the previous ones even though I do not watch any games outside of Korea these days for the sake of SC2.
|
On August 28 2016 23:00 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 22:52 Acritter wrote:
Losing in the Ro4 to Nerchio, in contrast, could teach you a lot. Maybe your gamesense was off. Maybe your build order left you at a disadvantage.
But those are the same things that cause you to lose no matter who you play against. So in the end what you're implying is that if a foreign pro loses to a Korean pro they either think they did nothing wrong, they can't see what they did wrong or they don't think it matters what they did wrong. All of those things would be very bad.
It isn't so much losing to a Korean, but the mental state when losing. Being horribly crushed by a Korean in a R32 is demoralizing. You don't feel good about the game, and it makes the game feel pointless to play.
Psychology is a big factor going into these tournaments. I honestly believe foreigners are similar to the Koreans skillwise, but they don't have the same mental control. They aren't quite par on skill, but they aren't leagues below.
The region lock is giving the foreigners the experience and exposure to playing on the big stage. That intimidation factor can only go away if you make it to the big stage, but foreigners were constantly being denied that experience. Its also giving them encouragement to keep playing.
Here is an article on psychology in the MLB. It doesn't apply to our SC2 players directly, but it does emphasize the importance of mental state. If the weekend tournaments are constantly being filled by Koreans in the round of 8, then foreigners are never given a chance to play under these environments. Without that experience, they will always feel inferior to the Koreans.
I don't love the region/citizen locking in the IEM and DH. I love watching Zest, herO, Maru, etc. playing. Now I'm stuck with catching re-runs on the french stream, or occasionally waking up early enough for a few matches. It sucks, but I know this is for the greater good.
|
|
|
What is the reason that the foreign players NEED to be around at all for sc2 scene? There are enough NOT racist folks watching for the quality of the plays and players. All this posturing is just a thin excuse for RACISM.
|
On August 28 2016 22:05 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On August 28 2016 21:05 KrOmander wrote:On August 28 2016 20:47 Insidioussc2 wrote:
Completly agree with Musicus here.
GSL has effectively been region locked to residents of Seoul since the beginning of Sc2. You have to qualify in offline events and then have regular offline matches for about 3-4 months. And since blizzard massively supports those Korean events with money, I am okay with providing tournaments and money for people without this opportunity, too.
You might not agree with me here, but it is a reasonable argument why people who live in Korea are specifically locked from those events.
And so I am happy to see the best players from different nations, who cannot easily compete in GSL, SSL and Proleague clash it out between themselves in WCS once in a while and make a living out of it. Also more money means more motivation, and more importantly the chance to go fulltime. So it is a reasonable statement to say foreign scene has gotten better, if thats true we'll see at blizzcon.
What I am certainly not okay with, is that blizzard only helps funding offline tournaments with region lock. Dreamhacks, IEMs, and other external tournaments should be open for everyone and show the viewers the best Starcraft there is..
IIRC homestory cup as an example decided not to be part of the WCS system, didn't get Blizzard money anymore and now struggles to get enough prize money for Koreans to come over.
Hopefully the success of a rather small event like the Shoutcraft Kings (with thankfully Blizzard still funds) will promt them to change things next year. Agree mostly with this. WCS seems reasonable, but banning the most competitive region from the premier weekend tourneys such as Dreamhacks, IEMs....... yeah I just can't wrap my head around that one. That'd be like blizzard telling the foreigners "look, we know you guys will never be on equal footing with Koreans in weekend tournaments and other events, so we made this little charity league for you guys so you can at least feel a little better about yourselves".
How is that different from what they did this year?
|
On August 28 2016 22:52 Acritter wrote:
Y'know, the more I think about this change, the more it makes sense. Koreans dominating every tournament wasn't healthy any more than it would be healthy to let MLB teams into Little League. You don't learn much of anything, in terms of game mechanics and strategy, from playing in tournaments. Tournaments teach you how to bear up under stress and make good adjustments in the moment. They don't make you an abstractly better player. Practice time makes you a better player. They do, however, give a benchmark of where you are as a player, and give you insight on how to best leverage your practice time. The problem is, losing in the Ro32 to PartinG doesn't tell you much of anything. "I couldn't beat someone who has a much better practice environment." Yeah, pretty useless. Losing in the Ro4 to Nerchio, in contrast, could teach you a lot. Maybe your gamesense was off. Maybe your build order left you at a disadvantage. All that will help you practice and help you improve. Basically, what this change means is that there actually is a foreign scene now.
The few comments I see which say that foreigners should just up and move to Korea are a little comical. So if anyone who isn't Korean wants to play good Starcraft, they need to develop their skills enough that they're confident making the move, gather enough money and support to do it, and learn enough of the language to be able to effectively communicate, only to risk being rejected by an established system? Yeah, sure sounds like we're promoting equal barriers to entry, here.
Usually that's what people who want to be at the top of their fields do. If you want to study traditional martial arts at the highest level, Japan's the place to be. If you want a succesful movie career, you go to hollywood and try your luck. You want to work with the most brilliant phycisists in the world? Why not go for a job at CERN. Those barriers of entry aren't equal either, but clearly it does not stop people determined enough to try, even though they know that the chances of success are small.
Competitive sports is about wanting to be the best, and wanting to be able to best people who are better than you is probably the main motivator for most professional athletes. This is not what non-korean progamers in favour of the current WCS system want, however. They want a safe environment where people who would provide too much competition are simply denied entry because it endangers their cash flow. Their logic is that they cannot possibly become as good as Koreans because the Korean training environment is unparallelled, and as such they deserve charity in the form of the current WCS system because Blizzard cannot possibly expect them to do what is expected of top-level athletes: go to every length to become the absolute best you can be.
Before Blizzard mangled WCS I was not a fan of foreign players because most of them seemed more occupied with becoming interesting personalities rather than becoming good at the game. This view was further strengthened by fans who prefered seeing stories unfold during tournaments rather than seeing the highest possible level of play. As a consequence they stood little to no chance against "faceless Koreans" who spent full working days training their asses off in their team houses rather than fooling around on Twitch. Sure, the foreign SC2 players had the fanbase-thing down, but the "faceless Koreans" happily ran away with all the cash and awards. With the current WCS system I stopped taking foreigners serious at all. The level of play at WCS has plummeted compared to two years ago, as have the viewer numbers.
I guess this is also largely due to cultural differences between Western countries and East Asian countries. The latter tend to place incredible value on individual performance. There's a reason why many American universities get "flooded" with East Asian students, and why East Asians are overrepresented in high-level music competitions. It probably also explains why the suicide rates among students in South Korea are among the highest if not the highest in the developed world.
Either way, the current WCS system is a farce. I don't care if it forces 90% of the current non-Korean professional SC2 gamers in retirement, but I want the ban on Korean players participating in non-Korean WCS lifted. I want to see the very best duking it out against the very best, not tournaments where the two Koreans who did somehow manage to get into the tournament steamrolling the second rate competition on their way to the finals. It just isn't fun or exciting.
Winning a WCS tournament is not a badge of honour anymore. It just means that you won a tournament in which the best were banned from competing.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
