• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 00:40
CET 06:40
KST 14:40
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175Evil Geniuses - shutting down23ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier7Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1
StarCraft 2
General
Liquibets sc2 season 30 Evil Geniuses - shutting down Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR?
Tourneys
WardiTV Mondays ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers [G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles Mutation # 548 Shining Bright
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Rollback Netcode in Brood War Top Players of October 2026 (EBPD Rankings) [Megathread] Daily Funny Videos How SKT1 S-Tiers Felt To Be Swept By Flash
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues 2v2v2v2 Tournament Stage 1: Community Poll [IPSL] IPSL Winter 26-27 Ro24 is HERE!
Strategy
50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Deus Ex 3!? Mobile Legends: Bang Bang Armies of Exigo - YesYes?
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 11265 users

Community Feedback Update - February 26 - Page 5

Forum Index > SC2 General
303 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 14 15 16 Next All
Tenks
Profile Joined April 2010
United States3104 Posts
February 26 2016 22:59 GMT
#81
They really do need to fix TvT. It is about as tedious to play as the HotS hellbat bullshit. It is just absolutely no fun with doom drop into counter doom drop.
Wat
Dangermousecatdog
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom7084 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 23:12:46
February 26 2016 23:10 GMT
#82

It’s awesome how we’re all working towards having a more positive atmosphere towards StarCraft II on various sites and forums.
Urgh really? The first thing they say? The attempt to prevent any criticism of their actions just disgusts me. It's pretty clear that they are not a balance/design team anymore, they are just a PR team.
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
February 26 2016 23:17 GMT
#83
I don't know David Kim, but what I'm reading is that half of the players defending the tankivac start their posts with "I'm only watching the game". There is a basic understanding issue, a balanced SC2 will always produce great games, the skill level is way too high not to. Even an imbalanced SC2 produces great games on the highest level. But viewers that have no clue about the game and should have no saying then use those games to justify the state of the game. Those games would happen with or without the tankivac.

On the other hand I tune into Nathanias stream for 5 seconds and I hear him complain about him winning by dropping his tankivacs first. Dunno, but the main argument I read from the actual players in favor of the tankivac are balance-concerns, mainly in ZvT, not how incredible fun TvT with tankivacs is.
Shield
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Bulgaria4824 Posts
February 26 2016 23:19 GMT
#84
On February 27 2016 04:15 Charoisaur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2016 04:11 90ti wrote:
On February 27 2016 04:00 Charoisaur wrote:
We would obviously want to combo this with more of a damage buff than we have cuttently

I really don't think tanks need even more damage especially not for tvt.
The biggest issue with mech play are vipers in tvz and tempests in tvp.
A further tank buff won't really help against those two units but would make them overpowered against everything else.

So maybe adress blinding cloud by reducing the range of affected units by 5 or 6 so tanks don't get nullified by it and nerf tempests which are currently problematic in every matchup.


GSL showed it pretty well this morning, libs just shred everything and toss's only answer is the worst dps/cost unit in the game that's saving grace is that it outranges it. I think a slight increase to the time for the dropped tank to fire vs removing the mechanic. Make it 3-4 seconds so that in TvT positioning matters and for TvZ, they have a chance of repositioning their army/drones during drop/pickup play

If tempests get nerfed, libs can be nerfed too.
It's bad design anyway that an air unit can only be countered with other air units.


This. It's so stupid to be forced to get tempests in PvT or lose the game. One response only.
MaxTa
Profile Joined February 2016
61 Posts
February 26 2016 23:25 GMT
#85
Well one thing is sure, if they don't remove tankivacs and buff siege tanks like proposed, mech will pretty much never be used both in TvT and TvP. It will pretty much always be what we are seeing right now and that has been figured out already: Bio + tankivacs or liberators.

To me it's already feeling redundant and I'm all for some new fresh builds and meta...If really it's a must to be able to pick up sieged tanks I would make it so they unload unsieged, that way they could at least be saved agaisn't ravagers and they would require more micro and time to siege them up again so it would be fair.

With that said, depending on what they do with tankivacs, the ravagers will also need to be tweaked. There are so many ways to do this: increase their morphing time, require lair, make them armored, increase corrosive bile cooldown, nerf corrosive bile damage... This needs to be tested !
Fran_
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1024 Posts
February 26 2016 23:36 GMT
#86
I'm impressed, this is a very solid community update. I like the reasoning.
Psychobabas
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
2531 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 23:45:21
February 26 2016 23:36 GMT
#87
My god if they dont buff the damn tank damage... so frustrating...

they claim they want diversity in terran play. You mean marine medivac tank every game???
Elentos
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
55594 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-26 23:58:38
February 26 2016 23:42 GMT
#88
On February 27 2016 08:36 Psychobabas wrote:
My god if they dont buff the damn tank damage... so frustrating...

Something tells me they didn't give up on that idea.
On February 27 2016 03:38 purakushi wrote:
try out a version of the Siege Tank where we heavily increase the delay before Siege Tanks can fire after being dropped off by the Medivac while in Siege Mode. We would obviously want to combo this with more of a damage buff than what we have currently.

Can't quite put my finger on it.
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
MaxTa
Profile Joined February 2016
61 Posts
February 26 2016 23:43 GMT
#89
Concerning the liberators, they are like most of the air units slightly too strong at the moment. I'm all for nerfing them a little but I'm afraid decreasing their range will actually render them useless without the upgrade... I would look into increasing their supply cost to 4, reducing their move speed or reducing their attack speed instead...

That being said I would do something similar with the tempest: either increase their supply cost to 6, reduce their attack speed or even make them attack air only.
Spyridon
Profile Joined April 2010
United States997 Posts
February 26 2016 23:43 GMT
#90
On February 27 2016 08:10 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Show nested quote +

It’s awesome how we’re all working towards having a more positive atmosphere towards StarCraft II on various sites and forums.
Urgh really? The first thing they say? The attempt to prevent any criticism of their actions just disgusts me. It's pretty clear that they are not a balance/design team anymore, they are just a PR team.


Exactly!!

Design went out the window when they admit to choosing inferior design in order to avoid "negative perception from the community" during beta. The transition from Design team to PR team was completed at that point, and we've been screwed ever since.

On February 27 2016 08:36 Psychobabas wrote:
My god if they dont buff the damn tank damage... so frustrating...


Welcome to everyday life when dealing with the SC2 development team.

Makes me so damn frustrated and angry. More than other games. Because SC2 SHOULD be a good game. Blizzard SHOULD have made major changes and turned things around by now. At least some-what. Just like they have did in the past on D2, WC3, D3, and basically every game of theirs except WoW.

Their vanilla games are not always the best reception, but Blizzard usually puts in the work to make each of their games a success. With SC2, I don't know what the hell they are doing anymore...
MaxTa
Profile Joined February 2016
61 Posts
February 26 2016 23:57 GMT
#91
About the Korean pros well, they obviously have a lot of experience and we cannot ignore them, but I think their opinion can be biased simply because their actual life and income depends on the current game design and maps. So of course if they are winning with one strat all the time on the current map pool they will not want any change whatsoever...

The fact is that pretty much all the top T koreans are doing the same exact build which is Bio+ Libs some maybe using tankivas and that's pretty much all we will ever see unless we are willing to make some change...
Elentos
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
55594 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-27 00:00:15
February 27 2016 00:00 GMT
#92
On February 27 2016 08:57 MaxTa wrote:
About the Korean pros well, they obviously have a lot of experience and we cannot ignore them, but I think their opinion can be biased simply because their actual life and income depends on the current game design and maps. So of course if they are winning with one strat all the time on the current map pool they will not want any change whatsoever...

The fact is that pretty much all the top T koreans are doing the same exact build which is Bio+ Libs some maybe using tankivas and that's pretty much all we will ever see unless we are willing to make some change...

You're implying that people who disagree with them are somehow not biased for any reason. Which I doubt.
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
MaxTa
Profile Joined February 2016
61 Posts
February 27 2016 00:02 GMT
#93
We're all at least slightly biased but Korean pros making a living out of it are more proned to it, im my opinion
Bippzy
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States1466 Posts
February 27 2016 00:06 GMT
#94
Just posting here to say that I think the flying tanks in their current implementation in pro play are really cool, and I don't want them to take away flying tanks. I think the higher damage and longer delay could be cooler tho
LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK
MaxTa
Profile Joined February 2016
61 Posts
February 27 2016 00:10 GMT
#95
Flying tanks + higher damage would be way too strong though, that's all we would see... It's either we keep everything like it is now or we buff their DPS but adjust accordingly...
imre
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
France9263 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-27 00:16:58
February 27 2016 00:14 GMT
#96
On February 27 2016 07:59 Tenks wrote:
They really do need to fix TvT. It is about as tedious to play as the HotS hellbat bullshit. It is just absolutely no fun with doom drop into counter doom drop.


Funny considering we're seing like 1/10 of the doom dropping action that there was in HotS in LotV pro games when both players are going marine/tank. I'd guess that until a certain skill level doom drops are still strong because players are unable to react properly with their own tankivacs.

On February 27 2016 09:02 MaxTa wrote:
We're all at least slightly biased but Korean pros making a living out of it are more proned to it, im my opinion


at least they're not that awful that doom dropping is an issue because I'm pretty sure canon rushing should be an issue somewhere on the ladder too.
Zest fanboy.
Gwavajuice
Profile Joined June 2014
France1810 Posts
February 27 2016 00:27 GMT
#97
Tankivacs are too strong in TvT period. We need a different comp that can fight them on equal foot, to get the variety and strategy back in the match up.

I don't know how you can change this without impacting other match ups too much, though :

-remove them?
-make them slower?
-reduce their dmg?
-buffing another Terran unit?

Whatever, something has to be done, or nobody will want to play not watch TvT in a few monthes.

+ Show Spoiler +
Also, could the people that keep insulting DK and the balance team on every thread just shut the fuck up please?
Dear INno and all the former STX boys.
imre
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
France9263 Posts
February 27 2016 00:29 GMT
#98
On February 27 2016 09:27 Gwavajuice wrote:
Tankivacs are too strong in TvT period. We need a different comp that can fight them on equal foot, to get the variety and strategy back in the match up.

I don't know how you can change this without impacting other match ups too much, though :

-remove them?
-make them slower?
-reduce their dmg?
-buffing another Terran unit?

Whatever, something has to be done, or nobody will want to play not watch TvT in a few monthes.

+ Show Spoiler +
Also, could the people that keep insulting DK and the balance team on every thread just shut the fuck up please?


removing boost or a higher delay between the siege and the volley are two things that don't have monstruous impact vP/Z (even if that means TY vs Solar could no longer be played) and are compatible with a slight tank buff I think, while effectively killing tankivac outside of early game in TvT.
Zest fanboy.
MaxTa
Profile Joined February 2016
61 Posts
February 27 2016 00:42 GMT
#99
Removing boost on certain units seems a bit too weird and breaking the rules. Doom drops will still arrive but with the tanks slightly delayed, I'm not sure it will change the outcome enough...
AaBbCc
Profile Joined February 2016
New Zealand110 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-02-27 01:01:12
February 27 2016 00:56 GMT
#100
T player here.

Personally, I like the Tankivac and would like it to stay, in some form or another. I think most people's preference really comes down to whether they like it as a mechanic or not, rather than anything to do with balance (tank purists vs. those that love fancy micro). Obviously, if it is removed then this will create some issues due to the design of the ravager. The reason I want it to stay is I love the idea of forced counter micro in legacy, even if it's slightly predictable to watch as a viewer sometimes. The reason I love it is because it allows great players for force extra actions out of their opponents and allows the player with better mechanics and multi-tasking to shine, leading to the better player gaining an advantage. The other school of thought though, is that the pick up mechanic takes away from those players with strong tactics and positioning skills. Historically these slower and less mechanically able players were able to compete by cleverly using positioning. It really comes down to what you prefer for your playing/viewing experience.

I admit I do miss the good old positional chess battles of TvT but despite this, it's hard to deny how exciting aLive vs. TY was the other night. I think I'd rather that kind of game than a siege line slug fest any day. Because TvT, rather than TvZ seems to be the area of most concern, I am in favor of a further delay between drop and firing, this will give more advantage to the player who has his tanks pre-sieged and the player with the faster reaction time. A damage buff may not be necessary, however, could result in a return of mech in the TvT meta at least.

I think the ravager-liberator interaction is balanced currently, as is the liberator range. Four shots is too many to kill a liberator. However, ZvP early ravager aggression definitely needs to be addressed. I think a cool-down nerf or a decrease in the amount of damage corrosive bile does to buildings are good starting points for testing, they could also tinker with increasing pylon health but I don't really like this as PO is already so strong.

As for the cyclone, I think it's basic attack should be increased to range 7, to match it's lock-on range. I don't think it's damage should be increased, as it already does plenty of damage while locked and higher damage will promote massing in the mid game, even if the supply cost is increased. A slight armor or health buff to increase survive-ability is probably the way to go.
Life is a meaningless interruption to an otherwise peaceful non-existence.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 14 15 16 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Cup
10:00
#106
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 241
Nina 63
StarCraft: Brood War
ProTech137
Dewaltoss 101
Noble 77
Aegong 38
yabsab 8
Force[name] 6
Icarus 6
League of Legends
Doublelift5599
JimRising 335
Counter-Strike
fl0m3649
Other Games
summit1g9173
XaKoH 729
C9.Mang0281
ViBE137
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick693
Counter-Strike
PGL119
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 37
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Laughngamez YouTube
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• ChaeLyn 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota2117
League of Legends
• Lourlo782
• Stunt277
Other Games
• Shiphtur441
Upcoming Events
Kung Fu Cup
5h 20m
Replay Cast
17h 20m
The PondCast
1d 4h
KCM Race Survival
1d 4h
OSC
1d 8h
IntoTheTV X SOOP
3 days
Reynor vs Solar
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs MaxPax
herO vs Rogue
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
IPSL
3 days
WorsT vs nOmaD
Dewalt vs andersOn
AI Arena Tournament
3 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
4 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
IPSL
4 days
Azhi_Dahaki vs ggnore13
Double vs WIZARD
Replay Cast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-02
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

1xBet Invitational
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.