• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 22:56
CET 04:56
KST 12:56
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners4Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11
Community News
Starcraft, SC2, HoTS, WC3, returning to Blizzcon!22$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship5[BSL21] RO32 Group Stage4Weekly Cups (Oct 26-Nov 2): Liquid, Clem, Solar win; LAN in Philly2Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win9
StarCraft 2
General
Starcraft, SC2, HoTS, WC3, returning to Blizzcon! TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win 5.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8)
Tourneys
Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) $3,500 WardiTV Korean Royale S4
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace
Brood War
General
[BSL21] RO32 Group Stage BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ SnOw's ASL S20 Finals Review Practice Partners (Official) [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] RO32 Group B - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO32 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CET BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION
Strategy
PvZ map balance Current Meta How to stay on top of macro? Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Dating: How's your luck?
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Why we need SC3
Hildegard
Career Paths and Skills for …
TrAiDoS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1641 users

Community Feedback Update - February 26 - Page 16

Forum Index > SC2 General
303 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 14 15 16 All
Glorfindel!
Profile Joined May 2011
Sweden1815 Posts
March 07 2016 17:45 GMT
#301
On March 08 2016 00:58 Big J wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2016 00:53 Elentos wrote:
On March 08 2016 00:39 Big J wrote:
Cyclone and Banshee both see as many appearances as oracles or phoenixes by the way

For the record, is that statement based on actual data? Because I have a hard time believing that, considering the cyclone and the banshee each have a matchup where they're not used at all, without being all too common in the other ones. Would be really strange if they ended appearing as often.


No, no data. But phoenixes aren't all too common in PvP either as much as I understand and oracles seem to be a bit on and off in PvP and PvZ. But yeah, you are right, they probably appear a little more often. I guess my point is rather that you can play banshees and cyclones in two matchups basically at will. If you don't see them there, it's by choice, not because they are useless.


Perhaps you can play A cyclone. I doubt you will see Cyclones more then once a blue moon....
http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/598681/1/Glorfindel/ladder/161337#current-rank
PressureSC2
Profile Joined January 2016
122 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-07 18:59:06
March 07 2016 18:02 GMT
#302
No, no data. But phoenixes aren't all too common in PvP either as much as I understand and oracles seem to be a bit on and off in PvP and PvZ. But yeah, you are right, they probably appear a little more often. I guess my point is rather that you can play banshees and cyclones in two matchups basically at will. If you don't see them there, it's by choice, not because they are useless.


In what series in LOTV have you seen any pro build more than 2-3 cyclones/banshees with a favorable outcome, beyond the early game opener(s)? I would really like to review those replays/series.

Terran is fine in the early games (except for perhaps Ravagers right now). It is in the mid/end game with higher levels of tech on the map that we lack options. It's MMM with full upgrades or die at the pro levels it seems (except for liberator support which may change depending on this balance map's outcome).
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-07 19:10:15
March 07 2016 19:02 GMT
#303
On March 08 2016 03:02 PressureSC2 wrote:
Show nested quote +
No, no data. But phoenixes aren't all too common in PvP either as much as I understand and oracles seem to be a bit on and off in PvP and PvZ. But yeah, you are right, they probably appear a little more often. I guess my point is rather that you can play banshees and cyclones in two matchups basically at will. If you don't see them there, it's by choice, not because they are useless.


In what series in LOTV have you seen any pro build more than 2-3 cyclones/banshees with a favorable outcome, beyond the early game opener(s)? I would really like to review those replays/series.

Terran is fine in the early games (except for perhaps Ravagers right now). It is in the mid/end game with higher levels of tech on the map that we lack options. It's MMM with full upgrades or die at the pro levels it seems (except for liberator support which may change depending on this balance map's outcome).


I Did not say that they build 2-3 of them. 1 Cyclone is very common in TvT and TvP and sometimes you see a second one, banshees are quite viable in TvT and TvZ. That's all I implied.

I dunno, but I think I have covered the "in the lategame we lack options part" rather extensively in a previous post. You gotta be more precise if you want to respond to that. Do you mean you lack options in the lategame when going bio, do you mean you lack options to set up differently or do you plainly think that Terran should be able to transition away from bio-centric play in the lategame?
PressureSC2
Profile Joined January 2016
122 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-07 20:28:08
March 07 2016 20:23 GMT
#304
To put it quite simply... Terran currently needs more than three barracks to survive on anything more than one base in all match-ups. It would be interesting if instead of building a fourth barracks to expand and hold 2-3+ bases, you could either choose to have the majority of your resources building from 3+ factories, or 3+ starports, in all matchups. I am talking at the pro level.

Do we call this factory mech, or starport mech? I am not sure - but something other than MM as units that actually attack/fire. I am excluding support units built out of 1-2 buildings to add to MM. You can mention MMM or Liberators as styles other than bio, but it's still going to end up being 3-3 EB with 9+ barracks pumping bio all game long. Most people would call this going Bio with starport support.

I do not think that it would be reasonable to expect that bio play (EB x 2 upgrades going, and barracks x 3+) could transition into what I describe above at the pro level. Too many resources invested at that point. That is just the nature of Terran - at some point you need to commit to get your engineering bay upgrades, or instead go the way of the armory(ies) upgrades.

Prev 1 14 15 16 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
23:00
WardiTV Mondays #58
LiquipediaDiscussion
OSC
22:00
Masters Cup 150 Open Qual
Liquipedia
LAN Event
18:00
Day 3: Ursa 2v2, FFA
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 191
NeuroSwarm 146
ProTech122
Nina 18
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 8286
Shuttle 685
Sharp 435
actioN 399
Leta 177
Noble 87
Icarus 7
Dota 2
monkeys_forever204
LuMiX1
Other Games
tarik_tv12394
summit1g10095
JimRising 482
WinterStarcraft302
C9.Mang0185
ViBE175
FrodaN119
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick806
Counter-Strike
PGL144
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Sammyuel 11
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Stunt319
Other Games
• Scarra567
Upcoming Events
OSC
8h 4m
LAN Event
11h 4m
Korean StarCraft League
23h 4m
CranKy Ducklings
1d 6h
LAN Event
1d 11h
IPSL
1d 14h
dxtr13 vs OldBoy
Napoleon vs Doodle
BSL 21
1d 16h
Gosudark vs Kyrie
Gypsy vs Sterling
UltrA vs Radley
Dandy vs Ptak
Replay Cast
1d 19h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
[ Show More ]
LAN Event
2 days
IPSL
2 days
JDConan vs WIZARD
WolFix vs Cross
BSL 21
2 days
spx vs rasowy
HBO vs KameZerg
Cross vs Razz
dxtr13 vs ZZZero
Replay Cast
3 days
Wardi Open
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
Classic vs Solar
herO vs Cure
Reynor vs GuMiho
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Solar vs Zoun
MaxPax vs Bunny
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 21 Points
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

BSL Season 21
SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.