It's getting ridiculous. People keep "arguing against me" by posting arguments that I agree with and which actually support my point that the current WCS global system is completely ridiculous. So once again:
Firstly: "getting the right visa is a lot of work"- yes it is. And it is ridiculous that this absurdly complicated process is what decides the results of WCS Global, not actual personal skill in SC2.
On April 07 2015 06:56 Swisslink wrote: I don't really understand the discussion here. All the players that were competing in this WCS LIVE in Europe or America. There's absolutely no way to keep them from playing in WCS, tbh. If Polt was excluded from WCS, he'd have to give up his studies and go back to Korea. And - let's face it - that'd be completely ridiculous. Also: these Koreans don't profit from the Korean training environment anymore and Koreans aren't genetically superior, you know? :-P
Please, tell that to all the Korean players who were kept from playing in the WCS. This your statement doesn't make any sense and just ignores the main problem of the WCS system, that it randomly keeps a portion of willing participants from playing.
Megafathers post really didn't hit the point that I was trying to make. I was just slightly annoyed, or upset for a better word, that a round of 4 match in a tier 1 tournament was completely not fun to watch. Ritual slaughter of a foreigner by a Korean is never good to see even in the earlier stages of WCS, but to see it happen in a playoff match was terrible. I can't imagine such a one sided serious in GSL or NSSL ro.4 matches, and I really didn't stay up till 3,4 in the morning to watch a ro.4 match that was basically a protossing all-inning a more experienced zerg and dying a horrible death afterwards. I never said Hydra was unskilled, or that non-kespa players or players that moved away from Kespa are bad. I just hate the fact that nothing really has changed in WCS; Korean players, no matter how small in number, ALWAYS dominate the ro.8 and beyond, with foreigners never quite fully edging them out.
On April 06 2015 11:24 BretZ wrote: Will this finally give Polt consideration for one of the best sc2 terrans...ever?
Why should it? Sure the tournament was enjoyable but it was hardly stacked
The tournament might not be stacked as a whole, but you have to respect the playoff run of Bunny -> ForGG -> Hydra, which was the hardest run he could have possibly hit
On April 08 2015 01:05 Orlok wrote: Megafathers post really didn't hit the point that I was trying to make. I was just slightly annoyed, or upset for a better word, that a round of 4 match in a tier 1 tournament was completely not fun to watch. Ritual slaughter of a foreigner by a Korean is never good to see even in the earlier stages of WCS, but to see it happen in a playoff match was terrible. I can't imagine such a one sided serious in GSL or NSSL ro.4 matches, and I really didn't stay up till 3,4 in the morning to watch a ro.4 match that was basically a protossing all-inning a more experienced zerg and dying a horrible death afterwards. I never said Hydra was unskilled, or that non-kespa players or players that moved away from Kespa are bad. I just hate the fact that nothing really has changed in WCS; Korean players, no matter how small in number, ALWAYS dominate the ro.8 and beyond, with foreigners never quite fully edging them out.
It was a terrible match, but let's not pretend it hasn't happened before in GSL
On April 06 2015 08:32 King David wrote: That will teach Hydra to dance his units again! God that made me angry :S . But it turned out good in the end at least :D Always liked Polt for being such a sport and hearty person. Glad he won
He danced his units when polt had obviously lost the game a long time ago. Then polt stayed another few minutes past that. I'm not a fan of dancing units either, but I'm sure it was in a "stop delaying the game" kind of way, not an arrogant, "I'm better than you" kind of way.
On April 08 2015 00:04 opisska wrote: It's getting ridiculous. People keep "arguing against me" by posting arguments that I agree with and which actually support my point that the current WCS global system is completely ridiculous. So once again:
Firstly: "getting the right visa is a lot of work"- yes it is. And it is ridiculous that this absurdly complicated process is what decides the results of WCS Global, not actual personal skill in SC2.
On April 07 2015 06:56 Swisslink wrote: I don't really understand the discussion here. All the players that were competing in this WCS LIVE in Europe or America. There's absolutely no way to keep them from playing in WCS, tbh. If Polt was excluded from WCS, he'd have to give up his studies and go back to Korea. And - let's face it - that'd be completely ridiculous. Also: these Koreans don't profit from the Korean training environment anymore and Koreans aren't genetically superior, you know? :-P
Please, tell that to all the Korean players who were kept from playing in the WCS. This your statement doesn't make any sense and just ignores the main problem of the WCS system, that it randomly keeps a portion of willing participants from playing.
So you're ignoring the sentence before the bolded part. Which is why you completely missed his point and probably why you are confused.
The entire point is there is no fair way to bar players who live in Europe or America from competing in WCS despite what you want.
On April 08 2015 01:05 Orlok wrote: Megafathers post really didn't hit the point that I was trying to make. I was just slightly annoyed, or upset for a better word, that a round of 4 match in a tier 1 tournament was completely not fun to watch. Ritual slaughter of a foreigner by a Korean is never good to see even in the earlier stages of WCS, but to see it happen in a playoff match was terrible. I can't imagine such a one sided serious in GSL or NSSL ro.4 matches, and I really didn't stay up till 3,4 in the morning to watch a ro.4 match that was basically a protossing all-inning a more experienced zerg and dying a horrible death afterwards. I never said Hydra was unskilled, or that non-kespa players or players that moved away from Kespa are bad. I just hate the fact that nothing really has changed in WCS; Korean players, no matter how small in number, ALWAYS dominate the ro.8 and beyond, with foreigners never quite fully edging them out.
That's you. Personally, I watch these tournaments to watch Koreans bop foreigners. I have no interest in watching foreigner only tournaments. If I want to watch the best of the best, there's Proleague, GSL and NSSL. I watch this for the same reason people watch Alabama vs directional Alabama in college football.
I think easily the greatest WCS America finals ever. Polt was a true hero. Although I wanted a foreigner to win for a change, Polt has always been one of my favorite players. He is hilarious, charming, and fucking deadly haha. He is the perfect example of how experience affects play level. He's awesome. Go POLTUUU
On April 06 2015 18:05 opisska wrote: While I was cheering for Polt out of sheer love for him, it's kinda pity that Hydra didn't win, because that would expose the absurdity of this WCS to the maximum. Polt at least is someone who truly lives outside Korea for a reason and it would be honestly difficult for him to compete in Korean tournaments. But Hydra? This guy just shows that the only three things standing between a horde of sufficiently high-level Koreans ) and easy money and WCS points are willingness to move, visa bureaucracy and Polt. Hydra is pretty good for an "export Korean", but there are dozens of guys of comparable skill in Korea who end in Ro16s of the two leagues.
The grand finals itself was fantastic games and awesomely nail-biting - for me particularly because of my hatred towards how Hydra got there, so I should actually congratulate WCS for creating that story but overall this WCS was pretty lame at times and the concept is just wrong. Yes, there were high viewer numbers, but this was the first time, so nobody could know upfront how bad some of the games are going to be. Next time I think people will be more scpetical and tune in only for the eventual Korean-Korean or Korean/Bunny/Snute matches.
While I'll try to stay objective, I have a short story, which might be interesting regarding this topic. For me personally, I don't mind either way. I agree with both sides in this matter but here it is ;
So, while I was watching the finals this weekend, my girlfriend was sitting next to me on my couch. Having never ever seen Starcraft, I explained the basics a bit and she already knew I used to play alot/consider e-sports, THE sports to watch. She actually quite liked the awesomeness and the hype for every particular match, although she still has/had no clue what was happening during the games itself (The GG timings seem to really be hard to grasp for people who don't know SC).
I had explained the region differences and how it is aranged now. One of the first things she said was ; "Why are there still koreans then in an EU/AM tournament?"
I thought about it for a second and explained how it got evolved from last year, where there were tons of Koreans in all regions (explained her about WCS KR2(AM)) and explained how Koreans just generally dominate this season. For her, this was just really confusing and weird. Why not let the koreans play on their own turf? Why have such weird VISA rules? I had also told her Polt's story and she agreed, that maybe something like that would be acceptable. However she disagreed with any other "Foreigners" from entering such a tourney and had some solid arguments for it.
edit; She also mentioned that it would be really weird for Foreigners to move to Korea for the same reason. Which I then told her, that foreigners had been doing that since 2001, which she found really odd aswell. She said; "It's as if America's best basketball players, would join Russia's biggest basketball league, just to win some easy prize-money, which shouldn't be possible". (I told her, that the foreigners weren't even winning in Korea, eventhough that isn't the point)
I know, that in our (gaming) scene, we have alot of arguments for and against almost everything. But I was rather surprised that she took such a hard stance against these rules, and viewed them as really weird and offputting. She bassically said that if it would turn out to be a KR vs KR finals, that she felt less interested and was rooting for any non-korean. (My bias was heavily towards ShoWTimE, so she wanted him to win mostly).
Here's the kicker; I have never ever told/said/leaked anything about my stance towards the korean-eu-am scene to her, nor did I ever agree to her stance at that point. I was just really interested what she had to say as an outsider.
@Opisska, her stance towards this situation, was at that time, almost exactly the same as your post here. Minus the background knowledge on WCS and e-sports in general.
On April 08 2015 00:04 opisska wrote: It's getting ridiculous. People keep "arguing against me" by posting arguments that I agree with and which actually support my point that the current WCS global system is completely ridiculous. So once again:
Firstly: "getting the right visa is a lot of work"- yes it is. And it is ridiculous that this absurdly complicated process is what decides the results of WCS Global, not actual personal skill in SC2.
On April 07 2015 06:56 Swisslink wrote: I don't really understand the discussion here. All the players that were competing in this WCS LIVE in Europe or America. There's absolutely no way to keep them from playing in WCS, tbh. If Polt was excluded from WCS, he'd have to give up his studies and go back to Korea. And - let's face it - that'd be completely ridiculous. Also: these Koreans don't profit from the Korean training environment anymore and Koreans aren't genetically superior, you know? :-P
Please, tell that to all the Korean players who were kept from playing in the WCS. This your statement doesn't make any sense and just ignores the main problem of the WCS system, that it randomly keeps a portion of willing participants from playing.
So you're ignoring the sentence before the bolded part. Which is why you completely missed his point and probably why you are confused.
The entire point is there is no fair way to bar players who live in Europe or America from competing in WCS despite what you want.
And the current choice of rules seems "fair" to you? You people still somehow manage to assume that anyone who is against the current system wants a strictly protected non-Korean competition. Where have I ever said that? I just only really hate the way it is know and would like it to change, in any direction that creates a level playing field. If we can really conclude that there is no reasonable way to prevent people like Hydra from coming over and getting second in WCS by getting the right visa, then the only plausible conclusion is that WCS needs to be open to any participant.
On April 06 2015 18:05 opisska wrote: While I was cheering for Polt out of sheer love for him, it's kinda pity that Hydra didn't win, because that would expose the absurdity of this WCS to the maximum. Polt at least is someone who truly lives outside Korea for a reason and it would be honestly difficult for him to compete in Korean tournaments. But Hydra? This guy just shows that the only three things standing between a horde of sufficiently high-level Koreans ) and easy money and WCS points are willingness to move, visa bureaucracy and Polt. Hydra is pretty good for an "export Korean", but there are dozens of guys of comparable skill in Korea who end in Ro16s of the two leagues.
The grand finals itself was fantastic games and awesomely nail-biting - for me particularly because of my hatred towards how Hydra got there, so I should actually congratulate WCS for creating that story but overall this WCS was pretty lame at times and the concept is just wrong. Yes, there were high viewer numbers, but this was the first time, so nobody could know upfront how bad some of the games are going to be. Next time I think people will be more scpetical and tune in only for the eventual Korean-Korean or Korean/Bunny/Snute matches.
While I'll try to stay objective, I have a short story, which might be interesting regarding this topic. For me personally, I don't mind either way. I agree with both sides in this matter but here it is ;
So, while I was watching the finals this weekend, my girlfriend was sitting next to me on my couch. Having never ever seen Starcraft, I explained the basics a bit and she already knew I used to play alot/consider e-sports, THE sports to watch. She actually quite liked the awesomeness and the hype for every particular match, although she still has/had no clue what was happening during the games itself (The GG timings seem to really be hard to grasp for people who don't know SC).
I had explained the region differences and how it is aranged now. One of the first things she said was ; "Why are there still koreans then in an EU/AM tournament?"
I thought about it for a second and explained how it got evolved from last year, where there were tons of Koreans in all regions (explained her about WCS KR2(AM)) and explained how Koreans just generally dominate this season. For her, this was just really confusing and weird. Why not let the koreans play on their own turf? Why have such weird VISA rules? I had also told her Polt's story and she agreed, that maybe something like that would be acceptable. However she disagreed with any other "Foreigners" from entering such a tourney and had some solid arguments for it.
edit; She also mentioned that it would be really weird for Foreigners to move to Korea for the same reason. Which I then told her, that foreigners had been doing that since 2001, which she found really odd aswell. She said; "It's as if America's best basketball players, would join Russia's biggest basketball league, just to win some easy prize-money, which shouldn't be possible". (I told her, that the foreigners weren't even winning in Korea, eventhough that isn't the point)
I know, that in our (gaming) scene, we have alot of arguments for and against almost everything. But I was rather surprised that she took such a hard stance against these rules, and viewed them as really weird and offputting. She bassically said that if it would turn out to be a KR vs KR finals, that she felt less interested and was rooting for any non-korean. (My bias was heavily towards ShoWTimE, so she wanted him to win mostly).
Here's the kicker; I have never ever told/said/leaked anything about my stance towards the korean-eu-am scene to her, nor did I ever agree to her stance at that point. I was just really interested what she had to say as an outsider.
@Opisska, her stance towards this situation, was at that time, almost exactly the same as your post here. Minus the background knowledge on WCS and e-sports in general.
There are plenty of American basketball players in "foreign" leagues. Just saying.
That's just a weird argument. The USA's sports scene might not notice this as much, because it's really focused on sports no one else in the world really cares about ( I jest. :p), like basketball, baseball and American football. So all the viewers, players and money come from and stay in the US. But in football, cycling, tennis, ... and just about any other international sport it's very common for athletes to hop across borders to compete in different leagues.
On April 08 2015 00:04 opisska wrote: It's getting ridiculous. People keep "arguing against me" by posting arguments that I agree with and which actually support my point that the current WCS global system is completely ridiculous. So once again:
Firstly: "getting the right visa is a lot of work"- yes it is. And it is ridiculous that this absurdly complicated process is what decides the results of WCS Global, not actual personal skill in SC2.
On April 07 2015 06:56 Swisslink wrote: I don't really understand the discussion here. All the players that were competing in this WCS LIVE in Europe or America. There's absolutely no way to keep them from playing in WCS, tbh. If Polt was excluded from WCS, he'd have to give up his studies and go back to Korea. And - let's face it - that'd be completely ridiculous. Also: these Koreans don't profit from the Korean training environment anymore and Koreans aren't genetically superior, you know? :-P
Please, tell that to all the Korean players who were kept from playing in the WCS. This your statement doesn't make any sense and just ignores the main problem of the WCS system, that it randomly keeps a portion of willing participants from playing.
So you're ignoring the sentence before the bolded part. Which is why you completely missed his point and probably why you are confused.
The entire point is there is no fair way to bar players who live in Europe or America from competing in WCS despite what you want.
And the current choice of rules seems "fair" to you? You people still somehow manage to assume that anyone who is against the current system wants a strictly protected non-Korean competition. Where have I ever said that? I just only really hate the way it is know and would like it to change, in any direction that creates a level playing field. If we can really conclude that there is no reasonable way to prevent people like Hydra from coming over and getting second in WCS by getting the right visa, then the only plausible conclusion is that WCS needs to be open to any participant.
So go back to how it was last year? Just, no. The current system is a lot more interesting IMO. Your conclusion follows from the flawed starting point that the current system is broken. It isn't. There is no reason to bar someone who uprooted his entire live and moved to the USA in order to be able to compete there from entering the competition.
On April 06 2015 18:05 opisska wrote: While I was cheering for Polt out of sheer love for him, it's kinda pity that Hydra didn't win, because that would expose the absurdity of this WCS to the maximum. Polt at least is someone who truly lives outside Korea for a reason and it would be honestly difficult for him to compete in Korean tournaments. But Hydra? This guy just shows that the only three things standing between a horde of sufficiently high-level Koreans ) and easy money and WCS points are willingness to move, visa bureaucracy and Polt. Hydra is pretty good for an "export Korean", but there are dozens of guys of comparable skill in Korea who end in Ro16s of the two leagues.
The grand finals itself was fantastic games and awesomely nail-biting - for me particularly because of my hatred towards how Hydra got there, so I should actually congratulate WCS for creating that story but overall this WCS was pretty lame at times and the concept is just wrong. Yes, there were high viewer numbers, but this was the first time, so nobody could know upfront how bad some of the games are going to be. Next time I think people will be more scpetical and tune in only for the eventual Korean-Korean or Korean/Bunny/Snute matches.
While I'll try to stay objective, I have a short story, which might be interesting regarding this topic. For me personally, I don't mind either way. I agree with both sides in this matter but here it is ;
So, while I was watching the finals this weekend, my girlfriend was sitting next to me on my couch. Having never ever seen Starcraft, I explained the basics a bit and she already knew I used to play alot/consider e-sports, THE sports to watch. She actually quite liked the awesomeness and the hype for every particular match, although she still has/had no clue what was happening during the games itself (The GG timings seem to really be hard to grasp for people who don't know SC).
I had explained the region differences and how it is aranged now. One of the first things she said was ; "Why are there still koreans then in an EU/AM tournament?"
I thought about it for a second and explained how it got evolved from last year, where there were tons of Koreans in all regions (explained her about WCS KR2(AM)) and explained how Koreans just generally dominate this season. For her, this was just really confusing and weird. Why not let the koreans play on their own turf? Why have such weird VISA rules? I had also told her Polt's story and she agreed, that maybe something like that would be acceptable. However she disagreed with any other "Foreigners" from entering such a tourney and had some solid arguments for it.
edit; She also mentioned that it would be really weird for Foreigners to move to Korea for the same reason. Which I then told her, that foreigners had been doing that since 2001, which she found really odd aswell. She said; "It's as if America's best basketball players, would join Russia's biggest basketball league, just to win some easy prize-money, which shouldn't be possible". (I told her, that the foreigners weren't even winning in Korea, eventhough that isn't the point)
I know, that in our (gaming) scene, we have alot of arguments for and against almost everything. But I was rather surprised that she took such a hard stance against these rules, and viewed them as really weird and offputting. She bassically said that if it would turn out to be a KR vs KR finals, that she felt less interested and was rooting for any non-korean. (My bias was heavily towards ShoWTimE, so she wanted him to win mostly).
Here's the kicker; I have never ever told/said/leaked anything about my stance towards the korean-eu-am scene to her, nor did I ever agree to her stance at that point. I was just really interested what she had to say as an outsider.
@Opisska, her stance towards this situation, was at that time, almost exactly the same as your post here. Minus the background knowledge on WCS and e-sports in general.
There are plenty of American basketball players in "foreign" leagues. Just saying.
That's just a weird argument. The USA's sports scene might not notice this as much, because it's really focused on sports no one else in the world really cares about ( I jest. :p), like basketball, baseball and American football. So all the viewers, players and money come from and stay in the US. But in football, cycling, tennis, ... and just about any other international sport it's very common for athletes to hop across borders to compete in different leagues.
I had the same thought after reading that post.
But even in America Major League Soccer still maintains caps on international players per-team.
Plus, any college basketball fans knows the fate of the majority of your favorite players is playing oversees. So it's not like Americans are completely insulated from the fact that foreigners arrive to play in other countries all the time.
On April 08 2015 00:04 opisska wrote: It's getting ridiculous. People keep "arguing against me" by posting arguments that I agree with and which actually support my point that the current WCS global system is completely ridiculous. So once again:
Firstly: "getting the right visa is a lot of work"- yes it is. And it is ridiculous that this absurdly complicated process is what decides the results of WCS Global, not actual personal skill in SC2.
On April 07 2015 06:56 Swisslink wrote: I don't really understand the discussion here. All the players that were competing in this WCS LIVE in Europe or America. There's absolutely no way to keep them from playing in WCS, tbh. If Polt was excluded from WCS, he'd have to give up his studies and go back to Korea. And - let's face it - that'd be completely ridiculous. Also: these Koreans don't profit from the Korean training environment anymore and Koreans aren't genetically superior, you know? :-P
Please, tell that to all the Korean players who were kept from playing in the WCS. This your statement doesn't make any sense and just ignores the main problem of the WCS system, that it randomly keeps a portion of willing participants from playing.
So you're ignoring the sentence before the bolded part. Which is why you completely missed his point and probably why you are confused.
The entire point is there is no fair way to bar players who live in Europe or America from competing in WCS despite what you want.
And the current choice of rules seems "fair" to you? You people still somehow manage to assume that anyone who is against the current system wants a strictly protected non-Korean competition. Where have I ever said that? I just only really hate the way it is know and would like it to change, in any direction that creates a level playing field. If we can really conclude that there is no reasonable way to prevent people like Hydra from coming over and getting second in WCS by getting the right visa, then the only plausible conclusion is that WCS needs to be open to any participant.
So go back to how it was last year? Just, no. The current system is a lot more interesting IMO. Your conclusion follows from the flawed starting point that the current system is broken. It isn't. There is no reason to bar someone who uprooted his entire live and moved to the USA in order to be able to compete there from entering the competition.
If you enjoyed watching completely pointless stomps in the top 8 of WCS (which is the place you would normally look for the best games outside of GSL/SSL) then you probably don't feel that the current system is broken. How can you find it more interesting than last year is beyond my comprehension, but so are most of the opinions of the majority of people so it's not that surprising.
The residency rule was installed exactly to make it more "interesting", particularly to viewers who care more about the foreigner players. Back then I was saying how stupid that is and I was proven right - at least in my opinion the resulting tournament was pretty stupid. Now you (and other people) are saying that the situation at hand is the inevitable outcome of this change and thus I conclude that the only possible solution is to reverse the change.
On April 06 2015 15:35 thecrazymunchkin wrote: POLT YOU MAGNIFICENT SON OF A BITCH
You are a champion. What a good reference, perfect song for the occasion (Btw - Did you get the song from Perks of being a Wallflower?). I'm just going to come out and say it... "I love you". #NoHomo
On April 06 2015 18:05 opisska wrote: While I was cheering for Polt out of sheer love for him, it's kinda pity that Hydra didn't win, because that would expose the absurdity of this WCS to the maximum. Polt at least is someone who truly lives outside Korea for a reason and it would be honestly difficult for him to compete in Korean tournaments. But Hydra? This guy just shows that the only three things standing between a horde of sufficiently high-level Koreans ) and easy money and WCS points are willingness to move, visa bureaucracy and Polt. Hydra is pretty good for an "export Korean", but there are dozens of guys of comparable skill in Korea who end in Ro16s of the two leagues.
The grand finals itself was fantastic games and awesomely nail-biting - for me particularly because of my hatred towards how Hydra got there, so I should actually congratulate WCS for creating that story but overall this WCS was pretty lame at times and the concept is just wrong. Yes, there were high viewer numbers, but this was the first time, so nobody could know upfront how bad some of the games are going to be. Next time I think people will be more scpetical and tune in only for the eventual Korean-Korean or Korean/Bunny/Snute matches.
While I'll try to stay objective, I have a short story, which might be interesting regarding this topic. For me personally, I don't mind either way. I agree with both sides in this matter but here it is ;
So, while I was watching the finals this weekend, my girlfriend was sitting next to me on my couch. Having never ever seen Starcraft, I explained the basics a bit and she already knew I used to play alot/consider e-sports, THE sports to watch. She actually quite liked the awesomeness and the hype for every particular match, although she still has/had no clue what was happening during the games itself (The GG timings seem to really be hard to grasp for people who don't know SC).
I had explained the region differences and how it is aranged now. One of the first things she said was ; "Why are there still koreans then in an EU/AM tournament?"
I thought about it for a second and explained how it got evolved from last year, where there were tons of Koreans in all regions (explained her about WCS KR2(AM)) and explained how Koreans just generally dominate this season. For her, this was just really confusing and weird. Why not let the koreans play on their own turf? Why have such weird VISA rules? I had also told her Polt's story and she agreed, that maybe something like that would be acceptable. However she disagreed with any other "Foreigners" from entering such a tourney and had some solid arguments for it.
edit; She also mentioned that it would be really weird for Foreigners to move to Korea for the same reason. Which I then told her, that foreigners had been doing that since 2001, which she found really odd aswell. She said; "It's as if America's best basketball players, would join Russia's biggest basketball league, just to win some easy prize-money, which shouldn't be possible". (I told her, that the foreigners weren't even winning in Korea, eventhough that isn't the point)
I know, that in our (gaming) scene, we have alot of arguments for and against almost everything. But I was rather surprised that she took such a hard stance against these rules, and viewed them as really weird and offputting. She bassically said that if it would turn out to be a KR vs KR finals, that she felt less interested and was rooting for any non-korean. (My bias was heavily towards ShoWTimE, so she wanted him to win mostly).
Here's the kicker; I have never ever told/said/leaked anything about my stance towards the korean-eu-am scene to her, nor did I ever agree to her stance at that point. I was just really interested what she had to say as an outsider.
@Opisska, her stance towards this situation, was at that time, almost exactly the same as your post here. Minus the background knowledge on WCS and e-sports in general.
There are plenty of American basketball players in "foreign" leagues. Just saying.
That's just a weird argument. The USA's sports scene might not notice this as much, because it's really focused on sports no one else in the world really cares about ( I jest. :p), like basketball, baseball and American football. So all the viewers, players and money come from and stay in the US. But in football, cycling, tennis, ... and just about any other international sport it's very common for athletes to hop across borders to compete in different leagues.
You're missing the point, the basketball argument was just an example. Lets just say "National team" in any sport. Someone who has been living for a long time in a country, might be eligible for the National team. However, a good player who decided to live in country X, to play for that national team, just because getting on the national team is too hard in his/her own country. That's a different story.. Now view WCS AM, WCS EU, WCS China, WCS KR as "National team" (just look at WCS2012) and read the argument again.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/JIiCpcP.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/oa9Walk.jpg)
