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On November 03 2014 12:08 mikumegurine wrote:
so Balloon has a student visa?
So POlt, Violet, Balloon
any others? can get a student visa, maybe for a cheap community college or something (any country where its easiest, Macau, Africa, Middle East etc)?
I'm pretty sure that when CatZ recruited hydra and SuperNova he told that he was going to do anything for them to play in WCS AM, or am I wrong?
(also did this thread really devolved into a "SC2 ded gaem" thread...)
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just admit you've lost the eSport race Blizzard.
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cant do the math
does that mean wcs is diminishing or restructuring?
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On November 03 2014 15:03 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 12:08 mikumegurine wrote:
so Balloon has a student visa?
So POlt, Violet, Balloon
any others? can get a student visa, maybe for a cheap community college or something (any country where its easiest, Macau, Africa, Middle East etc)? (also did this thread really devolved into a "SC2 ded gaem" thread...)
Some people like to gnash their teeth at any change to their system. Damned if they do, damned if they don't.
As long as I get to see more foreigners play, I'm very happy.
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On November 03 2014 16:47 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
As long as I get to see more foreigners play, I'm very happy.
Ditto.
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On November 03 2014 15:12 aka_star wrote:
just admit you've lost the eSport race Blizzard.
The esports race is barely out of the starting blocks.
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On November 03 2014 13:23 brickrd wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 11:58 Doodsmack wrote:On November 03 2014 07:11 Zealously wrote:On November 03 2014 07:03 Doodsmack wrote:
It is pretty funny that they teased us with region lock and then halved the number of spots available for foreigners lol. In practice, this change does not hurt foreigners. Because the money paid out in WCS has doubled, one season in Premier now pays as much (or more, assuming distribution stays the same) as two seasons did this year. With the removal of essentially all Koreans but three or four, more spots are open for foreigners to make it into Premier. It may look like a net loss on paper, but unless a lot of Koreans manage to secure visas such as Violet's (and they won't), the foreign scene will receive more money through WCS in 2015 than in 2014. The prize money thing is definitely good, but it's less additional spots available in premier than the initial region lock tease would have led us to believe. ok so? i'm not seeing how that matters. prize money is more important for foreign talent to develop than the "prestige" of being in a league called premier. you need to eat and pay your bills, then you can worry about whether you can put "premier" on your list of accomplishments
Being in the league called premier isn't just about prestige, it also brings with it a nice payday, even in the Ro32. Less spots means less people getting that payday. IMO having a broader playing field paying money to more people is more important for the health of the scene than paying more money to fewer people. That's also why I loath winner-takes-all formats.
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- Two global premier leagues in Korea: GSL by GOM eXP and SPOTV Games Individual League
um, HELL YEAH !!! xD
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On November 01 2014 07:50 Cricketer12 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2014 07:48 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:I like this a lot. - Unified league outside of Korea is really exciting to me. Grubby vs Violet, TLO vs HuK, Bunny vs Scarlett bring it on.
- Additionally the regional qualifiers into live Ro32 are a huge improvement to the legitimacy of playing cross server for Taiwanese, Latin Americans, Chinese, etc. Now they can just play on their local servers and qualify directly into live Ro32.
- Live on-site Ro16 as a legitimate event instead of Ro8 and even the finals played in the same studio in front of the same 20 people?
- Same prizepool?!
whilst having some cool NA v EU matchups, i dont really understand the purpose behind such a drastic change to an otherwise mostly stable system
Might have something to do with ESL hosting both NA and EU right now. Would make production easier, and also organising much easier if EU + NA merge.
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On November 03 2014 14:42 lolmlg wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 05:46 JimmyJRaynor wrote:On November 03 2014 02:51 TheDwf wrote:
I love Blizzard, I love the game, but it's obviously bad, we need more, look at yesterday, Taeja, Life, soO are there but where is the show? Where is the crowd? Where is the money? Everything is cheap, 5 years later... WCS should be the ultimate tournament, the most imposing, the most beautiful... Even the schedule was not good (yesterday it started at 6pm to 8 am for EU, after 3 am for EU we were 35k...) and we all know that EU is watching Starcraft more than US... Really I mean so many guys paid to think and no one makes the right call... I really love Blizzard and Starcraft 2 but no, it's not a good little step, nobody has time, Blizzard needs do step it up for the community, not buy time like that." The game is fine. Blizzard does not know how to create excitement around a competitive live event. Blizzard does not know how to "create stars". It is a fine art that few have mastered. I do not think Blizzard is even focused on "creating stars". Its ironic that the best event promotion and star creation occurred when Blizzard basically surrendered its rights to Brood War and several South Korean promoters were given carte blanche due to Blizzard's disinterest and total focus on WoW. There's honestly nothing ironic or surprising about that. Anyone who didn't see that coming before SC2 launched was either naive or had ulterior motives. The plan Blizzard had was to make as much money as possible in the short term by exploiting the reputation of Brood War and forcing the player base to transition to the new game. Their entire partnership with GOM was intended to be disruptive. They weren't partnering with the most competent, experienced team. All they wanted to do was create conflict. These tournaments only benefit Blizzard to the extent that they advertise Blizzard products and foster good will among people who are likely to buy Blizzard products. They don't need to be great. There's no incentive for Blizzard to make them great. They just need to be passable. We're deep in the realm of diminishing returns here.
Blizzard disagrees ..Pierce intended SC2 esports to be a 10 year project. as you've noted its in a serious tailspin after 4.5 years.
smart live event promoters will always be around sniffing around looking for the next big thing. at one time that was Brood War. Blizzard snuffed them out of their game. They failed to partner with them and their 10 year project is in a serious tailspin 5 years in. but, hey, at least SC2 esports lasted longer than Destiny and Titanfall.
and you say Blizzard wanted this to happen 
great plan. Blizzard needs to stay out of live event promotion.. they do not know what they are doing. 5 years ago they thought they could do it. they failed.... so this is what we're left with half way through their grand plan. 60 people at thelive event watching the top 16 fight for the world title... makes you wonder what 2019 will look like.
the game itself is great though.
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On November 03 2014 18:49 Thax wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 13:23 brickrd wrote:On November 03 2014 11:58 Doodsmack wrote:On November 03 2014 07:11 Zealously wrote:On November 03 2014 07:03 Doodsmack wrote:
It is pretty funny that they teased us with region lock and then halved the number of spots available for foreigners lol. In practice, this change does not hurt foreigners. Because the money paid out in WCS has doubled, one season in Premier now pays as much (or more, assuming distribution stays the same) as two seasons did this year. With the removal of essentially all Koreans but three or four, more spots are open for foreigners to make it into Premier. It may look like a net loss on paper, but unless a lot of Koreans manage to secure visas such as Violet's (and they won't), the foreign scene will receive more money through WCS in 2015 than in 2014. The prize money thing is definitely good, but it's less additional spots available in premier than the initial region lock tease would have led us to believe. ok so? i'm not seeing how that matters. prize money is more important for foreign talent to develop than the "prestige" of being in a league called premier. you need to eat and pay your bills, then you can worry about whether you can put "premier" on your list of accomplishments Being in the league called premier isn't just about prestige, it also brings with it a nice payday, even in the Ro32. Less spots means less people getting that payday. IMO having a broader playing field paying money to more people is more important for the health of the scene than paying more money to fewer people. That's also why I loath winner-takes-all formats.
The Koreans just have the vastly superior system when it comes to developing talents. More amount of prestige or more amount of money will be nothing more than a drop in the bucket when it comes to Foreigners catching up to Koreans.
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On November 03 2014 18:49 Thax wrote:
Being in the league called premier isn't just about prestige, it also brings with it a nice payday, even in the Ro32. Less spots means less people getting that payday. IMO having a broader playing field paying money to more people is more important for the health of the scene than paying more money to fewer people. That's also why I loath winner-takes-all formats.
WCS 2014 top48 got paydays
places 33-48: $600
places 17-32:$2000
WCS 2015 top64 get paydays
places 33-64: $2000
96-64= 32 less spots get $600 because EU and NA are together now. Actually I dont see why a 65th or 96th placed player should get some money.
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On November 03 2014 22:48 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 14:42 lolmlg wrote:On November 03 2014 05:46 JimmyJRaynor wrote:On November 03 2014 02:51 TheDwf wrote:
I love Blizzard, I love the game, but it's obviously bad, we need more, look at yesterday, Taeja, Life, soO are there but where is the show? Where is the crowd? Where is the money? Everything is cheap, 5 years later... WCS should be the ultimate tournament, the most imposing, the most beautiful... Even the schedule was not good (yesterday it started at 6pm to 8 am for EU, after 3 am for EU we were 35k...) and we all know that EU is watching Starcraft more than US... Really I mean so many guys paid to think and no one makes the right call... I really love Blizzard and Starcraft 2 but no, it's not a good little step, nobody has time, Blizzard needs do step it up for the community, not buy time like that." The game is fine. Blizzard does not know how to create excitement around a competitive live event. Blizzard does not know how to "create stars". It is a fine art that few have mastered. I do not think Blizzard is even focused on "creating stars". Its ironic that the best event promotion and star creation occurred when Blizzard basically surrendered its rights to Brood War and several South Korean promoters were given carte blanche due to Blizzard's disinterest and total focus on WoW. There's honestly nothing ironic or surprising about that. Anyone who didn't see that coming before SC2 launched was either naive or had ulterior motives. The plan Blizzard had was to make as much money as possible in the short term by exploiting the reputation of Brood War and forcing the player base to transition to the new game. Their entire partnership with GOM was intended to be disruptive. They weren't partnering with the most competent, experienced team. All they wanted to do was create conflict. These tournaments only benefit Blizzard to the extent that they advertise Blizzard products and foster good will among people who are likely to buy Blizzard products. They don't need to be great. There's no incentive for Blizzard to make them great. They just need to be passable. We're deep in the realm of diminishing returns here. and you say Blizzard wanted this to happen great plan. Blizzard needs to stay out of live event promotion.. they do not know what they are doing. 5 years ago they thought they could do it. they failed.... so this is what we're left with half way through their grand plan. 60 people at thelive event watching the top 16 fight for the world title... makes you wonder what 2019 will look like. the game itself is great though.
You might be interested in knowing that what you're calling "the live event" (which it really wasn't, it was the prelude) was a private event played out in Blizzard's Burbank studios, not open (as far as I know) to just anyone. The big event will still be held at Blizzcon and the crowd will still be large, but you're acting as if Blizzcon has already come and went and failed. You do that a lot when talking about SC2 events, and I don't recall a time when you weren't partially wrong in your predictions.
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Excited to see what 2015 will bring, I think that the Korea is in a really good place now.
Between non-WCS events I think we'll hopefully still see enough foreigner vs Korean play though.
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On November 03 2014 23:37 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 22:48 JimmyJRaynor wrote:On November 03 2014 14:42 lolmlg wrote:On November 03 2014 05:46 JimmyJRaynor wrote:On November 03 2014 02:51 TheDwf wrote:
I love Blizzard, I love the game, but it's obviously bad, we need more, look at yesterday, Taeja, Life, soO are there but where is the show? Where is the crowd? Where is the money? Everything is cheap, 5 years later... WCS should be the ultimate tournament, the most imposing, the most beautiful... Even the schedule was not good (yesterday it started at 6pm to 8 am for EU, after 3 am for EU we were 35k...) and we all know that EU is watching Starcraft more than US... Really I mean so many guys paid to think and no one makes the right call... I really love Blizzard and Starcraft 2 but no, it's not a good little step, nobody has time, Blizzard needs do step it up for the community, not buy time like that." The game is fine. Blizzard does not know how to create excitement around a competitive live event. Blizzard does not know how to "create stars". It is a fine art that few have mastered. I do not think Blizzard is even focused on "creating stars". Its ironic that the best event promotion and star creation occurred when Blizzard basically surrendered its rights to Brood War and several South Korean promoters were given carte blanche due to Blizzard's disinterest and total focus on WoW. There's honestly nothing ironic or surprising about that. Anyone who didn't see that coming before SC2 launched was either naive or had ulterior motives. The plan Blizzard had was to make as much money as possible in the short term by exploiting the reputation of Brood War and forcing the player base to transition to the new game. Their entire partnership with GOM was intended to be disruptive. They weren't partnering with the most competent, experienced team. All they wanted to do was create conflict. These tournaments only benefit Blizzard to the extent that they advertise Blizzard products and foster good will among people who are likely to buy Blizzard products. They don't need to be great. There's no incentive for Blizzard to make them great. They just need to be passable. We're deep in the realm of diminishing returns here. and you say Blizzard wanted this to happen great plan. Blizzard needs to stay out of live event promotion.. they do not know what they are doing. 5 years ago they thought they could do it. they failed.... so this is what we're left with half way through their grand plan. 60 people at thelive event watching the top 16 fight for the world title... makes you wonder what 2019 will look like. the game itself is great though. You might be interested in knowing that what you're calling "the live event" (which it really wasn't, it was the prelude) was a private event played out in Blizzard's Burbank studios, not open (as far as I know) to just anyone. The big event will still be held at Blizzcon and the crowd will still be large, but you're acting as if Blizzcon has already come and went and failed. You do that a lot when talking about SC2 events, and I don't recall a time when you weren't partially wrong in your predictions.
we're going way off topic so i made a blog entry for it.\
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/470524-sc2-esports-decline-do-not-blame-the-game
Blizzard's biggest errors occurred 6 or 7 years ago.
with proper promotion i think SC2 esports can be #1 as Brood War was. i don't think it'll ever happen though.
as far as predictions go.
check this out
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/games/468326-borderlands-the-pre-sequel
the prize pool peaked in 2012.
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On November 03 2014 23:14 Dingodile wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 18:49 Thax wrote:
Being in the league called premier isn't just about prestige, it also brings with it a nice payday, even in the Ro32. Less spots means less people getting that payday. IMO having a broader playing field paying money to more people is more important for the health of the scene than paying more money to fewer people. That's also why I loath winner-takes-all formats. WCS 2014 top48 got paydays places 33-48: $600 places 17-32:$2000 WCS 2015 top64 get paydays places 33-64: $2000 96-64= 32 less spots get $600 because EU and NA are together now. Actually I dont see why a 65th or 96th placed player should get some money.
to encourage higher level participation among foreigners
since a good amount of money is on the line even at the low tier level, it should raise overall skill floor of foreign competitors
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
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On November 04 2014 01:38 GumBa wrote:
Not happy with this
I would like to hear your reasoning
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I remember watching avilo goi bio yesterday on stream. he smells the money and he's adapting from ladder warrior to wcs competitor.
same should be going on everywhere
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Poland3751 Posts
On November 03 2014 18:43 Thax wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2014 15:12 aka_star wrote:
just admit you've lost the eSport race Blizzard. The esports race is barely out of the starting blocks.
Also SC2 is by far the most popular RTS game or individual game (unless you count hearthstone but that's Blizzard's as well).
ATP is not trying to dethrone Soccer in terms of popularity.
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EPT
