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On August 12 2014 00:36 Crot4le wrote:
No. Dreamhack, IEM and Red Bull isn't funded by the community. They are funded by sponsors. All profit they make they have to make through businesses. They don't get donations.
You don't get it. Giving money directly isn't the only way of giving money.
On August 12 2014 00:03 Jimmeh wrote:
Agreed with this 100%. $1800 for 6 days work (and however long it took him to invite a 8 players and contact the 8 ladder qualifiers) seems a bit of a joke.
It's especially funny how people don't take into account all the time that he has to put in to make a brand out of himself. You think someone else here can just say: "woo hoo i'm gonna make a tournament!"? Nope, we can't, but he can. Why? Because of all that time he spends around doing stuff for his promotion.
Destiny is tournament organizer but he is also biggest commercial for this tournament. You gotta take those things into account.
Really funny how some of you think so straightforward.
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Just a small comment: There should maybe have been a fourth option in the "will you donate next time?" poll. I voted for the middle road because I think I very conceivably could donate, but I doubt it will have anything to do with perks or rewards or anything like that. I will have to consider at the time whether I will donate.
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On August 12 2014 00:45 zev318 wrote:
saying you dont want to damage relationships and then posting an email is kind of ironic dont you think?
talk about being full of yourself, why would kespa send their players to this 1st time tournament? that's like me running a 1st time basketball tournament in buttfuck nowhere and then complaining why NBA wont send their players when i ask nicely.
Destiny a person who tops the starcraft stream list of players most months isn't comparable to some random creating a tournament, you can see why Kespa didn't want their players to attend and you can see why Destiny is questioning that choice. I agree 50/50 with both sides.
But now destiny has shown his tournament has merit so there shouldn't be any hitch in getting some Kespa players to play.
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On August 12 2014 00:46 bLah. wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2014 00:36 Crot4le wrote:
No. Dreamhack, IEM and Red Bull isn't funded by the community. They are funded by sponsors. All profit they make they have to make through businesses. They don't get donations.
You don't get it. Giving money directly isn't the only way of giving money.
You know this is the second time you have taken a single quote out of a post of mine and deleted the rest of the post which provide the context/eleboration/reasoning for it....
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I really enjoyed watching this tournament. Even though I think I remember reading that your initial plan was to have a more serious casting environment, I think the more laid back approach was really nice. It felt like it hit a really nice balance, somewhere between "serious" casting and Homestory Cup style casting. Overall it was a great event, I'd contribute to the next one if I had the spare money.
The people in this thread complaining about you "paying" yourself with the sponsor money seems insane to me. Seems like you put in more than enough work to justify it.
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Really happy with how it went. Kind of how I expected it to go to be honest. When you're serious you get shit done man! :D Looking forward to the 2nd tournament and even though I didn't have money this time to throw around, I'll definitely support it next time. Kudo's! 
Also some people seem to be thinking a bit ignorantly. He didn't do work for 6 days, he worked for many more hours past those days communicating, setting up, planning, fixing, inviting, preparing his tournament. If something is succesful the organizer or producer deserves a decent slice of cake for it too. We all enjoyed it, didn't we? Nothing was missing and IMO Destiny fully ''deserved'' the $1800 he made for all the work and sleepless nights he put in 
I could've removed my post and just repost this I suppose:
On August 12 2014 00:37 Hot_Bid wrote:
I think the transparency is really nice. I wonder why anyone thinks that $1,800 is too much for the amount of work Destiny put in. He deserved it.
I didn't personally contribute to this one but I probably will for the next one.
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If Destiny doesn't make any money off of this, he wouldn't be planning on doing another one. It's great to give your time and all that, but things don't happen if people don't get paid.
How many tournament series have we seen fail because someone important(players, casters, tournament organizers) wasn't getting paid as they expected, despite great viewership numbers?
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Personally, I don't think KESPA response is an issue. As Destiny said himself - even he didn't expect such a large viewership. KESPA is choosing their partners very carefully and Destiny came with an idea of crowdfunded tournament with little sponsorship. To be honest, it didn't look well on the paper. And I think it was quite reasonable decision from KESPA.
I think some of KESPA players could raise viewership even more. However, I hope they do not take too much foreigner spots. I feel foreigner - Korean ratio in this tournament was perfect. We had high level Koreans, we had our favourite foreigners. We had Korean vs foreigner final. Some quite unknown players had a chance to show a good play too. It was perfect. In my opinion too many KESPA players would ruin that, so their number should not be too high. I don't know if KESPA would agree to that, but seeing what a success Destiny I was, I think they really should take part this time.
Also, a bit offtopic, but Destiny-KESPA conversation reminds me one of Game of Thrones scenes I put it in spoiler tag. Warning: Season 4 spoilers
+ Show Spoiler +
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awsome torunament destiny! i hope we can have another with some kespa players aswell :D
also would be awsome to include some fan favorites like mvp
btw definitely invite apocalypse again, he was a beast!
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I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
You let the viewers pay and go home with the sponsorship money. I think you should have mentioned that before fundraising, I would definitely be pissed, would I have had donated money for this event.
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On August 12 2014 00:51 Ovid wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2014 00:45 zev318 wrote:
saying you dont want to damage relationships and then posting an email is kind of ironic dont you think?
talk about being full of yourself, why would kespa send their players to this 1st time tournament? that's like me running a 1st time basketball tournament in buttfuck nowhere and then complaining why NBA wont send their players when i ask nicely.
Destiny a person who tops the starcraft stream list of players most months isn't comparable to some random creating a tournament, you can see why Kespa didn't want their players to attend and you can see why Destiny is questioning that choice. I agree 50/50 with both sides. But now destiny has shown his tournament has merit so there shouldn't be any hitch in getting some Kespa players to play.
just cause you can stream on twitch for 20 hours a day everyday doesnt automatically guarantee a successful, well-run and profitable (kespa probably cares less about this) tournament.
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On August 12 2014 00:37 Hot_Bid wrote:
I think the transparency is really nice. I wonder why anyone thinks that $1,800 is too much for the amount of work Destiny put in. He deserved it.
I didn't personally contribute to this one but I probably will for the next one.
For a tournament on the smaller side, that was crowdfunded I think around $2,000 for a week of work seems appropriate. It went rather well, money was made, people enjoyed it. I see no problems here.
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On August 12 2014 00:56 Kimb3r wrote:Show nested quote +I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament. You let the viewers pay and go home with the sponsorship money. I think you should have mentioned that before fundraising, I would definitely be pissed, would I have had donated money for this event.
Why? I raised $5,500 via Indiegogo and said I would put it all towards the tournament. I did. All of the money's been paid out. What on earth could you possibly be mad about?
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I'm honestly surprised how many people are voting "no" in the Kespa poll. While I'm sure that response hurt you a bit, it doesn't really seem all that unreasonable. Even then, I don't see a reason to punish Kespa players simply because some guy in management questioned the benefits of attending your first tournament. There are only Pros to Kespa players attending future tournaments; your Cons are entirely about how you feel, and have nothing to do with the tournament itself. If it hurt your ego that bad, then I'm sorry to hear that, and you can do what you want. But I'd hope you'd put the tournament quality first rather than carrying out a feud with some random Kespa manager.
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I liked the part of the tournament i watched!
Considering the shitty weekend you chose to host your tournament (pro league final, taiwan open and redbull battleground), you had a great viewer number!
I'll definetly watch again!
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Good work! I didn't participate in the crowdfunding, but I did tune in for most of the days. I didn't mind the sponsor logos and stuff at all, and am looking forward to a better Destiny II. The variety of guest casters was a nice touch.
Edit: I would like to add that I love that you produced this candid report. Great analysis.
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I Think Destiny and all the casters (Naruto@ take.tv )did great. The tournament was indeed fun to watch.
I don't know how the money could be distributed to Destiny and his Co- Casters. Casters from other (language) Streams should not get paid, unless they promote a sponsor for the event.
Destiny "earning" about 2000$ Directly + Add Revenue or additional subs + Twitch should be fine.
Maybe do two Tipjars?
1. Destiny | 2. Prizepool ?
I am not decided on the KeSpA Thing. Everytime they should interact with another Organization they act arrogant. The Proleague format is plain boring and only picks up excitement during the Play Offs and Finals, at least for me.
There are some Koreans opening to the foreign community, and the elitist KeSpA.
And somehow they show yet another level of starcraft, if it is pure skill or just the fact that KeSpa is a rather tiny pool of players competing against one another over and over.
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On August 12 2014 01:01 plgElwood wrote:
I Think Destiny and all the casters (Naruto@ take.tv )did great. The tournament was indeed fun to watch.
I don't know how the money could be distributed to Destiny and his Co- Casters. Casters from other (language) Streams should not get paid, unless they promote a sponsor for the event.
Destiny "earning" about 2000$ Directly + Add Revenue or additional subs + Twitch should be fine.
Maybe do two Tipjars?
1. Destiny | 2. Prizepool ?
I am not decided on the KeSpA Thing. Everytime they should interact with another Organization they act arrogant. The Proleague format is plain boring and only picks up excitement during the Play Offs and Finals, at least for me.
There are some Koreans opening to the foreign community, and the elitist KeSpA.
And somehow they show yet another level of starcraft, if it is pure skill or just the fact that KeSpa is a rather tiny pool of players competing against one another over and over.
Destiny did not run ads, because of the crowdfunding .
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If I was Kespa I would use events like this to send 'b-teamers', give them a chance for tournament exposure and an opportunity to make money. Its not like b-teamers were too involved in pro-league either.
As advice to Destiny, Kespa are notoriously elitist but you should take the moral high ground and not blacklist them, maybe they will learn a lesson. Also we want to watch Kespa players.
Tournament was amazing, loved every second of it (even the 10year olds trying to ddos)
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The only ones who are bitching over the $1800 are 14 year olds with no clue how life works. Great job Destiny! You will for sure get a donation from me for The Destiny Two!
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EPT
