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On July 31 2014 18:27 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. LoL has definitely made it work, and I think LoL's success is what most people are looking at.
As far as I am considered LoL is not a fair F2P model since some heroes are behind a paywall and need to be purchased. Also MOBA's are easier to customise (100 difeerent heroes) than RTS games and I doubt that F2P is the answer. Have you played a f2p MOBA? It is filled with people who do not know how to behave in a civilised manner. That is one of the huge disadvantages that comes with going F2P.
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On July 31 2014 18:16 MajorBiscuit wrote:
The button to disable skins kind of defeats their purpose though. Seeing others players have cool cosmetics in game is the biggest advertisement one can ask for. During TI all of the pro players had the latest skins released especially for TI and the casters at one game went like look at this cool Etheral Blade X player's Morphling has equiped.
Although I certainly aggree that as long SC2 is a paid game that option should exist.
the problem is also that skins on a moba don't affect your computer too much, mass zergling with wings does
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Czech Republic12133 Posts
On July 31 2014 18:35 MajorBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:27 Zealously wrote:On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. LoL has definitely made it work, and I think LoL's success is what most people are looking at. As far as I am considered LoL is not a fair F2P model since some heroes are behind a paywall and need to be purchased. Also MOBA's are easier to customise (100 difeerent heroes) than RTS games and I doubt that F2P is the answer. Have you played a f2p MOBA? It is filled with people who do not know how to behave in a civilised manner. That is one of the huge disadvantages that comes with going F2P.
Ehm, I even created a clan named "Bad Manners Positive". I do not behave in a civilized manner unless I am playing a custom game, arcade or I know the person. Ladder is just a rage free zone to me  So, no, paywall doesn't work as the BM thread shows (and I haven't been there yet to my surprise :D) And my opponents are not better than me, most of the time I am just the silent type doing myself ignoring their chat, but once it turns to !@#!@$!$!$! (I have filter on) I try to enrage them even more So, naaaah, paywall does not work 
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i think a form of in-game currency would be nice, the way you unlock the few skins and dances we have now is by leveling up, but leveling goes so fast you can be done with it in 2-3 days. if they give us a form of in-game currency (like influence points from LoL) and make it so that you get a bit of them every game (more if you win, less if you lose) then this would take away some of the ladder anxiety and make 1v1 a bit more casual because you get a reward no matter what, while now when you lose a 1v1 you gain nothing beside exp (which is incredibly useless after you hit the cap) and you lose your points. while if you gain a bit of currency you can use that to save up for a skin/portrait/decal.
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Im indifferent to skins, but if this opens up the way to HUDs/Announcers then I'll be really happy. I agree that it definitely needs an on/off switch.
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On July 31 2014 18:41 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:35 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:27 Zealously wrote:On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. LoL has definitely made it work, and I think LoL's success is what most people are looking at. As far as I am considered LoL is not a fair F2P model since some heroes are behind a paywall and need to be purchased. Also MOBA's are easier to customise (100 difeerent heroes) than RTS games and I doubt that F2P is the answer. Have you played a f2p MOBA? It is filled with people who do not know how to behave in a civilised manner. That is one of the huge disadvantages that comes with going F2P. Ehm, I even created a clan named "Bad Manners Positive". I do not behave in a civilized manner unless I am playing a custom game, arcade or I know the person. Ladder is just a rage free zone to me So, no, paywall doesn't work as the BM thread shows (and I haven't been there yet to my surprise :D) And my opponents are not better than me, most of the time I am just the silent type doing myself ignoring their chat, but once it turns to !@#!@$!$!$! (I have filter on) I try to enrage them even more So, naaaah, paywall does not work
That does not change what I said. On average the SC community is much more well behaved than the DOTA one. If the game goes F2P the forums will be filled with kids crying Protoss is imba, fuck this game going back to LoL (to a much higher degree than now).
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On July 31 2014 18:50 MajorBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:41 deacon.frost wrote:On July 31 2014 18:35 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:27 Zealously wrote:On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. LoL has definitely made it work, and I think LoL's success is what most people are looking at. As far as I am considered LoL is not a fair F2P model since some heroes are behind a paywall and need to be purchased. Also MOBA's are easier to customise (100 difeerent heroes) than RTS games and I doubt that F2P is the answer. Have you played a f2p MOBA? It is filled with people who do not know how to behave in a civilised manner. That is one of the huge disadvantages that comes with going F2P. Ehm, I even created a clan named "Bad Manners Positive". I do not behave in a civilized manner unless I am playing a custom game, arcade or I know the person. Ladder is just a rage free zone to me So, no, paywall doesn't work as the BM thread shows (and I haven't been there yet to my surprise :D) And my opponents are not better than me, most of the time I am just the silent type doing myself ignoring their chat, but once it turns to !@#!@$!$!$! (I have filter on) I try to enrage them even more So, naaaah, paywall does not work That does not change what I said. On average the SC community is much more well behaved than the DOTA one. If the game goes F2P the forums will be filled with kids crying Protoss is imba, fuck this game going back to LoL (to a much higher degree than now).
You know that it's already the case ? Did you looked at official forums ? Lol.
And TL doesn't fear to press the ban button when you whine so that won't change a lot in here too.
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On July 31 2014 19:08 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:50 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:41 deacon.frost wrote:On July 31 2014 18:35 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:27 Zealously wrote:On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. LoL has definitely made it work, and I think LoL's success is what most people are looking at. As far as I am considered LoL is not a fair F2P model since some heroes are behind a paywall and need to be purchased. Also MOBA's are easier to customise (100 difeerent heroes) than RTS games and I doubt that F2P is the answer. Have you played a f2p MOBA? It is filled with people who do not know how to behave in a civilised manner. That is one of the huge disadvantages that comes with going F2P. Ehm, I even created a clan named "Bad Manners Positive". I do not behave in a civilized manner unless I am playing a custom game, arcade or I know the person. Ladder is just a rage free zone to me So, no, paywall doesn't work as the BM thread shows (and I haven't been there yet to my surprise :D) And my opponents are not better than me, most of the time I am just the silent type doing myself ignoring their chat, but once it turns to !@#!@$!$!$! (I have filter on) I try to enrage them even more So, naaaah, paywall does not work That does not change what I said. On average the SC community is much more well behaved than the DOTA one. If the game goes F2P the forums will be filled with kids crying Protoss is imba, fuck this game going back to LoL (to a much higher degree than now). You know that it's already the case ? Did you looked at official forums ? Lol. And TL doesn't fear to press the ban button when you whine so that won't change a lot in here too.
I know that this is already the case but I also said that it will be even worse when the barrier of entry is lowered.
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I am fairly sure it is going to happen.
Heroes are their main focus and most features if not all can be ported to sc2.
It servers as a perfect testing ground for them.
Hope I am not wrong on this
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On July 31 2014 18:34 LastManProductions wrote:
Why are people against skins/cosmetics? If they are distracting you to much, maybe you should look into some ADD medication...
Maybe because some people think those things are retarded? Just a guess 
Seeing pink giant ultralisks running around is kind of against my idea of what SC is like. But, as I don't want to kill others joy, just have the freaking option to kill such things and everybody will be happy.
And please people, stop with the F2p idea...it is bad for you. And there are enough threads about it anyway.
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On July 31 2014 19:17 KobraKay wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:34 LastManProductions wrote:
Why are people against skins/cosmetics? If they are distracting you to much, maybe you should look into some ADD medication... Maybe because some people think those things are retarded? Just a guess Seeing pink giant ultralisks running around is kind of against my idea of what SC is like. But, as I don't want to kill others joy, just have the freaking option to kill such things and everybody will be happy. And please people, stop with the F2p idea...it is bad for you. And there are enough threads about it anyway.
There's no denying that it's gonna happen.
And why Pink Ultralisk ? Did you see the Thors skin ? It's badass as fuck. There are a lot of skins cool like marauders, tanks, etc that are already implemented in the campaign and doesn't disturb the lore and the view.
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On July 31 2014 18:29 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. Because if you remove the paywall, more people will play the game. That's all what we want right ? There are a lot of F2P not P2W out there and I don't see why they pose problem to you. SC2 is declining slowly but surely, and passing in F2P will be a huge bawl of fresh air. I know a lot of people who might wanna try sc2 if it becomes free.
I would be all for f2p, but I'm afraid it cannot happen until blizzard deals with maphackers.. imagine how many maphackers will there be if it becomes f2p, so many people would do it just to try it out and don't care about an account ban.
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I think skins could be good. Only officially approved skins, and an option to turn them on/off. Its really just another optional feature to add that could provide a new revenue stream not otherwise tapped.
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On July 31 2014 19:22 Extenz wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:29 Faust852 wrote:On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. Because if you remove the paywall, more people will play the game. That's all what we want right ? There are a lot of F2P not P2W out there and I don't see why they pose problem to you. SC2 is declining slowly but surely, and passing in F2P will be a huge bawl of fresh air. I know a lot of people who might wanna try sc2 if it becomes free. I would be all for f2p, but I'm afraid it cannot happen until blizzard deals with maphackers.. imagine how many maphackers will there be if it becomes f2p, so many people would do it just to try it out and don't care about an account ban.
Yeah that's my biggest worry too. I don't know if its feasable but making sc2 server side instead of client side would be awesome.
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On July 31 2014 19:21 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 19:17 KobraKay wrote:On July 31 2014 18:34 LastManProductions wrote:
Why are people against skins/cosmetics? If they are distracting you to much, maybe you should look into some ADD medication... Maybe because some people think those things are retarded? Just a guess Seeing pink giant ultralisks running around is kind of against my idea of what SC is like. But, as I don't want to kill others joy, just have the freaking option to kill such things and everybody will be happy. And please people, stop with the F2p idea...it is bad for you. And there are enough threads about it anyway. There's no denying that it's gonna happen. And why Pink Ultralisk ? Did you see the Thors skin ? It's badass as fuck. There are a lot of skins cool like marauders, tanks, etc that are already implemented in the campaign and doesn't disturb the lore and the view.
Sure. Make the option to turn it all off a reality and you can have all the skins in the world you want.
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On July 31 2014 19:16 ETisME wrote:
I am fairly sure it is going to happen.
Heroes are their main focus and most features if not all can be ported to sc2.
It servers as a perfect testing ground for them.
Hope I am not wrong on this
I remember DB said in a Heroes interview recently that it would be possible to port the functionality to spectate live games back to Starcraft, but that no-one was looking at it right now. I'd imagine theyre saving stuff up for LotV at this point.
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Germany3367 Posts
If they do this, please give me the option to turn them off...
If the option is there, you can implement everything you want.
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On July 31 2014 18:35 MajorBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:27 Zealously wrote:On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them. LoL has definitely made it work, and I think LoL's success is what most people are looking at. As far as I am considered LoL is not a fair F2P model since some heroes are behind a paywall and need to be purchased. Also MOBA's are easier to customise (100 difeerent heroes) than RTS games and I doubt that F2P is the answer. Have you played a f2p MOBA? It is filled with people who do not know how to behave in a civilised manner. That is one of the huge disadvantages that comes with going F2P.
I think you're misusing the term "paywall" as you can earn any hero by simply playing the game. It's possible that if the amount of time you have to invest to be able to purchase a hero is large enough then you might say heros are "effectively paywalled". However the time investment to unlock a hero in LoL is reasonable. You could call them "Playwalled"?
I think this is a good direction for SC2 to be going, but the skepticism people are displaying is warranted. The challenges for re-skinning thoroughbred RTS units are different and more restrictive than for re-skinning aRTS avatars. Units are smaller and there are a ton of them so there is, literally, less room for skins to show themselves and, figuratively, more room for skinning mistakes that make the game harder to parse visually. The party hats of the 4th anniversary are an example of this, as I found it hard to see if a behatted worker was holding minerals while watching streams.
Strong team colours which never change position and differentiated unit silhouettes would be good choices, as would putting emphasis on changing particle effects like lasers and so forth. I can't help imagining immortals with shields that go opaque silver when hit, oily black creep or marauders that fire energy weapons when I think about re-skinning and it makes me smile.
There's the whole playwall vs. paywall thing too. There will be a temptation on blizzard's part to paywall everything as it will all be cosmetic. However unlocking cosmetics through play would be a great way for blizzard to shape player behaviour, if they want more ladder play then throw skins at ladder games played. If they want more arcade interaction then put skins there.
Ultimately "more hats and skins" is generally a good idea but implementation is a wide open country and, while parts of it are sublime, some counties are ugly as all get out.
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On July 31 2014 18:23 MajorBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2014 18:19 Faust852 wrote:
One step closer to F2P, always a good thing. Why is F2P considered such a good thing in the community is completely beyond me. It is very hard to pull a succesful not pay-to-win F2P model. Only Valve has pulled it off, and they had the infastructure (Steam) ready for a very long time to make this viable. Even if Dota 2 didn't make a profit, attracting more people to Steam will always be beneficial to them.
Only Valve? Ever heard of League of Legends? It's got more players, more viewers and makes more money than DOTA 2.
There's plenty of other games that are free-to-play that make ludicrous money. Sure, a lot of them are at least a little pay-to-win, but there certainly exist a good chunk that are not.
EDIT: Not that I'm advocating for F2P, I vastly prefer to buy a game outright and never spend money on it ever again, I just recognise how very successful the F2P model has been.
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I'd rather hear some news about LotV
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EPT
