EPTOn March 05 2014 04:20 Bagi wrote:
Seems to get under the skin of protoss players?
Seems to get under the skin of protoss players?
Maybe, but nothing gets under a Terran's skin like suggesting that they don't play the mechanically hardest race.
Next Balance Patch the 28th February. - Page 33
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
Maybe, but nothing gets under a Terran's skin like suggesting that they don't play the mechanically hardest race. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On March 05 2014 04:55 Plansix wrote: Maybe, but nothing gets under a Terran's skin like suggesting that they don't play the mechanically hardest race. QFMFT | ||
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marpis
Finland18 Posts
I don't really see why not and I haven't seen anyone talk about this earlier. | ||
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
On March 05 2014 04:55 Plansix wrote: Maybe, but nothing gets under a Terran's skin like suggesting that they don't play the mechanically hardest race. Not true though, zerg takes just as much skill as terran. | ||
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PrivateGG
France8 Posts
Couldn't that solve a part of the problem? | ||
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aZealot
New Zealand5447 Posts
On March 05 2014 04:20 Bagi wrote: Seems to get under the skin of protoss players? Meh, I couldn't give a shit, either way. If some Terrans want to indulge a martyr complex everytime they find match, go for gold is how I see it. I do wish, though, that some Protoss players didn't feel the need to stoke the mania. It's a waste of time. | ||
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Magnifico
1958 Posts
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
On March 05 2014 06:28 aZealot wrote: Meh, I couldn't give a shit, either way. If some Terrans want to indulge a martyr complex everytime they find match, go for gold is how I see it. I do wish, though, that some Protoss players didn't feel the need to stoke the mania. It's a waste of time. Yeah clearly you do not care. The attempted jab towards terran players comes from not caring. | ||
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
On March 05 2014 06:49 Tiaraju9 wrote: I can't believe that there are people claiming the "protoss no micro race" card here. Why TL can't be better than Twitch chat and BL.net forums anymore? no one believes that protoss is a "no" micro race. some people here just think that the mechanical requirements that it takes to control a protoss army is easier | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12071 Posts
On March 05 2014 06:49 Tiaraju9 wrote: I can't believe that there are people claiming the "protoss no micro race" card here. Why TL can't be better than Twitch chat and BL.net forums anymore? I don't think you're remembering TL about 5-6 years ago. It was the same shit in BW, nothings changed but slowly but surely all those people whining all the time do or say something stupid and get themselves banned. They then get replaced by someone else. | ||
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aZealot
New Zealand5447 Posts
On March 05 2014 06:50 Bagi wrote: Yeah clearly you do not care. The attempted jab towards terran players comes from not caring. Oh no, I said some Terran players (that includes you by the way). Most Terran just get on with it (as do most Protoss). But, as to the debate, I could not give a shit. Knock yourself out, unappreciated hero. | ||
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RampancyTW
United States577 Posts
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Kevin_Sorbo
Canada3217 Posts
Well I like the new patch. Not getting rekt by a-moved zealots as much when I have mines. And now they dont have storm by the time I get a pair of medevacs to their base, because they are afraid of said mines. I feel like it could shift the meta in interesting ways. Now watching tvp wont be as much as a cringefest either. | ||
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cheekymonkey
France1387 Posts
On March 04 2014 20:50 Foxxan wrote: I think when people say "protoss requires no micro" its degree wise, not literally. In general it doesnt take much micro for protoss. The skill ceiling aint very high/or fun to watch or play. THAT is the core problem then you haven't watched Parting... | ||
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
On March 05 2014 07:17 aZealot wrote: Oh no, I said some Terran players (that includes you by the way). Most Terran just get on with it (as do most Protoss). But, as to the debate, I could not give a shit. Knock yourself out, unappreciated hero. You know what would show that you do not give a shit? To stop posting about it. Instead you always enter these discussions pretending to be above it all and then potshots at the side you dont like. Its getting pretty fucking obnoxious and you really are not fooling anyone, except maybe yourself? | ||
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pure.Wasted
Canada4701 Posts
On March 05 2014 04:27 NonY wrote: Uhh, yeah, obviously. Zealots and stalkers without blink are boring and basic units. Warpgate rushes that used sentries were somewhat interesting, but often too early in the game to be very complex. The variety of ways you deal with blink/dt/oracle are much more interesting than dealing with a warpgate rush. And the variety of ways the protoss player controls blink/dt/oracle and executes the builds are much more interesting as well. Clearly we see the game very very differently if you don't think having the option between 3+ builds all involving very different units is better than doing the same rush over and over again with the same basic units. I can't even fathom why you'd have to ask or even consider if making things simpler and more predictable in every way possible is better for a strategy game. I don't think that Protoss having versatility is bad at all, and I love Blink Stalkers, except right now Blink Stalkers shut down all Terran creativity until 10+ minutes into a match, so while Protoss has gotten more interesting, Terran has gotten less interesting. There's no net gain. The MU hasn't improved. But this conversation started because you said nerfing PO in PvT would destroy Protoss versatility, and I just don't see why that's true. It would kill some extreme builds that have no right to exist, like proxy Oracle (which should be just as viable as proxy Banshee -- aka textbook "all in" and not a macro opening!!!) and allow Terrans to punish pressure builds that fail to do damage, but how in the world would it prevent Blink Stalker pressure from being a potential threat, or teching straight into Archives for HT over Colo? On March 05 2014 04:55 Plansix wrote: Maybe, but nothing gets under a Terran's skin like suggesting that they don't play the mechanically hardest race. Must be nice to argue strawmen all the time. HOTS TvZ Zerg was just as mechanically challenging as Terran before WMs got nerfed. Step 1. Watch Innovation vs. DRG. Step 2. Give me a single series where a Protoss player has to multitask (micro, macro, and out-maneuver the enemy all at the same time) as frequently and efficiently over the course of 3 20+ minute games. Step 3. Realize that the multitasking required in Innovation vs. DRG was spectacular when it happened, but then became the norm for the MU. And before you point me to any given series Polt played, I want you to sit and think, for a minute, about how much attention a Zerg had to pay to his army when WM still had large splash. Lings, Banes, Mutas, the three core units of the standard Zerg composition, required CONSTANT supervision. In the case of Banes, if they were not babysat, they could all die to one widow mine or just do zero damage against split Marines. In the case of Mutas, sure, they don't take more micro to use than Phoenixes (one of the most microable Protoss units), but the difference is Classic makes 5 Phoenixes in one game out of 5, whereas you're liable to see 20-40 Mutas in any single game of TvZ. What takes more multitasking, 5 units over 5 minutes or 20-40 over 15? In one game or in every single game? It's just math. FWIW, Rain's multitasking against Polt was very impressive, and I'm sure that if Protoss units had higher skill ceilings, he would be first in line to take advantage of them. I don't for a second think that all Protoss players are mechanically weaker -- but those that are can get free rides, and those that aren't don't get to impress us to the degree that they should. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27480 Posts
In my case Terran just feels a hell of a lot harder mechanically, whereas with Protoss there's a frustration to be had in the lack of microability of base units that Terran bio has and the need to rely on AoE and spells to equalise that, the good use of which is a skill in itself. Protoss has periods where you can really multitask and rely on mechanics but it doesn't seem to scale across the whole game as much which is disappointing for those who like that kind of thing. For example doing a Phoenix opener in PvZ, harassing perhaps with Zealots while macroing is a period of the game where mechanically sound players are clearly better in, but you can't keep playing like that for a whole game. I don't understand this 'don't complain' attitude either as long as you're not a prick about it | ||
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Foxxan
Sweden3427 Posts
Oh, yes i have. He uses good forcefields with good blink. Iam not impressed. When i see a good terran use his great micro/multitasking iam impressed. When i saw stephano attack a protoss with his roaches with good flank/position i was impressed Or when i saw life use his zerglings, i was impressed. Protoss just does not have that special thing as a race, and therefore iam not impressed. When dear played - I was impressed by something, cant remember exactly what - Maybe his positioning. Which doesnt even happen in combat- just pre combat. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On March 05 2014 11:28 Foxxan wrote: Oh, yes i have. He uses good forcefields with good blink. Iam not impressed. When i see a good terran use his great micro/multitasking iam impressed. When i saw stephano attack a protoss with his roaches with good flank/position i was impressed Or when i saw life use his zerglings, i was impressed. Protoss just does not have that special thing as a race, and therefore iam not impressed. When dear played - I was impressed by something, cant remember exactly what - Maybe his positioning. Which doesnt even happen in combat- just pre combat. If you are not impressed by Parting's play then really, there is no point debating with you. Even the most diehard, biased Terran players are impressed by Parting. He is God. Parting's micro extends past just good FF and blink usage. The way he positions his army. The way he hits like 5 different spells perfectly at the same time. The way he picks up hurt units with his warp prism and drops them off in the back while continue to micro the battle.... how he flanks Terran armies with storm drops... He's ridiculous. If you can't appreciate that then you know nothing about StarCraft... | ||
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
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