EPTFeb 10: Balance Test Map Coming - Page 13
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thezanursic
5500 Posts
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gingerfluffmuff
Austria4570 Posts
On February 11 2014 06:23 BlackCompany wrote: Ah okay. Then the Hydra change isnt too bad, though more Hp would probably better.. but its ok. I guess DK wants to buff the weak Z anti air with this too. Not only the roach hydra push aspect. | ||
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Melliflue
United Kingdom1389 Posts
On February 11 2014 06:22 sCnInfinity wrote: Now the Tempest change: Well, i don't really know what to say about this one. I don't see the point in helping against SHs by increasing the damage vs buildings. It helps kill the spine/spore crawlers. The swarm hosts in PvZ are used with a large wall of static defence. | ||
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Wingblade
United States1806 Posts
Widow mine change is good IMO it opens some aggressive option for Terran early against Protoss potentially although Protoss have been working on defending that for a while now. Hydra change feels like maybe too much. | ||
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Pirfiktshon
United States1072 Posts
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PVJ
Hungary5221 Posts
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Melliflue
United Kingdom1389 Posts
On February 11 2014 06:27 Wingblade wrote: I actually think a 9 vision range for the MSC is fine, remember it's an "air unit" that comes out WAY before any other air unit in the game. Giving air unit vision range at 7 minutes is still kinda silly. Except for overlords. They are much slower than a MSC but they are air units that come out way before a MSC and have 11 sight range. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
It doesn't really matter anyway because proxy Tempests is purely a team game trolling build anyway. | ||
Destructicon
4713 Posts
The blink change though is terrible, blink itself is a fine ability and one of the few APM intensive ones that Toss have, blink wars are very fun to see, and I always admire a player with excellent blink stalker micro. This is just bringing a sledgehammer to the equation and nerfing blink all across the board, including in MUs and situations where it doesn't need a nerf, overall terrible change. WM change is interesting, I guess we'll now we might have another style to use against chargelot archon, 4M. I don't think it will actually change much, late game you probably will still want a mass of vikings, ghosts and supporting bio and medivacs, this just seems like a early to mid game thing. Hydralisk buff I guess is decent, I'd have much rather prefered if they reduced their damage point to 0 to make them more microable, but this is still a buff. However late game its still irrelevant, late game Protoss still has storm + colossus to melt the Hydras. Tempest change I don't like at all, but if it goes trough it will for sure accomplish what they want, breaking static defense. I still don't think it will make the game more fun, you'll still have turtling from both sides just that toss can better deal with it now. Edit: One nice change in there, some interesting ones, and a couple of bad ones, Blizz are kind of going in the right direction with the MsC vision nerf, but they still need guidance or they'll nerf what doesn't need nerfing. | ||
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Qwerty85
Croatia5536 Posts
On February 11 2014 06:30 Melliflue wrote: Except for overlords. They are much slower than a MSC but they are air units that come out way before a MSC and have 11 sight range. But overlord is merely a supply/scout unit. It doesn't strengthen zerg early game aggression in any way. You can't compare those two units at all. | ||
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Anacreor
Netherlands291 Posts
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Frex
Finland888 Posts
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tar
Germany991 Posts
The new Blink cd will be super weird to play with and feels like a very very strong nerf considering blink is a rather important ability in PvZ hydra change should be alright. Tempst change is meh. just make them unabductable if you only want to only affect ZvP. aaaand then there is the WM buff. WTF?! Mineral lines on all servers will be cleansed of probes time and again. | ||
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Tomasy
Poland80 Posts
That unit will continue to produce boring games if they wont change drastically way the locusts work. Decrease duration, reduce hp , buff movement speed and maybe dmg a bit. Make it more mobile with hit and run strategy rather then: hit and hit and hit and hit. Also their changes always amuse me. Why on earth do they change smth by 50 or 100% like blink cd? Wouldn't changing it by 2 sec be better rather then doing such huge jump? | ||
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Yorkie
United States12612 Posts
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FrostedMiniWheats
United States30730 Posts
On February 11 2014 06:29 Pirfiktshon wrote: I Honestly Believe that buffing hydras will make ZvP and ZvT with Roach Hydra styles Very Strong to the point where in Conjunction with Vipers and Infestors we will an UBER STrong Push 17 mins that will darn near impossible to stop head on lol but i'm actually ok with that I miss the Days where Zerg just ROFLSTOMPED ME with just Pure Infestor ling into INfestor/ BL Depends how strong the hydralisks become. With what they're proposing (+10% dps) I only see ZvZ being somewhat affected. Muta/ling is still way better against bio ZvT, and a dps buff isn't going to break mech TvZ nor ZvP as hp and attack range are more of an issue vs those compositions. | ||
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TeeTS
Germany2762 Posts
MSC vision: It´s a totally reasonable nerf. The MSC now doesn´t know way in advance, if its little scouting tour becomes dangerous. This is a little buff against blink opener as well, but only a very small one there. Still a good change, since the MSC was not only an incredible strong offensive and defensive unit in the early game, but also a brilliant scouting tool. The latter will become way harder. blink cooldown: If I viewed this isolated on TvP, I would totally approve. Designwise you have 2 options how to deal with those shitty blink allins: Either limit maps to not giving a lot of opportunities for blink-ins or nerf the blink allin into oblivion - what would happen here. Blink "allins" are just simply toxic to the matchup, because they are by no means allin. They combine the kill potential of a fully commited allin with the smooth transition options of a small pressure. This should not be possible, especially if it´s that easy to execute. The other use of blink stalkers in the matchup (blink under Vikings and dropships) would be totally unaffected by this. However: I don´t like this nerf for PvP and PvZ at all, because Blink adds well needed diversity to the protoss strategy pool there. Therefor I disapprove to this change. It can not be the goal to repair one problem by creating two new ones. edit: I´m still for the solution of simply removing the possibility of the blink allin! But it needs to be done in a way, that doesn´t affect PvP and PvZ that much! Widow mine splash: I like the change in general. I would love widow mines to have a real impact on battles in TvP as an answer to zealots, since Hellbats are not allowed to fulfill this task. However Widow mines are not really more accessable than Ghosts in the matchup, since you still want to use your factory to build a reactor for the starport first. A plain splash damage increase to 60 maybe? I don´t think this does enough, since the effect is overlapping with emp. Tempest building attack: No! Just no! The unit is already terrible strong. It does not need a buff, whatever it is, NO! Hydralisk attackspeed buff: See Tempest. Buffing an already strong unit just seems so wrong. I mean giving hydras a little more defensive stats would sound ok for me, to make them a bit stronger, when they´re engaged directly. (+10HP would come to mind as a good solution for that). However, increasing their already strong damage output, when they sit behind a roach/ling wall just is so terrible wrong, I don´t know what they are thinking at blizzard! | ||
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Melliflue
United Kingdom1389 Posts
On February 11 2014 06:31 Qwerty85 wrote: But overlord is merely a supply/scout unit. It doesn't strengthen zerg early game aggression in any way. You can't compare those two units at all. I'm not comparing the units. I was replying to Wingblade's assertion that the MSC "comes out WAY before any other air unit in the game" which is not true. | ||
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sCnInfinity
Germany82 Posts
I'm not comparing the units. I was replying to Wingblade's assertion that the MSC "comes out WAY before any other air unit in the game" which is not true. Still it comes olut before any "useful" Units. Yeah i know that Overlords can scout but Zerg does not have blink  | ||
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playa
United States1284 Posts
On February 11 2014 06:35 Yorkie wrote: Remember everyone, the blink change is simply being tested. They want to have the change in their back pocket in case blink plays are still too strong after the MSC vision nerf (since this change, or at least a very similar one, is probably going to go through). If this blink change tests poorly, then they will scrap it for something new I wish it was the other way around. I couldn't care less about blink cool down timing. If it were 25 second cool down, w/e. But, the vision change is large and actually affects every build/stage in the game. All of that because of stalkers? Jesus, sick trade off. If something could possibly be this strong that it takes 2 blink all-in nerfs, yet the test is just happening, wtf? That's inexcusable. Was David Kim in a coma? Where is the explanation for this? The guy who is always trying to make pointless changes, finally gets around to making a change in a matchup where everyone has greater than 70% win rate simply through deciding to do a blink all-in. Jesus. | ||
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