• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 02:59
CET 08:59
KST 16:59
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10
Community News
Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced15[BSL21] Ro.16 Group Stage (C->B->A->D)4Weekly Cups (Nov 17-23): Solar, MaxPax, Clem win3RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket13
StarCraft 2
General
Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4) BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win SC2 Proleague Discontinued; SKT, KT, SGK, CJ disband
Tourneys
RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14! Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement Mutation # 501 Price of Progress Mutation # 500 Fright night Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation
Brood War
General
Foreign Brood War BW General Discussion MBCGame Torrents [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions Which season is the best in ASL?
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] RO16 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO16 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Current Meta Game Theory for Starcraft How to stay on top of macro? PvZ map balance
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile ZeroSpace Megathread The Perfect Game
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Big Programming Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Where to ask questions and add stream? The Automated Ban List
Blogs
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
Physical Exertion During Gam…
TrAiDoS
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1223 users

Feb 10: Balance Test Map Coming

Forum Index > SC2 General
992 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 48 49 50 Next All
juicyjames *
Profile Joined August 2011
United States3815 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-11 14:41:52
February 10 2014 19:52 GMT
#1
[image loading]
Banner by Existor

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/11674147788
http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/9694049643

Before we begin, I’d like to point out these changes are for a test map. There seems to be some confusion when we’ve tested changes in the past that all the changes we are testing are going to be patched into the game. This is simply not the case. Please keep this in mind as you consider and respond to the change-list.

Mothership Core vision radius decreased from 14 to 9
We currently feel this would be a helpful change, but we’re worried that a vision radius decrease doesn’t really nerf the highest end Protoss players who are positioning the Mothership Core perfectly already. We’ll talk to professional Protoss players about this one once the test map goes live.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game MsC Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Blink cooldown increased from 10 to 15
This is a more direct nerf that affects all Protoss players. If Blink play continues to be problematic, this is the sort of thing we’d want to have tested and prepared to put in the game.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Blink Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Widow Mine splash damage component deals 40 + 40 shield damage
We’ve seen some games against Protoss where Widow Mines are used, and they are very exciting to watch, whether they’re just Widow Mine drops or Widow Mines in combination with the Terran army (while sniping Observers). We feel like both of these strategies could use a bit of help. The Widow Mine potential against Protoss basic units will be unchanged for direct hits, but we’d reduce the number of indirect hits required against units like Stalkers, Zealots, or Sentries. Also, when using Widow Mine drops against Protoss, the chance of splash damage one-shotting Probes will increase slightly.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Widow Mine Change Image] +
[image loading]
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Tempest ground weapon damage increased from 30 to 30+30-to-structures
We still think this is a good change, and we want to see more testing with it. If Tempests gain more ability to wear down Zerg defenses, Zerg players will be less incentivized to play a completely defensive style. Surprisingly, we’ve gotten a lot of feedback that proxy Tempest rushes are too strong right now, and this change would make that strategy even stronger, but we’ve been watching all of the major tournament games, and we still don’t think it’s being used enough (or being used at all). If you can identify some games where the best of the best pro players have successfully used this strategy against a formidable opponent, please let us know. We’d like to check out such games and analyze them.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Tempest Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Hydralisk delay between attacks decreased from .83 to .75
This would increase Hydralisk damage output against all targets by about 10%. Our stance on Hydralisks needing a buff in TvZ and ZvZ hasn’t changed. Additionally, the trend toward Protoss being stronger than Zerg has continued. We need more time and results to draw conclusions on the most-recent balance patch, but we’d like to be prepared to help Zerg here if it’s necessary.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Hydralisk Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Again, none of these are final; we’re just testing these changes. We do this so that potential changes are tested and ready if another balance patch is needed. We do not aim to have every single change we test go into the live game. We'll be releasing a test map later this week, but until then, your feedback here is greatly appreciated.

Thank you.


Poll: Impressions on Mothership Core Vision Decrease?

Approve (1834)
 
84%

Disapprove (263)
 
12%

Neutral (77)
 
4%

2174 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Mothership Core Vision Decrease?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Blink cooldown increase?

Approve (1163)
 
50%

Disapprove (974)
 
42%

Neutral (170)
 
7%

2307 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Blink cooldown increase?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Widow Mine splash increase vs shields?

Approve (1344)
 
66%

Disapprove (513)
 
25%

Neutral (180)
 
9%

2037 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Widow Mine splash increase vs shields?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Tempest ground damage increase vs structures?

Disapprove (880)
 
45%

Approve (669)
 
34%

Neutral (423)
 
21%

1972 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Tempest ground damage increase vs structures?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Hydralisk attack delay decrease?

Approve (1106)
 
53%

Disapprove (700)
 
34%

Neutral (271)
 
13%

2077 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Hydralisk attack delay decrease?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral

Facebook Twitter Reddit
This Week in SC2Find out what happened 'This Week in Starcraft 2': http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=278126
Adreme
Profile Joined June 2011
United States5574 Posts
February 10 2014 19:55 GMT
#2
Wait they are finally going to test the vision change that people have been suggesting for months. I cant believe what I am reading, I mean they are doing it very begrudgingly but they are still doing it.
bobsire
Profile Joined December 2011
Canada296 Posts
February 10 2014 19:55 GMT
#3
i agree with the mother ship core vision
gillon
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden1578 Posts
February 10 2014 19:56 GMT
#4
Sick city.
www.teamproperty.net | "You should hate losing, but you should never fear defeat." - 이윤열
shivver
Profile Joined June 2011
United States232 Posts
February 10 2014 19:56 GMT
#5
blink play is gone from pvp, that will be for sure

I think that widow mine buff is just ridiculous, bump it up slowly not 40 jesus christ man, start at 20 then adjust up or down

[MD]Frostbite
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Canada292 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-10 20:16:30
February 10 2014 19:56 GMT
#6
Edit: First! (SNIPED)

Now I wonder if the widow mine buff towards Protoss might make the 4 marine 1 medivac 2 widow mine attack early game a little to strong

I don't know if the Tempest change is a good one. Time will tell.

Blink cooldown. A little too much? I don't really know maybe the MSC vision nerf fixed it a little?

User was warned for this post


Sorry mods >.<
White-Ra, the godfather Protoss
Penguinator
Profile Joined December 2010
United States837 Posts
February 10 2014 19:57 GMT
#7
YES YES YES YES TO ALL OF THESE CHANGES!!!!!!!
Towelie.635
Nerchio
Profile Joined October 2009
Poland2633 Posts
February 10 2014 19:57 GMT
#8
Glad blizzard is trying a lot of changes but the most important things still remain broken
Progamer"I am the best" - Nerchio , 2017.
sabas123
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands3122 Posts
February 10 2014 19:57 GMT
#9
omfg awesome. finaly something decent!:D
The harder it becomes, the more you should focus on the basics.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-10 19:59:26
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#10
Blink cooldown is too much. Zero reason not to open stargate in PvP with this. And PvT blink openings would die out as well
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Adreme
Profile Joined June 2011
United States5574 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#11
On February 11 2014 04:56 [MD]Frostbite wrote:
Edit: First! (SNIPED)

Now I wonder if the widow mine buff towards Protoss might make the 4 marine 1 medivac 2 widow mine attack early game a little to strong

I don't know if the Tempest change is a good one. Time will tell.

Blink cooldown. A little too much? I don't really know maybe the MSC vision nerf fixed it a little?


I don't think the blink one will go into the game its just a change they are testing to see how it works out.
Aeromi
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
France14461 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#12
Finally !
https://twitter.com/DrAeromi | Updates on live tournaments: @StarCrafteSport
Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12372 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#13
Intuitively it feels like it's a little too much, but I'm willing to try it out and see if I'm wrong. Doubt we'll see many blink all-ins after that, which is a good thing.
No will to live, no wish to die
ReMinD_
Profile Joined May 2013
Croatia846 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#14
On February 11 2014 04:55 Adreme wrote:
Wait they are finally going to test the vision change that people have been suggesting for months. I cant believe what I am reading, I mean they are doing it very begrudgingly but they are still doing it.


When I played WoW, this was exactly how Blizzard was doing things. 6-12 months to fix glaring issues.
Parting: Well, even I can make better maps than these.
GreenMash
Profile Joined August 2012
Norway1746 Posts
February 10 2014 19:59 GMT
#15
good changes but NERF SWARM HOSTS
I love hellbats
FrostedMiniWheats
Profile Joined August 2010
United States30730 Posts
February 10 2014 19:59 GMT
#16
haha, I was just thinking after Reality vs Soulkey: "Emergency patch round 2! David Kim" and here it is...

Actually, these mostly look good all around unlike the last one. The latter two (tempest and hydralisks) I'm still unsure of though.

Again, I have to wonder especially now since they seem to be going the dps route of buffing the hydra...why not give it a bonus solely towards bio units. That pretty much only affects bio ZvT and ZvZ which is apparently their intent. They're already used against mech and in ZvP to decent effect, where hp is really more the issue in those scenarios.
NesTea | Mvp | MC | Leenock | Losira | Gumiho | DRG | Taeja | Jinro | Stephano | Thorzain | Sen | Idra |Polt | Bomber | Symbol | Squirtle | Fantasy | Jaedong | Maru | sOs | Seed | ByuN | ByuL | Neeb| Scarlett | Rogue | IM forever
Thor.Rush
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden702 Posts
February 10 2014 20:00 GMT
#17
Oh my god, yes. I might just have to install SC2 again if this happens.
| SaSe | Naniwa |Stephano | LucifroN | Mvp | MarineKing | ByuN | Polt | MC | Parting |
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
February 10 2014 20:00 GMT
#18
Wow, sensible changes for once?!
juicyjames *
Profile Joined August 2011
United States3815 Posts
February 10 2014 20:00 GMT
#19
Thanks mod for changing the date in the title from being numerically American to being more universal. I actually realized that error once I posted.
This Week in SC2Find out what happened 'This Week in Starcraft 2': http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=278126
Storm-Giant
Profile Joined March 2012
Spain416 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-10 20:03:10
February 10 2014 20:01 GMT
#20
Finally a MCore vision reduction. Maybe it would be better to try with 11 like many air units, but whatever.

Bye Blink micro & blink based builds? Not really sure about this change...

WM drops against toss is going to be very annoying (again). Not sure if good or bad though, we'll see.

Tempest change still looks as stupid as it was when first announced. Please, make some Swarm Host changes that favours active players and punish pasive turtle players (a window of time without locust would be a good start, although I'd go further)

Hydras getting a buff. We have to see how it goes, I hope it doesn't destroy VR builds in ZvP.
<3 Rain
1 2 3 4 5 48 49 50 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 1m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SortOf 144
ProTech91
StarCraft: Brood War
Larva 541
Stork 427
Leta 337
Killer 226
PianO 194
910 193
EffOrt 98
Zeus 82
Rush 54
Light 37
[ Show more ]
ZergMaN 36
soO 33
NotJumperer 32
sorry 29
Noble 10
Hm[arnc] 8
Sacsri 4
Dota 2
singsing2558
NeuroSwarm89
League of Legends
JimRising 573
Super Smash Bros
C9.Mang0497
hungrybox398
Mew2King79
Other Games
summit1g10330
WinterStarcraft542
trigger9
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1010
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 64
lovetv 10
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH203
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1250
• HappyZerGling129
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
2h 1m
WardiTV 2025
4h 1m
SC Evo League
4h 31m
IPSL
9h 1m
Dewalt vs ZZZero
BSL 21
12h 1m
Sziky vs OyAji
Gypsy vs eOnzErG
OSC
14h 1m
Solar vs Creator
ByuN vs Gerald
Percival vs Babymarine
Moja vs Krystianer
EnDerr vs ForJumy
sebesdes vs Nicoract
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 2h
WardiTV 2025
1d 4h
OSC
1d 7h
IPSL
1d 9h
Bonyth vs KameZerg
[ Show More ]
BSL 21
1d 12h
Bonyth vs StRyKeR
Tarson vs Dandy
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
StarCraft2.fi
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
WardiTV 2025
3 days
StarCraft2.fi
3 days
PiGosaur Monday
3 days
StarCraft2.fi
4 days
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
WardiTV 2025
5 days
StarCraft2.fi
5 days
WardiTV 2025
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-30
RSL Revival: Season 3
Light HT

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
Slon Tour Season 2
Acropolis #4 - TS3
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
RSL Offline Finals
Kuram Kup
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.