• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 09:35
CET 15:35
KST 23:35
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT22Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book16Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8
Community News
Weekly Cups (Feb 9-15): herO doubles up2ACS replaced by "ASL Season Open" - Starts 21/0225LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals (Feb 10-16)46Weekly Cups (Feb 2-8): Classic, Solar, MaxPax win2Nexon's StarCraft game could be FPS, led by UMS maker16
StarCraft 2
General
How do you think the 5.0.15 balance patch (Oct 2025) for StarCraft II has affected the game? ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT Nexon's StarCraft game could be FPS, led by UMS maker Weekly Cups (Feb 9-15): herO doubles up SpeCial on The Tasteless Podcast
Tourneys
PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals (Feb 10-16) Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) WardiTV Team League Season 10
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ? [A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 513 Attrition Warfare The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 512 Overclocked Mutation # 511 Temple of Rebirth
Brood War
General
ACS replaced by "ASL Season Open" - Starts 21/02 Ladder maps - how we can make blizz update them? Liquipedia.net NEEDS editors for Brood War Gypsy to Korea TvZ is the most complete match up
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 1 Small VOD Thread 2.0 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates Zealot bombing is no longer popular? Current Meta
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Path of Exile Diablo 2 thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Ask and answer stupid questions here! Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TL MMA Pick'em Pool 2013
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Inside the Communication of …
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2363 users

Feb 10: Balance Test Map Coming

Forum Index > SC2 General
992 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 48 49 50 Next All
juicyjames *
Profile Joined August 2011
United States3815 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-11 14:41:52
February 10 2014 19:52 GMT
#1
[image loading]
Banner by Existor

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/11674147788
http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/9694049643

Before we begin, I’d like to point out these changes are for a test map. There seems to be some confusion when we’ve tested changes in the past that all the changes we are testing are going to be patched into the game. This is simply not the case. Please keep this in mind as you consider and respond to the change-list.

Mothership Core vision radius decreased from 14 to 9
We currently feel this would be a helpful change, but we’re worried that a vision radius decrease doesn’t really nerf the highest end Protoss players who are positioning the Mothership Core perfectly already. We’ll talk to professional Protoss players about this one once the test map goes live.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game MsC Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Blink cooldown increased from 10 to 15
This is a more direct nerf that affects all Protoss players. If Blink play continues to be problematic, this is the sort of thing we’d want to have tested and prepared to put in the game.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Blink Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Widow Mine splash damage component deals 40 + 40 shield damage
We’ve seen some games against Protoss where Widow Mines are used, and they are very exciting to watch, whether they’re just Widow Mine drops or Widow Mines in combination with the Terran army (while sniping Observers). We feel like both of these strategies could use a bit of help. The Widow Mine potential against Protoss basic units will be unchanged for direct hits, but we’d reduce the number of indirect hits required against units like Stalkers, Zealots, or Sentries. Also, when using Widow Mine drops against Protoss, the chance of splash damage one-shotting Probes will increase slightly.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Widow Mine Change Image] +
[image loading]
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Tempest ground weapon damage increased from 30 to 30+30-to-structures
We still think this is a good change, and we want to see more testing with it. If Tempests gain more ability to wear down Zerg defenses, Zerg players will be less incentivized to play a completely defensive style. Surprisingly, we’ve gotten a lot of feedback that proxy Tempest rushes are too strong right now, and this change would make that strategy even stronger, but we’ve been watching all of the major tournament games, and we still don’t think it’s being used enough (or being used at all). If you can identify some games where the best of the best pro players have successfully used this strategy against a formidable opponent, please let us know. We’d like to check out such games and analyze them.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Tempest Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Hydralisk delay between attacks decreased from .83 to .75
This would increase Hydralisk damage output against all targets by about 10%. Our stance on Hydralisks needing a buff in TvZ and ZvZ hasn’t changed. Additionally, the trend toward Protoss being stronger than Zerg has continued. We need more time and results to draw conclusions on the most-recent balance patch, but we’d like to be prepared to help Zerg here if it’s necessary.

+ Show Spoiler [In-Game Hydralisk Change Image] +
[image loading]

Source: http://redd.it/1xlle2


Again, none of these are final; we’re just testing these changes. We do this so that potential changes are tested and ready if another balance patch is needed. We do not aim to have every single change we test go into the live game. We'll be releasing a test map later this week, but until then, your feedback here is greatly appreciated.

Thank you.


Poll: Impressions on Mothership Core Vision Decrease?

Approve (1834)
 
84%

Disapprove (263)
 
12%

Neutral (77)
 
4%

2174 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Mothership Core Vision Decrease?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Blink cooldown increase?

Approve (1163)
 
50%

Disapprove (974)
 
42%

Neutral (170)
 
7%

2307 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Blink cooldown increase?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Widow Mine splash increase vs shields?

Approve (1344)
 
66%

Disapprove (513)
 
25%

Neutral (180)
 
9%

2037 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Widow Mine splash increase vs shields?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Tempest ground damage increase vs structures?

Disapprove (880)
 
45%

Approve (669)
 
34%

Neutral (423)
 
21%

1972 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Tempest ground damage increase vs structures?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral


Poll: Impressions on Hydralisk attack delay decrease?

Approve (1106)
 
53%

Disapprove (700)
 
34%

Neutral (271)
 
13%

2077 total votes

Your vote: Impressions on Hydralisk attack delay decrease?

(Vote): Approve
(Vote): Disapprove
(Vote): Neutral

Facebook Twitter Reddit
This Week in SC2Find out what happened 'This Week in Starcraft 2': http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=278126
Adreme
Profile Joined June 2011
United States5574 Posts
February 10 2014 19:55 GMT
#2
Wait they are finally going to test the vision change that people have been suggesting for months. I cant believe what I am reading, I mean they are doing it very begrudgingly but they are still doing it.
bobsire
Profile Joined December 2011
Canada296 Posts
February 10 2014 19:55 GMT
#3
i agree with the mother ship core vision
gillon
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden1578 Posts
February 10 2014 19:56 GMT
#4
Sick city.
www.teamproperty.net | "You should hate losing, but you should never fear defeat." - 이윤열
shivver
Profile Joined June 2011
United States232 Posts
February 10 2014 19:56 GMT
#5
blink play is gone from pvp, that will be for sure

I think that widow mine buff is just ridiculous, bump it up slowly not 40 jesus christ man, start at 20 then adjust up or down

[MD]Frostbite
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Canada292 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-10 20:16:30
February 10 2014 19:56 GMT
#6
Edit: First! (SNIPED)

Now I wonder if the widow mine buff towards Protoss might make the 4 marine 1 medivac 2 widow mine attack early game a little to strong

I don't know if the Tempest change is a good one. Time will tell.

Blink cooldown. A little too much? I don't really know maybe the MSC vision nerf fixed it a little?

User was warned for this post


Sorry mods >.<
White-Ra, the godfather Protoss
Penguinator
Profile Joined December 2010
United States837 Posts
February 10 2014 19:57 GMT
#7
YES YES YES YES TO ALL OF THESE CHANGES!!!!!!!
Towelie.635
Nerchio
Profile Joined October 2009
Poland2633 Posts
February 10 2014 19:57 GMT
#8
Glad blizzard is trying a lot of changes but the most important things still remain broken
Progamer"I am the best" - Nerchio , 2017.
sabas123
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands3122 Posts
February 10 2014 19:57 GMT
#9
omfg awesome. finaly something decent!:D
The harder it becomes, the more you should focus on the basics.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-10 19:59:26
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#10
Blink cooldown is too much. Zero reason not to open stargate in PvP with this. And PvT blink openings would die out as well
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Adreme
Profile Joined June 2011
United States5574 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#11
On February 11 2014 04:56 [MD]Frostbite wrote:
Edit: First! (SNIPED)

Now I wonder if the widow mine buff towards Protoss might make the 4 marine 1 medivac 2 widow mine attack early game a little to strong

I don't know if the Tempest change is a good one. Time will tell.

Blink cooldown. A little too much? I don't really know maybe the MSC vision nerf fixed it a little?


I don't think the blink one will go into the game its just a change they are testing to see how it works out.
Aeromi
Profile Blog Joined August 2012
France14461 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#12
Finally !
https://twitter.com/DrAeromi | Updates on live tournaments: @StarCrafteSport
Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12389 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#13
Intuitively it feels like it's a little too much, but I'm willing to try it out and see if I'm wrong. Doubt we'll see many blink all-ins after that, which is a good thing.
No will to live, no wish to die
ReMinD_
Profile Joined May 2013
Croatia846 Posts
February 10 2014 19:58 GMT
#14
On February 11 2014 04:55 Adreme wrote:
Wait they are finally going to test the vision change that people have been suggesting for months. I cant believe what I am reading, I mean they are doing it very begrudgingly but they are still doing it.


When I played WoW, this was exactly how Blizzard was doing things. 6-12 months to fix glaring issues.
Parting: Well, even I can make better maps than these.
GreenMash
Profile Joined August 2012
Norway1746 Posts
February 10 2014 19:59 GMT
#15
good changes but NERF SWARM HOSTS
I love hellbats
FrostedMiniWheats
Profile Joined August 2010
United States30730 Posts
February 10 2014 19:59 GMT
#16
haha, I was just thinking after Reality vs Soulkey: "Emergency patch round 2! David Kim" and here it is...

Actually, these mostly look good all around unlike the last one. The latter two (tempest and hydralisks) I'm still unsure of though.

Again, I have to wonder especially now since they seem to be going the dps route of buffing the hydra...why not give it a bonus solely towards bio units. That pretty much only affects bio ZvT and ZvZ which is apparently their intent. They're already used against mech and in ZvP to decent effect, where hp is really more the issue in those scenarios.
NesTea | Mvp | MC | Leenock | Losira | Gumiho | DRG | Taeja | Jinro | Stephano | Thorzain | Sen | Idra |Polt | Bomber | Symbol | Squirtle | Fantasy | Jaedong | Maru | sOs | Seed | ByuN | ByuL | Neeb| Scarlett | Rogue | IM forever
Thor.Rush
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden702 Posts
February 10 2014 20:00 GMT
#17
Oh my god, yes. I might just have to install SC2 again if this happens.
| SaSe | Naniwa |Stephano | LucifroN | Mvp | MarineKing | ByuN | Polt | MC | Parting |
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
February 10 2014 20:00 GMT
#18
Wow, sensible changes for once?!
juicyjames *
Profile Joined August 2011
United States3815 Posts
February 10 2014 20:00 GMT
#19
Thanks mod for changing the date in the title from being numerically American to being more universal. I actually realized that error once I posted.
This Week in SC2Find out what happened 'This Week in Starcraft 2': http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=278126
Storm-Giant
Profile Joined March 2012
Spain416 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-10 20:03:10
February 10 2014 20:01 GMT
#20
Finally a MCore vision reduction. Maybe it would be better to try with 11 like many air units, but whatever.

Bye Blink micro & blink based builds? Not really sure about this change...

WM drops against toss is going to be very annoying (again). Not sure if good or bad though, we'll see.

Tempest change still looks as stupid as it was when first announced. Please, make some Swarm Host changes that favours active players and punish pasive turtle players (a window of time without locust would be a good start, although I'd go further)

Hydras getting a buff. We have to see how it goes, I hope it doesn't destroy VR builds in ZvP.
<3 Rain
1 2 3 4 5 48 49 50 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
12:00
King of the Hill #238
iHatsuTV 19
Liquipedia
WardiTV Winter Champion…
12:00
Group B
WardiTV614
IndyStarCraft 294
3DClanTV 63
Liquipedia
PiG Sty Festival
09:00
Group A
Maru vs Bunny
Classic vs SHIN
PiGStarcraft1011
TKL 249
Rex198
IntoTheiNu 29
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft1011
IndyStarCraft 294
TKL 249
Rex 198
Reynor 163
ProTech135
Vindicta 28
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 40089
Horang2 7206
Hyuk 1852
GuemChi 1602
Sea 1185
firebathero 838
ZerO 590
EffOrt 573
Shuttle 528
Larva 481
[ Show more ]
Stork 447
BeSt 371
Mini 258
Snow 255
Rush 179
ggaemo 158
Mong 140
hero 129
Hyun 111
Soulkey 85
Sea.KH 81
Pusan 74
Barracks 67
ToSsGirL 46
JYJ 42
sSak 41
Hm[arnc] 38
Mind 38
Free 26
JulyZerg 25
Movie 22
scan(afreeca) 21
Terrorterran 20
Bale 18
910 18
sorry 17
GoRush 17
Yoon 15
ZergMaN 13
Rock 9
Dota 2
Gorgc4834
Dendi601
XcaliburYe80
Counter-Strike
markeloff121
edward100
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor152
Other Games
singsing2883
B2W.Neo562
DeMusliM343
Lowko298
crisheroes282
XaKoH 160
Sick157
Hui .138
QueenE125
Mew2King61
KnowMe31
Trikslyr31
ZerO(Twitch)7
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis5516
• Jankos2510
• TFBlade786
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
9h 25m
PiG Sty Festival
18h 25m
Clem vs Percival
Zoun vs Solar
Escore
19h 25m
Epic.LAN
21h 25m
Replay Cast
1d 9h
PiG Sty Festival
1d 18h
herO vs NightMare
Reynor vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
1d 19h
Epic.LAN
1d 21h
Replay Cast
2 days
PiG Sty Festival
2 days
Serral vs YoungYakov
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Winter Champion…
4 days
WardiTV Winter Champion…
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-02-18
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
WardiTV Winter 2026
PiG Sty Festival 7.0
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: King of Kings
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 1st Round
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 1st Round Qualifier
Acropolis #4 - TS5
Jeongseon Sooper Cup
Spring Cup 2026: China & Korea Invitational
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 2nd Round
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
FISSURE Playground #3
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.