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On February 06 2014 20:18 DnCL wrote:
This makes me wonder, how is it done for live poker ? Crowds have screens and see the TV feed, right ? To they simply count on the crowd being quiet ?
The audience don't have a live feed, all streams and TV are delayed by a minimum 15 mins, usually an hour (for eveyone, not just the live audience). The audience are as much in the dark as the other players, more so even, since they don't know anyone's hole cards.
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so  HerO didn't hear the crowd both GSL days (ro64 & ro32)....at least thats what he said to Stork at the ro64
this seems so unlikely because everyone else does...
this feels so wrong
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On February 06 2014 20:18 Facultyadjutant wrote:Show nested quote +On February 06 2014 17:49 SC2Toastie wrote:On February 06 2014 17:12 AnonymousSC2 wrote:On February 06 2014 16:57 legatus legionis wrote:
I think the threat of early game aggression and special attacks based on tech rushes are a really important part of the game.
They rely on being hidden to some degree and players can usually scout to cross certain ones off their list.
With a sound issue like this it seems to push players to not doing those strategies since they are extra risky as your opponent has an easier time figuring out if it is happening or not.
That is kind of a shame.
Also for me it is a bit weird to see these players side with sportsmanship over winning. If you can hear the crowd shouldn't you be almost obvious about this and use it to your advantage? I guess this is just a different culture thing or they are trying to protect the company and maybe even their own careers seeing how GOM has handled some of the sportsmanship issues in the past. I really don't like that. You don't like sportsmanship? It should be the first priority in a professional environment. You can't compromise morality to get ahead. That would show a lot about your character. Bottom line is they need to fix this issue. Like others, I'm surprised this issue hasn't come up and been resolved a long time ago. You(Legatius) kind of underestimate the respect profesional athletes/players have for one another. Look, EU Football/Soccer/whatever is a joke in which people screw eac other up as much as possible, but in most sports (and even in soccer/EU Football, sorry for the example) a lot of players REALLY care about each other, will step up for each other, and won't cheat to win. There's always a few rotten apples, but in general, these people show respect. Respect and a good reputation is worth a lot more than a bag of cash and a shade over your person for the rest of your life. Don't generalize, starcraft have their share of unsportmanship from big things like Savior to small things like Xlord. All sports have their bad sportpersonas and good sportpersonas
I specifically wrote there's always a few rotten apples.......!? Your comment confuses me.
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The crowd thing is hard because nothing is going to cancel our that noise or vibration. Players talk about there screen shacking during big plays and no booth is going to fix that. Headphones will help, but like in baseball, I think the crowd is part of the field.
Also, the studio could go the golf route and request that people keep their voices down during proxy plays. I think of the casters hyped the part about not giving the strat away, the crowd could get really into it.
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France9034 Posts
On February 07 2014 00:45 Plansix wrote:
The crowd thing is hard because nothing is going to cancel our that noise or vibration. Players talk about there screen shacking during big plays and no booth is going to fix that. Headphones will help, but like in baseball, I think the crowd is part of the field.
Also, the studio could go the golf route and request that people keep their voices down during proxy plays. I think of the casters hyped the part about not giving the strat away, the crowd could get really into it.
I remember such cases, but it was in really small tournaments, like "Oh hey, noticed that people? It's going to be X, but don't cheer too loud so they don't know !"
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It is a simpler solution than making sound proof booths. At some point the players are going to be infront of crowds so large that no booth will be able to handle the noise. The best route is to have the casters and studio try to build up the tension and request the crowd respect the players and keep their cheering until after the proxy strat has resolved. I think it would be fun for the crowd, since it would be like they are in on the strat and are "helping" keep the players in the dark for eachothers moves.
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On February 07 2014 01:00 Plansix wrote:
It is a simpler solution than making sound proof booths. At some point the players are going to be infront of crowds so large that no booth will be able to handle the noise. The best route is to have the casters and studio try to build up the tension and request the crowd respect the players and keep their cheering until after the proxy strat has resolved. I think it would be fun for the crowd, since it would be like they are in on the strat and are "helping" keep the players in the dark for eachothers moves.
Even booths may not be able to handle the noise after a certain point, granted, but a combo of solid headset over earphones has proven quite effective and doesn't rely on the human element at all. ^^;
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The best way to handle it is to tell the crowd to go back at home to watch the stream.
In fact, some players are uncomfortable playing while thousand of people are looking at the stream.
In order to let them play their best, for esport's sake, close your stream !
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OGN booths are the best I think
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On February 06 2014 13:31 Caihead wrote:Show nested quote +On February 06 2014 13:24 bokchoi wrote:On February 06 2014 13:16 Lucid_Interval wrote:
I've noticed that the hand warmers have made a reappearance at GSL as well. It was always strange to me that they could pay Korean pro gamers salaries and winnings but can't give them a warm place to play... Looks like soundproofing isn't much of a priority either... Unfortunate. its cold in korea + harm warmers are used to warm up regardless of temperature. if they had heating for the winter tournaments and ac for the summer tournaments gom would probably go broke off those bills alone If you can't pay for AC / Heating for a live venue.... I don't know what to say about this, that's ridiculous.
AC/Heating in a large open area where there's bound to be numerous places heat will escape (open doors, windows etc.) costs a fortune.
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The crowd will follow the caster's lead for the most part, and the Korean casters start screaming when a cheese in in progress. I think if the started whispering it would work.
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On February 07 2014 02:14 Taters_ wrote:Show nested quote +On February 06 2014 13:31 Caihead wrote:On February 06 2014 13:24 bokchoi wrote:On February 06 2014 13:16 Lucid_Interval wrote:
I've noticed that the hand warmers have made a reappearance at GSL as well. It was always strange to me that they could pay Korean pro gamers salaries and winnings but can't give them a warm place to play... Looks like soundproofing isn't much of a priority either... Unfortunate. its cold in korea + harm warmers are used to warm up regardless of temperature. if they had heating for the winter tournaments and ac for the summer tournaments gom would probably go broke off those bills alone If you can't pay for AC / Heating for a live venue.... I don't know what to say about this, that's ridiculous. AC/Heating in a large open area where there's bound to be numerous places heat will escape (open doors, windows etc.) costs a fortune.
You realize that nearly every technology related business in the developed world offers this in their venues and offices right? Yes it costs alot but that's to be expected when people need their hands to be adequately warmed to work on their computers, let alone play a super micro intensive match. If you can't expect that from the most premier SC2 venue in S.Korea I don't know what to tell you.
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Here's what needs to happen:
- Orient sound system so audio coverage is adequate in the audience area, but minimal on stage. Use a distributed sound system, with ceiling mounted speakers if possible
- Lower overall volume of casters
- Use high Sound Transmission Class rated construction and materials for booths (double paned glass, sealed doorway, etc).
- Introduce sound masking white/pink noise inside the booth via speakers
-Use sound isolation head set/ear muffs (like used for firearms, around loud mechanical equipment, etc) on top of ear buds.
The sound booth is the least important part of the equation, and to make a booth that actually was somewhat good at isolating exterior sound would require a lot of money and effort.
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On February 06 2014 12:38 AnonymousSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 06 2014 12:28 forsooth wrote:On February 06 2014 12:20 Adebisi wrote:
Just about everywhere else couples helicopter headsets with the booths, not sure why Gom chooses not to... Those things are so goddamn uncomfortable. who cares? this ruins the tournament
Whoa. Holy shit. Who cares about players being uncomfortable - it ruins the tournament.
First off, it didn't ruin anything, all it really did was make Rain feel kinda weird at one point and raise a topic for discussion, which is a good thing. Probably needs to be fixed but not at an expense of players like u suggest. Things that ruin a tournament would be more severe like I dont know, IPL going bankrupt after qualifying their players for their tournament. Unwatchable streams in some leagues. 20% uptime etc.. No sound in games.
Apart from that. Who cares about players being uncomfortable? Gee I don't know. People with ANY sense of compassion? Non-psychopaths? People thinking that all those tournaments and players aren't doing it ONLY for AnonymousSC2's god damn entertainment? World doesn't revolve around you.
While you're at it, let's put players on kidney dialysis so they don't have to go for toilet breaks which ruin the tournament. Who cares right? Let's put them in isolated cages miles from civilization to make SURE they don't get a slightest hint from the crowd's reactions. Uncomfortable? who cares. at least the tournaments are pure.
Grow some heart. Players' comfort is just as important as viewer's. Hell, without player's comfort there won't be good games for the viewers. It's not ALL made just for you, AnonymousSC2. This ain't your f****ng circus and the players ain't your f****ng monkeys.
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On February 07 2014 03:14 Caihead wrote:Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 02:14 Taters_ wrote:On February 06 2014 13:31 Caihead wrote:On February 06 2014 13:24 bokchoi wrote:On February 06 2014 13:16 Lucid_Interval wrote:
I've noticed that the hand warmers have made a reappearance at GSL as well. It was always strange to me that they could pay Korean pro gamers salaries and winnings but can't give them a warm place to play... Looks like soundproofing isn't much of a priority either... Unfortunate. its cold in korea + harm warmers are used to warm up regardless of temperature. if they had heating for the winter tournaments and ac for the summer tournaments gom would probably go broke off those bills alone If you can't pay for AC / Heating for a live venue.... I don't know what to say about this, that's ridiculous. AC/Heating in a large open area where there's bound to be numerous places heat will escape (open doors, windows etc.) costs a fortune. You realize that nearly every technology related business in the developed world offers this in their venues and offices right? Yes it costs alot but that's to be expected when people need their hands to be adequately warmed to work on their computers, let alone play a super micro intensive match. If you can't expect that from the most premier SC2 venue in S.Korea I don't know what to tell you.
Or players can use had warmers. My fiancé plays in a band they have to play in whatever conditions are at the venue and most of them are chilly. And playing guitar on stage with cold hands sucks. As long as the venue is a reasonable, livable tempture, the players can suck it up and find ways to keep their hands warm.
Edit: to the post above: players can suck it up and wear headphones. They are not being asked to play the game over hot coals.
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On February 07 2014 03:42 Plansix wrote:
Edit: to the post above: players can suck it up and wear headphones. They are not being asked to play the game over hot coals.
You missed the point. I talked baout the idea of not caring about player's comfort, not about the headphones. Yes, those examples I used were sarcastic, glad you made up your own ones too. My point was about the big difference in saying :
"Who cares [about player's comfort]?"
and saying
"I think proper headphones are crucial. The players should be able to handle that since they call themselves professionals."
Also your statement (about sucking up etc.) was perfectly fine. Second statement and your statement both say it's probably uncomfortable thing for them but necessary. First statement (the one I criticised) says 'who gives a f*** about players'.
I'm just allergic to pure self-admitted ignorance. And nothing screams ignorance more than starting your sentence with "who cares about ...".
About keeping your hands warm... I think Gumiho is miles ahead of everyone :D towel>any hand warmers
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On February 07 2014 03:31 Stye wrote:Show nested quote +On February 06 2014 12:38 AnonymousSC2 wrote:On February 06 2014 12:28 forsooth wrote:On February 06 2014 12:20 Adebisi wrote:
Just about everywhere else couples helicopter headsets with the booths, not sure why Gom chooses not to... Those things are so goddamn uncomfortable. who cares? this ruins the tournament Whoa. Holy shit. Who cares about players being uncomfortable - it ruins the tournament. First off, it didn't ruin anything, all it really did was make Rain feel kinda weird at one point and raise a topic for discussion, which is a good thing. Probably needs to be fixed but not at an expense of players like u suggest. Things that ruin a tournament would be more severe like I dont know, IPL going bankrupt after qualifying their players for their tournament. Unwatchable streams in some leagues. 20% uptime etc.. No sound in games. Apart from that. Who cares about players being uncomfortable? Gee I don't know. People with ANY sense of compassion? Non-psychopaths? People thinking that all those tournaments and players aren't doing it ONLY for AnonymousSC2's god damn entertainment? World doesn't revolve around you. While you're at it, let's put players on kidney dialysis so they don't have to go for toilet breaks which ruin the tournament. Who cares right? Let's put them in isolated cages miles from civilization to make SURE they don't get a slightest hint from the crowd's reactions. Uncomfortable? who cares. at least the tournaments are pure. Grow some heart. Players' comfort is just as important as viewer's. Hell, without player's comfort there won't be good games for the viewers. It's not ALL made just for you, AnonymousSC2. This ain't your f****ng circus and the players ain't your f****ng monkeys.
Are you okay?
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We should build the next GOM studio as an add on to the IST, That way players can be suspended in space where there is no air to vibrate and produce sound! Problem solved, ill take my check in the mail whenever you are ready GOM!
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On January 28 2014 21:16 ChoiSulli wrote:
Hey now that ESF is dead Kespa can go back to boycotting GOM eventually, I think commander Stork just planting the first seed.
I said this back when Stork first made the complaint, I was called crazy then probably will still be called crazy now but the plot thickens.
+ Show Spoiler +yes im trolling, but since people make KESPA out to be some kind of evil organization then isnt this exactly something they would do
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EPT
