|
On December 20 2013 22:11 kinsky wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2013 18:58 KOtical wrote:
nice blizzard really nice idea with the 2 weeks inatcivity thing... so heres my problem. my pc is broken, and i have to wait around 6 to 8 weeks for my new parts... so i guess i can find myself in silver next season... ty blizzard for forcing people to play! that seems really a good idea expecially for non pro gamers... *ironie off* Why would you have to wait that long for pc parts?
I went through the same situation. My laptop broke and I decided to build my own PC, which took me a couple of months to get all of the parts/ put it together. The reason being for the time frame, money.
|
I'm starting to play again (took a few weeks off) and I'm going to just play unranked until this is resolved. Leagues were kind of meaningless to start with, now they mean absolutely nothing due to there being no consistency in matchmaking anymore. I have a busy schedule for university, so having to fight MMR decay just to play decent opponents in ranked is unrealistic for me at this point.
|
On January 08 2014 23:08 Ben... wrote:
I'm starting to play again (took a few weeks off) and I'm going to just play unranked until this is resolved. Leagues were kind of meaningless to start with, now they mean absolutely nothing due to there being no consistency in matchmaking anymore. I have a busy schedule for university, so having to fight MMR decay just to play decent opponents in ranked is unrealistic for me at this point.
I believe decay functions the same in unranked.
|
On January 08 2014 22:59 tili wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2014 21:36 Qwerty85 wrote:
At its maximum value, the adjustment is small; it’s the equivalent of losing a few games.
Yesterday I played a zerg player who was in master league for 12 seasons and finished last season of 2013 as a top 16 diamond player. And I am currently on gold/plat level. I played a lot of games and worked my way up to rank 1, then I met this guy and even though he is miles better than me I was losing 15-16 points every time I got matched against him. I started WoL from bronze and worked my way to high diamond/low master. I know how playing genuine gold player looks like. The system obviously thought he is worse than me (his MMR is probably lower) even though in reality it was a one sided stomp. And I got unlucky and played him 3x in a row, losing around 50 points in total.. All my effort from previous games washed away.
So how is 12 season master vs. borderline gold/plat an equivalent of losing a few games? Who are they kidding? That guy down ranked himself or was playing with his unranked mmr. There is no evidence that mmr decay would ever send a player from top diamond to gold in one season.
He maybe down ranked himself (he didn't play unranked since he gained points), but I heard about many golds who play diamonds and platinums who play master league players. As I said, I was away for more than a year and my skill dropped about 2 leagues in that whole period - from high dia to high gold at the moment. So even skipping an entire season which is 3 months of inactivity at best can't really reduce your skill so much that you play people so much higher on the ladder than yourself.
So even if my example is a bit drastic, the decay is certainly not the equivalent of losing a few games as Blizzard says. The decay is strong enough to usually result in demotion at the start of the new season. You don't get demoted for losing a few games.
|
On January 08 2014 23:16 JacobShock wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2014 23:08 Ben... wrote:
I'm starting to play again (took a few weeks off) and I'm going to just play unranked until this is resolved. Leagues were kind of meaningless to start with, now they mean absolutely nothing due to there being no consistency in matchmaking anymore. I have a busy schedule for university, so having to fight MMR decay just to play decent opponents in ranked is unrealistic for me at this point. I believe decay functions the same in unranked. I'm aware of that possibility. If I played ranked how it is now, by the time I hit February break I will be in silver league or something, so for me there is no point even doing ranked play. I know once assignments kick in I am not going to be able to play more than one session every couple or three weeks. My league already decayed from Master to Diamond to Gold over the last two seasons. With unranked, I can just play when I have time and not have to worry about league at all, decay be damned.
|
What I dont understand is why you have to be punished so hard for being beaten by a player in a higher league. As top platinum ive played masters players and when I win its + the normal points but when they beat me I get -14-16 points... Why the hell is that happening. He is 2 leagues above me ffs. When I lose to another top platinum I can lose less points than against a masters. So weird
|
Plz fix unranked games. Unrank shouldn't have his own MMR but it has to be the same than the ranked one, expect losing or winning unranked game doesn't change it. People use to free lose on unrank because they don't want to play some MU. Could be better too if you can choose your MU you want to play.
At this moment as rank vs unranked exist bronze meet diamand/master and it's very frustrating for both.
A button with " i off race " could be cool too, which permit players to play at a lower MMR to discover a new race, and warn the other that his opponent is not a real dimand/master. Could be less frustrating.
|
On January 08 2014 23:43 Tyrhanius wrote:
Plz fix unranked games. Unrank shouldn't have his own MMR but it has to be the same than the ranked one, expect losing or winning unranked game doesn't change it. People use to free lose on unrank because they don't want to play some MU. Could be better too if you can choose your MU you want to play.
At this moment as rank vs unranked exist bronze meet diamand/master and it's very frustrating for both.
A button with " i off race " could be cool too, which permit players to play at a lower MMR to discover a new race, and warn the other that his opponent is not a real dimand/master. Could be less frustrating.
That button would be too easy to abuse.
|
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay.
|
On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay.
I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d
I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again.
|
On January 08 2014 23:58 HaRuHi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay. I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again.
If you had a long break your MMR would reset anyway even in WoL so you would basically start over after 5 placement games. So the decay feature was not really needed at all.
|
On January 09 2014 00:25 Qwerty85 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2014 23:58 HaRuHi wrote:On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay. I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again. If you had a long break your MMR would reset anyway even in WoL so you would basically start over after 5 placement games. So the decay feature was not really needed at all.
Agreed. I suspect this has happened to a number of people who went from 'masters/diamond to silver'
|
On January 09 2014 01:06 tili wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 00:25 Qwerty85 wrote:On January 08 2014 23:58 HaRuHi wrote:On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay. I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again. If you had a long break your MMR would reset anyway even in WoL so you would basically start over after 5 placement games. So the decay feature was not really needed at all. Agreed. I suspect this has happened to a number of people who went from 'masters/diamond to silver'
even so, there's something fishy about how long it is taking for people to return back to a higher rank.
In WoL it wouldn't give you 27 gold players in a row. After a bunch of consecutive wins it tries to challenge you and find an even footing. something else is effecting this, and I find it hard to believe that MMR decay is the primary cause.
|
On January 09 2014 01:10 Oboeman wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 01:06 tili wrote:On January 09 2014 00:25 Qwerty85 wrote:On January 08 2014 23:58 HaRuHi wrote:On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay. I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again. If you had a long break your MMR would reset anyway even in WoL so you would basically start over after 5 placement games. So the decay feature was not really needed at all. Agreed. I suspect this has happened to a number of people who went from 'masters/diamond to silver' even so, there's something fishy about how long it is taking for people to return back to a higher rank. In WoL it wouldn't give you 27 gold players in a row. After a bunch of consecutive wins it tries to challenge you and find an even footing. something else is effecting this, and I find it hard to believe that MMR decay is the primary cause.
Well that is my point exactly. MMR decay system as it is now is bad both for returning players (so it basically has the opposite effect) and for active players. In WoL you would start over, play 5 placements and probably got back to your league sooner than now in Hots.
|
On January 09 2014 01:29 Qwerty85 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 01:10 Oboeman wrote:On January 09 2014 01:06 tili wrote:On January 09 2014 00:25 Qwerty85 wrote:On January 08 2014 23:58 HaRuHi wrote:On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay. I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again. If you had a long break your MMR would reset anyway even in WoL so you would basically start over after 5 placement games. So the decay feature was not really needed at all. Agreed. I suspect this has happened to a number of people who went from 'masters/diamond to silver' even so, there's something fishy about how long it is taking for people to return back to a higher rank. In WoL it wouldn't give you 27 gold players in a row. After a bunch of consecutive wins it tries to challenge you and find an even footing. something else is effecting this, and I find it hard to believe that MMR decay is the primary cause. Well that is my point exactly. MMR decay system as it is now is bad both for returning players (so it basically has the opposite effect) and for active players. In WoL you would start over, play 5 placements and probably got back to your league sooner than now in Hots.
^^, Well, half of those 27 Goldplayers were platinum/daimond/masters at some point, maybe it is more difficult to get promoted when the players you usually have to beat to get promoted are not rated higher than gold themselfes. But Blizzard said only 6% are effected by mmr decay, maybe they did not use current active players but all registered players?`And since mmr decay does also effect teamgames, maybe most of those 6% are 1v1 players? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
|
On January 09 2014 01:45 HaRuHi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 01:29 Qwerty85 wrote:On January 09 2014 01:10 Oboeman wrote:On January 09 2014 01:06 tili wrote:On January 09 2014 00:25 Qwerty85 wrote:On January 08 2014 23:58 HaRuHi wrote:On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay. I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again. If you had a long break your MMR would reset anyway even in WoL so you would basically start over after 5 placement games. So the decay feature was not really needed at all. Agreed. I suspect this has happened to a number of people who went from 'masters/diamond to silver' even so, there's something fishy about how long it is taking for people to return back to a higher rank. In WoL it wouldn't give you 27 gold players in a row. After a bunch of consecutive wins it tries to challenge you and find an even footing. something else is effecting this, and I find it hard to believe that MMR decay is the primary cause. Well that is my point exactly. MMR decay system as it is now is bad both for returning players (so it basically has the opposite effect) and for active players. In WoL you would start over, play 5 placements and probably got back to your league sooner than now in Hots. ^^, Well, half of those 27 Goldplayers were platinum/daimond/masters at some point, maybe it is more difficult to get promoted when the players you usually have to beat to get promoted are not rated higher than gold themselfes. But Blizzard said only 6% are effected by mmr decay, maybe they did not use current active players but all registered players?`And since mmr decay does also effect teamgames, maybe most of those 6% are 1v1 players? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Huh, the active vs inactive distinction does make sense... But it seems almost deliberately misleading if that were the case.
|
On January 09 2014 01:10 Oboeman wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 01:06 tili wrote:On January 09 2014 00:25 Qwerty85 wrote:On January 08 2014 23:58 HaRuHi wrote:On January 08 2014 23:49 LordYama wrote:
The situation seems to boil down to basically this: The problem that Blizzard was trying to solve - players losing games when coming back after inactivity - was a much smaller problem than the problem they have now created with their solution.
They have created a situation where the MMRs are much less reflective of true skill than before, leading to active players taking a lot of beatdowns from players much more skilled than them presumably because those players have "decayed" down to an MMR that is way lower than their true skill, causing a lot more unhappiness than the original "problem" ever caused.
The problem is that this comes at a time when a lot of the player base is probably already dropping out due to the normal lifecycle of a game, this kind of thing will only accelerate that.
I for one would be much happier if the current ladder system was scrapped entirely and switched back to the one they had right before MMR decay. I am like 27 - 2 after they dropped me from daimond to gold...must say I enjoy it, even though I probably should not. :d I don`t know when they changed it, because I came back after a long long long long long break, but I really like that they started to show loses and wins in lower leagues again. If you had a long break your MMR would reset anyway even in WoL so you would basically start over after 5 placement games. So the decay feature was not really needed at all. Agreed. I suspect this has happened to a number of people who went from 'masters/diamond to silver' even so, there's something fishy about how long it is taking for people to return back to a higher rank. In WoL it wouldn't give you 27 gold players in a row. After a bunch of consecutive wins it tries to challenge you and find an even footing. something else is effecting this, and I find it hard to believe that MMR decay is the primary cause.
There is nothing fishy regarding how long it takes to reach your pre-decay MMR. MMR changes much more rapidly only if you have played small amount of matches after fresh start or MMR reset (It takes ~25 matches or little more before MMR change rate normalizes after a 'blank MMR' start). But as you have played more, your MMR changes in normal pace. The current MMR ranges for different leagues are actually smaller than they were in WoL. It takes roughly 20 straight wins to pass one league range (size of different leagues differ little bit, except that master is much larger).
You wondered why you mostly face people only from your league. The matchmaker was also changed regarding this when HotS was published. It not only takes account your MMR, but also your league. It primarily matches you with opponents from same league who have similar MMR as you and secondarily opponents from other leagues who have similar MMR as you.
I am sure many have realized this when they have been promoted. Before promotion most of the opponents are from the old league, but after the promotion the opponents are mostly from the new league. Remember that when you are promoted, you have just passed the lower MMR threshold of your new league (exception new accounts/accounts that faced MMR reset). If the league would not affect matchmaking then roughly half of your opponents would be from your old league and half from your new league.
One purpose for this change was surely to hide the effects of MMR decay. You can imagine how many complaints there would be when players would return from their 4+ weeks hiatus and suddenly would be mostly facing one or two leagues lower opponents than before. They would quickly realize that their MMR has been changed (max decay corresponds roughly little more than one typical league range in MMR). But as this mechanic is in place, the decayed players do not necessarily realize that their MMR has been dropped before they play their next placement matches in the beginning of the subsequent season and get demoted.
|
That's good, because I just like to play this game for fun. I am busy with work and my career so when I log on I play a game and get STOMPED, I fucking LOVE it! This game is SO much fun. I mean... nothing makes me want to play this game more than losing my one game every 3 days and not having my MMR decay to adjust to my skill level. No just keep sending me up against people who play 20+ games a day. Like how da fuq? TWO FUCKING WEEKS!?! FUCK YOU! If I have to wait 2 fucking weeks I might as well not play the fucking game. It's dying anyways. That is why people are so upset! They used to be this rank and that, but people are quitting so the percentages are skewed and now people are dropping ranks and don't like it and your system can't handle the decline in population.
Edit: The REAL reason the ladder system is so fucked up is because all these plat/diamond Terran and Zergs are switching to Protoss and fucking up everyone's MMR when they lose.
|
On January 08 2014 23:08 Ben... wrote:
I'm starting to play again (took a few weeks off) and I'm going to just play unranked until this is resolved. Leagues were kind of meaningless to start with, now they mean absolutely nothing due to there being no consistency in matchmaking anymore. I have a busy schedule for university, so having to fight MMR decay just to play decent opponents in ranked is unrealistic for me at this point.
You realize you only need to play one game ever 2 weeks and no decay at all? The ladder is perfectly fine for me, I play a few games a week and have been diamond all the time (which is where I should be). Ladder was fucked first 2 seasons of hots, was master back then, wasnt worthy.
|
On January 08 2014 23:47 Lurtzer wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2014 23:43 Tyrhanius wrote:
Plz fix unranked games. Unrank shouldn't have his own MMR but it has to be the same than the ranked one, expect losing or winning unranked game doesn't change it. People use to free lose on unrank because they don't want to play some MU. Could be better too if you can choose your MU you want to play.
At this moment as rank vs unranked exist bronze meet diamand/master and it's very frustrating for both.
A button with " i off race " could be cool too, which permit players to play at a lower MMR to discover a new race, and warn the other that his opponent is not a real dimand/master. Could be less frustrating. That button would be too easy to abuse.
You should just have three different MMR, one for protoss, one for zerg and one for terran. Whenever you ladder, you should be able to choose which race you want to play as (whether it be only one race, two races or all three races) and bnet should try to pick a suitable opponent for you.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
