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On November 13 2013 21:16 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2013 21:12 Conti wrote:On November 13 2013 21:05 Plansix wrote:On November 13 2013 21:01 Conti wrote:On November 13 2013 20:56 Plansix wrote:On November 13 2013 20:22 Conti wrote:On November 13 2013 19:53 Grettin wrote:On November 13 2013 19:45 TeeTS wrote:On November 13 2013 19:41 diwurn wrote:
That's it for MLG and SC2 I guess... Hope Axeltoss and Axslav will find a new home! yep. I wouldn´t expect MLG to pick up SC2 again unless it gets an unforseen boost in fanbase. I don't think its about the fanbase/viewer numbers. Sure, Dota2 probably gets more viewers, but what Dota 2 has to offer is something that benefits MLG as well. For example, ticket sales to increase prize pools (like with this upcoming tournament), which makes the tournament even bigger. Wasn't there some discussion awhile back about MLG having to pay to Blizzard for hosting tournaments? Yes, though that has been refuted by MLG, if I remember correctly. Then again, MLG said they initially cancelled SC2 from one of their events because Red Bull already signed up an event for that date, and you can't have 2 SC2 events at the same weekend. And the Red Bulle vent turned out to be an 8 player invitational. Soo.. Blizzard is completely fine with giving up a huge MLG tournament for an 8 player invitational, just because the latter was there first? And MLG is completely fine with that, too? Something just didn't add up, and it seemed like MLG used that as a convenient excuse (whether true or not) to ditch SC2 as a whole. The impression I got was that Blizzard doesn't play favorites and doesn't try to make events move to get out of each others way. They don't want to take the place of events communicating with each other. I said this before in a Dota 2 thread. MLG might come back to SC2, but right now they are taking a break. The community is doing the same. The Dota 2 community, though critical, has been overwhelmingly excited about the first big LAN in NA since TI3 and MLG is really doubling down on that. Both MLG and the SC2 community need to decide if they want to be together and not take the other for granted. I think a clean slate is best for both sides and MLG can see where they fit in after Blizzard announced WCS 2014. But does that make any sense? Maybe I'm just dense here, but if I were Blizzard and I'd find out that a tournament with hundreds of participants and thousands of live viewers could not happen because of an 8 player invitational, I sure as hell would try to see what I can do to make both happen instead of saying "Eh, bad luck, better tell us your dates earlier next time!". I'm not trying to say that MLG is the SC2-hating devil. But I do find the official reasoning for dropping SC2 to be rather.. odd, both from MLG's point of view as well as Blizzard's. You would be shocked how little power Blizzard has at the end of the day to force another business to do something. People act like they are all powerful and control all of SC2, but they can't make anyone move an event to another date. Plus the venues that were rented costs thousands(sometimes tens of thousands) of dollars just to secure for a weekend. It also needs to be done months and months in advance, sometimes a full year. And you can't get that money back. Once these events are booked, there might be nothing Blizzard can do to change the dates. And at that point, what do they do? Tell Redbull they can't show SC2 at their SC2 only event? Sometimes there is no good solution and you just take the best of the terrible choices you have. Allowing both events to take place seems like the obvious thing to do here, and only Blizzard could make that happen, since it is Blizzard in the first place that requires events to basically get permission before they take place. And your argument actually goes both ways: Everything has to be planned and paid for and worked for months in advance. You think MLG would just give up their main game for one of their big events just like that, just because an 8 player invitational happened to be on the same weekend? Wouldn't it be a huge deal to have to change plans, etc. due to the scheduling conflict? That is exactly what they did. They have a good relationship with Red Bull and decided to not step on their toes and just not have SC2 at this event. It's really not that crazy, it's really bad business to make the fans choose. They can always have SC2 at another event.
I just cannot wrap my head around the idea that "Good relationship with Red Bull" is more important than "Main event of one of our big events".  Of course I'm not MLG, and I might be missing something here. And I might be entirely wrong, too.
But to me it just feels that there was way more going on in the background, and that MLG was neither surprised nor entirely unhappy about having to drop SC2. And that they did not pick it up again and now let go of their SC2 casters just confirms to me that they are not planning to return to the game in the near or intermediate future.
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i guess that's it. really sad since MLG had brought me so many great games, and with the cast of axeltoss
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Canada16217 Posts
On November 13 2013 21:17 Musicus wrote:
Oh man that sucks... and Noobcon in Ireland turned out the be a scam too. I feel sorry for them, they were doing really cool stuff at MLG and are so passionate. I hope they can stay in e-sports and find a new home.
care to elaborate further about Noobcon? I know it was cancelled but that's about the extent of what I know(or is that it?)
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On November 13 2013 21:23 Conti wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2013 21:16 Plansix wrote:On November 13 2013 21:12 Conti wrote:On November 13 2013 21:05 Plansix wrote:On November 13 2013 21:01 Conti wrote:On November 13 2013 20:56 Plansix wrote:On November 13 2013 20:22 Conti wrote:On November 13 2013 19:53 Grettin wrote:On November 13 2013 19:45 TeeTS wrote:On November 13 2013 19:41 diwurn wrote:
That's it for MLG and SC2 I guess... Hope Axeltoss and Axslav will find a new home! yep. I wouldn´t expect MLG to pick up SC2 again unless it gets an unforseen boost in fanbase. I don't think its about the fanbase/viewer numbers. Sure, Dota2 probably gets more viewers, but what Dota 2 has to offer is something that benefits MLG as well. For example, ticket sales to increase prize pools (like with this upcoming tournament), which makes the tournament even bigger. Wasn't there some discussion awhile back about MLG having to pay to Blizzard for hosting tournaments? Yes, though that has been refuted by MLG, if I remember correctly. Then again, MLG said they initially cancelled SC2 from one of their events because Red Bull already signed up an event for that date, and you can't have 2 SC2 events at the same weekend. And the Red Bulle vent turned out to be an 8 player invitational. Soo.. Blizzard is completely fine with giving up a huge MLG tournament for an 8 player invitational, just because the latter was there first? And MLG is completely fine with that, too? Something just didn't add up, and it seemed like MLG used that as a convenient excuse (whether true or not) to ditch SC2 as a whole. The impression I got was that Blizzard doesn't play favorites and doesn't try to make events move to get out of each others way. They don't want to take the place of events communicating with each other. I said this before in a Dota 2 thread. MLG might come back to SC2, but right now they are taking a break. The community is doing the same. The Dota 2 community, though critical, has been overwhelmingly excited about the first big LAN in NA since TI3 and MLG is really doubling down on that. Both MLG and the SC2 community need to decide if they want to be together and not take the other for granted. I think a clean slate is best for both sides and MLG can see where they fit in after Blizzard announced WCS 2014. But does that make any sense? Maybe I'm just dense here, but if I were Blizzard and I'd find out that a tournament with hundreds of participants and thousands of live viewers could not happen because of an 8 player invitational, I sure as hell would try to see what I can do to make both happen instead of saying "Eh, bad luck, better tell us your dates earlier next time!". I'm not trying to say that MLG is the SC2-hating devil. But I do find the official reasoning for dropping SC2 to be rather.. odd, both from MLG's point of view as well as Blizzard's. You would be shocked how little power Blizzard has at the end of the day to force another business to do something. People act like they are all powerful and control all of SC2, but they can't make anyone move an event to another date. Plus the venues that were rented costs thousands(sometimes tens of thousands) of dollars just to secure for a weekend. It also needs to be done months and months in advance, sometimes a full year. And you can't get that money back. Once these events are booked, there might be nothing Blizzard can do to change the dates. And at that point, what do they do? Tell Redbull they can't show SC2 at their SC2 only event? Sometimes there is no good solution and you just take the best of the terrible choices you have. Allowing both events to take place seems like the obvious thing to do here, and only Blizzard could make that happen, since it is Blizzard in the first place that requires events to basically get permission before they take place. And your argument actually goes both ways: Everything has to be planned and paid for and worked for months in advance. You think MLG would just give up their main game for one of their big events just like that, just because an 8 player invitational happened to be on the same weekend? Wouldn't it be a huge deal to have to change plans, etc. due to the scheduling conflict? That is exactly what they did. They have a good relationship with Red Bull and decided to not step on their toes and just not have SC2 at this event. It's really not that crazy, it's really bad business to make the fans choose. They can always have SC2 at another event. I just cannot wrap my head around the idea that "Good relationship with Red Bull" is more important than "Main event of one of our big events". Of course I'm not MLG, and I might be missing something here. And I might be entirely wrong, too. But to me it just feels that there was way more going on in the background, and that MLG was neither surprised nor entirely unhappy about having to drop SC2. And that they did not pick it up again and now let go of their SC2 casters just confirms to me that they are not planning to return to the game in the near or intermediate future.
Looking back, they were clearly planning to get out of sc2, otherwise they would've resumed hosting sc2 tournaments at their events. That Red Bull tournament was just a good excuse that came in handy.
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hope axslav stays in sc2 casting
for axeltoss ... dont know he was the most boring caster for me and i always turned him off so i dont mind what he does but wish him best luck obv.
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Seems like MLG definitely distancing itself from SC2... Unfortunate, I was hoping that MLG would start running smaller SC2 tournaments... Ones where the incentive for people to fly across the globe is lower. But alas we do not end up getting a decent lan event in the NA scene with mostly NA players playing.
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The community actually killed MLG/SC2 by insisting upon the involvement of Korean players. Curiosity propped it up for a tournament or two, but in the end the move had the effect of crushing the NA scene and a good portion of domestic interest. Gotta tip your hat to everyone for their short-sightedness.
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Sad to hear they're parting ways. Axslav is still one of the best analysts imo.
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On November 13 2013 21:59 jdsowa wrote:
The community actually killed MLG/SC2 by insisting upon the involvement of Korean players. Curiosity propped it up for a tournament or two, but in the end the move had the effect of crushing the NA scene and a good portion of domestic interest. Gotta tip your hat to everyone for their short-sightedness.
Yeah god forbid we see the highest level games and best players possible. You realize the Koreans were kinda big in the SC1 scene, right? It's only natural we care about them in SC2.
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On November 13 2013 21:38 NovemberstOrm wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2013 21:17 Musicus wrote:
Oh man that sucks... and Noobcon in Ireland turned out the be a scam too. I feel sorry for them, they were doing really cool stuff at MLG and are so passionate. I hope they can stay in e-sports and find a new home. care to elaborate further about Noobcon? I know it was cancelled but that's about the extent of what I know(or is that it?)
Basically, the event has been cancelled and the organization running it has been tight lipped about why. Some people have had their tickets refunded. Some of the players and teams going to the event are bound to lose a lot of money because of cancelled planet tickets and such. There is at least one sponsor who wants his money back from the organization.
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On November 13 2013 21:59 jdsowa wrote:
The community actually killed MLG/SC2 by insisting upon the involvement of Korean players. Curiosity propped it up for a tournament or two, but in the end the move had the effect of crushing the NA scene and a good portion of domestic interest. Gotta tip your hat to everyone for their short-sightedness.
Yes the good old days when MLG consisted of the same 16 players over and over in pool play. That was such a draw for viewers.
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i guess we don't need much more evidence that SC2 is indeed truly dying... what a shame :'(
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I think MLG is done with SC2
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On November 13 2013 22:03 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2013 21:59 jdsowa wrote:
The community actually killed MLG/SC2 by insisting upon the involvement of Korean players. Curiosity propped it up for a tournament or two, but in the end the move had the effect of crushing the NA scene and a good portion of domestic interest. Gotta tip your hat to everyone for their short-sightedness. Yeah god forbid we see the highest level games and best players possible. You realize the Koreans were kinda big in the SC1 scene, right? It's only natural we care about them in SC2.
Personally I think there could have been a better balance and MLG does seem to be focused on running NA only qualifiers for Dota. Those teams are going to get mauled by the big boys, but the qualifer event had its own prize money, so ther is something for NA teams to fight for. With the current WCS being so heavily Korean dominated,not here is room for an NA focused MLG event of some form.
The real question is does the SC2 community want MLG events to have SC2. I am not 100% sure that people do or how much they want it.
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starcraft still gets viewers. i mean is mlg gonna go back and keep doing flavor of the year console games now?
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On November 13 2013 22:43 MagnuMizer wrote:
i guess we don't need much more evidence that SC2 is indeed truly dying... what a shame :'(
After Blizzcon getting 150K+ in the finals?
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On November 13 2013 21:59 jdsowa wrote:
The community actually killed MLG/SC2 by insisting upon the involvement of Korean players. Curiosity propped it up for a tournament or two, but in the end the move had the effect of crushing the NA scene and a good portion of domestic interest. Gotta tip your hat to everyone for their short-sightedness.
SC2 shot itself in the foot. First with the boring Infestor that dominated at the end of WOL, and then the changes in HOTS. I personally still don't think the game is as exciting as it was in 2011.
Idra's run at MLG Orlando, and MLG Orlando in general was my favorite tournament, and it was full of Koreans. But Huk finished 1st, and Idra 4th.
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On November 13 2013 23:18 Firestorm wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2013 22:43 MagnuMizer wrote:
i guess we don't need much more evidence that SC2 is indeed truly dying... what a shame :'( After Blizzcon getting 150K+ in the finals?
Ignore them, some people will look for any reason to post "ded gaem, Blizrad fix now".
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On November 13 2013 23:20 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2013 23:18 Firestorm wrote:On November 13 2013 22:43 MagnuMizer wrote:
i guess we don't need much more evidence that SC2 is indeed truly dying... what a shame :'( After Blizzcon getting 150K+ in the finals? Ignore them, some people will look for any reason to post "ded gaem, Blizrad fix now".
Destiny has done more damage to the scene (to get people thinking like that) than MLG leaving the scene will ever do.
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On November 13 2013 23:23 Firestorm wrote:Show nested quote +On November 13 2013 23:20 Plansix wrote:On November 13 2013 23:18 Firestorm wrote:On November 13 2013 22:43 MagnuMizer wrote:
i guess we don't need much more evidence that SC2 is indeed truly dying... what a shame :'( After Blizzcon getting 150K+ in the finals? Ignore them, some people will look for any reason to post "ded gaem, Blizrad fix now". Destiny has done more damage to the scene (to get people thinking like that) than MLG leaving the scene will ever do.
It did put a negative cloud over the community and made any bad news more fuel for the "ded gaem" crowd.
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EPT
