EPTThere's still too many timings and all-ins that seem too strong and since P can reinforce very quickly, if you miss one beat as Z it can be gg, which can be quite frustrating for the viewers as zergs don't even bother to try to defend : if they can't break the push at 1st try they just leave the game.
SK MC's thoughts on the current state of SC2 - Page 49
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ChApFoU
France2982 Posts
There's still too many timings and all-ins that seem too strong and since P can reinforce very quickly, if you miss one beat as Z it can be gg, which can be quite frustrating for the viewers as zergs don't even bother to try to defend : if they can't break the push at 1st try they just leave the game. | ||
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saddaromma
1129 Posts
On September 12 2013 14:38 rezoacken wrote: To me esport is at an alltime low. Moba are the big thing right now but I really dont get the hype for those and can't get myself to watch them without getting bored out of my mind. It's way too slow and unexciting from a viewer point of view. And SC2 hasn't been interesting to me for a long time due to design decisions Blizzard doesn't want to get rid off making the game way too volatile and battles way too quick and too decisive to make the game exciting. Last e-sport thing I've watched were some pro matches of Age of Conquerors (aoe2)... Speak for yourself. I'm mostly on the edge of my seat while watching high profile LCS games. Ofc, boring games happen, every sports have boring games. | ||
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rezoacken
Canada2719 Posts
On September 12 2013 14:50 saddaromma wrote: Speak for yourself. I'm mostly on the edge of my seat while watching high profile LCS games. Ofc, boring games happen, every sports have boring games. Yeah of course I'm just expressing my point of view, that's pretty obvious from my post unless you want me to add "imo" at every sentences... I doubt the dozens of thousands of viewers just watch out of boredom. | ||
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Maeldun
Australia169 Posts
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Nibbler89
884 Posts
On September 12 2013 10:15 blade55555 wrote: I bet you were one of those players at the end of WoL who complained about zerg non stop no matter how bad the terran played at times. Also in reality this community isn't anywhere as toxic as some other communities like LoL or Dota2 or Cod. ??? aren't you just reinforcing my point? "I bet you are x and thought x wrong thing because you played terran", I could turn around and say " oh i bet you were one of those players that tried to defend infestor broodlord no matter how bad the zerg played at times" but that would be stupid. Maybe the community doesn't seem as toxic to you because people don't randomly shove wrong statements into your mouth based on what race you play(although like I said i stopped playing terran so there's really no need for the hate, I can play random or zerg as well and I think I prefer it this way all the races are pretty fun in hots). I mean this is coming from a respected community member / zerg player as well, imagine what the typical player is like. I can't speak to Dota2 or cod as I haven't played those much but I haven't really had that many negative experiences in league so far. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25556 Posts
On September 12 2013 14:57 rezoacken wrote: Yeah of course I'm just expressing my point of view, that's pretty obvious from my post unless you want me to add "imo" at every sentences... I doubt the dozens of thousands of viewers just watch out of boredom. I don't inherently have a problem with MOBAs but have developed an irrational hatred of them due to the incessant SC2/MOBA pissinh contest that has gone on for the past god knows how long. I suck at MOBAs but I do understand how they work. Just find things too bright and confusing to watch. Being colourblind doesn't help that's for sure  | ||
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Clbull
United Kingdom1439 Posts
On September 12 2013 04:06 Nibbler89 wrote: Eh part of the reason I've been playing more league recently is how toxic I find the sc2 community especially as a terran player Is an example of what I'm talking about, and it's sad how common it is people think this way, especially when the race you play is the least played race so the majority tends to side against you. When I do play sc2 now I just play protoss because it's the most played race and thus the most accepted. I really don't think it's any worse in league, it might even be better, people aren't divided by what champions they pick. I got called an autistic fuck and a massive cunt for playing passively last night. Against a Zerg who intentionally dragged the game out by droning massively, making nothing but swarm hosts, vipers and corruptors and turtling with spines and spores everywhere. I agree, the SC2 community is toxic-as-shit and in a way that would make League of Legends seem like kindergarten. | ||
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rezoacken
Canada2719 Posts
On September 12 2013 19:28 Wombat_NI wrote: I don't inherently have a problem with MOBAs but have developed an irrational hatred of them due to the incessant SC2/MOBA pissinh contest that has gone on for the past god knows how long. I suck at MOBAs but I do understand how they work. Just find things too bright and confusing to watch. Being colourblind doesn't help that's for sure Oh I'm all with you, I understand the game but I don't understand the hype. It's a bit like American Football to me, I understand the game but I think it fucking sucks  | ||
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saddaromma
1129 Posts
On September 13 2013 05:53 rezoacken wrote: Oh I'm all with you, I understand the game but I don't understand the hype. It's a bit like American Football to me, I understand the game but I think it fucking sucks At first it sucked for me too. But I started paying attention to little details, like who focusing who, synchronized execution of combos, team decisions or all-ins in dire situations. It becomes much more interesting the more you watch. Especially korean leagues. | ||
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rezoacken
Canada2719 Posts
On September 13 2013 06:19 saddaromma wrote: At first it sucked for me too. But I started paying attention to little details, like who focusing who, synchronized execution of combos, team decisions or all-ins in dire situations. It becomes much more interesting the more you watch. Especially korean leagues. Doubt it. Do you actually like the game yourself ? Because I don't so... yeah. | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
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Ingsoc
59 Posts
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Jawra
Sweden146 Posts
On September 16 2013 07:57 Ingsoc wrote: I wonder if this would have gotten more attention if MC didn't compare the current state of SC2 with BW. It's not wrong to compare the two, actually it's beneficial for Sc2 =P Blizzard should take more aspects from BW, especially regarding the midgame passivity. | ||
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Hattori_Hanzo
Singapore1229 Posts
- reintroduction of transformation servos - increase of loading size from 2 to 4. - reintroduction of the blue flame requirement Thanks SC2 forum trolls. | ||
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gobbledydook
Australia2603 Posts
On September 16 2013 11:01 Hattori_Hanzo wrote: It became stagnant again after three consecutive hellbat nerfs, - reintroduction of transformation servos - increase of loading size from 2 to 4. - reintroduction of the blue flame requirement Thanks SC2 forum trolls. hellbat drops all day? | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
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Hattori_Hanzo
Singapore1229 Posts
It was close to being solved by the meta, when anticipating hellbat drops, opponents would start turreting up and/or add in anti-air flying units to patrol the blind spots. It was beginning to look interesting with all that action around the map as T would try to sneak in a hellbat drop while pushing the front. But noooooooooooooooo, Big Daddy Designer had to come "save the day" with a hellbat nerf. I facepalmed so hard I didn't watch a game until last Friday. Sorry Blizzard, it is YOU who is killing SC2 scene. | ||
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Clbull
United Kingdom1439 Posts
I will not copy and paste this post and will instead summarize it due to four reasons: 1) My thread is locked so I can't even copy and paste everything and can't be bothered to edit using BBCode, 2) My thread hasn't been deleted, only locked for I feel, good reason which has been explained thoroughly, 3) It was too long winded anyway and 4) I am not qualified to comment on proposed gameplay changes. Biomine needs a nerf. It should not be the predominant playstyle in every stage of the mid and late game for TvZ. This can be done by nerfing the Medivac to no longer have Boost and by either nerfing, redesigning or outright removing the Widow Mine. By fixing this we will hopefully stop seeing Zergs forced into mutalisks to hold aggression. Some of David Kim's proposed changes such as Medivac Boost are downright retarded. Terrans never had a problem in Wings of Liberty executing drop play. Why do they need boosted drop speed? At the same time bio may need a small, minor nerf so that it's not so effective in the late game. It's already effective against all tiers provided a good engagement. Hydralisks should be able to cleave bio with Roach support, not completely melt in an equal supply equal upgrade engagement. As for the stagnation of bio vs Protoss, that's more-so because Mech is underpowered because Biomine hardly fights off the Protoss late game. In fact, Widow Mines suck against Protoss in all aspects of the game. I want to see Mech buffed to improve their useability in games and I currently feel like the only real reason we don't see units like Siege Tanks, Thors or Hellbats anymore is because they are underpowered. The Siege Tank for instance does less splash against light units than the Widow Mine does (35 Damage vs Light vs 40 Damage.) In addition, it actually does far less damage than in Brood War which in turn makes other units far tankier against it. All Protoss ground units apart from the Sentry, High Templar and Dark Templar (with detection) hard-counter the Siege Tank. The Stalker takes 1 extra hit to kill (despite having 20 less Life than the Dragoon) and with Blink can jump on top of a tank line, forcing the issue of friendly fire. The Zealot can Charge, closing the gap quicker than with Leg Enhancements and guaranteeing a hit due to changes made in early WoL. But consider the fact Siege Tanks die to Gateway tech then consider how tanky tier 2 and tier 3 is. Colossi take 7 hits to kill, more than the tankiest ground unit in Brood War used to take. The Archon takes 11 hits to kill when it used to take 6 and the Immortal takes the cake by taking 14 hits to kill, more than even the neo-Ultralisk which takes as much damage as an Archon does and used to take as much damage to kill as an Archon in BW. This is why we don't see Mech in TvP or TvZ anymore. When a transition into ultralisks can destroy a clumped up siege tank line without the added protection of simcity or buildings obstructing ground army movement, it has become time to rethink Terran Mech. The Hellbat also steered away from its original design philosophy of being a tanky Mech unit. The unit has been changed to biological, light and a harassment unit. It is less tanky than the Marauder due to having less base armor, only 10 more HP and a lack of stimpack of Concussive Shells. Its status as a light unit means it is also hard-countered by a tier 1 unit in the form of the Baneling and its status as a unit with only 2 attack range and a slow movement speed means it is hard-countered by any ranged unit. Sky Terran is also the same. It costs a lot, is supposedly the ultimate unit composition yet dies so easily to tier 1 and tier 2. Battlecruisers and Ravens are GARBAGE, as are Ultralisks, Vipers and Brood Lords. And before you think David Kim should fix this. Consider the fact that one balance update that was his responsibility was not only unnecessary but also broke Wings of Liberty. I think it's high time David Kim did a Jay Wilson and left the StarCraft II development team. There's quite a bit of talent in the Starbow and OneGoal mapmaking teams. Maybe hire some of them? | ||
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ETisME
12471 Posts
On September 16 2013 11:21 Hattori_Hanzo wrote: It was close to being solved by the meta, when anticipating hellbat drops, opponents would start turreting up and/or add in anti-air flying units to patrol the blind spots. It was beginning to look interesting with all that action around the map as T would try to sneak in a hellbat drop while pushing the front. But noooooooooooooooo, Big Daddy Designer had to come "save the day" with a hellbat nerf. I facepalmed so hard I didn't watch a game until last Friday. Sorry Blizzard, it is YOU who is killing SC2 scene. I think most people would agree that TvT is way better than before now. Exactly what the community wanted, you are in the minority here | ||
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Clbull
United Kingdom1439 Posts
On September 16 2013 11:27 ETisME wrote: I think most people would agree that TvT is way better than before now. Exactly what the community wanted, you are in the minority here Except replace dropping Hellbats with dropping Marines and Marauders on everything. Bio is still broken in TvT and is phasing out Mech because of Stimivac drops. When you can deny 6 - 7 Siege Tanks with a handful of Hellbats below by dropping about 3 medivacs full of MM on top and engaging with another force in a concave, it's not balanced | ||
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