EPTI like the idea that someone brought up about unlocking 3-3 for zerg with infestation pit. That way the zerg could stay alive longer with muta/ling and when he finaly transitions he can go straight for the choice of T3 tech/units he wants. As it is now we see zergs being forced to stay way to long on 2-2 lair tech and when he eventually gets the hive he somehow has to afford everything at once, having to build 3-3, greater spire or ultra cavern, adrenaline claws all at once. And thats when they are usually already behind or in a very fragile situation.
Call to Action: August 19 Balance Testing - Page 6
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Fjodorov
5007 Posts
I like the idea that someone brought up about unlocking 3-3 for zerg with infestation pit. That way the zerg could stay alive longer with muta/ling and when he finaly transitions he can go straight for the choice of T3 tech/units he wants. As it is now we see zergs being forced to stay way to long on 2-2 lair tech and when he eventually gets the hive he somehow has to afford everything at once, having to build 3-3, greater spire or ultra cavern, adrenaline claws all at once. And thats when they are usually already behind or in a very fragile situation. | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3559 Posts
I really don't feel Ultralisks are underwhelming at this point. I guess Zerg feels a little weak lategame, if not going for Swarmhosts, but this is also a buff to that style, since going against Swarmhosts, you still need to be ready for the tech switches. | ||
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
On August 20 2013 17:37 lolfail9001 wrote: That change is not for mech play. It is for easier incorporation of hellbats in late game (since you usually have attack upgrades for vikings). Pretty much this. Mech play is a no-go in HoTS. They will need to make quite a few changes to make mech work and that won't happen until LoTV. I can't see them ignoring make on the last expanion/last chance. That would just be sad. | ||
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Decendos
Germany1341 Posts
On August 20 2013 17:36 lolfail9001 wrote: Suggest buff to any of this, that makes sense. Good luck. burrowed roachspeed increased SHs is hard to change without redesign hydras 6 base range + +dmg to bio while lowering +dmg bio from spores to not make roach hydra the only strat ZvZ drops increase ovispeed from HT speed to sth useful viper BC now makes units -5 range so tanks have still use while making BC stick to units for 4 sec also nydus unload units faster neural no more channeling (if too strong for lower duration or even only neutralizing instead of getting opponents unit) corruptors corruption changed into sth that affects ground once air units are dead (viking/phoenix like) | ||
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Xulatis
Germany34 Posts
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Rabiator
Germany3948 Posts
The upgrade change is unstylish and if you go mech you get it anyways, so nothing changes. The "switch to air" or "better support from air" arguments are stupid because Terran air is relatively useless against ground (Fungal and massed Hydras really make Banshees very inefficient) and against Broodlords the damage output of Vikings seemed ok so far. | ||
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IeZaeL
Italy991 Posts
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Lukeeze[zR]
Switzerland6838 Posts
On August 20 2013 17:48 Rabiator wrote: So why didnt they increase the damage output of the Siege Tank if they think mech is underpowered? The upgrade change is unstylish and if you go mech you get it anyways, so nothing changes. The "switch to air" or "better support from air" arguments are stupid because Terran air is relatively useless against ground (Fungal and massed Hydras really make Banshees very inefficient) and against Broodlords the damage output of Vikings seemed ok so far. My guess is that blizzard likes the fact that terran is that low supply, swarmish super mobile race (it should've been the zergs, but eh w/e ^^), hence why they don't want to reput the tank in the metagame. | ||
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Grumbels
Netherlands7032 Posts
On August 20 2013 17:48 Rabiator wrote: So why didnt they increase the damage output of the Siege Tank if they think mech is underpowered? The upgrade change is unstylish and if you go mech you get it anyways, so nothing changes. The "switch to air" or "better support from air" arguments are stupid because Terran air is relatively useless against ground (Fungal and massed Hydras really make Banshees very inefficient) and against Broodlords the damage output of Vikings seemed ok so far. Battlecruisers are very strong versus zerg I think, so theoretically it could make transitions to air stronger, but I don't know of terran builds that get mech weapon upgrades because they don't use the siege tank anymore. -- I think the ultralisk change could be helpful, zergs tend to lose to terran when teching to hive and their first few ultralisks aren't too helpful. I don't like the change though, I feel like it might balance the brief transition window shortly after hive, but leave the bulk of late game play strongly in zerg's favor. Ultralisks are already stronger than they were in WoL, do they need even more buffs? My preferred change is to weaken terran bio-mine slightly and to give them ghosts as a necessary transition for late game. | ||
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12593 Posts
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DemigodcelpH
1138 Posts
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ottosec
505 Posts
I don't see how overseer buff will help zerg much, except for maybe better scouting. Ultralisk seems already one of the strongest units in the game, why would the buff it, only God knows. | ||
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Fjodorov
5007 Posts
On August 20 2013 17:55 Nebuchad wrote: I love how half the people are whining because "the ultras are going to be too strong", and half the people are whining because "ZvT won't be fixed at all". Just try it out, people. I guess it's cool to have threads like these some of the time to remind us how much everyone is ready to cry on details. To me it seems like almost everyone is saying that zerg late game isnt weak and ultras dont need a buff at all. Blizzard should instead be looking at what happens on the way to the late game. Atleast from a ZvT perspective | ||
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KrazyTrumpet
United States2520 Posts
I really wish instead of things like buffing starting energy or research upgrades to add to starting mana, they would do things like increasing the energy recharge rate or something. A buff/upgrade that makes spellcasters more useful faster, and also gives staying power. Other two changes are still good, though. | ||
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Tsubbi
Germany7997 Posts
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Absentia
United Kingdom973 Posts
That seems a far better change than some ham-fisted ultralisk buff. The overseer change is nice, though. | ||
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Vanadiel
France961 Posts
On August 20 2013 18:04 Fjodorov wrote: To me it seems like almost everyone is saying that zerg late game isnt weak and ultras dont need a buff at all. Blizzard should instead be looking at what happens on the way to the late game. Atleast from a ZvT perspective People don't go for fast Hive/Ultralisk because it doesn't really work anymore against high terran player, if a buff to the Ultralisk legitimate this path you could see some zerg players trying to go faster Hive, because it will be worth it. | ||
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Mehukannu
Finland421 Posts
On August 20 2013 17:37 lolfail9001 wrote: That change is not for mech play. It is for easier incorporation of hellbats in late game (since you usually have attack upgrades for vikings). Hellbats are easy to incorporate with bio in late game, but there is no reason to add them since they just slow down the whole bio composition. You only really need the pre-igniter upgrade for the damage and you already get air/ground armor in the same package so that isn't a problem. If you retreat you'll end up losing most of your hellbats if not all and if you are in a situation where you are going after the retreating enemy army, they just end up blocking your path, which isn't a big problem, but it is little annoying, when you are aiming to snipe as much as possible. | ||
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Timmsh
Netherlands201 Posts
This change, will make it impossible. | ||
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TheRabidDeer
United States3806 Posts
On August 20 2013 18:19 Timmsh wrote: I vote against the overseer buff, because as protoss it's already hard to deny scouting from the zerg. This change, will make it impossible. ... what? You think it is hard to deny scouting from zerg? Do you build observers ever? How do you stop scans? | ||
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