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[Now live] New Patch - Warp Prism buff - Page 33

Forum Index > SC2 General
980 CommentsPost a Reply
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DinoMight
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States3725 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-20 18:59:09
June 20 2013 18:58 GMT
#641
Win ratios are going to be difficult to calculate because who do you exclude etc. etc.. but I think if you look at major tournament wins in all regions you will find that T and Z have a lot more than P.

Aside from HerO winning WCS America and then getting ROFLSTOMPED shortly thereafter, I don't remember Protoss winning much. It's been mostly T and Z.

EDIT - Oh and Stardust won Dreamhack. But otherwise I can't think of last event a Protoss won.
"Wtf I come back and find myself in camp DinoMight all of a sudden, feels weird man." -Wombat_NI
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
June 20 2013 19:00 GMT
#642
On June 21 2013 03:54 Plansix wrote:
Well then all the results from WCS are worthless. Innovation is in KR, MVP is in EU and NA players don't matter because its NA and filled with Korean B teamers. None of it matters because of the highly skilled(or not skilled) players involved in each region.

We don't have to ask this question for WCS Kr because, if I counted right, TvP was 15-15 in maps at Code S last season; and anyway, there are some Protoss who can win Bogus in a BO3 (Rain, sOs, PartinG I presume; perhaps others as well, I'm not a Protoss specialist), so we're not really in a "one player above the rest" configuration for Korea. I don't know for WCS America.
Targe
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom14103 Posts
June 20 2013 19:00 GMT
#643
On June 20 2013 23:53 syno wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2013 23:51 Targe wrote:
On June 20 2013 23:37 syno wrote:
On June 20 2013 23:27 fighter2_40 wrote:
On June 20 2013 21:01 GhostOwl wrote:
Okay, for all the Terran players whining, how about this?

Warp Prism gets medivac boost skill, and Medivac loses the skill. In return, Medivac gain the tiny speed boost granted by this patch.

See what Protoss and Zerg players have to deal with? Or are you going to keep complaining until Zealots and Zerglings each do only 1 damage to marines?



The point is each race has its advantages. Terran bio has mobility, toss has very strong 1a and zeros have Econ. Give toss strong mobility as well and it just doesn't sit right. Though I don't think this patch does that much because unless they also have a speed upgrade late game that makes them even faster than before

Isn't the mobility more the Zergs advantage?
And why the fuck are people keep saying that Protoss is a 1a race?
I don't get that, since protoss has alot more casting abilities than, lets say zerg (and i don't wanna say that zerg doesn't require micro). You have to cast guardian shielf, FF, storm, micro your colossi, blink your stalkers,...
Does that sound like 1a to you? If yes, you're just ignorant.
Come on, we're not in the beta of WoL anymore.

And how exactly does a warp prism speed buff give the race a strong mobility?

You're logic on this topic is just silly and you have such a tunnel vision.


Tbh I've never had a problem with any of the micro you mentioned whenever I've tried playing toss.

That still makes no difference at all, it's still not 1A, what is your point?


I'm sure if I spent a week learning how to work towards a zealot archon composition I could basically a-move my way to the same level I'm at at Terran, it's just a few letters, get over it.
11/5/14 CATACLYSM | The South West's worst Falco main
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
June 20 2013 19:06 GMT
#644
On June 21 2013 04:00 Targe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2013 23:53 syno wrote:
On June 20 2013 23:51 Targe wrote:
On June 20 2013 23:37 syno wrote:
On June 20 2013 23:27 fighter2_40 wrote:
On June 20 2013 21:01 GhostOwl wrote:
Okay, for all the Terran players whining, how about this?

Warp Prism gets medivac boost skill, and Medivac loses the skill. In return, Medivac gain the tiny speed boost granted by this patch.

See what Protoss and Zerg players have to deal with? Or are you going to keep complaining until Zealots and Zerglings each do only 1 damage to marines?



The point is each race has its advantages. Terran bio has mobility, toss has very strong 1a and zeros have Econ. Give toss strong mobility as well and it just doesn't sit right. Though I don't think this patch does that much because unless they also have a speed upgrade late game that makes them even faster than before

Isn't the mobility more the Zergs advantage?
And why the fuck are people keep saying that Protoss is a 1a race?
I don't get that, since protoss has alot more casting abilities than, lets say zerg (and i don't wanna say that zerg doesn't require micro). You have to cast guardian shielf, FF, storm, micro your colossi, blink your stalkers,...
Does that sound like 1a to you? If yes, you're just ignorant.
Come on, we're not in the beta of WoL anymore.

And how exactly does a warp prism speed buff give the race a strong mobility?

You're logic on this topic is just silly and you have such a tunnel vision.


Tbh I've never had a problem with any of the micro you mentioned whenever I've tried playing toss.

That still makes no difference at all, it's still not 1A, what is your point?


I'm sure if I spent a week learning how to work towards a zealot archon composition I could basically a-move my way to the same level I'm at at Terran, it's just a few letters, get over it.


And I am sure if I spent a week learning some dumb hellbat all in, I could drop my way to the same level I am right now. What is your point?
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Dreamer.T
Profile Joined December 2009
United States3584 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-20 19:30:02
June 20 2013 19:29 GMT
#645
Oh noes, time to build PF before orbital! In all seriousness, let's wait a while to see what toss do with this new upgrade.
Forever the best, IMMvp <3
MaTaAeRuKaNa
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States95 Posts
June 20 2013 19:30 GMT
#646
On June 20 2013 09:34 blade55555 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2013 09:33 Atlas247 wrote:
On June 20 2013 09:26 Quakecomm wrote:
So when does Zerg get their hyper op drop mechanic? When will nydus worms have more than 3 heath?


There's this unit called the Mutalisk...


Not a drop mechanic lol.

I hope zerg gets an op drop mechanic soon :D



Zergs have nydus -_________-

TvP lategame imba, bring back warhounds
Luddite wrote: Tentacle monster: Basically a sunken colony with legs, and multiple tentacles to attack with. It gets bonus damage vs. large units and Japanese school girls.
Wingblade
Profile Joined April 2012
United States1806 Posts
June 20 2013 19:31 GMT
#647
On June 21 2013 03:24 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 02:06 Wingblade wrote:
Countless games? You cited two, and two horrible examples at that. sOs DIDN'T fight with pure gate units. Yes having storm helped to an extent, but writing "countless games in which Protoss plays on pure gate units" after citing a game where that is just flat wrong is ignorant and silly.

I said "with zero robo fighting unit" for the sOs example. Other instances? OK. ForGG vs sOs, Neo Planet S, WCS global finals: 13'20 robo, 14'30 robobay i. e. pure gates until at least 15'. Second game from that series, Bel'shir Vestige: 12'30 robo, 14'20 robobay. Can't you just watch top players from your race and know by yourself that opening Templars into late Colossi (Immortals aren't even mandatory, zeal/archons/storm can work on its own) is perfectly viable?

Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 02:45 Wingblade wrote:
Meanwhile in tournaments, PvT featured something like a 35 percent winrate in Europe.

Ah yes, the famous proof of "imbalance" in which the 35% is based on a glorious 37 games sample size (14-23 according to Liquipedia), including Mvp having 8 wins against much inferior Protoss. OK. Please watch the following list and tell me some of the results are surprising?

ForGG 1:2 SaSe
Happy 2:1 HasuObs
ThorZaIN 2:1 TitaN
ThorZaIN 2:1 TitaN
Mvp 2:0 Siw
Mvp 2:1 Socke
Shuttle 0:2 NaNiwa
Shuttle 0:2 NaNiwa
KrasS 0:2 Grubby
MMA 1:2 Feast
MMA 2:0 MaNa
Happy 2:0 BabyKnight
Mvp 2:0 SaSe
Mvp 2:0 SaSe
LucifroN 3:0 BabyKnight

Any Terran upset? No, that's right. Protoss had a bad season on WCS Europe, which is irrelevant for balance. Move on.


Err 14-23...? What are you smoking Mr. Grandmaster?

http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2013_StarCraft_II_World_Championship_Series/Statistics

try 32-59 PvT winrate in Europe last season.
PartinG fanboy to the max, Rain/Squirtle/Dear/Scarlett/Bbyong are cool too. I don't always watch Dota2 but when I do I have no clue what's going on. GOGO POWER RANGERS
arterian
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada1157 Posts
June 20 2013 19:32 GMT
#648
Just played my first game with this patch, PvZ.

The buff is amazing. It a niche buff that was really only used once in a blue moon to snipe a spire or something and made it something I can use every game, defensively (immortal pickups vs roach timings) and offensively with drops and push.
http://www.twitch.tv/arterian
Wingblade
Profile Joined April 2012
United States1806 Posts
June 20 2013 19:36 GMT
#649
On June 21 2013 04:00 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 03:54 Plansix wrote:
Well then all the results from WCS are worthless. Innovation is in KR, MVP is in EU and NA players don't matter because its NA and filled with Korean B teamers. None of it matters because of the highly skilled(or not skilled) players involved in each region.

We don't have to ask this question for WCS Kr because, if I counted right, TvP was 15-15 in maps at Code S last season; and anyway, there are some Protoss who can win Bogus in a BO3 (Rain, sOs, PartinG I presume; perhaps others as well, I'm not a Protoss specialist), so we're not really in a "one player above the rest" configuration for Korea. I don't know for WCS America.


So what is your explanation for Challenger League in Europe being massively Terran favored? Mvp didn't play in Challenger.
PartinG fanboy to the max, Rain/Squirtle/Dear/Scarlett/Bbyong are cool too. I don't always watch Dota2 but when I do I have no clue what's going on. GOGO POWER RANGERS
SSVnormandy
Profile Joined July 2012
France392 Posts
June 20 2013 19:39 GMT
#650
It's very good news that protoss can finally do proper harass that can poke and will require micromanagement because nowadays with very cheap DT and oracles their harass capability is very dumb with no micro and lead to poor wins.

They should put the cost to dark shrine at the WOL cost to counter balance the WP buff.

Go go protoss just harass in a skilled way for change
Battlecruisers.... Just Battlecruisers...
Irre
Profile Joined August 2010
United States646 Posts
June 20 2013 19:41 GMT
#651
On June 21 2013 04:39 SSVnormandy wrote:
It's very good news that protoss can finally do proper harass that can poke and will require micromanagement because nowadays with very cheap DT and oracles their harass capability is very dumb with no micro and lead to poor wins.

They should put the cost to dark shrine at the WOL cost to counter balance the WP buff.

Go go protoss just harass in a skilled way for change



how exactly is warping in zealots or DTs and forgetting about them at an earlier timing more skillful harass?
kyllinghest
Profile Joined December 2011
Norway1607 Posts
June 20 2013 19:46 GMT
#652
On June 20 2013 07:02 GTPGlitch wrote:
afaik barracks can't be put in medivacs

This obvious problem should be adressed!
"NO" -Has
juicyjames *
Profile Joined August 2011
United States3815 Posts
June 20 2013 19:52 GMT
#653
Patch is live.

http://us.launcher.battle.net/en-us/sc2/patch

STARCRAFT II PATCH 2.0.9

BALANCE

Protoss

Warp Prism
  • Movement speed increased from 2.5 to 2.953.
  • Acceleration increased from 2.125 to 2.625.
This Week in SC2Find out what happened 'This Week in Starcraft 2': http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=278126
TrickyGilligan
Profile Joined September 2010
United States641 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-20 20:01:24
June 20 2013 20:01 GMT
#654
On June 21 2013 04:52 juicyjames wrote:
Patch is live.

http://us.launcher.battle.net/en-us/sc2/patch

Show nested quote +
STARCRAFT II PATCH 2.0.9

BALANCE

Protoss

Warp Prism
  • Movement speed increased from 2.5 to 2.953.
  • Acceleration increased from 2.125 to 2.625.


Yay, maybe people will actually lose to this a few times before complaining, instead of just complaining.

I can hope, right?
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening. But this wasn't it." -Groucho Marx
Figgy
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada1788 Posts
June 20 2013 20:02 GMT
#655
On June 20 2013 08:04 viasacra89 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2013 07:58 AngrySalmon wrote:
As a top 5 platinum league, i could do with this buff.. for too long has swarm hosts lurked around at my door steps and i not being able to get out to expand.. A fast warp prism should do the trick!


Was there a point in telling us that you're top 5 plat?


Soon he'll be rank 7000 Diamond
Bug Fixes Fixed an issue where, when facing a SlayerS terran, completing a hatchery would cause a medivac and 8 marines to randomly spawn nearby and attack it.
Thieving Magpie
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States6752 Posts
June 20 2013 20:03 GMT
#656
On June 21 2013 04:36 Wingblade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 04:00 TheDwf wrote:
On June 21 2013 03:54 Plansix wrote:
Well then all the results from WCS are worthless. Innovation is in KR, MVP is in EU and NA players don't matter because its NA and filled with Korean B teamers. None of it matters because of the highly skilled(or not skilled) players involved in each region.

We don't have to ask this question for WCS Kr because, if I counted right, TvP was 15-15 in maps at Code S last season; and anyway, there are some Protoss who can win Bogus in a BO3 (Rain, sOs, PartinG I presume; perhaps others as well, I'm not a Protoss specialist), so we're not really in a "one player above the rest" configuration for Korea. I don't know for WCS America.


So what is your explanation for Challenger League in Europe being massively Terran favored? Mvp didn't play in Challenger.


your counterargument to his example using top level play is a qualifiers round?
Hark, what baseball through yonder window breaks?
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
June 20 2013 20:05 GMT
#657
On June 21 2013 05:03 Thieving Magpie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 04:36 Wingblade wrote:
On June 21 2013 04:00 TheDwf wrote:
On June 21 2013 03:54 Plansix wrote:
Well then all the results from WCS are worthless. Innovation is in KR, MVP is in EU and NA players don't matter because its NA and filled with Korean B teamers. None of it matters because of the highly skilled(or not skilled) players involved in each region.

We don't have to ask this question for WCS Kr because, if I counted right, TvP was 15-15 in maps at Code S last season; and anyway, there are some Protoss who can win Bogus in a BO3 (Rain, sOs, PartinG I presume; perhaps others as well, I'm not a Protoss specialist), so we're not really in a "one player above the rest" configuration for Korea. I don't know for WCS America.


So what is your explanation for Challenger League in Europe being massively Terran favored? Mvp didn't play in Challenger.


your counterargument to his example using top level play is a qualifiers round?

Cherry picking data is the best way to win any argument.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Thieving Magpie
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States6752 Posts
June 20 2013 20:08 GMT
#658
On June 21 2013 05:05 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 05:03 Thieving Magpie wrote:
On June 21 2013 04:36 Wingblade wrote:
On June 21 2013 04:00 TheDwf wrote:
On June 21 2013 03:54 Plansix wrote:
Well then all the results from WCS are worthless. Innovation is in KR, MVP is in EU and NA players don't matter because its NA and filled with Korean B teamers. None of it matters because of the highly skilled(or not skilled) players involved in each region.

We don't have to ask this question for WCS Kr because, if I counted right, TvP was 15-15 in maps at Code S last season; and anyway, there are some Protoss who can win Bogus in a BO3 (Rain, sOs, PartinG I presume; perhaps others as well, I'm not a Protoss specialist), so we're not really in a "one player above the rest" configuration for Korea. I don't know for WCS America.


So what is your explanation for Challenger League in Europe being massively Terran favored? Mvp didn't play in Challenger.


your counterargument to his example using top level play is a qualifiers round?

Cherry picking data is the best way to win any argument.


Fine, how about I cherry pick this factoid.

We have no empirical data on the effects of this buff and hence cannot make conclusions until top level play has had a chance to push the boundaries of its possibilities further.
Hark, what baseball through yonder window breaks?
Xaeldaren
Profile Joined June 2010
Ireland588 Posts
June 20 2013 20:14 GMT
#659
Anyone know when the patch is live on EU? I usually play on EU but I left my SC2 on NA last time I played and now I'm getting the client mismatch error.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
June 20 2013 20:15 GMT
#660
On June 21 2013 05:08 Thieving Magpie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 05:05 Plansix wrote:
On June 21 2013 05:03 Thieving Magpie wrote:
On June 21 2013 04:36 Wingblade wrote:
On June 21 2013 04:00 TheDwf wrote:
On June 21 2013 03:54 Plansix wrote:
Well then all the results from WCS are worthless. Innovation is in KR, MVP is in EU and NA players don't matter because its NA and filled with Korean B teamers. None of it matters because of the highly skilled(or not skilled) players involved in each region.

We don't have to ask this question for WCS Kr because, if I counted right, TvP was 15-15 in maps at Code S last season; and anyway, there are some Protoss who can win Bogus in a BO3 (Rain, sOs, PartinG I presume; perhaps others as well, I'm not a Protoss specialist), so we're not really in a "one player above the rest" configuration for Korea. I don't know for WCS America.


So what is your explanation for Challenger League in Europe being massively Terran favored? Mvp didn't play in Challenger.


your counterargument to his example using top level play is a qualifiers round?

Cherry picking data is the best way to win any argument.


Fine, how about I cherry pick this factoid.

We have no empirical data on the effects of this buff and hence cannot make conclusions until top level play has had a chance to push the boundaries of its possibilities further.

Great, but the patch is live so there is little to discuss. The WP now moves as fast as a stalker, so I am sure the world for terrans will now end.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
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