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On June 04 2013 07:08 Blargh wrote:
That doesn't really make sense to me. So, let's assume the top 2% (isn't that what Master league consists of?) make it into Master league at the beginning of the season. Then, as the season progresses, people who WOULD get promotions cannot because the top 2% is already filled. Normally, players would be demoted out of Master league and players would be promoted into Master league. Or is it that the players who -WOULD HAVE- gotten demoted from Masters will stay in it and be ignored for the "top 2%" while players still get promoted from Diamond, thus making master league technically larger than 2%?
While I don't like to get demoted because master league so kewl man, I disagree with the idea. If you aren't playing master league level, then you probably shouldn't be in Master league. But this might be better for a majority of people. It just doesn't follow the "competitive" style of a ladder.
It would probably make masters league 2.5% or 3% of players, and then that 1 or half a percent gets demoted at the end. Or at least that's how I think it would work.
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I like this change. I think it makes more sense at the lower levels, up to Plat. But I still think you should be able to be demoted from Diamond-Master.
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On June 04 2013 07:08 Blargh wrote:
That doesn't really make sense to me. So, let's assume the top 2% (isn't that what Master league consists of?) make it into Master league at the beginning of the season. Then, as the season progresses, people who WOULD get promotions cannot because the top 2% is already filled. Normally, players would be demoted out of Master league and players would be promoted into Master league. Or is it that the players who -WOULD HAVE- gotten demoted from Masters will stay in it and be ignored for the "top 2%" while players still get promoted from Diamond, thus making master league technically larger than 2%?
While I don't like to get demoted because master league so kewl man, I disagree with the idea. If you aren't playing master league level, then you probably shouldn't be in Master league. But this might be better for a majority of people. It just doesn't follow the "competitive" style of a ladder.
Masters League is already larger than 2% according to SC2Stats and nios.kr (and has been for a looooong time). I predict this change will only serve to exacerbate that problem.
Edit: Though from reading the blizzpost more carefully, this seems to have been in effect for a while and would definitely explain why Masters has been consistently larger than the supposed 2%.
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On June 04 2013 07:08 Blargh wrote:
That doesn't really make sense to me. So, let's assume the top 2% (isn't that what Master league consists of?) make it into Master league at the beginning of the season. Then, as the season progresses, people who WOULD get promotions cannot because the top 2% is already filled. Normally, players would be demoted out of Master league and players would be promoted into Master league. Does this mean that the players who -WOULD HAVE- gotten demoted from Masters will stay in it and be ignored for the "top 2%" while players still get promoted from Diamond, thus making master league technically larger than 2%?
While I don't like to get demoted because master league so kewl man, I disagree with the idea. If you aren't playing master league level, then you probably shouldn't be in Master league. But this might be better for a majority of people. It just doesn't follow the "competitive" style of a ladder.
While it was originally touted as "the top 2%" there was a post about a month ago that discussed how masters now was more closer to the top 6%. Also to be completely honest none of this really matters as long as the MMR algo still works.
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On June 04 2013 06:59 phuzi0n wrote:
Does that mean GM players can't be demoted either? If so then the first people to make GM would stay GM all season.
AFAIK GM players were never "demoted" mid-season. The only way to drop out is by letting your bonus pool get too high, and since HOTS losses detract from your BP the only way to lose GM status is by not playing any games for a few weeks.
That's why it's so much harder to get GM mid-season than it is if you manage to go on a win-streak right as the new season opens.
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That's an interesting change I didn't expect Blizzard to ever implement in a competitive game like this. Doesn't make much of a difference, and I guess it is nice to know once you reach a certain league, you can't get demoted until next season, very similar to how LoL works nowadays, where the only way you can be demoted is pretty much through elo decay.
Either way MMR is the still the big player here and not necessarily league.
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On June 04 2013 07:11 Heyoka wrote:
Not entirely sure why everyone is so mad at this. I'd guess it doesn't effect basically anything, and that the 2% (or whatever it is) of masters will be made up of MMR calculations and not what is displayed, so those who have dropped below will still free up slots. It just won't show on their account.
They're still taking up spaces in the leagues, though. Some people play a couple of games early in the season and then disappear off the face of the Earth. It makes it really annoying for people who are due for a promotion but can't get one until a new league opens up as ranked player numbers hopefully increase. There should be movement in both directions of ladder ranking throughout the season, and this is clearly one of those BS "ladder anxiety" changes.
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this is going to make people very scared to play their placement matches if they weren't already.
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this is stupid, leagues are stupid in general. just using our raw mmr as a ranking system would be much better
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On June 04 2013 07:00 R1CH wrote:
I'm sure the regular GM dropdown conditions still apply (inactivity etc).
Yeah, didn't Select make it to GM mid season?
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I never really understood why Leagues mattered to people. The way MMR is designed you're going to be on a (roughly) 50% W:L ratio until you get HIGH on the skill plateau.
Who shives a git if you're Gold or Platinum? The MMR will even you out at some point so the result is the same no matter what. You'll lose half, and win half your games....
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On June 04 2013 06:58 DavoS wrote:
Eh, not too thrilled. When I first started playing, I was put in Gold. I was not gold league caliber. I lost every game that season and that was against low level silvers after the first few golds roflstomped me. I literally celebrated when I got demoted to silver. Would like to see a way to make placement matches more accurate before they worry about things like demotion
This doesn't really matter for who you are placed against though, because your league has nothing to do with who you are placed against - that is ONLY your MMR.
League is purely a metaphor for your skill quintile (more or less... considering the recent 8% changes to bronze/gold).
Right?
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I don't like this change. If you're doing badly enough to get demoted, you should get demoted. I don't see the benefit of waiting until the start of next season for you to find out how bad you are. If they really wanted to change things, they should just give us a better indication of our actual MMR.
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England2410 Posts
My instinctive response was ''wtf, stupid casualisation grumble grumble, I'm still terrible...." but after some consideration, I think it could just represent a change towards the ladder being a competition with the 100 people in your ladder group, rather than competing against an almost inumerable mass of accounts. I think it fits with the social options they added, the WCS ladder seasons and what not.
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On June 04 2013 07:16 tili wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 06:58 DavoS wrote:
Eh, not too thrilled. When I first started playing, I was put in Gold. I was not gold league caliber. I lost every game that season and that was against low level silvers after the first few golds roflstomped me. I literally celebrated when I got demoted to silver. Would like to see a way to make placement matches more accurate before they worry about things like demotion This doesn't really matter for who you are placed against though, because your league has nothing to do with who you are placed against - that is ONLY your MMR. League is purely a metaphor for your skill quintile (more or less... considering the recent 8% changes to bronze/gold). Right?
It's also the only feedback you get as a determiner of your progression. There are many people who think they aren't improving because the divisions above them are saturated with inactives.
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Bleh this is dumb. Players if they aren't playing well should be placed into the division they belong. It will help them in the long run if you ask me. Motivation to get back into the higher leagues. But I guess they just want to avoid the mindset "oh I got demoted, now I don't want to play even more."
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Seems dumb and unnecessary.
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On June 04 2013 07:13 dUTtrOACh wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 07:11 Heyoka wrote:
Not entirely sure why everyone is so mad at this. I'd guess it doesn't effect basically anything, and that the 2% (or whatever it is) of masters will be made up of MMR calculations and not what is displayed, so those who have dropped below will still free up slots. It just won't show on their account. They're still taking up spaces in the leagues, though. Some people play a couple of games early in the season and then disappear off the face of the Earth. It makes it really annoying for people who are due for a promotion but can't get one until a new league opens up as ranked player numbers hopefully increase.
That's not how league promotions work. There are MMR boundaries that you have to pass with a certain margin of confidence. The boundaries are static and based on some educated prediction of active ladder population distribution. There are no "open/filled spots" in a direct sense, so demotions/promotions happen independent of one another.
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why is blizzard making these changes? Are they that desperate to keep players on the ladder? Is that a sign that there is a significant drop on the ladder activity?
I think so. Since they have to cater to the concerns of the minority that stress about their league.
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first thought - what a crock of shit
second thought - who cares...o wait other than the fact that you now need to be masters to do qualifiers for WCS, so now that requirement is going to be easier to obtain...ie if you get on a good streak and get promoted, but then go on a bad streak (because you didn't deserve it) then you will still be in...but again, who cares that's probably not many people
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EPT
