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Stephano leaving Korea, giving up his Code S match - Page 11

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Thieving Magpie
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States6752 Posts
March 27 2013 19:18 GMT
#201
When you see MVP, Life, Parting, MC, DRG, and Rain in the top 32 and it is honestly possible that none of them will get to the round of 4 because GSL is just that hard => you know that its just too much competition for a player like Stephano.

Not because of skillset => he has the skillset. But when you're used to winning effortlessly, its hard not to be disheartened.

Morale is important, I'm glad Stephano is stepping back.
Hark, what baseball through yonder window breaks?
dUTtrOACh
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada2339 Posts
March 27 2013 19:20 GMT
#202
On March 28 2013 04:05 archonOOid wrote:
If only the other team members were more inclusive perhaps the Koreans should brush up their English skills. I think you should treat players differently in a team and perhaps have a laxed schedule for someone like stephano.


The inverse could be argued much more easily.

It's actually easier for an individual to make compromises than an entire team. Stephano obviously lacks the character traits that make someone a successful pro-gamer under the Korean formula. The Korean formula is also proven to work, so this isn't really a matter of "I think the way I train is better".

When you go to a place it is not the responsibility of the people who live there to make a bunch of compromises for you and allow you to call the shots. That's called entitlement, and people don't like having to pamper someone whose sense of entitlement is that high. It's also a waste of time and money. Airplane tickets aren't free and neither is accommodation for a lengthy stay. A coach doesn't volunteer his time at the whim of the trainee, nor does a coach have to treat everybody differently if his coaching style works. It's not like the guy has brain damage or something that warrants a more relaxed schedule, he's just lazy and ungrateful.

This guy has honestly wasted so many people's time it's disgusting and I'm amazed at the patience that everybody extends to him, especially his fans. How can anybody support someone who throws away opportunities as much as Stephano?
twitch.tv/duttroach
danbel1005
Profile Joined February 2008
United States1319 Posts
March 27 2013 19:24 GMT
#203
Coach Park doing his job, great news, this ain't about GSL its about Proleague and miracle maker Park is looking for the best. Soon we'll see more new dudes playing for EG-TL in Proleague, cant be otherwise.
"EE HAN TIMING" Jaedong vs Stork [22 December, 2007] 2set @ Finals EVER OSL.
canikizu
Profile Joined September 2010
4860 Posts
March 27 2013 19:25 GMT
#204
I remember on the other topic, someone said that an anonymous on 4chan who have some connection with Korean pro scene said that Stephano was really unhappy with the EGTL teamhouse, he and the coach had racial arguments and almost got into a fight. That was when he wanted to drop GSL and went to IEM, but was stopped. I guess now he just wants to drop everything.
zanga
Profile Joined September 2011
659 Posts
March 27 2013 19:26 GMT
#205
On March 28 2013 03:31 Incomplet wrote:
Good decision. Some people just aren't good enough for Code S.
White flag + pants down duly noted.


Lol!

Naniwa is the only one with a true fighting spirit and iron will it seems
THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!
(:
Shinta)
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1716 Posts
March 27 2013 19:26 GMT
#206
With how much Stephano boasts for funsies, he really took himself down a few levels by doing this. A really embarrassing and cowardly move from the person who's considered the top foreigner in SC2.
Suteki Da Ne 素敵だね Isn't it Wonderful
Whiplash
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States2929 Posts
March 27 2013 19:26 GMT
#207
Knew about this for awhile, too bad it is happening
Cinematographer / Steadicam Operator. Former Starcraft commentator/player
baba1
Profile Joined April 2005
Canada355 Posts
March 27 2013 19:27 GMT
#208
Not sure what people were expecting from Stephano in Korea.

Beside the fact that he hates living in Korea, doesn't speak their langage and have no friends there and whatnot, I don't think he was Code S material.

You need much more dedication to the game to be code S.
Practicing a few hours here and there and not really caring and taking your talent as granted and that it will carry you through it won't get you a code S win. These guys play all the freaking time, they are in team houses where the only thing people do is play SC2 for 10 hours a day. They prepare for their matches and have a lot of support.

He will just continue to do what he does best, stomp foreigners where he doesn't need to prepare or care about the matches, which is good for him.
noq uote
zanga
Profile Joined September 2011
659 Posts
March 27 2013 19:28 GMT
#209
I know this is not about Naniwa - but I just want to say that at least he dares to lose in public, and then work hard to fight back to stand tall again. That is true spirit.
(:
Al Bundy
Profile Joined April 2010
7257 Posts
March 27 2013 19:31 GMT
#210
So much for the so-called "foreigner hope". Disappointing decision.
o choro é livre
Jaaaaasper
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States10225 Posts
March 27 2013 19:34 GMT
#211
Stephano has been very clear that he is in this solely for the money, it is far easier to make money in international tournaments, and he gets better exposure for his sponsors. He has always made it clear this is a break from school for him so that he is financially secure going forward, and this makes perfect sense from his stated goals. I wish him the best of luck.
Hey do you want to hear a joke? Chinese production value. | I thought he had a aegis- Ayesee | When did 7ing mad last have a good game, 2012?
DraStic8
Profile Joined December 2012
Canada17 Posts
March 27 2013 19:36 GMT
#212
On March 28 2013 04:28 zanga wrote:
I know this is not about Naniwa - but I just want to say that at least he dares to lose in public, and then work hard to fight back to stand tall again. That is true spirit.


Although Naniwa might lack modesty and humility at times, he does have something that Stephano lacks; a competitive spirit and desire to be the best SC2 player. I for one will cheer on Naniwa over Stephano going forward.
Aeroplaneoverthesea
Profile Joined April 2012
United Kingdom1977 Posts
March 27 2013 19:39 GMT
#213
On March 28 2013 03:15 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 28 2013 03:04 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:52 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:35 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:16 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:06 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:03 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 01:57 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 01:51 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 01:46 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
[quote]

This is the kind of logic that's so funny about Stephano fans (it also applies for Nerchio, Naniwa and any other of the current hyped foreigners too).

We constantly have to suffer this double think of how when they win (or better yet not actually playing vs Koreans at all as this is when their hype is biggest) they're Code S quality, amongst the absolute best in the world and can beat anyone and take down any tournament including Code S.

When they lose however it's okay because they lost to good player and there's no shame in that apparently.

The foreigner fanboy however never makes the connection that beating top players like Last, MVP, Yoda, Life and Flash is what makes you a top player and consistently losing to these level of players (like Stephano has for months and months now) means you're not a top player.

Stephano got absolutely smashed at IEM and MLG, no if's no but's he was destroyed by better players.


Well I can say he did shitty and should have done better. That it is unacceptable to get beaten 3-0 and that is total crap. But you see, I am a Red Sox fan, so I know what slumps are. Unlike many fans in the SC2 scene, who are like weather vains and just band wagon to the next winning Korean player and call him a god of the game until he loses and then its on to the next one. I would say that one is not much better than the other.


What's wrong with that? It's basically how Sc2 has worked at the pro level since it's inception.

Beta/Late 2010 - Fruitdealer/Tester era.
Early - Mid 2011 - Mvp/MC/Nestea era
Late 2011 - Mvp/MMA/DRG era
Early - Mid 2012 - MKP/DRG era
Mid - Late 2012 - Life/Parting/Rain/Leenock/Patch Zerg era

Are you denying that players in Sc2 tend to be at the top for about 6 months maximum and then fall off still able to win tournament but never consistently stringing together GSL/MLG wins like Mvp, DRG and Life were able to do at their peaks?


Well in the Boston area, we have words for people like that, but I won't use it on TL. But it's called being a fair weather fan. They cheer when their team is winning, but disappear when they aren't. Real fan cheer when the team is playing. I still cheer for MC and willl until he quits. Same with MKP and the members of EG. I am not a fair weather fan, I even cheer when they lose.


Most Sc2 fans are a fan of the game more than players so we just like whoever has cool play and shows good games.


That is what a fair weather fan is, they don't care who is playing and just cheer for the winner because it is easy. They like to watch the winner and can’t deal with the disappointment, or the idea that they might have to wait to see their favorite player be awesome. Fans like myself and my father who waited 20 years or (nearly 60 in my fathers case) for the Sox to win a world series have little patience for fair weather fans.


People are never going to be like that for Sc2 because you don't grow up with a team like you do it in real sports.

Instead people support players for their country, region, race, team, playstyle etc..

Real sports are also a lot more consistent, your favourite team is a constant forever. When I first got into Sc2 my favourite players were Nestea, Fruit Dealer, Jinro and July and my favourite team was oGs. Three of those players don't even play anymore, Nestea plays but is a shadow of what he was and oGs has disbanded. I'd love for Nestea to come back but it's not going to happen, so naturally people move onto new players to cheer for who are active.


Real sports are no more consistent than Esports. Winning 5 super bowls in a row is unheard of, or 5 masters or any number of World Series. The Yankees are known for winning 26 world series in the life of the ball club, which dates back nearly 100 years. They are the only club with that many titles in all of professional sports. The only reason teams seem consistent in real sports is because their seasons take a full year. And people who cheer for a team one year, only to leave them when they lose next year.

Once again, you can cheer for the top player if you want, but don’t go out of your way to mock the people who are fans the guys who lost or are doing poorly.


Well maybe in terrible American sports because you have comical affirmative action rules.

And don't patronise me because aren't the Boston Red Sox the 2nd greatest team in the history of American baseball?

My football team Huddersfield Town have been basically total shit since the 1930s and have never been in the top division in my lifetime and yet 10-20k fans watch them every week.

Also absolutely loads of football teams have more than 26 titles.



The Red Sox didn’t win a world series for 86 years, it was called the Curse of the Bambino and it was a huge part of the lore of the city of Boston for years. They are a good baseball team, but not the second best for raw numbers(hopefully my father won’t read this). And I am talking about America sports, I don’t follow soccer at all, but I am sure that some clubs have a good number of titles. I don’t know about these “comical affirmative action rules” are, unless you are talking about salary caps for teams.

But this is what you get for calling me a fan boy and mindlessly cheering for Stephano.


Salary caps, the draft system and lack of relegation/promotion are absolutely retarded.
Bagration
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States18282 Posts
March 27 2013 19:40 GMT
#214
Well, in terms of overall results, his appearance in Code S and GSL was quite underwhelming. But it was nice to see the guy go to Korea at all, considering how he once said that he was going to retire to medical school.
Team Slayers, Axiom-Acer and Vile forever
PhoenixVoid
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Canada32755 Posts
March 27 2013 19:41 GMT
#215
Not surprised, Stephano did not appear happy at all in Korea. This is for the better though, so it should go well for him in the future.
I'm afraid of demented knife-wielding escaped lunatic libertarian zombie mutants
Irre
Profile Joined August 2010
United States646 Posts
March 27 2013 19:43 GMT
#216
I wonder if EG will renew his contract. You might say, " ARE YOU CRAZY HES THE BEST FOREIGNER!" and while this is true, I am not sure he is making EG very happy right now. Hes not much of a promoter the way the rest of the teams foreign players are. He is not cooperating with the top priorities of EGs A Team- wont play in GSL and Proleague. He has personality and skill, but without playing in those leagues, is he really offering EG enough to warrant the 100k a year investment? I would say no, and given the past behavioral issues and the efforts made to accomodate him without the return of practice, participation or promotion, I would actually be surprised if his contract is renewed next time around.
Aeroplaneoverthesea
Profile Joined April 2012
United Kingdom1977 Posts
March 27 2013 19:48 GMT
#217
On March 28 2013 04:43 Irre wrote:
I wonder if EG will renew his contract. You might say, " ARE YOU CRAZY HES THE BEST FOREIGNER!" and while this is true, I am not sure he is making EG very happy right now. Hes not much of a promoter the way the rest of the teams foreign players are. He is not cooperating with the top priorities of EGs A Team- wont play in GSL and Proleague. He has personality and skill, but without playing in those leagues, is he really offering EG enough to warrant the 100k a year investment? I would say no, and given the past behavioral issues and the efforts made to accomodate him without the return of practice, participation or promotion, I would actually be surprised if his contract is renewed next time around.


There's also the bad publicity and sponsor drama they got from the 15 year old girl situation.
GaNgStaRR.ElV
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada535 Posts
March 27 2013 19:53 GMT
#218
On March 28 2013 03:41 StarStruck wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 28 2013 02:52 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:35 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:16 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:06 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 02:03 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 01:57 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 01:51 Plansix wrote:
On March 28 2013 01:46 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
On March 28 2013 01:39 Plansix wrote:
[quote]
Well to be fair, he go 3-0ed by a Kespa player, Last, in one of the most stacked brackets I have ever seen. Last then went 2-3 vs Life, who won MLG. He didn't lose to some scrub, but a guy who almost beat the winner of the entire event.


This is the kind of logic that's so funny about Stephano fans (it also applies for Nerchio, Naniwa and any other of the current hyped foreigners too).

We constantly have to suffer this double think of how when they win (or better yet not actually playing vs Koreans at all as this is when their hype is biggest) they're Code S quality, amongst the absolute best in the world and can beat anyone and take down any tournament including Code S.

When they lose however it's okay because they lost to good player and there's no shame in that apparently.

The foreigner fanboy however never makes the connection that beating top players like Last, MVP, Yoda, Life and Flash is what makes you a top player and consistently losing to these level of players (like Stephano has for months and months now) means you're not a top player.

Stephano got absolutely smashed at IEM and MLG, no if's no but's he was destroyed by better players.


Well I can say he did shitty and should have done better. That it is unacceptable to get beaten 3-0 and that is total crap. But you see, I am a Red Sox fan, so I know what slumps are. Unlike many fans in the SC2 scene, who are like weather vains and just band wagon to the next winning Korean player and call him a god of the game until he loses and then its on to the next one. I would say that one is not much better than the other.


What's wrong with that? It's basically how Sc2 has worked at the pro level since it's inception.

Beta/Late 2010 - Fruitdealer/Tester era.
Early - Mid 2011 - Mvp/MC/Nestea era
Late 2011 - Mvp/MMA/DRG era
Early - Mid 2012 - MKP/DRG era
Mid - Late 2012 - Life/Parting/Rain/Leenock/Patch Zerg era

Are you denying that players in Sc2 tend to be at the top for about 6 months maximum and then fall off still able to win tournament but never consistently stringing together GSL/MLG wins like Mvp, DRG and Life were able to do at their peaks?


Well in the Boston area, we have words for people like that, but I won't use it on TL. But it's called being a fair weather fan. They cheer when their team is winning, but disappear when they aren't. Real fan cheer when the team is playing. I still cheer for MC and willl until he quits. Same with MKP and the members of EG. I am not a fair weather fan, I even cheer when they lose.


Most Sc2 fans are a fan of the game more than players so we just like whoever has cool play and shows good games.


That is what a fair weather fan is, they don't care who is playing and just cheer for the winner because it is easy. They like to watch the winner and can’t deal with the disappointment, or the idea that they might have to wait to see their favorite player be awesome. Fans like myself and my father who waited 20 years or (nearly 60 in my fathers case) for the Sox to win a world series have little patience for fair weather fans.


People are never going to be like that for Sc2 because you don't grow up with a team like you do it in real sports.

Instead people support players for their country, region, race, team, playstyle etc..

Real sports are also a lot more consistent, your favourite team is a constant forever. When I first got into Sc2 my favourite players were Nestea, Fruit Dealer, Jinro and July and my favourite team was oGs. Three of those players don't even play anymore, Nestea plays but is a shadow of what he was and oGs has disbanded. I'd love for Nestea to come back but it's not going to happen, so naturally people move onto new players to cheer for who are active.


Real sports are no more consistent than Esports. Winning 5 super bowls in a row is unheard of, or 5 masters or any number of World Series. The Yankees are known for winning 26 world series in the life of the ball club, which dates back nearly 100 years. They are the only club with that many titles in all of professional sports. The only reason teams seem consistent in real sports is because their seasons take a full year. And people who cheer for a team one year, only to leave them when they lose next year.

Once again, you can cheer for the top player if you want, but don’t go out of your way to mock the people who are fans the guys who lost or are doing poorly.


It's next to impossible with stupid salary caps but they do this to keep all the teams competitive and level the playing field. There are consequences when you expand your league to the point the player pool just isn't the same, or expand to areas that aren't necessarily viable or market proven or how about lockouts between ownership and the players? The '94 lockout destroyed the Blue Jays in terms of attendance, mystique and losing core players. This doesn't even address the process of losing and what it does to your fan's morale to show up. Salary caps are a bitch and the game changes to maintaining your core and finding players for the supporting roles. Dynasties are a thing of the past.

It's fun to talk about such things but when we're talking about RTS gaming especially over here? I find it somewhat irrelevant because it's mostly based on individual achievements. In Korea, sure there's more emphasis on the Team Leagues but player's have said all the time they want that individual sense of accomplishment as well. Not only that, but the onus is truly on the players for them to be successful. They have a lot of responsibility. In the past we've seen certain players dominate the scene for small to lengthy periods of time whether it be Brood War, Warcraft 3 or SC2. It does happen. Regardless of the format like our Western Gauntlet Lans or long dragged out processes like your OSLs/GSLs/team leagues. Time and time again the Koreans have shown they can shine in both. Ofc it's only a weekend in a foreign place to them when they show up here and do there thing. It's like a holiday; whereas, if you want to compete in the GSL/OSL shindigs you're basically relocating. It's much easier to take a holiday compared to relocating. It's much easier on them. I'd like to see the correlation between Koreans joining/moving elsewhere and still finding some success. Polt will be fun to watch out for now that he's in Texas and found some success but I'm not sure when he finally moved back to Korea or how long he stayed inside the U.S.


Please don't call salary caps stupid, they make sense. As a hockey(toronto maple leafs)and a soccer(Fulhamfc) I support two teams at the middle to bottom of the barrel. However I cannot respect a team like man city who can just get a rich owner spend a billion in 3-4 years and have a championship to show for it. Salary caps force teams to use their money responsibly.
vesicular
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States1311 Posts
March 27 2013 19:55 GMT
#219
On March 28 2013 04:20 dUTtrOACh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 28 2013 04:05 archonOOid wrote:
If only the other team members were more inclusive perhaps the Koreans should brush up their English skills. I think you should treat players differently in a team and perhaps have a laxed schedule for someone like stephano.


The inverse could be argued much more easily.

It's actually easier for an individual to make compromises than an entire team. Stephano obviously lacks the character traits that make someone a successful pro-gamer under the Korean formula. The Korean formula is also proven to work, so this isn't really a matter of "I think the way I train is better".

When you go to a place it is not the responsibility of the people who live there to make a bunch of compromises for you and allow you to call the shots. That's called entitlement, and people don't like having to pamper someone whose sense of entitlement is that high. It's also a waste of time and money. Airplane tickets aren't free and neither is accommodation for a lengthy stay. A coach doesn't volunteer his time at the whim of the trainee, nor does a coach have to treat everybody differently if his coaching style works. It's not like the guy has brain damage or something that warrants a more relaxed schedule, he's just lazy and ungrateful.

This guy has honestly wasted so many people's time it's disgusting and I'm amazed at the patience that everybody extends to him, especially his fans. How can anybody support someone who throws away opportunities as much as Stephano?


This is a good post. Much of the same could be said with most foreigners in korea. Even in a recent Huk interview he talked about how hard it is in korea, the communication barrier, culture barrier, training differences etc. When asked if he tried to learn any korean to bridge the gap his answer was "no". How can you move to a country with an entirely different language and way of doing things and then complain about it without even trying to adapt to it?

I swear most foreigners think they just need to *be* in korea and it will all just magically make them better players, but none of them spend the time doing the work to integrate themselves into society so that it can actually work and be of benefit. And then they just complain about it.
STX Fighting!
_SpiRaL_
Profile Joined December 2012
Afghanistan1636 Posts
March 27 2013 20:12 GMT
#220
On March 28 2013 02:52 Plansix wrote:

Real sports are no more consistent than Esports. Winning 5 super bowls in a row is unheard of, or 5 masters or any number of World Series. The Yankees are known for winning 26 world series in the life of the ball club, which dates back nearly 100 years. They are the only club with that many titles in all of professional sports. The only reason teams seem consistent in real sports is because their seasons take a full year. And people who cheer for a team one year, only to leave them when they lose next year.

Once again, you can cheer for the top player if you want, but don’t go out of your way to mock the people who are fans the guys who lost or are doing poorly.


The football team I support have won 43 titles and it's about to be 44. That isn't even the record number of titles in that country lol.
Red and yellow are all I see
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