• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:20
CEST 18:20
KST 01:20
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202550RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16
Community News
BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams5Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed19Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll8Team TLMC #5 - Submission re-extension4
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing RSL Season 1 - Final Week
Tourneys
Esports World Cup 2025 Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams Ginuda's JaeDong Interview Series [Update] ShieldBattery: 1v1 Fastest Support!
Tourneys
CSL Xiamen International Invitational [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile CCLP - Command & Conquer League Project
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Post Pic of your Favorite Food! Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 904 users

EG releases Ho Joon “PuMa” Lee - Page 30

Forum Index > SC2 General
718 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 28 29 30 31 32 36 Next All
synapse
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
China13814 Posts
March 15 2013 19:52 GMT
#581
Not sure why Puma didn't accept the pay cut, at least give yourself a chance in hots before quitting.
:)
Grumbels
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Netherlands7031 Posts
March 15 2013 19:54 GMT
#582
On March 16 2013 04:29 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2013 03:50 Ctone23 wrote:
On March 16 2013 03:45 Grettin wrote:
On March 16 2013 03:34 Ctone23 wrote:
On March 16 2013 01:31 ELA wrote:
On March 16 2013 01:16 Ctone23 wrote:
As a businessman myself, I find it hard to look at this with a lot of objectivity.

Typically if you are in a financial situation where you wish to obtain a higher goal (I.E. Proleague) then you objectively identify weaknesses and efficiency of the entire company (team).

At the end of the day, EG can do whatever they want to. However, my opinion is that they should take a broader approach to identifying goals and pursuing them.

GL Puma





Subjectively, this makes very little sense

Are you saying that Proleague as a goal, is bad for EG?


No, but bad business management could be..

In the article Alex expressed that EG was focusing on Korean events such as Proleague, he then went on to go into how Puma had lackluster results, insinuating Pumas salary vastly overwhelmed his performance.

Meanwhile, back in the US, EG owns a very expensive house with at least two professional players that make absolutely no contribution tournament-wise, which was essentially the basis for letting Puma go (highly contradictory to EG business model, ex. Incontrol casting and what not).



The house costs ~36,000 USD/year to EG according to Scoots, which is "literally nothing". It's located in Phoenix which is why its way cheaper compared to other cities, the players split the costs of utilities and food.

Listen about the house etc @56:05


Um. http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2012/11/27/phoenix-arizona-home-price-gains-lead.html?page=all

Phoenix is an expensive place to live. On the flip side. They will get the money back when they sell at least.

All in all, good luck to Puma and I hope EG does well.


$36,000 a year is $3000 monthly. The house has at minimum 5 people living in it at a time, which equals to $600/monthly per person. That is beyond cheap for the quality of the living space and use they get out of it. Realistically, 5 college students could rent that place at that price with entry level jobs.

The house provides them with a number of uses, such as living space for players attending MLG from Korean, an international airport and media output. Considering it saves them the cost of hotel rooms and the man hours needed to book those hotel rooms, it is a net gain. It also saves EG money on salary for the US staff members, since they are providing cheap housing(they would need to pay them more to keep them on full time if the staff was renting).

But I am with Grettin, the amateur business experts of TL get annoying and really should be clamped down on. They just spread miss information.

It's silly basing your calculation on the 'minimum of 5 people', given that on average there are a lot more.
Well, now I tell you, I never seen good come o' goodness yet. Him as strikes first is my fancy; dead men don't bite; them's my views--amen, so be it.
jinorazi
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)4948 Posts
March 15 2013 19:58 GMT
#583
people automatically assume its expensive (eg house) after seeing korean team houses...
age: 84 | location: california | sex: 잘함
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 15 2013 20:01 GMT
#584
On March 16 2013 04:54 Grumbels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2013 04:29 Plansix wrote:
On March 16 2013 03:50 Ctone23 wrote:
On March 16 2013 03:45 Grettin wrote:
On March 16 2013 03:34 Ctone23 wrote:
On March 16 2013 01:31 ELA wrote:
On March 16 2013 01:16 Ctone23 wrote:
As a businessman myself, I find it hard to look at this with a lot of objectivity.

Typically if you are in a financial situation where you wish to obtain a higher goal (I.E. Proleague) then you objectively identify weaknesses and efficiency of the entire company (team).

At the end of the day, EG can do whatever they want to. However, my opinion is that they should take a broader approach to identifying goals and pursuing them.

GL Puma





Subjectively, this makes very little sense

Are you saying that Proleague as a goal, is bad for EG?


No, but bad business management could be..

In the article Alex expressed that EG was focusing on Korean events such as Proleague, he then went on to go into how Puma had lackluster results, insinuating Pumas salary vastly overwhelmed his performance.

Meanwhile, back in the US, EG owns a very expensive house with at least two professional players that make absolutely no contribution tournament-wise, which was essentially the basis for letting Puma go (highly contradictory to EG business model, ex. Incontrol casting and what not).



The house costs ~36,000 USD/year to EG according to Scoots, which is "literally nothing". It's located in Phoenix which is why its way cheaper compared to other cities, the players split the costs of utilities and food.

Listen about the house etc @56:05
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gfdh42U9F4


Um. http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2012/11/27/phoenix-arizona-home-price-gains-lead.html?page=all

Phoenix is an expensive place to live. On the flip side. They will get the money back when they sell at least.

All in all, good luck to Puma and I hope EG does well.


$36,000 a year is $3000 monthly. The house has at minimum 5 people living in it at a time, which equals to $600/monthly per person. That is beyond cheap for the quality of the living space and use they get out of it. Realistically, 5 college students could rent that place at that price with entry level jobs.

The house provides them with a number of uses, such as living space for players attending MLG from Korean, an international airport and media output. Considering it saves them the cost of hotel rooms and the man hours needed to book those hotel rooms, it is a net gain. It also saves EG money on salary for the US staff members, since they are providing cheap housing(they would need to pay them more to keep them on full time if the staff was renting).

But I am with Grettin, the amateur business experts of TL get annoying and really should be clamped down on. They just spread miss information.

It's silly basing your calculation on the 'minimum of 5 people', given that on average there are a lot more.


I know, it is likely way more efficent than what I listed, but I decided to keep is low just to make the point. $36,000 a year is super cheap for any multi-resident house in almost any market.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
WolfintheSheep
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada14127 Posts
March 15 2013 20:02 GMT
#585
On March 16 2013 04:09 Ctone23 wrote:
@ Grettin


What proof do you have other than the "EX-COO"

My argument was about the contradictory business model, not Phoenix, Arizona's housing market lol...

It's only "contradictory" because you're utterly failing at using an kind of critical thought. Why don't you think about what the term "ROI" means, and come back to us once you're willing to provide something reasonable to this thread?
Average means I'm better than half of you.
nichan
Profile Joined December 2010
United States158 Posts
March 15 2013 20:02 GMT
#586
EG can do way better when it comes to player and results this is a good start.
ArcadeR
Profile Joined May 2011
Germany199 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-15 20:05:38
March 15 2013 20:05 GMT
#587
Have to say that this is the best "release"-Statement I read in quite a while (in terms of E-Sports)...and one of the few that looks like an completly honest one (from one side)
p1oneer
Profile Joined April 2011
Latvia50 Posts
March 15 2013 20:06 GMT
#588
Okay, looks like PUMA was not that good anymore to be in such team as EG. What about Machine?Had he ever succeeded? ooor incontrol? okay he is probably doing lots of different stuff.demuslim never shined as well. donno
Jasiwel
Profile Joined June 2012
United States146 Posts
March 15 2013 20:08 GMT
#589
I'm sad to see PuMa teamless, but that's business I guess. I'm curious if EG picks up anyone soon though. They are becoming pretty strong right now with HotS. In my opinion, I don't see their dropping PuMa as saying he's not good enough so much as saying that he hasn't been able to keep up the pace with the rest of the team in terms of improving on the scene. But as they said, it really all comes down to investment and the cards really weren't with PuMa for them.

I do agree that they should have waited another season to see how PuMa handles HotS at tournaments. DeMuslim is one example of a player that's really starting to emerge very strong in HotS where he wasn't as good in WoL. Of course, that all does remain to be seen as more pros become accustomed to the game as a source of profit.
Grumbels
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Netherlands7031 Posts
March 15 2013 20:12 GMT
#590
They could get aLive, but I don't even know if he's better than Puma, even though it would make sense what with EG's penchant for picking up TSL players. They could get Polt, but Polt now has sponsors and wants to stay in the USA, so that's unlikely. If they had been keeping an eye on strong terran players they could have gotten Center, but he found a new team.

If they're interested in buying a player that isn't necessarily a free agent then T8_Cure is a good up and coming player. And Kespa might be okay with Team 8 serving a role of fostering talent for other teams.

I doubt that EG can really just go ahead and acquire any of the super good terrans from eSF, since those wouldn't be allowed to play for a while. As for the main good terrans from KeSPA, like Flash, Innovation, Baby. they did buy Jaedong, but that was before the start of the season and I don't know if KeSPA would be okay with this.

This is all assuming they want a new terran player now that they only have Thorzain left (and Taeja from TL).
Well, now I tell you, I never seen good come o' goodness yet. Him as strikes first is my fancy; dead men don't bite; them's my views--amen, so be it.
KookyMonster
Profile Joined January 2012
United States311 Posts
March 15 2013 20:13 GMT
#591
Sad, but I wish the best for him. This is extremely normal in sports, and it (in a sad sort of way) helps to further legitimize SCII as a "sport."
Paper is Imba. Scissors is fine. -Rock
WolfintheSheep
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada14127 Posts
March 15 2013 20:13 GMT
#592
On March 16 2013 05:06 p1oneer wrote:
Okay, looks like PUMA was not that good anymore to be in such team as EG. What about Machine?Had he ever succeeded? ooor incontrol? okay he is probably doing lots of different stuff.demuslim never shined as well. donno

How about you read the last 28 pages and get a clue?
Average means I'm better than half of you.
sc2superfan101
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
3583 Posts
March 15 2013 20:13 GMT
#593
gl to everyone involved
My fake plants died because I did not pretend to water them.
GeNi
Profile Joined November 2012
United States49 Posts
March 15 2013 20:18 GMT
#594
Eh, that was a dumb statement made by EG. If they release players that no longer perform the way they had in the beginning, then why don't they release idra, incontrol, huk , and all them? Just because Puma's a korean but he isn't as good as the other koreans they have to release him to get ANOTHER better korean? thats pretty dumb if u ask me.... release one of the baddie foreigners and sign a korean.... w/e im out
DavoS
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States4605 Posts
March 15 2013 20:18 GMT
#595
Not that surprising, kinda stinks for PuMa but i bet plenty of NA teams would be willing to snap him up.
I wonder what EG is gonna do with it's spare pile of money. Maybe Oz? It couldn't hurt their Proleague line-up. Maybe even CoCa or Puzzle if their play is still looking solid?
"KDA is actually the most useless stat in the game" Aui_2000
WolfintheSheep
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada14127 Posts
March 15 2013 20:19 GMT
#596
On March 16 2013 05:18 GeNi wrote:
Eh, that was a dumb statement made by EG. If they release players that no longer perform the way they had in the beginning, then why don't they release idra, incontrol, huk , and all them? Just because Puma's a korean but he isn't as good as the other koreans they have to release him to get ANOTHER better korean? thats pretty dumb if u ask me.... release one of the baddie foreigners and sign a korean.... w/e im out

Seriously, do people like you even bother thinking about anything you post?
Average means I'm better than half of you.
Pittski
Profile Joined May 2010
United States50 Posts
March 15 2013 20:20 GMT
#597
I can understand renegotiating a lower contract. Puma has fallen behind, and unless he start to improve for HoTs if he decides to play HoTs, then he has to show he can be better class then some of the other Koreans and even surpass Stephano. Even though Stephano has declined since joining EG.
The One and Only
StarGalaxy
Profile Joined March 2011
Germany744 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-15 20:21:11
March 15 2013 20:20 GMT
#598
why is there no statement from puma?
Cj hero | Zest
mtn
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
729 Posts
March 15 2013 20:31 GMT
#599
On March 16 2013 03:57 HotGlueGun wrote:
Pro league putting the squeeze on EG's bankroll. I think KeSPA teams/training style would suit PuMa well.


They had Kespa training style since they joined Proleague... O_o
mtn
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
729 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-15 20:33:43
March 15 2013 20:32 GMT
#600
On March 16 2013 04:58 jinorazi wrote:
people automatically assume its expensive (eg house) after seeing korean team houses...


Dont forget that EG Lair is in the middle of nowhere.

Sir scoots covered up the fact that moving ANYWHERE else, would cost a lot more...

Plus Teams like SKT1, KT, Woongjin etc. Have small Villas that they live/sleep in. So Idk whats ur point.
Prev 1 28 29 30 31 32 36 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Esports World Cup
10:00
2025 - Day 3
herO vs SolarLIVE!
Clem vs Classic
EWC_Arena14674
ComeBackTV 3083
TaKeTV 780
JimRising 589
Hui .540
3DClanTV 393
Rex267
EnkiAlexander 210
mcanning182
CranKy Ducklings137
SpeCial108
Reynor95
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
EWC_Arena14674
JimRising 589
Hui .540
Rex 267
mcanning 182
UpATreeSC 115
SpeCial 108
Reynor 95
ProTech23
StarCraft: Brood War
Bisu 3458
Flash 2014
Sea 1941
BeSt 1670
Mini 1003
TY 849
EffOrt 749
ZerO 517
Soulkey 440
Soma 426
[ Show more ]
Stork 271
Zeus 134
Mind 131
Larva 103
Snow 80
Dewaltoss 79
Light 77
Pusan 70
actioN 54
sorry 37
Movie 33
JYJ32
zelot 31
sas.Sziky 28
Sacsri 25
yabsab 23
soO 18
scan(afreeca) 14
Terrorterran 14
IntoTheRainbow 11
Dota 2
Gorgc4415
qojqva1457
syndereN403
420jenkins394
XcaliburYe219
League of Legends
Dendi798
Counter-Strike
fl0m3531
ScreaM1859
sgares364
markeloff78
edward58
Other Games
FrodaN1798
hiko1006
Beastyqt806
B2W.Neo760
KnowMe139
ArmadaUGS80
Trikslyr67
QueenE62
ZerO(Twitch)20
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV17
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 6
• FirePhoenix5
• Michael_bg 2
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 3729
• masondota2789
League of Legends
• Jankos1814
Other Games
• Shiphtur184
Upcoming Events
Esports World Cup
18h 40m
Serral vs Cure
OSC
21h 40m
CranKy Ducklings
1d 17h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 21h
CSO Cup
1d 23h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
FEL
2 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
3 days
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
[ Show More ]
Online Event
5 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Xiamen Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
CC Div. A S7
Underdog Cup #2
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.