EPT[Story spoilers!!] Heart of the HOTS - Page 17
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labbe
Sweden1456 Posts
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willoc
Canada1530 Posts
On March 14 2013 04:18 dcemuser wrote: I never got this vibe at all, but now I don't think I will be able to picture anything else on my second playthrough. You have been.... infested! | ||
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SgtCoDFish
United Kingdom1520 Posts
I was tremendously annoyed that they basically spoiled Jim not actually being dead in the trailers - he says "Sarah, what have you done?" in one of them, and doesn't say that before he "dies." Looking forward to LotV now! | ||
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Tjubatjubs
Sweden30 Posts
I also like that you play Kerrigan and kick ass throughout the whole game yet she is totally powerless in the final cutscene and had to rely on manly Jim to finish her own game. But I guess its just projection from my part. | ||
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Shake n Blake
Canada159 Posts
On March 13 2013 17:31 Seam wrote: So uhm. Just finished and was wanting to say how I actually really really enjoyed the story telling and character development... But I guess I'm alone there... If you're being completely honest, then i must inform you that your standards of quality story telling and character development are very, very low. For a lot of gamers however, this is not uncommon, given that they're unlikely to do lots of reading outside of the gaming industry. (There simply isn't enough quality story-telling among triple A titles nowadays to make gaming a substitute for literature.) Other people in this thread have already expressed my reasons for despising the SC2 story arc so much and why the character development is so disgustingly incongruent to SC:BW. (Raynor's baffling decision making that makes him totally unrelatable to his personality & performance in SC1, Big bad Amon turns out to be the real villian and Kerrigan is somehow now the hero . . . oh and my personal gripe being Zeratul's abysmal voice acting, but that's just me comparing his voice to the outstanding original actor. Seriously, try comparing the two and I think you'll understand where I'm coming from.) I can just imagine Metzen picking up a harlequin novel and thinking how brilliant it would be to structure Jim & Kerrigan's relationship around it in HOTS, along with the cliched and uninspired dialogue. ("Like riding a bike!" O___O Honestly, how could've ANYONE at Blizzard read their fucking script and thought to themselves, "brilliant! We're gonna set a new standard for story telling in gaming, an original cliff hanger for LotV!") This doesn't leave much hope for LotV sadly, which makes me even more worried about Blizzard's say in how the Warcraft movie script is written, but I digress. I feel our only hope is if Blizzard fires Metzen now before he douses the maybe-salvagable train wreck that is SC2's storyline in gasoline and lights a match . . . . | ||
Firebolt145
Lalalaland34491 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [Storyline rant] + So essentially this entire campaign storyline is about a woman who got turned into a monster and after that, even after she is turned 'mostly human' again, is hellbent on murdering billions of people just to kill 1 man. Wow, woman scorned, much? We get very little into the whole Kerrigan/Raynor backstory (of which I'm interested in, I'm a sucker for love). I understand Kerrigan forsakes her humanity after she hears that Raynor is dead, but then after she shows her new form to Raynor, he basically says 'fuck you' and blames her for having killed Fenix even though she's still technically the same mostly-human-personality he was in love with just before he got captured, wtf? Then the ending is cut short, Kerrigan kills Mengst and immediately flies away without talking to Raynor, without explaining anything about her new responsibilities to chase after the Xel-Naga guy. There's no talk ever seeing each other again, no 'sorry but I've got to do this, I met zeratul etc etc,' it's simply 'k thx bye'. And Raynor just smiles and watches her leave. -_- | ||
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Serpest
United States603 Posts
Why not just come up with the SC2 campaign as it should have been ourselves? Those of us who feel letdown and such, why don't we rectify Blizzard's failings and develop the SC2 Campaign. Obligatory: The Queen Bitch of the Universe is dead. Long live Kerrigan, Long live the Queen of Blades. (Why do we have a sappy damsel in distress in her place?!?) T_T | ||
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Atticus.axl
United States456 Posts
On March 14 2013 05:03 Tjubatjubs wrote: I also like that you play Kerrigan and kick ass throughout the whole game yet she is totally powerless in the final cutscene and had to rely on manly Jim to finish her own game. But I guess its just projection from my part. No you're completely correct about this part. Could she technically fly through the window outside and kill him instantly? Yes. Could she direct her entire swarm to bring him to her, thus removing any danger? Yes. But no, she has to become a damsel in distress again, and rely on big strong man Jim to save the day. | ||
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Zozo
Brazil2579 Posts
I didn't mind the whole Zerus bit, I actually liked it. Stukov coming back was also fine, but the ghost death animation in SCBW didn't really help, the corpse exploding made it look like he died for realz. The ship characters were OK, didn't bother me, the zerg history telling has always been limited (cerebrate X). It just felt very limited by the number of missions (20), with 5ish more you could have raynor/UED strike back at Sarah while she hunted down Amon. | ||
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Slaughter
United States20254 Posts
On March 14 2013 05:12 Shake n Blake wrote: If you're being completely honest, then i must inform you that your standards of quality story telling and character development are very, very low. For a lot of gamers however, this is not uncommon, given that they're unlikely to do lots of reading outside of the gaming industry. (There simply isn't enough quality story-telling among triple A titles nowadays to make gaming a substitute for literature.) Other people in this thread have already expressed my reasons for despising the SC2 story arc so much and why the character development is so disgustingly incongruent to SC:BW. (Raynor's baffling decision making that makes him totally unrelatable to his personality & performance in SC1, Big bad Amon turns out to be the real villian and Kerrigan is somehow now the hero . . . oh and my personal gripe being Zeratul's abysmal voice acting, but that's just me comparing his voice to the outstanding original actor. Seriously, try comparing the two and I think you'll understand where I'm coming from.) I can just imagine Metzen picking up a harlequin novel and thinking how brilliant it would be to structure Jim & Kerrigan's relationship around it in HOTS, along with the cliched and uninspired dialogue. ("Like riding a bike!" O___O Honestly, how could've ANYONE at Blizzard read their fucking script and thought to themselves, "brilliant! We're gonna set a new standard for story telling in gaming, an original cliff hanger for LotV!") This doesn't leave much hope for LotV sadly, which makes me even more worried about Blizzard's say in how the Warcraft movie script is written, but I digress. I feel our only hope is if Blizzard fires Metzen now before he douses the maybe-salvagable train wreck that is SC2's storyline in gasoline and lights a match . . . . I don't think you can make such assumptions about him because he has a different point of a view on pretty much a purely subjective matter (plot being enjoyable or not). I don't know why people are so up in arms about Jims transition of feelings for Kerrigan between SC:BW and SC2. He was pretty much TOLD straight up "Kerrigan lives or everyone and everything dies" This of course just gives him an excuse to let go of his anger (that and its been 4 years) and he has always carried love for her. Its not surprising at all. Plus why the hell does every characters actions have to be 100% logical/in line with previous depictions? Real people make a combination of weird/bad/good/stupid decisions all the time and they change over time so why are people married to this ONE depiction of Raynor when he was in full rage mode (at the end of BW) to 4 years later? | ||
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Slaughter
United States20254 Posts
On March 14 2013 05:45 Zozo wrote: If I could change one thing, it would be Raynor not coming back to help her. I didn't mind the whole Zerus bit, I actually liked it. Stukov coming back was also fine, but the ghost death animation in SCBW didn't really help, the corpse exploding made it look like he died for realz. The ship characters were OK, didn't bother me, the zerg history telling has always been limited (cerebrate X). It just felt very limited by the number of missions (20), with 5ish more you could have raynor/UED strike back at Sarah while she hunted down Amon. There is a secret mission where Stukov is found to be alive and infested. In the mission you "rescue" him in one of those control a few units + heros type missions and you use some type of synthesized zerg cure to uninfest him. It appears he was captured by the Dominion and reinfested tho lol. | ||
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DarthYAM
19 Posts
On March 14 2013 05:38 Serpest wrote: I miss BW..... I mean seriously. Kerrigan AFTER the overmind was killed - so she's her own person again (which she flat out acknowledges in an effort to get Jim Raynor, Zeratul, Fenix, Arcturus (WHO SHE FORGIVES? IGNORES? in order to help him become emperor of Korhal) and Duke on her side), betrays all 5 (Fenix, Duke and Rashagal die), and takes on everybody (UED, Dominion and Protoss) and then we get WoL and HotS where that's all retconned and armwaved away..... WHY?!?!? Why not just come up with the SC2 campaign as it should have been ourselves? Those of us who feel letdown and such, why don't we rectify Blizzard's failings and develop the SC2 Campaign. Obligatory: The Queen Bitch of the Universe is dead. Long live Kerrigan, Long live the Queen of Blades. (Why do we have a sappy damsel in distress in her place?!?) T_T Because given that even when she was in the chrysalis she called for help, given that she was a relatively moral individual prior to infestation the idea of it being entirely her own choice was always stupid. Brood war had some things to like, but overall the story was pretty damn stupid. WOL had flaws (the nonlinear storytelling) but those who say it "rapes the lore" are being silly | ||
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DarthYAM
19 Posts
On March 14 2013 05:43 Atticus.axl wrote: No you're completely correct about this part. Could she technically fly through the window outside and kill him instantly? Yes. Could she direct her entire swarm to bring him to her, thus removing any danger? Yes. But no, she has to become a damsel in distress again, and rely on big strong man Jim to save the day. No he's not. He caught her off guard with something that had already defeated her, and the pain took out those others. | ||
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DarthYAM
19 Posts
On March 14 2013 05:12 Shake n Blake wrote: If you're being completely honest, then i must inform you that your standards of quality story telling and character development are very, very low. For a lot of gamers however, this is not uncommon, given that they're unlikely to do lots of reading outside of the gaming industry. (There simply isn't enough quality story-telling among triple A titles nowadays to make gaming a substitute for literature.) Other people in this thread have already expressed my reasons for despising the SC2 story arc so much and why the character development is so disgustingly incongruent to SC:BW. (Raynor's baffling decision making that makes him totally unrelatable to his personality & performance in SC1, Big bad Amon turns out to be the real villian and Kerrigan is somehow now the hero . . . oh and my personal gripe being Zeratul's abysmal voice acting, but that's just me comparing his voice to the outstanding original actor. Seriously, try comparing the two and I think you'll understand where I'm coming from.) I can just imagine Metzen picking up a harlequin novel and thinking how brilliant it would be to structure Jim & Kerrigan's relationship around it in HOTS, along with the cliched and uninspired dialogue. ("Like riding a bike!" O___O Honestly, how could've ANYONE at Blizzard read their fucking script and thought to themselves, "brilliant! We're gonna set a new standard for story telling in gaming, an original cliff hanger for LotV!") This doesn't leave much hope for LotV sadly, which makes me even more worried about Blizzard's say in how the Warcraft movie script is written, but I digress. I feel our only hope is if Blizzard fires Metzen now before he douses the maybe-salvagable train wreck that is SC2's storyline in gasoline and lights a match . . . . First of all it's not discustingly incongruent. Raynor's broken by years of failure, and while he has fond memories of Kerrigan prior to the QoB he hates the new one and views killing her as much an act of euthanasia as vengeance. Kerrigan's evil is revealed to be in part because the infestation and amon's taint surpressed her morality, hence when the artifact dezergified her she regained morality. Raynor faces his past over each mission and finally makes peace. Again, completely relatable. He climbs back from being broken and regains his fire. The dialogue was fine, and given that Metzen is the guy who WROTE the original starcraft and most games, firing him aint going to happen. Kerrigan in brood war was snively whiplash. Here she has (gasp) REAL CHARACTER DEPTH AND PERSONALITY BESIDES BEING SADISTIC. It didn't go the way you want, but that doesn't make it bad. | ||
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DarthYAM
19 Posts
On March 14 2013 05:53 Slaughter wrote: I don't think you can make such assumptions about him because he has a different point of a view on pretty much a purely subjective matter (plot being enjoyable or not). I don't know why people are so up in arms about Jims transition of feelings for Kerrigan between SC:BW and SC2. He was pretty much TOLD straight up "Kerrigan lives or everyone and everything dies" This of course just gives him an excuse to let go of his anger (that and its been 4 years) and he has always carried love for her. Its not surprising at all. Plus why the hell does every characters actions have to be 100% logical/in line with previous depictions? Real people make a combination of weird/bad/good/stupid decisions all the time and they change over time so why are people married to this ONE depiction of Raynor when he was in full rage mode (at the end of BW) to 4 years later? Because they either grew up on it, or feel that dark and grim is automatically good storytelling. | ||
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Bobgrimly
New Zealand250 Posts
Seriously can no one write a decent love story anymore? Can no one remember lore where jim was going to kill kerrigan if he ever got the chance. Can no one do anything other than a cheesy rip of romeo and juliet? Is that all any big budget movie/game is going to come up with for the rest of eternity? Why the hell can't they hire some decent writers?????? Is it because stephanie meyer proved you don't have to be a good writer to sell millions? I want to play the final chapter but I fear how cliched and pathetic it will be. So far hots has surpassed my fears for its ability to fail me more than wol. And I fear lotv will be worse again. | ||
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LingsAreBunnies
United States103 Posts
there are also a few things that didnt make sense to me. + Show Spoiler + 1. Why did kerrigan kill warfield without saying anything or hesitating? he was one of the people that helped her getting her humanity back 2. Why did she charge zeratul and just started whacking him? what did he even do to her? 3. If she wasnt willing to kill civilians for her goal, or was willing to spare warfields army when asked, why would she be willing to infest a bunch of prisoners for her goal? | ||
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Gatesleeper
Canada300 Posts
The big points have already been covered in this thread by Warlock40 (page 11) and abominare (Page 15). The people who disagree with these guys are using shitty plot points introduced in SC2 (The Prophecy, Amon is the new big baddy, Xel'Naga artifact as all purpose character development fixer) to defend shitty character development. The stupidity of the whole campaign, and perhaps the whole sequel so far, culminates in the final mission of HotS. Stop for a minute and look at what's happening here. Our human hero, Jim Raynor, is helping an army of Zerg kill an army of Terran. Imagine the HotS opening cinematic where the Zerg are killing Terrans on Korhal, that version of the attack is just a vision/dream Kerrigan has, but then it actually happens. Now imagine that Jim Raynor and his own army of Raiders are on the side of the Zerg in that cinematic and are helping them kill the Dominion. Jim Raynor, our perennial good guy, comes to the aid of Kerrigan, essentially forgiving her for all her past and present crimes (remember, she is still killing humans throughout the whole HotS campaign). In cutscene we see her telepathically commanding her brood mothers to attack and infest entire Terran planets. Do we assume that Raynor never found out about those planets? Or, as abominare said "do we just have to assume that every [Dominion] marine is a card carrying SS member". Remember in the beginning of Wings of Liberty when Kerrigan begins attacking Terran worlds, a news report in the game says "billions of casualties". I always thought that number was ludicrously high, maybe it was an exaggeration on part of the newscaster? So in SC2, Kerrigan has killed at least millions, if not billions, of human beings, mostly in her quest to kill one man she doesn't like. Or does that not count because she was under the influence of Amon? That is so dumb. It is established in SC1 that after The Overmind dies, Kerrigan is 100% in control of her actions. She is responsible for everything she does. But wait, we gotta have a Zerg campaign for our second expansion pack, better retcon the shit out of Kerrigan and make her a good guy! abominare reminds us to "keep in mind shes a god damn ghost who specialize in covert assassinations not involving giant wars". Not only was Kerrigan a ghost, she was the best, most gifted ghost in the history of the program. It would've made a lot more sense if Kerrigan chose to say as Terran and killed Mengsk using human means. Watching Kerrigan try to plan out a way to assassinate Mengsk as a ghost, that would've been fun. Holy shit I just made up the plot for Starcraft: Ghost 2. Anyway, if you thought the final mission was stupid, you're not ready for the final cinematic. It was written by a 6 year old, and goes like this: So Kerrigan is in the palace and all these marines and vikings are shooting at her but she's too fast and she jumps in the air and then lands and does her psionic thing and blows them all up. Next we see Mengsk sitting in his office and he's looking all smug and shit while he pulls out a cigar box. In it is a cigar and also this remote control thing, what is that, we don't know yet! Keep watching! Kerrigan tears through his door with her wings and shit and walks up to him and is all like "I'mma kill you now." But then Mengsk turns around and says "nope I'mma kill you" and presses his remote and suddenly the Xel'Naga Artifact comes out of the floor and zaps Kerrigan! Oh no, Kerrigan is down and zapped and can't get up. Mengsk gloats over her saying "lol I'm killing you" for a minute and is about to zap her again but then Raynor comes out of nowhere and beats Mengsk up! He breaks the remote and now Mengsk is defenseless. Kerrigan walks up to Mengsk and stabs him with her Wings, and says "okay I'm killing you now", then she puts psionic stuff into Mengsk's mouth and he blows up! Pa-chew! The whole office blows up. (We only see this from the outside because gore is gross, remember, this is written by a 6 year old, not a 12 year old). Kerrigan and Raynor walk onto the newly made balcony and tell each other that they love each other 5ever. Then Kerrigan floats away smiling knowing that today was a good day where thousands of human beings died to sate the bloodlust of one woman. Raynor is okay with this because he didn't like Mengsk either. | ||
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Psychobabas
2531 Posts
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Existor
Russian Federation4295 Posts
On March 14 2013 06:55 Psychobabas wrote: HotS portraits are terrible imo. I don't like this new art-style on them. Too cartoonish. Old portraits were more cartoonish than current ones. All new portraits are photoshoped original ones or parts of artwork. | ||
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