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TSL Disbands - Page 33

Forum Index > SC2 General
692 CommentsPost a Reply
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DiMano
Profile Joined July 2011
Korea (South)2066 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-04 12:02:27
January 04 2013 12:01 GMT
#641
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though
Shinta)
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1716 Posts
January 04 2013 12:04 GMT
#642
Professionalism was not given a chance, so Coach Lee left. Makes sense.
Sad thing is that we're still hoping for the scene to grow professionally, so Coach Lee have given up a few years before the game actually matured. He was too stressed out by the current state. T_T
Suteki Da Ne 素敵だね Isn't it Wonderful
Kontys
Profile Joined October 2011
Finland659 Posts
January 04 2013 12:30 GMT
#643
Rest in Pieces. I hope to keep my favourite team icon for as long as I can.

I will follow Polt, Symbol and HyuN wherever they go.. I also had great hopes for Center, and I'll watch him through the Up&Downs of the next season of GSL.
S_SienZ
Profile Joined September 2011
1878 Posts
January 04 2013 14:59 GMT
#644
On January 04 2013 21:01 DiMano wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though

They wouldn't have gotten a new team house if they had money trouble though

Pretty sure it will be NSH.
DiMano
Profile Joined July 2011
Korea (South)2066 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-04 15:27:07
January 04 2013 15:26 GMT
#645
On January 04 2013 23:59 S_SienZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 04 2013 21:01 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though

They wouldn't have gotten a new team house if they had money trouble though

Pretty sure it will be NSH.

TSL also got a new team house and? NSH has more players then Prime and if you watched GSL Blizz Cup there were a lot of players in NSH shirts.

Anyway I really really hope both Prime and NSH will not disband.
Divine-Sneaker
Profile Joined August 2010
Denmark1225 Posts
January 04 2013 15:27 GMT
#646
Sad day. TSL were awesome back in beta/early release days and to this day fostered some great talents. Also really liked hyun. Hope their talents get picked up by good teams.
tili
Profile Joined July 2012
United States1332 Posts
January 04 2013 15:50 GMT
#647
On January 04 2013 05:34 Fionn wrote:
Also I feel like Azubu fucked up.

They sign a bunch of middle of the road players.

A week later and they could have talked to Polt, Parting, Supernova, Symbol, Hyun, and BboongBboong.

Oops.


Haha, this is true.

In a way it's good though, because those players are going to find good homes no matter what, and the more middle of the roaders now have a salaried(?) chance at full time
executorx
Profile Joined July 2012
Germany81 Posts
January 04 2013 15:52 GMT
#648
Holy Fuck....

Polt leaves, Revival leaves and than the team disbands

Gl to the players that they will find new teams.
INnoVation > ALL!
TheRealNanMan
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1471 Posts
January 04 2013 16:25 GMT
#649
Such a sad day when any team disbands but TSL has been fighting to stay alive for a long time I had hoped that they were able to stabilize but with sponsorship money lacking it makes sense that they chose now to disband. I hope all the players find homes soon!
Sc2 Caster | Host of Sc2 Up & Coming | The Godfather of Team LXG | Sc2 Historian | Youtube.com/NanMan | Twitch.tv/TheRealNanMan | Twitter.com/TheRealNanMan |
S_SienZ
Profile Joined September 2011
1878 Posts
January 04 2013 16:32 GMT
#650
On January 05 2013 00:26 DiMano wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 04 2013 23:59 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 04 2013 21:01 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though

They wouldn't have gotten a new team house if they had money trouble though

Pretty sure it will be NSH.

TSL also got a new team house and? NSH has more players then Prime and if you watched GSL Blizz Cup there were a lot of players in NSH shirts.

Anyway I really really hope both Prime and NSH will not disband.

and Polt and RevivaL left. Prime has yet to lose any significant player since B4 left.

So what if NSH has more players than Prime? So do many other teams. But Prime has more Code S players and has overall a much stronger roster than NSH. NSH would've been forgotten by now if it wasn't for jjakji.
dArkko
Profile Joined January 2012
France34 Posts
January 04 2013 16:52 GMT
#651
damn
jmbthirteen
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States10734 Posts
January 04 2013 18:04 GMT
#652
On January 05 2013 01:32 S_SienZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 05 2013 00:26 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 23:59 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 04 2013 21:01 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though

They wouldn't have gotten a new team house if they had money trouble though

Pretty sure it will be NSH.

TSL also got a new team house and? NSH has more players then Prime and if you watched GSL Blizz Cup there were a lot of players in NSH shirts.

Anyway I really really hope both Prime and NSH will not disband.

and Polt and RevivaL left. Prime has yet to lose any significant player since B4 left.

So what if NSH has more players than Prime? So do many other teams. But Prime has more Code S players and has overall a much stronger roster than NSH. NSH would've been forgotten by now if it wasn't for jjakji.

dont you get it? it has nothing to do with roster strength. They could have MVP, Nestea, DRG, MC, MKP, but if they don't have major sponsors, it doesn't matter. Prime was begging for Twitch subscriptions just like a month ago. You don't do that if you team is in good position financially.
www.superbeerbrothers.com
Shellshock
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States97276 Posts
January 04 2013 18:05 GMT
#653
It was MJ Team. BBoongBBoong was at IPL5 and they disbanded now
Moderatorhttp://i.imgur.com/U4xwqmD.png
TL+ Member
AnomalySC2
Profile Joined August 2012
United States2073 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-04 19:43:29
January 04 2013 19:39 GMT
#654
On January 05 2013 03:04 jmbthirteen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 05 2013 01:32 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 05 2013 00:26 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 23:59 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 04 2013 21:01 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though

They wouldn't have gotten a new team house if they had money trouble though

Pretty sure it will be NSH.

TSL also got a new team house and? NSH has more players then Prime and if you watched GSL Blizz Cup there were a lot of players in NSH shirts.

Anyway I really really hope both Prime and NSH will not disband.

and Polt and RevivaL left. Prime has yet to lose any significant player since B4 left.

So what if NSH has more players than Prime? So do many other teams. But Prime has more Code S players and has overall a much stronger roster than NSH. NSH would've been forgotten by now if it wasn't for jjakji.

dont you get it? it has nothing to do with roster strength. They could have MVP, Nestea, DRG, MC, MKP, but if they don't have major sponsors, it doesn't matter. Prime was begging for Twitch subscriptions just like a month ago. You don't do that if you team is in good position financially.



It's because the viewer numbers just aren't there. No viewers, no sponsors. Everyone is switching to LoL :\. That is especially true in Korea, the game has swept through esports like the plague and left nothing else. Its popularity is staggering.
Lunareste
Profile Joined July 2011
United States3596 Posts
January 04 2013 19:43 GMT
#655
On January 05 2013 04:39 AnomalySC2 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 05 2013 03:04 jmbthirteen wrote:
On January 05 2013 01:32 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 05 2013 00:26 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 23:59 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 04 2013 21:01 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though

They wouldn't have gotten a new team house if they had money trouble though

Pretty sure it will be NSH.

TSL also got a new team house and? NSH has more players then Prime and if you watched GSL Blizz Cup there were a lot of players in NSH shirts.

Anyway I really really hope both Prime and NSH will not disband.

and Polt and RevivaL left. Prime has yet to lose any significant player since B4 left.

So what if NSH has more players than Prime? So do many other teams. But Prime has more Code S players and has overall a much stronger roster than NSH. NSH would've been forgotten by now if it wasn't for jjakji.

dont you get it? it has nothing to do with roster strength. They could have MVP, Nestea, DRG, MC, MKP, but if they don't have major sponsors, it doesn't matter. Prime was begging for Twitch subscriptions just like a month ago. You don't do that if you team is in good position financially.



It's because the viewer numbers just aren't there. No viewers, no sponsors. Everyone is switching to LoL :\. That is especially true in Korea, the game has swept through esports like the plague and left nothing else. Its popularity is staggering.


On January 03 2013 17:57 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 03 2013 17:50 WhiteSatin wrote:
Companies don't wanna sponsor a game with a limited viewership number like SC2, and if the trend continues, unfortunately I see this happening for other teams soon.

2011 was probably one of the best years for SC2, so unfortunate that stagnation of map pool, terrible balance decisions that brought the game to a shitty metagame that is super boring to watch, are slowly killing viewership number and by consequences, teams
2012 was super terrible.
I hope 2013 will be a great year for SC2 and can go back to its 2011 numbers and even better, but I am pretty negative because I think Blizzard will manage to fuck it up, yet again T_T

This is absolutely not the case, people really need to stop saying this. Any sport from top to bottom can find sponsorships based on viewership numbers. Just because there is something bigger out there does not mean there is no worth. If that were the case no sport below the largest would be able to find sponsors. There is plenty of opportunity for sponsorship dollars in StarCraft2.

The issue is too many people want to be a part of it. It is only natural to lose some along the way when that happens. This goes for tournaments, teams, and players. There are simply too many teams in Korea and only the ones with the best business structure will survive in the long run. Korean teams never evolved with the scene. They took a laid back BroodWar approach of no streaming, no social media, no websites. In BroodWar the teams were carried by being on TV. In StarCraft2 they did not have such a pitch and never got their act together.
KT FlaSh FOREVER
AnomalySC2
Profile Joined August 2012
United States2073 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-04 19:53:54
January 04 2013 19:51 GMT
#656
On January 05 2013 04:43 Lunareste wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 05 2013 04:39 AnomalySC2 wrote:
On January 05 2013 03:04 jmbthirteen wrote:
On January 05 2013 01:32 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 05 2013 00:26 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 23:59 S_SienZ wrote:
On January 04 2013 21:01 DiMano wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:57 opterown wrote:
On January 04 2013 20:56 DiMano wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

It is about Prime.

how are you so sure it's prime?

The news when they promote their streams, BBoong, AriA and Salmosa leaving the team, Prime players were at IPL5, they have the smallest roster among korean teams even NSH has more players and I doubt that it can be MVP, ST or IM. Ofc I am not 100% sure though

They wouldn't have gotten a new team house if they had money trouble though

Pretty sure it will be NSH.

TSL also got a new team house and? NSH has more players then Prime and if you watched GSL Blizz Cup there were a lot of players in NSH shirts.

Anyway I really really hope both Prime and NSH will not disband.

and Polt and RevivaL left. Prime has yet to lose any significant player since B4 left.

So what if NSH has more players than Prime? So do many other teams. But Prime has more Code S players and has overall a much stronger roster than NSH. NSH would've been forgotten by now if it wasn't for jjakji.

dont you get it? it has nothing to do with roster strength. They could have MVP, Nestea, DRG, MC, MKP, but if they don't have major sponsors, it doesn't matter. Prime was begging for Twitch subscriptions just like a month ago. You don't do that if you team is in good position financially.



It's because the viewer numbers just aren't there. No viewers, no sponsors. Everyone is switching to LoL :\. That is especially true in Korea, the game has swept through esports like the plague and left nothing else. Its popularity is staggering.


Show nested quote +
On January 03 2013 17:57 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
On January 03 2013 17:50 WhiteSatin wrote:
Companies don't wanna sponsor a game with a limited viewership number like SC2, and if the trend continues, unfortunately I see this happening for other teams soon.

2011 was probably one of the best years for SC2, so unfortunate that stagnation of map pool, terrible balance decisions that brought the game to a shitty metagame that is super boring to watch, are slowly killing viewership number and by consequences, teams
2012 was super terrible.
I hope 2013 will be a great year for SC2 and can go back to its 2011 numbers and even better, but I am pretty negative because I think Blizzard will manage to fuck it up, yet again T_T

This is absolutely not the case, people really need to stop saying this. Any sport from top to bottom can find sponsorships based on viewership numbers. Just because there is something bigger out there does not mean there is no worth. If that were the case no sport below the largest would be able to find sponsors. There is plenty of opportunity for sponsorship dollars in StarCraft2.

The issue is too many people want to be a part of it. It is only natural to lose some along the way when that happens. This goes for tournaments, teams, and players. There are simply too many teams in Korea and only the ones with the best business structure will survive in the long run. Korean teams never evolved with the scene. They took a laid back BroodWar approach of no streaming, no social media, no websites. In BroodWar the teams were carried by being on TV. In StarCraft2 they did not have such a pitch and never got their act together.





And yet, the viewer numbers are still consistantly dropping for sc2 (and growing for LoL). You can keep making convenient excuses like the one above but that would just be ignoring the core problem. The game has grown boring to play and to watch thanks to the constant patching. Not to mention, we rarely ever got games on the same excitement level as BW in the first place, but that's an argument for another day...
N.geNuity
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States5112 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-04 20:52:34
January 04 2013 20:46 GMT
#657
I have to disagree with nazgul saying it's a "laidback BroodWar approach" because all the most popular competitive games in korea--LoL, special forces, starcraft 1, warcraft 3-- have all been picked up by the big chaebols (south korean business conglomerate) eventually. If the game is popular enough, it gets picked up; it's proven to work and it is not unique to brood war.

When its big chaebols doing the sponsoring (LG, Samsung, CJ, KT, SKT) and some other large companies (woongjin which actually has some financial troubles that made international news, Najin industries, STX corporation) tv viewership does matter a lot. They are treating LoL as a professional sport essentially and treated BW as a professional sport; kespa will hope sc2 grows and sudden attack is very popular but has less viewership.

don't know how much razer is sponsoring MVP teams, and azubu is throwing its weight around in esports now. But those chaebols + MVP, azubu, najin,stx, woongjin covers the main korean owned teams except startale and prime for both LoL and sc2 in korea. Wemade and Hwaseung pulled out their investments.

It is not the best to your players to just "hope" a big sponsor picks you up--that's the problem sc2 korean teams have-- but all the popular multiplayer competitive games did get investment from big companies or from game publishers themselves in korea (Hanbit, Wemade, I don't know what to classify estro as but estro was IEG investment afaik) so it's proven to work. The mentality is to get picked up by a big corporation, I assume, because all the big non MMO games--which are huge in Maple story, Aion, Blade & Soul, and the sidescroller Dungeon fighter-- eventually got picked up.

Warcraft 3 players got picked up by estro, samsung, wemade (lyn and moon), and hanbit; starcraft 1 got huge investment from the chaebols; sudden attack has investments from the same chaebols and most kespa teams had sudden attack teams; LoL is dominant in korea and the chaebols have picked up teams, and sponsors are even buying 2 teams at once (najin, mvp, kt, azubu) and getting the huge esports personalities in Reach and YellOw to be coaches. I am not personally familiar with any history besides starcraft but you can look these things up.

LoL and special forces are #1 and #2 in online game rankings with those other 4 MMO games rounding out top 6, and top 4 streamed games are LoL, Star1 BW, minecraft, and Sudden attack. If a game is popular enough, it brings in the chaebols. Western teams bring in money by pooling in various sponsors, but eastern teams in warcraft 3, star1, sudden attack, LoL, and dota do get picked up by major companies. Yes, it's not good to the players to just hope a chaebol picks up the team, but the chaebols and equivalent companies for chinese dota are going to win out in korea/china, NOT teams that can "evolve" to a new business model in streaming/social media. At least not in the east, imho.

edit: on topic I guess TSL failed to get the big sponsor and that's going to be the case with the rest of star2 teams in korea. LG came in for LG-IM, MVP apparently has faith in getting 2 LoL teams and their sc2 team, FXO is foreign owned, but I'd expect prime and startale to get in trouble soon.
iu, seungah, yura, taeyeon, hyosung, lizzy, suji, sojin, jia, ji eun, eunji, soya, younha, jiyeon, fiestar, sinb, jung myung hoon godtier. BW FOREVERR
Inzan1ty
Profile Joined September 2012
1163 Posts
January 04 2013 20:52 GMT
#658
sad,I sincerely hope Polt and the Zergs get picked up by none other than fnatic

aLive will regain his strength from TSL anno 2011, and OZ can get his PvT on par with his PvZ, what a cool team that would be


RIP Seung Hyun 'Space' Park † 6/5/2013 - Undead hero and eSports rolemodel
Silencioseu
Profile Joined June 2011
Cyprus493 Posts
January 04 2013 21:57 GMT
#659
The other unstable team is most likely to be NSH as Prime has pretty stable sponsors, and NSH has been in trouble for a long time now.
i kno i r badass no need to repeat
Milkis
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
5003 Posts
January 04 2013 23:15 GMT
#660
On January 05 2013 05:46 N.geNuity wrote:
I have to disagree with nazgul saying it's a "laidback BroodWar approach" because all the most popular competitive games in korea--LoL, special forces, starcraft 1, warcraft 3-- have all been picked up by the big chaebols (south korean business conglomerate) eventually. If the game is popular enough, it gets picked up; it's proven to work and it is not unique to brood war.

When its big chaebols doing the sponsoring (LG, Samsung, CJ, KT, SKT) and some other large companies (woongjin which actually has some financial troubles that made international news, Najin industries, STX corporation) tv viewership does matter a lot. They are treating LoL as a professional sport essentially and treated BW as a professional sport; kespa will hope sc2 grows and sudden attack is very popular but has less viewership.

don't know how much razer is sponsoring MVP teams, and azubu is throwing its weight around in esports now. But those chaebols + MVP, azubu, najin,stx, woongjin covers the main korean owned teams except startale and prime for both LoL and sc2 in korea. Wemade and Hwaseung pulled out their investments.

It is not the best to your players to just "hope" a big sponsor picks you up--that's the problem sc2 korean teams have-- but all the popular multiplayer competitive games did get investment from big companies or from game publishers themselves in korea (Hanbit, Wemade, I don't know what to classify estro as but estro was IEG investment afaik) so it's proven to work. The mentality is to get picked up by a big corporation, I assume, because all the big non MMO games--which are huge in Maple story, Aion, Blade & Soul, and the sidescroller Dungeon fighter-- eventually got picked up.

Warcraft 3 players got picked up by estro, samsung, wemade (lyn and moon), and hanbit; starcraft 1 got huge investment from the chaebols; sudden attack has investments from the same chaebols and most kespa teams had sudden attack teams; LoL is dominant in korea and the chaebols have picked up teams, and sponsors are even buying 2 teams at once (najin, mvp, kt, azubu) and getting the huge esports personalities in Reach and YellOw to be coaches. I am not personally familiar with any history besides starcraft but you can look these things up.

LoL and special forces are #1 and #2 in online game rankings with those other 4 MMO games rounding out top 6, and top 4 streamed games are LoL, Star1 BW, minecraft, and Sudden attack. If a game is popular enough, it brings in the chaebols. Western teams bring in money by pooling in various sponsors, but eastern teams in warcraft 3, star1, sudden attack, LoL, and dota do get picked up by major companies. Yes, it's not good to the players to just hope a chaebol picks up the team, but the chaebols and equivalent companies for chinese dota are going to win out in korea/china, NOT teams that can "evolve" to a new business model in streaming/social media. At least not in the east, imho.

edit: on topic I guess TSL failed to get the big sponsor and that's going to be the case with the rest of star2 teams in korea. LG came in for LG-IM, MVP apparently has faith in getting 2 LoL teams and their sc2 team, FXO is foreign owned, but I'd expect prime and startale to get in trouble soon.


To be fair it was the entire IP rights debacle that stopped SC2 scene from being picked up by KeSPA. A lot of teams in Korea also really made teams with the mentality to sell their teams to KeSPA corporations when there was a switch but that never ended up happening thanks to the debacle. So they struggled quite a bit after figuring out no one was going to come and sponsor them and eventually died out :O

SC2 had a lot of hype in Korea for a while you know, things just didn't go smoothly.
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