|
Northern Ireland25353 Posts
On December 07 2012 07:45 Hider wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2012 07:32 Wombat_NI wrote:
Agreed with 4 Hider, but I mean that's not to say us TLers can not find cool ideas that pros could play around with.
Destiny showed the potential of Infestors long before other players had latched on and really refined the styles. Destiny also pplayed at a level above your average TL guy (like mid GM). I'd say if you think you can actually invent something that will have an impact on high level play and you are like a platinum or something like that, you are lying to your self. (which people often do IRL because they don't want to face the truth).
Of course, don't want to derail the thread. In those kind of cases, generally a higher level player can show you why your idea wouldn't work
Destiny relative to say, Life is as big a gap though between a low Masters player and a GM, if not bigger. People said he was gimmicky and that his style that let him beat the likes of Huk and Bomber in showmatches would be 'figured out', in his case he fell off, but his ideas were incorporated by better Zergs.
|
On December 07 2012 07:58 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2012 07:45 Hider wrote:On December 07 2012 07:32 Wombat_NI wrote:
Agreed with 4 Hider, but I mean that's not to say us TLers can not find cool ideas that pros could play around with.
Destiny showed the potential of Infestors long before other players had latched on and really refined the styles. Destiny also pplayed at a level above your average TL guy (like mid GM). I'd say if you think you can actually invent something that will have an impact on high level play and you are like a platinum or something like that, you are lying to your self. (which people often do IRL because they don't want to face the truth). Of course, don't want to derail the thread. In those kind of cases, generally a higher level player can show you why your idea wouldn't work Destiny relative to say, Life is as big a gap though between a low Masters player and a GM, if not bigger. People said he was gimmicky and that his style that let him beat the likes of Huk and Bomber in showmatches would be 'figured out', in his case he fell off, but his ideas were incorporated by better Zergs.
True, but in general odds of you inventing something is just way less the worse you are.
Say you are a top GM player and when you actually think you invented something useful, odds are maybe 10-50% that it in fact is usefull.
When a high master think he he invent something usefull odds are maybe 1-5% for his invention to be useful.
For a diamond player --> less than 1%.
and it keeps declining exponentially. So odds of a player that watches Day9/reads strategy forums on TL and plays once or twice a month = 0.0000000000000000000000000001%. or something like that.
It's just a much better use of time playing the game rather than theorycrafting for 99.9% of all players.
|
On December 07 2012 08:14 Hider wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2012 07:58 Wombat_NI wrote:On December 07 2012 07:45 Hider wrote:On December 07 2012 07:32 Wombat_NI wrote:
Agreed with 4 Hider, but I mean that's not to say us TLers can not find cool ideas that pros could play around with.
Destiny showed the potential of Infestors long before other players had latched on and really refined the styles. Destiny also pplayed at a level above your average TL guy (like mid GM). I'd say if you think you can actually invent something that will have an impact on high level play and you are like a platinum or something like that, you are lying to your self. (which people often do IRL because they don't want to face the truth). Of course, don't want to derail the thread. In those kind of cases, generally a higher level player can show you why your idea wouldn't work Destiny relative to say, Life is as big a gap though between a low Masters player and a GM, if not bigger. People said he was gimmicky and that his style that let him beat the likes of Huk and Bomber in showmatches would be 'figured out', in his case he fell off, but his ideas were incorporated by better Zergs. True, but in general odds of you inventing something is just way less the worse you are. Say you are a top GM player and when you actually think you invented something useful, odds are maybe 10-50% that it in fact is usefull. When a high master think he he invent something usefull odds are maybe 1-5% for his invention to be useful. For a diamond player --> less than 1%. and it keeps declining exponentially. So odds of a player that watches Day9/reads strategy forums on TL and plays once or twice a month = 0.0000000000000000000000000001%. or something like that. It's just a much better use of time playing the game rather than theorycrafting for 99.9% of all players.
95% of all statistics on the internet are made up on the spot. -.-
|
Those pictures did it for me.
I honestly couldn't tell which Zerg was which with the Infestor/Broodlord pics, but I could easily tell who was playing with the Zergling/Baneling/Mutalisk pictures.
|
On December 07 2012 08:16 Hryul wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2012 08:14 Hider wrote:On December 07 2012 07:58 Wombat_NI wrote:On December 07 2012 07:45 Hider wrote:On December 07 2012 07:32 Wombat_NI wrote:
Agreed with 4 Hider, but I mean that's not to say us TLers can not find cool ideas that pros could play around with.
Destiny showed the potential of Infestors long before other players had latched on and really refined the styles. Destiny also pplayed at a level above your average TL guy (like mid GM). I'd say if you think you can actually invent something that will have an impact on high level play and you are like a platinum or something like that, you are lying to your self. (which people often do IRL because they don't want to face the truth). Of course, don't want to derail the thread. In those kind of cases, generally a higher level player can show you why your idea wouldn't work Destiny relative to say, Life is as big a gap though between a low Masters player and a GM, if not bigger. People said he was gimmicky and that his style that let him beat the likes of Huk and Bomber in showmatches would be 'figured out', in his case he fell off, but his ideas were incorporated by better Zergs. True, but in general odds of you inventing something is just way less the worse you are. Say you are a top GM player and when you actually think you invented something useful, odds are maybe 10-50% that it in fact is usefull. When a high master think he he invent something usefull odds are maybe 1-5% for his invention to be useful. For a diamond player --> less than 1%. and it keeps declining exponentially. So odds of a player that watches Day9/reads strategy forums on TL and plays once or twice a month = 0.0000000000000000000000000001%. or something like that. It's just a much better use of time playing the game rather than theorycrafting for 99.9% of all players. 95% of all statistics on the internet are made up on the spot. -.-
99% of all TL posters are completely usefull.
Especially since you misunderstood the intention of using actual statistics and using clear fictive numbers to make a point easier to understand.
|
It is HILARIOUS!! how some people still say "your supposed to stop him from getting to the late game its your fault!!" to a terran about the TvZ match up.
Thats the biggets crock of B.S. I ever heard in my life. And if you truly believe in this way of thinking for dealing with balance, you should jump off a bridge. Lets see you stop DRG from getting to the late game with this analyzation. The truth is........MOST (IF NOT ALL) pro gamers, will bring the game into the late game. So if you have this mentality you are most likely a bronze retard living in your basement at your moms house going to college trying to get a liberal arts degree and still working at starbucks. Your brain has to be literaly the size of a pea, and if you even dare post your non sensical shit on teamliquid again with any ounce of pride.......YOU SHOULD SUICIDE. I wish I was a mod i'd ban your ass so fast, then drive to your house and beat the fuck out of you.
Also, you probably voted for Obama, so get off your ass and call mommy crying on your Obama phone kid!!
And do us all a favor and crack your sc2 disc in half.
Thanks
User was temp banned for this post.
|
what sense does it even make that infestors can move underground without any upgrade?
what sense does it even make that infestors can cast infested terrans from under the ground?
start with nerfing that, see where it goes, then do something more radical if they are still way too good.
|
Northern Ireland25353 Posts
On December 07 2012 08:54 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
It is HILARIOUS!! how some people still say "your supposed to stop him from getting to the late game its your fault!!" to a terran about the TvZ match up.
Thats the biggets crock of B.S. I ever heard in my life. And if you truly believe in this way of thinking for dealing with balance, you should jump off a bridge. Lets see you stop DRG from getting to the late game with this analyzation. The truth is........MOST (IF NOT ALL) pro gamers, will bring the game into the late game. So if you have this mentality you are most likely a bronze retard living in your basement at your moms house going to college trying to get a liberal arts degree and still working at starbucks. Your brain has to be literaly the size of a pea, and if you even dare post your non sensical shit on teamliquid again with any ounce of pride.......YOU SHOULD SUICIDE. I wish I was a mod i'd ban your ass so fast, then drive to your house and beat the fuck out of you.
Also, you probably voted for Obama, so get off your ass and call mommy crying on your Obama phone kid!!
And do us all a favor and crack your sc2 disc in half.
Thanks
.......
People have no problem with the lategame strength of a race, it's not like people are idiots, they just have an issue with it not being that, but more 'don't let them get inf/bl'
If Zergs were doing things like getting to 6 bases and trading armies to win, nobody would have an issue with their lategame.
|
On December 07 2012 09:02 Toxi78 wrote:
what sense does it even make that infestors can move underground without any upgrade?
what sense does it even make that infestors can cast infested terrans from under the ground?
start with nerfing that, see where it goes, then do something more radical if they are still way too good.
Youre breaking TL rules. No balance whining.
|
On December 07 2012 09:23 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2012 08:54 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
It is HILARIOUS!! how some people still say "your supposed to stop him from getting to the late game its your fault!!" to a terran about the TvZ match up.
Thats the biggets crock of B.S. I ever heard in my life. And if you truly believe in this way of thinking for dealing with balance, you should jump off a bridge. Lets see you stop DRG from getting to the late game with this analyzation. The truth is........MOST (IF NOT ALL) pro gamers, will bring the game into the late game. So if you have this mentality you are most likely a bronze retard living in your basement at your moms house going to college trying to get a liberal arts degree and still working at starbucks. Your brain has to be literaly the size of a pea, and if you even dare post your non sensical shit on teamliquid again with any ounce of pride.......YOU SHOULD SUICIDE. I wish I was a mod i'd ban your ass so fast, then drive to your house and beat the fuck out of you.
Also, you probably voted for Obama, so get off your ass and call mommy crying on your Obama phone kid!!
And do us all a favor and crack your sc2 disc in half.
Thanks ....... People have no problem with the lategame strength of a race, it's not like people are idiots, they just have an issue with it not being that, but more 'don't let them get inf/bl' If Zergs were doing things like getting to 6 bases and trading armies to win, nobody would have an issue with their lategame.
"People have no problem with the lategame strength of a race, it's not like people are idiots, they just have an issue with it not being that, but more 'don't let them get inf/bl'"
All i have to do is quote that line that you said, and prove that your one of the ones I was talking about.
People have no problem about the late game strength of a race? Are you kidding me? Please say that again 100x in your head and realize how dumb it is.
Thx~
|
Soo is extremely talented!!! It's an awesome feat to take down one of the best Terrans ever. Good job, Soo. You deserved it! Exceptional skill. :D
|
Northern Ireland25353 Posts
On December 07 2012 09:26 NaEjeOn88 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2012 09:23 Wombat_NI wrote:On December 07 2012 08:54 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
It is HILARIOUS!! how some people still say "your supposed to stop him from getting to the late game its your fault!!" to a terran about the TvZ match up.
Thats the biggets crock of B.S. I ever heard in my life. And if you truly believe in this way of thinking for dealing with balance, you should jump off a bridge. Lets see you stop DRG from getting to the late game with this analyzation. The truth is........MOST (IF NOT ALL) pro gamers, will bring the game into the late game. So if you have this mentality you are most likely a bronze retard living in your basement at your moms house going to college trying to get a liberal arts degree and still working at starbucks. Your brain has to be literaly the size of a pea, and if you even dare post your non sensical shit on teamliquid again with any ounce of pride.......YOU SHOULD SUICIDE. I wish I was a mod i'd ban your ass so fast, then drive to your house and beat the fuck out of you.
Also, you probably voted for Obama, so get off your ass and call mommy crying on your Obama phone kid!!
And do us all a favor and crack your sc2 disc in half.
Thanks ....... People have no problem with the lategame strength of a race, it's not like people are idiots, they just have an issue with it not being that, but more 'don't let them get inf/bl' If Zergs were doing things like getting to 6 bases and trading armies to win, nobody would have an issue with their lategame. "People have no problem with the lategame strength of a race, it's not like people are idiots, they just have an issue with it not being that, but more 'don't let them get inf/bl'" All i have to do is quote that line that you said, and prove that your one of the ones I was talking about. People have no problem about the late game strength of a race? Are you kidding me? Please say that again 100x in your head and realize how dumb it is. Thx~
Lol do you even understand what forms lategame strength can take? A zerg who took risks, displays good game sense and got to huge amounts of bases against a passive player 100% deserves to win. Especially if they won with good aggressive trading and smart techswitching.
Infestor/BL is not synonymous with Zerg having a good lategame being inherently bad, at all.
|
On December 07 2012 08:54 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
It is HILARIOUS!! how some people still say "your supposed to stop him from getting to the late game its your fault!!" to a terran about the TvZ match up.
Thats the biggets crock of B.S. I ever heard in my life. And if you truly believe in this way of thinking for dealing with balance, you should jump off a bridge. Lets see you stop DRG from getting to the late game with this analyzation. The truth is........MOST (IF NOT ALL) pro gamers, will bring the game into the late game. So if you have this mentality you are most likely a bronze retard living in your basement at your moms house going to college trying to get a liberal arts degree and still working at starbucks. Your brain has to be literaly the size of a pea, and if you even dare post your non sensical shit on teamliquid again with any ounce of pride.......YOU SHOULD SUICIDE. I wish I was a mod i'd ban your ass so fast, then drive to your house and beat the fuck out of you.
Also, you probably voted for Obama, so get off your ass and call mommy crying on your Obama phone kid!!
And do us all a favor and crack your sc2 disc in half.
Thanks
User was temp banned for this post.
Posts like this really make me wish I could see the person typing it out in real life.
|
On December 07 2012 09:35 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2012 09:26 NaEjeOn88 wrote:On December 07 2012 09:23 Wombat_NI wrote:On December 07 2012 08:54 NaEjeOn88 wrote:
It is HILARIOUS!! how some people still say "your supposed to stop him from getting to the late game its your fault!!" to a terran about the TvZ match up.
Thats the biggets crock of B.S. I ever heard in my life. And if you truly believe in this way of thinking for dealing with balance, you should jump off a bridge. Lets see you stop DRG from getting to the late game with this analyzation. The truth is........MOST (IF NOT ALL) pro gamers, will bring the game into the late game. So if you have this mentality you are most likely a bronze retard living in your basement at your moms house going to college trying to get a liberal arts degree and still working at starbucks. Your brain has to be literaly the size of a pea, and if you even dare post your non sensical shit on teamliquid again with any ounce of pride.......YOU SHOULD SUICIDE. I wish I was a mod i'd ban your ass so fast, then drive to your house and beat the fuck out of you.
Also, you probably voted for Obama, so get off your ass and call mommy crying on your Obama phone kid!!
And do us all a favor and crack your sc2 disc in half.
Thanks ....... People have no problem with the lategame strength of a race, it's not like people are idiots, they just have an issue with it not being that, but more 'don't let them get inf/bl' If Zergs were doing things like getting to 6 bases and trading armies to win, nobody would have an issue with their lategame. "People have no problem with the lategame strength of a race, it's not like people are idiots, they just have an issue with it not being that, but more 'don't let them get inf/bl'" All i have to do is quote that line that you said, and prove that your one of the ones I was talking about. People have no problem about the late game strength of a race? Are you kidding me? Please say that again 100x in your head and realize how dumb it is. Thx~ Lol do you even understand what forms lategame strength can take? A zerg who took risks, displays good game sense and got to huge amounts of bases against a passive player 100% deserves to win. Especially if they won with good aggressive trading and smart techswitching. Infestor/BL is not synonymous with Zerg having a good lategame being inherently bad, at all.
I'll share my private guide of how to get zerg into lategame against protoss / terran! (It has so far worked up to high diamond, i am ordinarily a mid platinum protoss.. switched to zerg just to see how far i could go by turtling to lategame and doing bl/infestor):
Step 1: Do all the normal zerg opener stuffs, scout for proxies / cannonrushes whilst getting 3 bases and scouting for any kind of agression.
Step 2: Scout out your enemies tech route, it wont be too hard since you got overlords / overseers
Step 3: Depending on your information in the previous steps either A) Make speedlings + banelings or B) Make Roaches.. add a few spine crawlers for extra defense if you feel threatened. Get into lair.
Step 4: Make infestors and start moving around the map to threaten your enemy, be prepared to either cast fungals to escape or cast fungals to engage depending on if you think you can win a fight.
Step 5: Get hive, start teching towards broodlords.
Step 6: Once maxed, plant about 4-5 spine crawlers in each base to free up more supply -> turn that supply into infestors / broodlords.
Step 7: Move across the map and turn any army you found into scraps of metal. This can be tricky if your skill is equal to silver or below since you will probably not have high enough apm to cast your fungals before running into siege tanks, or some other huge misstake possible. But overall if you just take it slow and push with your broodlords and keep the infestors as support... you pretty much cant lose.
Step 8: Open up a twitch.tv account and start earning cash by streaming games of you beating top tier players.
|
Fun read. Dunno if I should take it seriously or not, but it's definitely one perspective that I've explored in the past. If there's one thing I can pull away from the article, it's that I really do long for the old ling bling muta vs. tank marine medivac days again... Those were some of the funnest matches I've watched/played.
|
You talk about missing one feedback makes you lose an entire game where you were actually far ahead... sounds like what vortex does to late game too...
|
Northern Ireland25353 Posts
Man Fizzy if you had figured that out a year ago you'd have raked in a lot of cash at foreign tournaments  Hopefully you can find a similar step-by-step plan to tear it up in the HoTS metagame
|
I loved the original post; I didn't read it all; but it made me laugh out loud quite a few times.
Excellent semi-satire; much like the daily-show, half-joke half-serious. OR serious while being funny, either way. two thumbs up!
|
Considering how easy zerg is supposed to be, isn't it strange that it is the protoss and terrans of the Kespa-teams who have found the most success?
|
Northern Ireland25353 Posts
It's not that Zerg is easy, at all. It's more that the kind of raw mechanics and micro that the Kespa guys have who play Zerg, aren't necessarily skills that dictate Zerg success these days.
HoTS looks to be stepping up in separating the men from the boys both in strategical ways and mechanical ways though, finally so I do like this.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
