| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:13 Pazuzu wrote: earlier someone crunched the numbers on what would happen if you took out Taeja (10-1) and Gumiho (12-3). result was a terran win rate of 47% Thats really not that bad and as close to 50/50 at most winrates are going to get. | ||
|
Lorch
Germany3691 Posts
But the game looks really balanced in korea, even tvz, so I think it's fine, just give foreigners another month to adapt. | ||
|
NHY
1013 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:12 pmp10 wrote: Hp maybe but as long as you have buildings that's build once per game anywhere from bronze league to code S then chances are it's cost will change a race balance irrelevant to the players skill level. Let's just say we give zerg players extra 50 mineral at the beginning. We can agree that covers everyone from bronze league to code S. But that would also affect balance differently across skill level. Edit: And average number of spawning pools built per game would not be same across the skill level. | ||
|
Greenei
Germany1754 Posts
Why wouldn't it be possible to at least try to balance every level? Just make Toss and Zerg not so easy, it has been 3 month since Terran is the worst race internationally, I think it's time for a change. | ||
|
Irre
United States646 Posts
| ||
|
hunts
United States2113 Posts
| ||
|
Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:25 Greenei wrote: It's funny how the general consensus seems to be that "herp derp foreigner terran just need to be better" while also saying "korean terrans have the same skill as korean toss/zerg". Why wouldn't it be possible to at least try to balance every level? Just make Toss and Zerg not so easy, it has been 3 month since Terran is the worst race internationally, I think it's time for a change. Why is the game imbalanced for "other levels" if one region has a nearly 50/50 win rate and another does not? And if the region with the 50/50 win rate is also considered to have the most advanced metagame, why should the game be rebalanced? Why do you assume the game isn't balanced for your skill level? | ||
|
AKomrade
United States582 Posts
| ||
|
XiWi
11 Posts
apparently they are separate so nevermind | ||
|
NHY
1013 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:36 XiWi wrote: Hey all if the international games included the korea ones ( korea sample size ~2000 international 10k) I did some math and excluded the korean from the international ones and I got that international TvZ (w/o korea) is at ~42.77% I was wrong. The chart says they are included. | ||
|
canikizu
4860 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:13 lichter wrote: I don't care if it is skewed for T or for Z. I am against this kind of approach at looking at the numbers. In this month's case, it just happens that there are two T outliers that contribute greatly to their win percentage, mostly because they played more games and the sample size is so small that their games affect the overall numbers so much. Fortunately for that person's argument, there weren't any Z outliers, as you showed. However these are numbers for a SINGLE month, with a sample size so small one person can affect it by a significant percentage. Larger sample size, more months (within the same patch), either outliers will disappear or other outliers will appear because they will be able to play the matchup. They will cancel each other out if the game is near balance. I don't see how the presence of these outliers is supposed to mean that the numbers are "wrong" or "skewed". Some people are good. Some people suck. That's caused by talent, not balance. Same stuffs happened last month and I did the same stuff last month too. And same stuff is gonna happen next month, and I might have to do the same stuff next month too. I don't care about the number either. All I care about is the moving average on larger picture. I ran numbers to annoy people who use numbers to claim TvZ is not imbalance lol. | ||
|
pmp10
3382 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:32 Plansix wrote: Why is the game imbalanced for "other levels" if one region has a nearly 50/50 win rate and another does not? And if the region with the 50/50 win rate is also considered to have the most advanced metagame, why should the game be rebalanced? Because the SC2 viewer base consists of foreigners and race distribution at foreign tournaments is important for the game success. This has no meaning in trying to look at things in 2-3 months of meta-game shifts but the overall long-term trends are important. | ||
|
eFonSG
United States255 Posts
| ||
|
Huragius
Lithuania1506 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:25 Greenei wrote: It's funny how the general consensus seems to be that "herp derp foreigner terran just need to be better" while also saying "korean terrans have the same skill as korean toss/zerg". Why wouldn't it be possible to at least try to balance every level? Just make Toss and Zerg not so easy, it has been 3 month since Terran is the worst race internationally, I think it's time for a change. Balance hypocrits all the way. | ||
|
IshinShishi
Japan6156 Posts
| ||
|
ELA
Denmark4608 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:31 hunts wrote: Maybe now Ts will stop complaining about zerg after seeing it's balanced? Nah who am I kidding people will always cry imbalance even when there is none. Funny, find any Z's in here calling T's whiners, check their post history and you will most likely find something like this: On September 10 2011 09:12 hunts wrote: neural change is quite possibly the dumbest thing I've seen from blizzard yet. Yeah infstor is a bit too good of a unit as is, but it's basicly the only thing actually keeping Z viable as a race. If they want to really nerf ifnestors, they need to buff zerg elsewhere to keep it viable, but they aren't doing that. They nerfed fungal with no compensation, but that was fine because it wasn't a huge nerf. But now they are doing a huge nerf, and still no compensation. The overseer buff while nice still in no way helps the actual Z army. And while the ultra buff is better than nothing, it still doesn't help the actual zerg army because honeslty, ultras are still useless and will die before getting to their targets, even if they are fungald. Keep it classy | ||
|
Greenei
Germany1754 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:32 Plansix wrote: Why is the game imbalanced for "other levels" if one region has a nearly 50/50 win rate and another does not? And if the region with the 50/50 win rate is also considered to have the most advanced metagame, why should the game be rebalanced? Why do you assume the game isn't balanced for your skill level? Because the game makes more fun if the game is blanced. 99% of people who play this game are out of the balanced region. I can't see why they shouldn't matter at all. | ||
|
ShamW0W
160 Posts
 On topic, the Korean data is definitely interesting. On the ladder it feels like Terrans have started to really adapt to the new Zerg style of play and are more aggressive with their drops and removal of creep from the map. Watching some of the top players actually shows you the potential each race has. It's up to us as players to unlock that potential, not up to Blizzard to make the potential easier to obtain. | ||
|
Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:46 Greenei wrote: Because the game makes more fun if the game is blanced. 99% of people who play this game are out of the balanced region. I can't see why they shouldn't matter at all. I am having a great time and I am still getting rocked by zerg, protoss and terran's alike. Have you ever considered that you might now be playing a paticular match up correctly? Or that your winrates are not that bad against people of the same skill lever? Why are your losses to "less skilled players" not the results of some bad decision you made, rather than the fault of some balance issue? | ||
|
Doublemint
Austria8708 Posts
On August 09 2012 01:25 Greenei wrote: Why wouldn't it be possible to at least try to balance every level? Just make Toss and Zerg not so easy, it has been 3 month since Terran is the worst race internationally, I think it's time for a change. Just for answers like this one I like to come to these monthly threads :D Apart from foreigner Ts the numbers seem quite ok. Curious how long it will take blizzard, even after the beta, to come close to these numbers in HotS^^ | ||
| ||
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/HNrRa.jpg)
