EPTMLG Winter Arena to be PPV - Page 53
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Criticism is allowed. Undue flaming is not. Take a second to think your post through before you submit. Bans will be handed out. Should go without saying, but don't link restreams here either. | ||
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Shindou
United States120 Posts
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Gingerninja
United Kingdom1339 Posts
On February 14 2012 08:37 SMD wrote: Do you understand how much money it takes to fly players in from Korea and Europe, and have them stay for 3nights at least in NEW YORK CITY? Their 100k estimate seems reasonable to me. If they didnt pay for any player and made the player pay, the prize pool could be 100k, maybe thats a better move? But it would be a huge risk to players/teams to pay 3k+ to fly in stay for 4 days, and not win anything. Why hold it in such a ridiculously expensive location in the first place? Are there not cheaper alternatives? I'm not saying $20 is too much or anything, but if they want to turn profit, why hold it in such an expensive city as NY, and then pay for hotels and flights for players. The players should want to come for the prestige and the prizes, not because they are having it paid for. There is a business model in all of this that would allow a lot of players to play professionally (as in earn a living, not just claim they are going "pro" ) as well as provide good value that customers would be willing to pay for if it was constant product, and not sporadic 3 day events. *COUGH* copy the BW pro-league model *COUGH* it's been proven once, aren't they running something similar in Taiwan? Get the best players under contract, have them on teams, have them play regular fixtures every week. I can't imagine that'd be hard to have people pay for. 3 day events, which in the past have been plagued with black-outs, lots of downtime and other issues? Not good. GSL is regular, people pay. MLG is less regular, so harder to justify. I'd be more willing to pay, if I knew I could tune in every Friday night or whatever, and see this weeks games from the league, exactly like you do with regular sports. Why do we have to try and be different instead of copying already proven models? | ||
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Shiori
3815 Posts
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Oreo7
United States1647 Posts
On February 14 2012 09:57 CaptainAmerica wrote: America, FUCK NO. #Boycott Time (I have more intelligent things to say, but frankly, MLG, you just lost me. For good I think). At least do us all one back, Sundance, and use any profit from the Arena on promoting the game. I mean, get it out there. I can't tell you how many people I've met this last year who consider themselves gamers, but have no clue what MLG is. One guy was from Columbus, Ohio. Put simply, I don't think you're advertising enough and as one of the world's premier tournaments you ought to be out there growing the sport to the point where ad-based revenue is sufficient. If you didn't have the money before... Also, for the record, I've never seen an MLG ad, never. I'm sure they exist, but wtf. Look, it's not easy, hell it's friggin hard to grow something like this (I know personally), but that's why it's worth it. You get out what you put in and PPV is a cheap fix. Is that all you want eSports to be, Sundance? A cheap fix? Damn. Honestly, I feel like your advertising campaign is pretty much word of mouth and that's it. And one more thing, I live in America, particularly the U.S. I could afford this, but what about your global viewers (American or not) who can't? People who have supported you along the way? Now you leave them behind (yeah, it's just one tournament per season...for now). What a shitty thing to do. If I'm too harsh, then I'm too harsh, but I'm done with MLG. It's not that you're too harsh; it's that you're presumptuous. This idea that MLG isn't doing everything they can within budgetary restrictions to promote and advertise for their tourneys is absurd. Not only does it make financial sense for them, but Sundance & Co. have shown time and time again they are in esports because they love esports. Your point about advertisements reveals your ignorance. Anyone who has even glanced at MLG for more than 15 minutes could tell you about the Dr. Pepper or Hot Pockets ad. Sundance isn't looking for a cheap fix - quite the opposite - he's looking for a way to make esports both sustainable AND profitable. Like he said in his tweets, it's not right now. For some reason you presume you know more about the inner workings of MLG than MLG's CEO. Hopefully this is because you're frustrated the candy you've always eaten for free now has a price tag, and if that's so, within a few days you'll probably have calmed down. If, however, you are actually that ignorant, stupid and arrogant to think your assumptions are true about MLG without taking any effort to test them, than please, open your eyes. TL;DR: Sundance knows what he is doing. He is just trying to make esports sustainable and profitable which it can't be on pure ads. If everyone would stop being reactionary and start being rational, they would realize this. | ||
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Synche
United States1345 Posts
On February 14 2012 10:01 red4ce wrote: Despite being very 1 sided, the poll in the first page actually bodes well for MLG. 15% of respondents are saying they will pay for winter arena. If we take a conservative estimate of the potential viewing audience of 100k, that means winter arena will have 15k buys. 15k X $20 = $300k, which should be more than enough revenue for MLG since this is a no-audience event and the production costs would be a lot less than the championship events. This is pretty interesting. They only need something like 7.500 people to buy for them to break even? That's quite amazing, it really shows the strength of this model. | ||
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Mvrio
689 Posts
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WilDMousE
Chile1335 Posts
On February 14 2012 10:03 zolii wrote: This guys has a point - wait one week and you will see No doubt this will happen.. and everyone will be still paying for "supporting e-sports!!111" | ||
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Tony Danza
United States4 Posts
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BluePanther
United States2776 Posts
On February 14 2012 10:01 red4ce wrote: Despite being very 1 sided, the poll in the first page actually bodes well for MLG. 15% of respondents are saying they will pay for winter arena. If we take a conservative estimate of the potential viewing audience of 100k, that means winter arena will have 15k buys. 15k X $20 = $300k, which should be more than enough revenue for MLG since this is a no-audience event and the production costs would be a lot less than the championship events. You're sampling the 10% of their viewers that are most likely to pay though. I'd be highly surprised if they get 15k people paying 20 bucks for a single event when you can purchase all championships for a year for 30 dollars. | ||
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Angel_
United States1617 Posts
On February 14 2012 09:57 WilDMousE wrote: This guy, sundance, needs to learn to change this "We want to help e-sports, pay us" mentality... the whole "I Support E-sports" mindset is pretty much abused by now. The more I sit and think about it the more this looks like it to me. IPL gave more content and features in each tournament they've done than MLG did in a year and a half put together, at a better venue, with more features, more awesome streams, in a Casino for shit's sake, with multiple player panels, a stream for random interviews and people walking around seeing candid players and checking in on the player pool...and you never heard anything about "to help esports grow it's time to pay us"...and they didn't even have tournament internet capability most of the first entire day. what you got instead was one of the best run events we've had and a heartfelt letter/blog from a guy risking everything just to break even for something he loved. No one is forcing MLG to fly out all their players for free. No one is forcing MLG to run so many tournaments a year. No one is forcing MLG to overlap tournaments with other free tournaments and then expect people to watch them. And yet MLG is standing on thier podium holding their banner that in order to support esports, you should pay extra to THEM, citing helping to grow...while still providing less than most other big tournaments, while eliminating some of the biggest things that attract people to them (crowds) in the process. - But maybe we should be glad. If the problem is that there's too much supply for the demand (tournaments basically every month, and overlapping)... it's one less piece of real competition for viewers if everyone just doesn't watch MLG. and then they'll either die or they'll step up their game seriously. | ||
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pepsimaxibon
61 Posts
On February 14 2012 10:01 red4ce wrote: Despite being very 1 sided, the poll in the first page actually bodes well for MLG. 15% of respondents are saying they will pay for winter arena. If we take a conservative estimate of the potential viewing audience of 100k, that means winter arena will have 15k buys. 15k X $20 = $300k, which should be more than enough revenue for MLG since this is a no-audience event and the production costs would be a lot less than the championship events. that's 15% of the very centre of the sc2 hardcore, those invested enough in the game as an esport to visit this thread. 15% of that number will make for extremely grim reading to someone like sundance. though i'm sure he'll spin it to his investors in the same way you just did. i'm starting to wonder if lordzerith's rant and the subsequent thread posting were somehow provoked by sundance. i'm sure it came from the heart, but the timing is uncanny. sorta like the whole "independence in esports" wave just before half the mlg staff got the sack. | ||
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Playkid
Germany2 Posts
So why would i pay 20$ for watching something like this? It may be one of the best tournament in the world but other tournaments of that kind were very successful without charging money. Even the mlg itself. So why charging that amount. I think it would be better if they start out with 5-8$ and then see how many people are interested in paying for only one weekend. Because paying so much money for something which is growing so heavily seems to me as they just want to get some money as fast as possible without thinking long term | ||
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Blade Fox
United States215 Posts
I hope it comes out as a win for MLG though. | ||
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Shiori
3815 Posts
On February 14 2012 10:04 SimDawg wrote: This is pretty interesting. They only need something like 7.500 people to buy for them to break even? That's quite amazing, it really shows the strength of this model. It's strong in that the first event might survive, but they're a) not going to profit much and b) not going to get any exposure if most of the community just ignores it. | ||
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TheHova
United Kingdom2612 Posts
Like most people who play and follow the game, i'm young. I'm 21 and i've only just finished university. In a time where money is short for everybody, i can not justify paying to watch Starcraft like most others. Even if i had the money. It just doesn't sit well with me because i know there's people that don't and i don't want to support something that hinders the little guy. One of the main things that makes this community we have so awesome in my opinion at least is the fact that it's for everybody, everybody can watch, nobody is discriminated against. It doesn't matter if you're rich or poor. You can still watch every tournament albeit some in less quality. But the ability to follow your passion is still there. And in reward for that, people try as much as they can to support everything that supports what they love. People write emails to sponsors thanking them and tweet them. When they get their next upgrade for their computer, they'll pick a product that supports the scene. Or get that Steelseries Siberia headset or Blackwidow keyboard. When they want an energy drink, they'll drink monster because they support EG. If they've got the spare money, they'll get gold. So to insinuate the esport community is niggardly because they don't want to pay for PPV is just wrong. | ||
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Hrrrrm
United States2081 Posts
On February 14 2012 10:01 red4ce wrote: Despite being very 1 sided, the poll in the first page actually bodes well for MLG. 15% of respondents are saying they will pay for winter arena. If we take a conservative estimate of the potential viewing audience of 100k, that means winter arena will have 15k buys. 15k X $20 = $300k, which should be more than enough revenue for MLG since this is a no-audience event and the production costs would be a lot less than the championship events. Please don't be retarded. 15% of TL readers voted in that. We are not the casuals of SC2, if you are on TL you are more than likely quite heavily invested in following the game and the players in them. I don't even want to think what a casual fan that just watched some SC2 streams because they looked like fun or were linked to them by someone else would think about coughing up $20 just to watch. That poll doesn't bode well for MLG at ALL. | ||
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MCXD
Australia2738 Posts
I must admit this entire thing was... rather poorly executed. | ||
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Fjodorov
5007 Posts
And to all of you talking about "sustainable business models" and bashing ppl for saying they wont pay: People dont think its worth it, they wont pay. Its really easy. First you advocate capitalism and the second after you are complaining because the product you are selling has no demand on the market. lol | ||
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ClysmiC
United States2192 Posts
Edit: And there's NO way that they can sustain this. They may get a decent turnout for the first tourney... but if they don't change within a year their numbers will plummet. | ||
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Bashion
Cook Islands2612 Posts
We have so many tournaments for free, even if not all of them are always amazing. Asking for a PPV when we have so many high quality stuff for free, is kinda greedy. I ll watch Assembly instead. GOM already has my money every season, MLG also had last year. Im not cheap or anything like that, but i dont agree with the price. | ||
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