EPTHydra fixed.
What is holding the Hydralisk back? - Page 11
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Nereites
Canada102 Posts
Hydra fixed. | ||
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latan
740 Posts
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Harrow
United States245 Posts
I get that they were well-liked and iconic in BW, but I don't think that needs to drive game design decisions for SC2. | ||
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KimJongChill
United States6429 Posts
On October 27 2011 05:46 reptile wrote: Everyone here is forgetting that this Speed upgrade for the Hydra is HIVE TECH. Who the hell uses Hydras at Hive tech? I think this is one of the biggest issues. The initial thought to the speed upgrade was, "Wow, Hydras can now be microed/more efficient/and may survive battles with retreating"; but when you learn that the upgrade is at Hive tech, doesn't it just destroy its purpose all together? I don't even care about the upgrade now because the death balls and compositions I'd expect to play against at Hive tech will completely destroy my Hydralisks, continuing to make them a worthless unit. I'm with you man. I wish they would just take out hydra and corrupter and give us some better t1/1.5 stuff | ||
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sagefreke
United States241 Posts
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DoubleReed
United States4130 Posts
Anything that you would want hydras to do, mutas do better. (in zvt) | ||
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Micket
United Kingdom2163 Posts
Vs P: blink stalkers beat Hydras really badly. Chargelots eat hydras, Phoenix builds destroy small amount of hydras, and colossus lololololololroflstomps hydras. Wait, HT eat hydras, and archon immortal go even vs hydras. Hydras are only good vs void ray, carriers and probes. They also have great all inning potential. They have no place in standard macro play unless Protoss has managed to force them. | ||
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Salteador Neo
Andorra5591 Posts
Ninja edit: Oh and they melted against speedlots way more than in SC2. Like not even close. | ||
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neobowman
Canada3324 Posts
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UmiNotsuki
United States633 Posts
If hydralisks were even slower than they are now, but had as much health and survivability as a roach, we'd see a LOT of them on the field. As they stand in WoL, they have trouble living long enough to pay for themselves, even with their high DPS. | ||
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Tektos
Australia1321 Posts
Hydralisk - 100 minerals, 50 gas, 2 supply 14.5 DPS, 80 health Marine - 50 minerals, 0 gas, 1 supply 10.5 DPS (stimmed), 55 health (combat shields) 100min + 50 gas for one hydralisk is more valuable than 150 minerals (3 marines) 3 marines = 31.5 dps, 165 health SIGNIFICANTLY better than the Hydra's 14.5 DPS and 80 health. What is more? We Terrans have the medivac, the perfect synergy with the marine. Hydras just aren't worth the cost. Yes, they have good damage compared to other zerg units but the problem is by the time they come out collossus / tanks / banelings are already out or very close to being, which obliterate Hydras. Speed will help, but it isn't the only problem of the hydra.... | ||
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Wren
United States745 Posts
On October 27 2011 04:51 Saraf wrote: Oh my god, a "Piercing Spines" upgrade would be absolutely amazing, I wouldn't even want it on the same upgrade, I'd take it at hive tech. Put 3 upgrades on the hydra den: range, "reinforced carapace" (+10 hp and remove armor typing; armor strong enough to not be light but also not armored) both at lair tech and "Piercing Spines" at hive tech (linear splash damage vs. light). It would be awesome (clearly I haven't considered balance but hey). I really like the idea that the Hydra be a unit that gets way better over the course of a long macro game. Here's what I would do: ~Hydralisk and Roach swap positions on the tech tree (roach to lair, hydra to hatch). My initial thoughts are that it makes early game, especially ZvT, more stable. Queens and spines are good defense against hellions, and light-armor hydras can't attack into hellions like roaches can. Zerg also gets a mobile low-tech anti-air, so banshee/void ray is far less likely to simply end the game. ~A series of buffs or added upgrades to make it more viable in combat. Balance team has to figure out where they fit, but the list could include: loss of light-armor designation (lair tech), combat shield-esque extra HP, range boost (currently in the game), innovative boost to attack power (I really like the notion of limited splash at Hive tech). Can also add a morph to the game, which at least would get the hydra into the game for a little while. | ||
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gh0un
601 Posts
Right now, even if you amass a 200/200 consisting of an hydra army (or any composition involving hydras), it still feels pretty weak.and small compared to other compositions because hydras are just that weak. If they were 1 supply, you could atleast get a really big army in size at the cost of paying a lot for it. | ||
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ThisGS
Germany255 Posts
Yes, Hydralisks are just as fast as gateway / mm without stimp. The difference: The Protoss race is made so once you attack, you have to commit to it more or less. You have to be careful everytime you move out. The Zerg race is completly different. Your army has to be mobile and it is needed that you can poke in and out and not commit heavily to your attack. --> Concerning movement, a Hydralisk army feels like a Protoss-Army without having forcefields and a reinforcement proxy-pylon. You decide to attack, you can never move back. 2nd problem is: The Protoss army has 1 advantage to overcome the movement and commitment issues: It is actually not too fragile and pretty strong. The Hydralisk on the other hand is countered by every single AOE unit in game (storm, tanks, colossi, even hellions) and even a standard bio / biomech army does very well against the hydralisk in combat. Putting both things together, the Hydralisk has only 2 purposes right now: Defending vs Protoss air and fight against pure gateway armys, since thats the only non-zerg army the hydralisk is decent against. | ||
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ThisGS
Germany255 Posts
On October 27 2011 07:52 gh0un wrote: If they really want to keep their low stats in comparison to their high cost, then they should atleast reduce their supply cost to 1. Right now, even if you amass a 200/200 consisting of an hydra army (or any composition involving hydras), it still feels pretty weak.and small compared to other compositions because hydras are just that weak. If they were 1 supply, you could atleast get a really big army in size at the cost of paying a lot for it. you could never make Hydralisks 1 supply while zealots and roaches are 2 supply. | ||
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KDot2
United States1213 Posts
On October 27 2011 06:51 sagefreke wrote: I don't know who mentioned it but I remember someone saying that hydra/ultra in HotS will be very powerful against toss since the ultras can tank so well and now the hydras will be fast enough for you to stutter step and micro around off creep resulting in less of an all in type attack hydras still basically get 1 shotted by collosus | ||
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ThisGS
Germany255 Posts
On October 27 2011 08:03 ToguRo wrote: hydras still basically get 1 shotted by collosus well... Viper + new Ultra + new Hydra... i dont wanna fight that as WoL Protoss :D 1 range colossus or coloss poked into the zerg-army, the hydralisk in the back as heavy dps, ultras that tank and stomp into your ball... woot?^^ | ||
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Lucid90
Canada340 Posts
Give a lair tier speed upgrade with maybe 100 starting life and it'd be nice. | ||
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Antares777
United States1971 Posts
On October 27 2011 09:45 Lucid90 wrote: little life, very slow. Give a lair tier speed upgrade with maybe 100 starting life and it'd be nice. Lair tier speed upgrade is too powerful in my opinion. In HotS, it gets one at Hive tech, which is a good idea. | ||
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sjschmidt93
United States2518 Posts
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