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On September 20 2011 10:50 EightyFive wrote:
And this is why you approach a team with an offer first, and not the player. The same happens in sports and it works.
You don't approach the team when a player is soon to become a free agent, only when negotiating a buy/trade... In actuality these situations are handled by managers, something that starcraft players can't afford at this point.
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On September 20 2011 02:53 HolydaKing wrote:
Haha, this sounds like fun :D
Took the words right out of my mouth!
....and it begins.
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On September 20 2011 10:50 mebeblood wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 10:44 Arkless wrote:4) Yesterday Stephano contacted coL.CatZ and our COO Jason Bass to inform them he had made his final decision and told CatZ "Don't worry I won't change my mind again." He then executed a legally binding contract with our organization. He seemed genuinely excited to be a part of our organization and joined our private Skype channel to chat with the team before going to bed. Let's see papers, with a signature. I doubt very much a verbal contract over the internet cross continent is considered legal anywhere. (Not saying this like " YOU OWE US PAPER WITH SIGNATURE") More or less I am confused about what exactly "executing a legally binding contract" means specifically. That is a statement that is very open to interpretation. Honor is another thing entirely. Sorry if this was answered earlier in the thread Yeah this has been answered, they used some digital signing method. Here is a link where they said the actual thing. http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/kks4e/complexitys_statement_regarding_stephano/c2l2ch6
Oh ok thanks, didn't see anything like that on the official statement, nor do I go on reddit. Didn't necessarily mean show me the papers. Was just wanting clarification on the whole "executed a contract" statements absolute meaning.
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Yeah, I understood you're meaning lol. It just helps for naysayers to see there was an actual signature done. Either way, I'm not gunna judge until I see more facts, not enough here right now.
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Wait so will Stephano be in complexity or in millenium?
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It seems like we just need to wait for more information to come out. However, unless Millenium can prove their accusation of 'shady' dealings by Complexity, they should publicly apologize for the accusations.
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37063 Posts
On September 20 2011 11:12 Shootist wrote:
Wait so will Stephano be in complexity or in millenium?
This. I'm so confused, where is Stephano headed?
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I do think it is important to maintain the integrity of these contracts to protect the organization but, to me, it seems going after an 18-year-old with legal action for changing his mind only a few hours after seems quite unethical. Legal, maybe (I'm not an expert here) but unethical. It isn't like Complexity has lost anything financially or have been exposed in some way. The situation is the exact same as it was last month for them. There is very big difference when a player breaches contract terms halfway through the deal and what Stephano did (change his mind, and who hasn't done that, especially at 18?).
I think it is enough that we are even talking about the issue, how this will effect e-sports moving forward and what Mill/Stephano/coL did differently. From reading comments, the majority believe Stephano is in the wrong here. There will certainly be some people who will view him negatively from now on. Isn't that enough?
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I'm still confused as well, and the 120 pages of posts are very daunting to behold 
Could someone explain? T_T
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On September 20 2011 11:23 Aegisky wrote:I'm still confused as well, and the 120 pages of posts are very daunting to behold Could someone explain? T_T
No more developments than the OP shows, I believe. Just discussions.
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On September 20 2011 11:21 setzer wrote:
I do think it is important to maintain the integrity of these contracts to protect the organization but, to me, it seems going after an 18-year-old with legal action for changing his mind only a few hours after seems quite unethical. Legal, maybe (I'm not an expert here) but unethical. It isn't like Complexity has lost anything financially or have been exposed in some way. The situation is the exact same as it was last month for them. There is very big difference when a player breaches contract terms halfway through the deal and what Stephano did (change his mind, and who hasn't done that, especially at 18?).
I think it is enough that we are even talking about the issue, how this will effect e-sports moving forward and what Mill/Stephano/coL did differently. From reading comments, the majority believe Stephano is in the wrong here. There will certainly be some people who will view him negatively from now on. Isn't that enough?
I think most people, like me, would like to believe in eSports developing in something bigger. Breaching of contracts, whatever the circumstances and whether it is legal or not in regards to your countries law, should not be tolerated and taken lightly if you believe in said goal.
Also, for all of those talking about the legality of the contract, as far as what we know, the contract is both legal in its formation in a common law jurisdiction (presence of offer, acceptance and consideration) and in a civil law jurisdiction ( offer and acceptance). For the rest, as far as the legality of the actual clauses, we can' t judge without seeing the actual written piece.
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"5- Stephano would've been "one of the highest paid SC2 players in the world" at Complexity and they ensured that he would get "global travel" including to Korea."
I honestly don't understand that unless team managers talk about how much their players make. The other thing I found funny was:
"Stephano will sign, as agreed a CDI(Contrat a duree indeterminee, ie: a contract of work with no expiration date) as a "Professional player," identical to those signed by professional sportsmen."
No expiration date like what lol.
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On September 20 2011 11:21 setzer wrote:
I do think it is important to maintain the integrity of these contracts to protect the organization but, to me, it seems going after an 18-year-old with legal action for changing his mind only a few hours after seems quite unethical. Legal, maybe (I'm not an expert here) but unethical. It isn't like Complexity has lost anything financially or have been exposed in some way. The situation is the exact same as it was last month for them. There is very big difference when a player breaches contract terms halfway through the deal and what Stephano did (change his mind, and who hasn't done that, especially at 18?).
I think it is enough that we are even talking about the issue, how this will effect e-sports moving forward and what Mill/Stephano/coL did differently. From reading comments, the majority believe Stephano is in the wrong here. There will certainly be some people who will view him negatively from now on. Isn't that enough?
Apparently you didn't read all the mud throwing the manager of millenium has been doing for the past few hours... if that -- and the fact that a player just shit in their faces -- does not affect negatively the image of a team, then what does? there is little anyone can do at this point, it's a lose/lose situation for all involved.
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It is a shame a seasoned very good player like stephano is having issues with a very low caliber team like complexity. Pretty sure a contract is a contract though.
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So from all the information we have, I'm going to have to side with Complexity on this one. Permanent loss of respect for Millenium and Stephano.
User was warned for this post
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On September 20 2011 11:44 Msr wrote:
It is a shame a seasoned very good player like stephano is having issues with a very low caliber team like complexity. Pretty sure a contract is a contract though.
in sc2 they aren't that prominent maybe but col is not a low caliber team in the wide spectrum of esports. quite the contrary.
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Australia8532 Posts
On September 20 2011 11:44 Msr wrote:
It is a shame a seasoned very good player like stephano is having issues with a very low caliber team like complexity. Pretty sure a contract is a contract though.
It is a shame that you have absolutely no idea about complexity, it's history and presence in the esports industry. Even just it's sc2 is well above "low caliber"
I hope some more facts are revealed soon please - i think a quick resolution would be best for all. However, Jason Lake posting on reddit that Millenium may need a new legal team is not a good sign
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On September 20 2011 09:50 DreamChaser wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 09:39 RusHXceL wrote:
we might as well forget this ever happen.
"/ You may as well continue to lie down and get trampled on cause that's your attitude in life huh? Oh to bad guess i should just forget someone spilled coffee over me woops. This RIGHT here will set the precedent the case with Puma was similar but not exactly this is the first time a player signed a contract then backed out. There has to be a standard you cant just let people do what they want or we would have anarchy.
This was nothing similar about Puma rofl.
The only thing is similar is NASL and the Koreans situation.
what now?
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On September 20 2011 11:50 bkrow wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 11:44 Msr wrote:
It is a shame a seasoned very good player like stephano is having issues with a very low caliber team like complexity. Pretty sure a contract is a contract though. It is a shame that you have absolutely no idea about complexity, it's history and presence in the esports industry. Even just it's sc2 is well above "low caliber" I hope some more facts are revealed soon please - i think a quick resolution would be best for all. However, Jason Lake posting on reddit that Millenium may need a new legal team is not a good sign
I thought that he was saying that they don't understand the legality of the situation. As in, they gave Stephano bad advice on what to do, because what they told him to do was illegal. I didn't take it to mean that they are definitely suing.
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On September 20 2011 11:44 Msr wrote:
It is a shame a seasoned very good player like stephano is having issues with a very low caliber team like complexity. Pretty sure a contract is a contract though.
While they might not be at the level of EG or TL yet, nobody who actually knows the SC2 scene would call them low caliber.I doubt MVP would enter into a partnership with them or agree to let Col players come train at their house in Korea if they were low caliber. Unless of course you think MVP doesn't know what they are doing.
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EPT
