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On September 20 2011 12:01 setzer wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 11:41 s4life wrote:On September 20 2011 11:21 setzer wrote:
I do think it is important to maintain the integrity of these contracts to protect the organization but, to me, it seems going after an 18-year-old with legal action for changing his mind only a few hours after seems quite unethical. Legal, maybe (I'm not an expert here) but unethical. It isn't like Complexity has lost anything financially or have been exposed in some way. The situation is the exact same as it was last month for them. There is very big difference when a player breaches contract terms halfway through the deal and what Stephano did (change his mind, and who hasn't done that, especially at 18?).
I think it is enough that we are even talking about the issue, how this will effect e-sports moving forward and what Mill/Stephano/coL did differently. From reading comments, the majority believe Stephano is in the wrong here. There will certainly be some people who will view him negatively from now on. Isn't that enough? Apparently you didn't read all the mud throwing the manager of millenium has been doing for the past few hours... if that -- and the fact that a player just shit in their faces -- does not affect negatively the image of a team, then what does? there is little anyone can do at this point, it's a lose/lose situation for all involved. There are very few people I have seen actually think Mill. is in the right for how they have acted on their stream towards this situation. From what I have read (albeit with no legal education whatsoever) Mill. has not done anything wrong. They may help represent Stephano if any legal action does come, but to me there isn't anything that can actually be pinned on them. My interpretation of what Jason Lake said on Reddit is that they (complexity) are pursuing legal action against Stephano for breach of contract.
I'd imagine if they have a case, one of the routes coL would consider would have Millenium forced to buy out the remainder of Stephano's time as EG did with HuK from TL (only this time of course, the remainder is essentially the whole contract).
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a US contract would not comply with French contractual law. The only way legal action would work is if stephano entered the united states and was subpoenaed.
Whilst this whole situation sucks... Theres no legal grounds for anything other than threats.
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On September 20 2011 12:31 Slider954 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 12:24 Hall0wed wrote:On September 20 2011 12:18 Slider954 wrote:On September 20 2011 12:10 Hall0wed wrote:
I have no respect for Stephano or Millenium after all this. Oh and no respect for France either!
Best of luck to Complexity in the future. ^_^ Dude, might do you some good to pay attention to the mod heading at the top of the page. Eh saying that they don't have my respect isn't really flaming. Respect is something you earn and not really something that one should be upset about if they have not worked to earn it. Lol, basing your opinion on an entire nation off of this. Some people, just silly. Who said I based my opinion of an entire nation off this? Some people, just silly. Um you did, see the part I bolded. Saying you have no respect for Stephano or Mill or France either 'after all this' says you are basing your opinion on all 3 off of this one incident. Nothing else has been brought up that you could base an opinion from.
Naw. The "either" was just referencing the respect, not "after all this". Kinda basic I mean. Dunno why it should bother you though, even if you are French. Maybe it would help if I put law makers? Cause I have never really had respect for almost any law maker ever, or actually anything involving government at all. =O It all annoys me.
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Very immature from Stephano as well as the EU team. How disapointing =/.
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On September 20 2011 12:45 FXOpen wrote:
a US contract would not comply with French contractual law. The only way legal action would work is if stephano entered the united states and was subpoenaed.
Whilst this whole situation sucks... Theres no legal grounds for anything other than threats.
Entered the US...like competing in an MLG? Seems like this could cause him some issues for US tournaments if that was the case.
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United Kingdom16710 Posts
On September 20 2011 12:42 zaii wrote:
is Stephano on CoL or not?
Legally? That's up to debate. Will he ever play for them in the future? Somehow, I doubt it very much.
On September 20 2011 12:45 FXOpen wrote:
a US contract would not comply with French contractual law. The only way legal action would work is if stephano entered the united states and was subpoenaed.
Whilst this whole situation sucks... Theres no legal grounds for anything other than threats.
He's attending IPL3 at Atlantic City right? Maybe Complexity can try and get a subpoena in time for that?
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If stephano cant be sued successfully, quite honestly I think the correct course of action by the community is to ban him from events for a year, like we would a hacker. When the law fails, the community must work together to ensure that there are repercussions for the kind of behaviour that, frankly, is completely damaging to the scene.
In fact this kind of breach is far more serious than hacking.
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On September 20 2011 12:45 FXOpen wrote:
a US contract would not comply with French contractual law. The only way legal action would work is if stephano entered the united states and was subpoenaed.
Whilst this whole situation sucks... Theres no legal grounds for anything other than threats.
Best just to move on and remember this if Mil asks Col for any favors.
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On September 20 2011 12:47 Zill wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 12:45 FXOpen wrote:
a US contract would not comply with French contractual law. The only way legal action would work is if stephano entered the united states and was subpoenaed.
Whilst this whole situation sucks... Theres no legal grounds for anything other than threats. Entered the US...like competing in an MLG? Seems like this could cause him some issues for US tournaments if that was the case.
The problem is, he wouldnt be subpoenaed because there would be no case to begin with. The case would probably have to start with him already in the US, and the subpoena issued in time before he left.
So either complexity can pay millions for good legal representation and achieve this, or let it go.
I don't see the point in spending that kind of money just to try and make a point.
At least thats my opinion.
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On September 20 2011 12:24 Hall0wed wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 12:18 Slider954 wrote:On September 20 2011 12:10 Hall0wed wrote:
I have no respect for Stephano or Millenium after all this. Oh and no respect for France either!
Best of luck to Complexity in the future. ^_^ Dude, might do you some good to pay attention to the mod heading at the top of the page. Eh saying that they don't have my respect isn't really flaming. Respect is something you earn and not really something that one should be upset about if they have not worked to earn it. Show nested quote +Lol, basing your opinion on an entire nation off of this. Some people, just silly. Who said I based my opinion of an entire nation off this? Some people, just silly.
Ugh, you did?
On September 20 2011 12:10 Hall0wed wrote:
I have no respect for Stephano or Millenium after all this. Oh and no respect for France either!
Best of luck to Complexity in the future. ^_^
right there
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On September 20 2011 12:47 lizzard_warish wrote:
If stephano cant be sued successfully, quite honestly I think the correct course of action by the community is to ban him from events for a year, like we would a hacker. When the law fails, the community must work together to ensure that there are repercussions for the kind of behaviour that, frankly, is completely damaging to the scene.
In fact this kind of breach is far more serious than hacking.
Dude wtf, All this bashing of Stephano is disgusting you don't know what happened. Complexity and Millinium has put huge pressure on Stephano is simply not reasonable to expect that a person that was 17, 4months ago could handle this extreme situation properly
What about we ban you for a year instead?
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On September 20 2011 12:52 Lunas wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 12:47 lizzard_warish wrote:
If stephano cant be sued successfully, quite honestly I think the correct course of action by the community is to ban him from events for a year, like we would a hacker. When the law fails, the community must work together to ensure that there are repercussions for the kind of behaviour that, frankly, is completely damaging to the scene.
In fact this kind of breach is far more serious than hacking. Dude wtf, All this bashing of Stephano is disgusting you don't know what happened. Complexity and Millinium has put huge pressure on Stephano is simply not reasonable to expect that a person that was 17, 4months ago could handle this extreme situation properly What about we ban you for a year instead? Hes an adult legally, he signed a contract, hes breaking the law by literally every civilized countries standards- bar frances' ridiculous contract law. Repercussions are not only justified but necessary.
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On September 20 2011 12:47 lizzard_warish wrote:
If stephano cant be sued successfully, quite honestly I think the correct course of action by the community is to ban him from events for a year, like we would a hacker. When the law fails, the community must work together to ensure that there are repercussions for the kind of behaviour that, frankly, is completely damaging to the scene.
In fact this kind of breach is far more serious than hacking.
I agree with the whole banning thing. Don't know how long of a ban would be appropriate but man something has to be done so that it is known even more well (even though he was in a damn contract >_<) that you can't do something like this. How old he is doesn't make that big of a difference really. By the time that you are 18 most people have enough experience to know that things like this are just... not cool. Not even legal infact (except in France apparently -_-).
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On September 20 2011 12:45 FXOpen wrote:
a US contract would not comply with French contractual law. The only way legal action would work is if stephano entered the united states and was subpoenaed.
Whilst this whole situation sucks... Theres no legal grounds for anything other than threats.
While I respect your opinion, I'm pretty sure you haven't seen the actual contract so saying that it doesn't comply with French law is speculative. As Jason stated on the reddit thread this was a contractor contract NOT an employment contract and as such follows a different set of laws that seem to fall into international territory which France has agreed to thru treaties.
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On September 20 2011 12:47 lizzard_warish wrote:
If stephano cant be sued successfully, quite honestly I think the correct course of action by the community is to ban him from events for a year, like we would a hacker. When the law fails, the community must work together to ensure that there are repercussions for the kind of behaviour that, frankly, is completely damaging to the scene.
In fact this kind of breach is far more serious than hacking.
No it's not, calm down. Best scenario would be if coL was proven right in court but no real punishment for Stephano. He didn't do this to mess with coL, it was just a stupid mistake, one he'll probably learn from..
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On September 20 2011 12:54 lizzard_warish wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 12:52 Lunas wrote:On September 20 2011 12:47 lizzard_warish wrote:
If stephano cant be sued successfully, quite honestly I think the correct course of action by the community is to ban him from events for a year, like we would a hacker. When the law fails, the community must work together to ensure that there are repercussions for the kind of behaviour that, frankly, is completely damaging to the scene.
In fact this kind of breach is far more serious than hacking. Dude wtf, All this bashing of Stephano is disgusting you don't know what happened. Complexity and Millinium has put huge pressure on Stephano is simply not reasonable to expect that a person that was 17, 4months ago could handle this extreme situation properly What about we ban you for a year instead? Hes an adult legally, he signed a contract, hes breaking the law by literally every civilized countries standards- bar frances' ridiculous contract law. Repercussions are not only justified but necessary.
You don't know if he is breaking the law do you? There is other laws in the world beside US laws. I know its hard to comprehend when you apparently think the US laws applies for the hole world.
You not the only country in the world with laws tbh
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i'm surprised how the people are reacting with the mill. I'm french and this team is very serious imo.
Complexity hasn't respected mill, they announced this news in the night (in France), the contract is not legal, and they do that with TL Tribune.
Sorry for my bad english, i'm a french stupid gay like you said and i **** you
User was banned for this post.
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welp, looks like we won't be seeing Stephano at MLG any time soon.
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Why is so many up and coming pro-gamers so stupid... didn't they learn anything in school? when they signed their first bank account and so on?
It's a bloody job! you sign the paper, you agree to what ever is on that paper. You fuck them over, they sue you.. it's really not that hard to understand.
I really wonder why we constantly see thread about players getting a chance at life and then makes some retarded turn and pretty much makes sure that they will never really make it in that line of work anyway.
It's a small business the E-sports one, everyone knows everyone and the people with money certainly also know each other.
Think people!
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EPT
