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Korean teams withdraw from NASL - Page 92

Forum Index > SC2 General
3573 CommentsPost a Reply
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Volvograd12
Profile Joined August 2011
Russian Federation19 Posts
August 12 2011 06:27 GMT
#1821
On August 12 2011 15:25 annaky wrote:
Look in the overall scheme of things it not that bad. At least it gives Non-Koreans a chance.

Surely that's a good thing.



Actually it's going to hurt them.

If you aren't competing with the best, you are not going to become the best.
Suck my Russian blank.
SovereignT
Profile Joined January 2011
United States28 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-12 06:31:33
August 12 2011 06:28 GMT
#1822
On August 12 2011 08:12 StayFrosty wrote:
fuck em

User was warned for this post

Warn or not, this person hit it on the head. If they're going to be so ridiculous in their demands, fuck em.

Really pathetic that they won't make an effort to get out and spread the game to other areas outside of Korea. I'm aware that a select few korean players go to a tiny handful of other events, but if they don't start getting out of their dark caves soon, my interest, and I assume therefore that possibly some other people's interest, will rapidly decline.

NASL went far above and beyond what should have been necessary in being accommodating, as well as being perhaps overly generous in their offers. Sounds to me like the koreans don't deserve the prize money anyway.

Obviously starcraft won't up and die tomorrow because of this. But I must say, such a lack of effort to support the game in other areas is going to seriously hurt this game's chances of continuing its growth, or perhaps of even maintaining its current popularity. I'm sure it's difficult to travel, but them's the breaks when you play an e-sport like SC.

Gonna repeat a previous opinion: $2500 minimum for each korean player is stupidly generous. Screw em.

(On a side note, I use the term "koreans" in an overly generalized manner. I'm sure there were some koreans who disagreed with this decision, but since the article seems to refer to korea as a whole, I did the same to save time. Just a disclaimer for those nit-pickers out there.)
The opinions expressed by this user reflect the official position of both TeamLiquid.net and its staff.
Xenomorph
Profile Joined May 2010
United States137 Posts
August 12 2011 06:28 GMT
#1823
Koreans being greedier than a fast expand zerg. I hate when money and accommodation takes precedence over the game and the fans.
Intrepid Traveler
Volvograd12
Profile Joined August 2011
Russian Federation19 Posts
August 12 2011 06:29 GMT
#1824
On August 12 2011 15:22 MrBitter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 15:18 deroth wrote:
On August 12 2011 15:11 MrBitter wrote:
This isn't the worst news in the world.

NASL season 2 will be a true representation of its namesake: A North American, foreigner only tournament.

In all honesty, this excites me a little. It should motivate foreign players to work a little harder (because winning is more attainable) and it will serve as a chance to showcase some of the top foreigner talent that we don't know as much about.

Obviously very sad that we'll have no Koreans, and will lose some quality, but its not all bad news.


Given the current gap between koreans and foreigners, the "top foreigner talent" isn't worth much. The gap is visibly so high atm that it's become hardly interesting to even watch foreigners play (I'm not counting the very best ones that can still compete with koreans, but those you can count on one hand).


Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 15:16 Slider954 wrote:
On August 12 2011 15:11 MrBitter wrote:
This isn't the worst news in the world.

NASL season 2 will be a true representation of its namesake: A North American, foreigner only tournament.

In all honesty, this excites me a little. It should motivate foreign players to work a little harder (because winning is more attainable) and it will serve as a chance to showcase some of the top foreigner talent that we don't know as much about.

Obviously very sad that we'll have no Koreans, and will lose some quality, but its not all bad news.



Really MrBitter? (if its really you) I expected better of you, I guess all the EU players are now North Americans... and we will have a few Koreans, Rain, Puma, Hero so don't say there wont be any.


There is definitely a gap between foreigners and Koreans, but top guys are still quite good.

I'm not saying its good that the Koreans can't come. It's obviously not good when the champ can't show up for the title fight, but I don't think its the end of the world either.

I had an incredible time casting the Blizzcon EU Invitational which consisted 100% of top EU players. The games were all very close and the outcomes very exciting.

I enjoyed watching it. And I also felt like the fans related more with the games because they were all European too. Its fun to cheer for your hometown hero.

So while it is definitely a bummer that the very best players in the world can't attend, I do think that we will still get some very exciting games, and I love that we will be seeing foreigner vs foreigner the whole way through... If nothing else, it let's us conclusively answer the question of "who is the best non-Korean".


Mr. Bitter what's your opinion this Catz video?
Suck my Russian blank.
tripper688
Profile Joined January 2011
United States569 Posts
August 12 2011 06:30 GMT
#1825
On August 12 2011 15:20 Junichi wrote:
Personally I think it would be good to see the money flow into the NA or EU teams, by winning tournaments. If they do not earn money by playing there is less incentive to train hard.

I see this as a chance for NA / EU teams and will be watching the second season with great pleasure, I think.


Idk, I think it can go both ways. If they earn money by not trying as hard, what incentive will there be to actually try harder? Look at IdrA. He was considered one of the top Zergs while in Korea giving many in Code S a run for their money. He then leaves Korea, wins an MLG. Then starts practicing 3 hours a day and now the best thing he's done since then is place 4th at Columbus.
"Excuse me I gotta do some vacuuming really fast *vrrrrrrmmmmmmmmm*" Day[9]
Redlol
Profile Joined June 2010
United States181 Posts
August 12 2011 06:31 GMT
#1826
On August 12 2011 14:43 binkman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 14:34 Cathasaigh wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On August 12 2011 14:30 TooN wrote:
They dont wanna play. Get over it and stop criticizing the teams and the decisions they are making.

No one here knows the exact reasons why this is happening. So stop making up reasons and bashing people.

They can be criticized very strongly for the way they did this. They waited till the last second and made demands when they knew full well what the conditions were when they first signed up. This is completely on them, completely unprofessional, and very much something for which they can be criticized.


Nowhere in the OP does it say that the koreans waited til the last second to bring this up, where is this information coming from?

Koreans agreed to the season 1 conditions, and abided fully by them. Second season comes round and they want to negotiate some of the conditions. The two parties can't come to a 'reasonable' solution, so the Koreans say its a no-go.

I don't understand where the unprofessional nature of what they did comes into this? Re-negotiating the contract at the end of the season seems like a pretty reasonable expectation to me, or were the Koreans hooked into that same contract indefinitely, until NASL folds?

I am sure most people would prefer it that a more amicable solution was found that kept the Koreans in the NASL, but sometimes thats the way the cookie crumbles.


NASL is right around the corner, and the Koreans had already agreed, they're reneging on a contract that's already in place.(Individual player contracts that is.)
Kush74
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada17 Posts
August 12 2011 06:32 GMT
#1827
NASL post sound like they are investing a lot of money into bringing korean players over; however, compare to the amount of profit they are making out of korean players excellent performance, amount of money being invested is a joke. They even made more profit by making the high quality stream unavailable for viewers who are not paying. Despite that they still havent returned security deposites and worse yet prize money???
In addition, what kind of tournament asks for security deposits to a professional gamers??

That being said NASL is just greedy trying to make money off pro-gamers as jesters performing for them.
obsKura
Profile Joined March 2011
Ireland1061 Posts
August 12 2011 06:32 GMT
#1828
On August 12 2011 15:13 Kush74 wrote:
NASL you should seriously take this post off. This is very misleading

First of all, Korean players havent gotten their deposit back from the first season yet!!

and NASL doubled their deposit.... Korean players feel that NASL used them to just make more

money. As a "Professional gamer" they feel like they are being disrespected by NASL since NO

OTHER TOURNAMENT ASK FOR DEPOSITS (and they still HAVENT GOTTEN THE MONEY BACK!!)

ON TOP OF THAT NASL STILL HASNT PAID THE PLAYERS THEIR PRIZE MONEY.... which is A FUCKING JOKE


If that's the truth then I can understand their reasons for not participating.
C9 ~^v^~ In EE-sama we trust. ~^v^~ C9
vertical101
Profile Joined April 2011
Hong Kong311 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-12 06:34:08
August 12 2011 06:33 GMT
#1829
On August 12 2011 15:26 Volvograd12 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 15:22 vertical101 wrote:
NASL say: top 4 koreans here take our money.
koreans : we dont want your prize money, we want travel stipend!!
seriously??????????

i think SC2con are scheming something, i think they are setting a example for the other tournaments.this is bad for small tournaments or future new tournaments. this need to stop
funny they didnt include MLG with their crappy prize pool. GSL+MLG partnership lol?
is GSL and MLG is part of this bullshit i hope not. glad that slayers is not part of this shit.
its like what Kespa did to GOM in BW, SC2CON(or kespa 2.0) is gonna kill NASL.
its like their trying to sell talents


http://www.thisisgame.com/board/view.php?id=736266&board=&category=13439&subcategory=2&page=1&best=&searchmode=&search=&orderby=&token=

Read this. Use google translate if its in Korean.

Puma still hasn't been paid the 50k Grand Prize that the NASL promised.

2k isn't nearly enough to cover back to back flights from Korea to San Diego.

The deposits that the Koreans made hasn't even been returned yet.

Sounds like American Banksters to me.

GSL winner also wait for 3+months to get their money. its not like their not gonna give the money
Volvograd12
Profile Joined August 2011
Russian Federation19 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-12 06:33:55
August 12 2011 06:33 GMT
#1830
On August 12 2011 15:28 SovereignT wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 08:12 StayFrosty wrote:
fuck em

User was warned for this post

Warn or not, this person hit it on the head. If they're going to be so ridiculous in their demands, fuck em.

Really pathetic that they won't make an effort to get out and spread the game to other areas outside of Korea. NASL went far above and beyond what should have been necessary in being accommodating, as well as being perhaps overly generous in their offers. Sounds to me like the koreans don't deserve the prize money anyway.

Obviously starcraft won't up and die tomorrow because of this. But I must say, such a lack of effort to support the game in other areas is going to seriously hurt this game's chances of continuing its growth, or perhaps of even maintaining its current popularity. I'm sure it's difficult to travel, but them's the breaks when you play an e-sport like SC.

Gonna repeat a previous opinion: $2500 minimum for each korean player is stupidly generous. Screw em.

(On a side note, I use the term "koreans" in an overly generalized manner. I'm sure there were some koreans who disagreed with this decision, but since the article seems to refer to korea as a whole, I did the same to save time. Just a disclaimer for those nit-pickers out there.)


So much ignorance, I don't blame you.

Puma still hasn't been paid his 50k grand prize.

The Koreans who gave deposits to the NASL still haven't been reimbursed.

Overall, all the Korean teams, primarily OGS and Star Tale are fed up with the NASL lack of business ethics.

http://www.thisisgame.com/board/view.php?id=736266&board=&category=13439&subcategory=2&page=1&best=&searchmode=&search=&orderby=&token=

Use google translate, if you can't read Hangul.
Suck my Russian blank.
Fission
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada1184 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-12 06:35:07
August 12 2011 06:33 GMT
#1831
If its true that NASL has not paid back deposits or prize money and that they are misrepresenting the stipend amount by wrapping it up with the minimum prize money, then I think this post should be Mod Edited to reflect the truth.
Defacer
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada5052 Posts
August 12 2011 06:33 GMT
#1832
On August 12 2011 15:16 Volvograd12 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 15:13 Kush74 wrote:
NASL you should seriously take this post off. This is very misleading

First of all, Korean players havent gotten their deposit back from the first season yet!!

and NASL doubled their deposit.... Korean players feel that NASL used them to just make more

money. As a "Professional gamer" they feel like they are being disrespected by NASL since NO

OTHER TOURNAMENT ASK FOR DEPOSITS (and they still HAVENT GOTTEN THE MONEY BACK!!)

ON TOP OF THAT NASL STILL HASNT PAID THE PLAYERS THEIR PRIZE MONEY.... which is A FUCKING JOKE



This is probably the most constructive post in this entire debacle.
I completely agree with you mate.
NASL are making themselves look innocent.


LOL. Combat ex, is that you?

Troll another tournament, buddy.
tripper688
Profile Joined January 2011
United States569 Posts
August 12 2011 06:34 GMT
#1833
On August 12 2011 15:28 SovereignT wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 08:12 StayFrosty wrote:
fuck em

User was warned for this post

Warn or not, this person hit it on the head. If they're going to be so ridiculous in their demands, fuck em.

Really pathetic that they won't make an effort to get out and spread the game to other areas outside of Korea. I'm aware that a select few korean players go to a tiny handful of other events, but if they don't start getting out of their dark caves soon, my interest, and I assume therefore that possibly some other people's interest, will rapidly decline.

NASL went far above and beyond what should have been necessary in being accommodating, as well as being perhaps overly generous in their offers. Sounds to me like the koreans don't deserve the prize money anyway.

Obviously starcraft won't up and die tomorrow because of this. But I must say, such a lack of effort to support the game in other areas is going to seriously hurt this game's chances of continuing its growth, or perhaps of even maintaining its current popularity. I'm sure it's difficult to travel, but them's the breaks when you play an e-sport like SC.

Gonna repeat a previous opinion: $2500 minimum for each korean player is stupidly generous. Screw em.

(On a side note, I use the term "koreans" in an overly generalized manner. I'm sure there were some koreans who disagreed with this decision, but since the article seems to refer to korea as a whole, I did the same to save time. Just a disclaimer for those nit-pickers out there.)


It's not $2000 minimum. It's a 3 month commitment for free...at a chance for a $1000 minimum and a $1000 travel stipend. 3 months of NASL not doing what it can to make decent accommodations for Korean players and their teams. NASL hasn't gone far and above and beyond anything in my book if they don't have the decency to even make play times somewhat fair for the 3 months leading up to this prize pool.
"Excuse me I gotta do some vacuuming really fast *vrrrrrrmmmmmmmmm*" Day[9]
taLbuk
Profile Joined April 2010
Madagascar1879 Posts
August 12 2011 06:34 GMT
#1834
On August 12 2011 15:20 oldtimessake wrote:
http://www.thisisgame.com/board/view.php?id=736266&board=&category=13439&subcategory=2&page=1&best=&searchmode=&search=&orderby=&token=


read this (use google translator) and u guys will understand a litle bit


According to google translate they are basically saying NASL hasnt payed back deposites or puma's check, also that combined with the lag and the fact that they have to pay for expenses is why the are withdrawing

I find it laughable, how do they think foreigners going to GSL is? they have to spend a month instead of 3 days, sure if they go via the MLG exchange the flight is paid for , but they still have to pay for food.
Lann555
Profile Joined February 2010
Netherlands5173 Posts
August 12 2011 06:35 GMT
#1835
I dunno. There is probably more to the story then what we know.It seems strange for Koreans to decline if there is no downside to it. I expect we will be hearing more about this

Also, the main story doesn't mention IM/Slayers.Wouldn't mind Mr. Tea coming in to clean up things
Fantasy Fan! Gogogo vultures
Volvograd12
Profile Joined August 2011
Russian Federation19 Posts
August 12 2011 06:35 GMT
#1836
On August 12 2011 15:33 vertical101 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 15:26 Volvograd12 wrote:
On August 12 2011 15:22 vertical101 wrote:
NASL say: top 4 koreans here take our money.
koreans : we dont want your prize money, we want travel stipend!!
seriously??????????

i think SC2con are scheming something, i think they are setting a example for the other tournaments.this is bad for small tournaments or future new tournaments. this need to stop
funny they didnt include MLG with their crappy prize pool. GSL+MLG partnership lol?
is GSL and MLG is part of this bullshit i hope not. glad that slayers is not part of this shit.
its like what Kespa did to GOM in BW, SC2CON(or kespa 2.0) is gonna kill NASL.
its like their trying to sell talents


http://www.thisisgame.com/board/view.php?id=736266&board=&category=13439&subcategory=2&page=1&best=&searchmode=&search=&orderby=&token=

Read this. Use google translate if its in Korean.

Puma still hasn't been paid the 50k Grand Prize that the NASL promised.

2k isn't nearly enough to cover back to back flights from Korea to San Diego.

The deposits that the Koreans made hasn't even been returned yet.

Sounds like American Banksters to me.

GSL winner also wait for 3+months to get their money. its not like their not gonna give the money


You are comparing the GSL to NASL?

LAUGH.

GSL is actually reputable, and if you followed Ming Chul's twitter he has already spent a great deal of his hard earned cash.

NASL is very nefarious in its dealings.
Suck my Russian blank.
windsupernova
Profile Joined October 2010
Mexico5280 Posts
August 12 2011 06:35 GMT
#1837
On August 12 2011 15:33 vertical101 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2011 15:26 Volvograd12 wrote:
On August 12 2011 15:22 vertical101 wrote:
NASL say: top 4 koreans here take our money.
koreans : we dont want your prize money, we want travel stipend!!
seriously??????????

i think SC2con are scheming something, i think they are setting a example for the other tournaments.this is bad for small tournaments or future new tournaments. this need to stop
funny they didnt include MLG with their crappy prize pool. GSL+MLG partnership lol?
is GSL and MLG is part of this bullshit i hope not. glad that slayers is not part of this shit.
its like what Kespa did to GOM in BW, SC2CON(or kespa 2.0) is gonna kill NASL.
its like their trying to sell talents


http://www.thisisgame.com/board/view.php?id=736266&board=&category=13439&subcategory=2&page=1&best=&searchmode=&search=&orderby=&token=

Read this. Use google translate if its in Korean.

Puma still hasn't been paid the 50k Grand Prize that the NASL promised.

2k isn't nearly enough to cover back to back flights from Korea to San Diego.

The deposits that the Koreans made hasn't even been returned yet.

Sounds like American Banksters to me.

GSL winner also wait for 3+months to get their money


Well, I don't know if what that guy posted is true or fully understood by me and google translate.

But to be fair regarding GSL, GSL is backed up by a lot of well known corporations while... a lot of the stuff behind the NASL is still not quite clear. I can see why someone might be more reserved regarding NASL
"Its easy, just trust your CPU".-Boxer on being good at games
gehgrfhgrh
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany294 Posts
August 12 2011 06:35 GMT
#1838
Korean players feel that NASL used them to just make more money.


We all know, that NASL hadn't had all the money before the finals. They had like NO SPONSORS when the season started. They were so stupid to believe that the hype would get them all the money, after the horrible failiure they tried to hype up the Finals with a OpenBracket etc and some Koreans but at the End they still don't had the money. No Money + Bad Production = It only get's worse.

Even the NASL Finals are dead now. Sorry, I don't want to watch bad Foreigners get owned by B-Team Koreans who where to bad for a paid spot at a Korean Team, that they joined a Foreign Team. Its the fault of NASL, they wanted to have a big hype beacuse of the 50k #1st Prize but had no money for Flightcosts/Banners/Tech left.

Too bad that NASL was organized so bad. If NASL took more time to find sponsors and don't rushed it, they wouldn't have had all the ridiculous sound/stream-problems and maybe they decided for a better league-format what would have helped the League.

There goes 80% of NASL's viewers.


The whole 1000? :o
♥ MVP_Keen ♥ oGs.MC ♥ LiquidTLO ♥ mouzThorZain ♥
BackSideAttack
Profile Joined December 2010
1103 Posts
August 12 2011 06:35 GMT
#1839
On August 12 2011 15:11 MrBitter wrote:
This isn't the worst news in the world.

NASL season 2 will be a true representation of its namesake: A North American, foreigner only tournament.

In all honesty, this excites me a little. It should motivate foreign players to work a little harder (because winning is more attainable) and it will serve as a chance to showcase some of the top foreigner talent that we don't know as much about.

Obviously very sad that we'll have no Koreans, and will lose some quality, but its not all bad news.


This is very wrong and here's why. NASL stands for North American Star League. There's is no correlation between its name and the idea that the tournament is meant for foreigners only. Foreigners, when used in the context of Starcraft, implies everyone not Korean. Thus, such a term includes Europeans and Taiwanese players. The only player limitation you can deduce SOLELY based on its name is that ONLY NORTH AMERICAN players could play.
karpo
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1998 Posts
August 12 2011 06:36 GMT
#1840
The only thing i can understand is that flight travel back and home again in economy class is a real pain in the ass, especially when you only stay in the states for 2-3 days.

But it sucks. If they at least make their money back from winnings it's a good deal cause they get loads of foreign press and might even get some sponsors interested that way, isn't it?
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