EPT
Korean teams withdraw from NASL - Page 146
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XiGua
Sweden3085 Posts
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purecarnagge
719 Posts
On August 13 2011 01:52 tripper688 wrote: .... So the entire thread comes down to 1. I want Koreans in my tourney 2. I can't pay them what they want 3. I start filming them anyway without contract 4. They leave and I'm screwed...time to play the blame game Please tell me how my post is in any way worse or less true than yours. 1. cool 2. problem 3. stupid move 4. not really... Korean's are missing out on prize money. Overall the NASL lacks production value that GOM or other organizations deliver. They still have some koreans attending. | ||
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NotSupporting
Sweden1998 Posts
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nodicaL
Canada6 Posts
Being very new to the StarCraft community, I don't know if this is the how the Korean StarCraft scene works. Just reading and watching a little bit into StarCraft, I know that the Koreans are very good at this game. However, this kind of behaviour seems unprofessional, because of that fact that they did not give adaquet time for NASL to really resolve the conflict. ***EDIT*** Reading through some more, it does seem to be very biased report infavor of NASL. That is to be assumed, since it is they who made the announcement. | ||
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Jinivus
747 Posts
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Azzur
Australia6255 Posts
On August 13 2011 01:52 tripper688 wrote: .... So the entire thread comes down to 1. I want Koreans in my tourney 2. I can't pay them what they want 3. I start filming them anyway without contract 4. They leave and I'm screwed...time to play the blame game Please tell me how my post is in any way worse or less true than yours. I highlighted what I consider the important point. Was the season 2 contract signed? If not, the whole thing is NASL's fault. If things were signed, the korean teams acted unethically. | ||
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purecarnagge
719 Posts
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VillageBC
322 Posts
On August 13 2011 02:29 tripper688 wrote: I may have misunderstood the intent of the post was to claim $1 = 1200 won omg so gud. If that is the case, my apologies. The point isn't that there isn't potential to make money for Koreans. It's that the overall potential for the players involved isn't as high as some are making it out to be with all the issues mentioned concerning play times, latency, more Koreans, etc. which makes it not worth it for them to disrupt 3 months of training and scheduling for other tournaments. It's not just about the finals, it's about the cost of time/commitment/energy for getting there which is higher than for foreigners through no real fault of their own. Hells no, that would be a stupid claim. =) Just trying to figure out how they could lose money in the deal that was offered. I understand it happening if NASL offered the $500usd travel stipend, it cost them equivalent of $2kusd in won for travel, hotel, food and then they were knocked out before recovering the money in prize winnings. That doesn't appear to be the case here though. It might not be worth the time and effort overall, especially when it's 16(?) other Koreans you're going up against as your chance of being knocked out 1st round is much higher then when it was only a small handful of Koreans in the league. | ||
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Maenander
Germany4926 Posts
On August 13 2011 02:29 faruq wrote: Wake up call to NASL I guess. Change the Ro16 format, that way there is actual incentive for players to compete, more than dangling money/free tickets and housing. Look at it from the Koreans side, why would they join in on a half-prepared, almost unprofessionally run (based on season one) tournament when all the glory is in GSL, according to their own terms. NASL needs them more than they need it. They are simply making a logical decision How is it a logical decision when they will be missing out on a lot of prize money due to it? There is no doubt they would make a lot of profit overall. | ||
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tripper688
United States569 Posts
On August 13 2011 02:27 ShadowWolf wrote: Honestly, I think this needs to be echoed more and more. The NASL post sounds more awful than it actually is because the NASL brass has a really awful history of aggressive postings. It is aggressive, but if you read the EG posts it's not like they're a cup of tea as well. I think it's OK for a company to say "We're really unhappy with the way things went down." and it doesn't need to turn in to us telling them they need to use more corporate speak and add some soft, cute bunny pictures to their posts. At the same time, it is expected that a venue pays out to bring in teams; that's kinda the way such things work in things like NCAA and Auto Racing. I think that's fine, but the teams shouldn't be expecting that they walk out with $0 net expense. Last time I'd heard numbers, the venue payout for the Mid-Ohio Raceway is barely enough for any team to get there; however, the sponsorship dollars and winnings cover the rest without a big problem. Otherwise, you end up in a situation that's completely unfair and is basically holding the venue ransom. The things a team should be putting together are their own expense sheets and making it more clear to venues what it is they need to get their players around. If your sponsors suck for foreign tournaments then how much of that is really the foreign tournament's fault? Several companies seem to be tripping over themselves to sponsor Korean players! Contract out with the other teams, too, like you've seen with the teams doing lately! [ed: just in case it wasn't clear: i agree with you on this one, just pointing out that other sports actually do have venues pay. But that doesn't mean teams can take advantage of that.] Finally, I expect there's more to this than meets the eye. I have a feeling the big sticking point for the Korean folk was more the awful schedule, the absolutely beyond miserable way the finals play out, and the $500 security deposit. I understand that many foreigner players were awful about meeting commitments, but it seems more fair that NASL implements a better policy with regard to their deposit that's fair for all sides. This feels like a situation where, after living in an apartment for a year, the rental company says "Hey, we love having you and we're happy to keep you around, but we need another $250 for your security deposit and we decided that instead of raising your rent we'd just charge you another $175 admin fee. That's cool, right?" It's not exactly illegal or even improper business practice for a group to have unrealistic expectations going into bargaining and taking a hard line. At least it's not any worse than having your players treated like crap in the actual tournament and the sudden doubling of security deposit. All of this just sounds like failed negotiations. One side has unreasonable demands probably in part from the maltreatment the previous season. The other side cannot reasonably afford those demands. One side finally says enough is enough and leaves. It's not NASL's fault for not giving in. It's not their fault for not being able to afford to give in. It's not wrong for the Koreans to say either this gets done or we don't play. It's not their fault either how rough the previous season was for them or whether or not NASL can follow their demands. | ||
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tripper688
United States569 Posts
On August 13 2011 02:37 purecarnagge wrote: I'm wondering if this has anything to do with EG's involvement in upstarting the NASL, and then poaching a certain korean NASL finalist. Regardless, the issue seems to be the same here as it was there. No contract in place = Potential douchebaggery will probably go unpunished. Until anyone has proof that the Koreans had a binding contract to play in NASL regardless of their terms, you can't actually fault them for doing anything wrong. And as much as it sucks for NASL, they're the ones that have to pick up the pieces because they didn't have the contracts in place. On August 13 2011 02:38 VillageBC wrote: Hells no, that would be a stupid claim. =) Just trying to figure out how they could lose money in the deal that was offered. I understand it happening if NASL offered the $500usd travel stipend, it cost them equivalent of $2kusd in won for travel, hotel, food and then they were knocked out before recovering the money in prize winnings. That doesn't appear to be the case here though. It might not be worth the time and effort overall, especially when it's 16(?) other Koreans you're going up against as your chance of being knocked out 1st round is much higher then when it was only a small handful of Koreans in the league. Yea my apologies. And yes, the last point would probably be the final nail in the coffin for reasons why it's not feasible for KR to continue doing NASL in it's current form. Shitty and disruptive scheduling for 3 months at a chance to break even against 16 other Koreans is not quite the same as if you knew you had a good chance of making good money in the R/O16. | ||
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Shadowcloak
Netherlands194 Posts
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BigLighthouse
United Kingdom424 Posts
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VillageBC
322 Posts
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integrity
United States1014 Posts
On August 13 2011 02:37 Azzur wrote: I highlighted what I consider the important point. Was the season 2 contract signed? If not, the whole thing is NASL's fault. If things were signed, the korean teams acted unethically. pretty sure it was stated earlier that players sign contracts for season2 | ||
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Ksni
United States11 Posts
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VillageBC
322 Posts
On August 13 2011 02:55 Ksni wrote: Guess ill watch the north americans win there own league, finally makes me happy Nah, not every Korean is out. Just the SC2Con member teams so far.  | ||
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NriPes
Portugal2 Posts
Does NASL make the same offer to EU players? I know that korean players are good and that it is allways a pleasure to see them playing, BUT come on! What do you want more? A limo!? Particular air plain? I dont want to diserspect Koren players by any means, but the comitte guys need to learn to be more humble and start letting SC2 grow every where, not keeping it in Korea. | ||
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MorNin
United States443 Posts
On August 13 2011 02:53 VillageBC wrote: I keep reading in this thread how awful Koreans were treated at NASL finals. Is there some proof of this? Seems the rest of the competitors had no issues, and enjoyed it. Not saying it wasn't rough around the edges as a production goes. But really, they were somehow mistreated? They had to actually pay some money in order to have a chance at the 50k. Now most if not all their expenses are covered and still want more...They expect westerners to bend over... | ||
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PumaPete
United States3 Posts
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