EPTWell according to the thread in which blizzard gave the numbers for each matchup, they are taking there stats from MASTER LEAGUE. If this is the highest levels of play from your PoV, then I think you're right in your world, but in my world I really don't think that an average master league player has the slightest chance to win a Bo7 vs a GSL Code A player, played in the most imba MU in the most imba spots on the most imba map according to blizzards masterleague+ stats.
Season 3 Ladder Map Changes (Official) - Page 46
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
Well according to the thread in which blizzard gave the numbers for each matchup, they are taking there stats from MASTER LEAGUE. If this is the highest levels of play from your PoV, then I think you're right in your world, but in my world I really don't think that an average master league player has the slightest chance to win a Bo7 vs a GSL Code A player, played in the most imba MU in the most imba spots on the most imba map according to blizzards masterleague+ stats. | ||
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BeeNu
615 Posts
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lefix
Germany1082 Posts
On July 27 2011 00:32 Big J wrote: Apologize and go to the Maps Forum... If you can't find 20+ playable maps there, I guess you won't find a single one in the ladder pool. Just take the last Map of the Month (MotM #7): you will find at least 5 great maps in that thread... And you really think Tal'darim has balancing issues just because blizzard uses masterleague stats instead of Tournament stats. Besides the following quote: I am in masterleague and the standard there is pretty bad. Terrans can all-in and spread marines, Protoss can Forcefield and cheese and Zergs can ecocheese and scout. That's it for 95% of the games. + Show Spoiler + On July 26 2011 15:56 Djagulingu wrote: Well, we can use a veto on that, I guess. Speaking of vetoes, are the other maps good so that we don't have to use 5 vetoes? Let's see Tal'darim's TLPD stats: Tal'darim Altar: Korean: TvZ: 8-3 (72%) ZvP: 5-4 (55.6%) International: TvZ: 49-64 (43.4%) ZvP: 46-49 (48.4%) Tal'darim Altar LE: Korean: TvZ: 17-18 (48.6%) ZvP: 9-14 (39.1%) International: TvZ: 88-103 (46.1%) ZvP: 66-75 (46.8%) Again, what were you saying about Tal'darim? this. seriously, check out Map of the Month if you think there aren't any good community maps. the finals are to be casted later today by mrbitter, btw. and this is just the maps from this month. dozens of maps are made each month, which could easily replace some ladder maps. they might not all be perfect, but neither are blizzards maps! | ||
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mechavoc
United States664 Posts
Lots of dropping options double center golds with the towers. Smoke in the back of the base. I'm going to miss it | ||
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BronzeKnee
United States5212 Posts
I hope one of the new maps shares the same tileset, I am really fan of the urban environment. | ||
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IRaider
United States13 Posts
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Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
On July 27 2011 01:06 Big J wrote: Well according to the thread in which blizzard gave the numbers for each matchup, they are taking there stats from MASTER LEAGUE. If this is the highest levels of play from your PoV, then I think you're right in your world, but in my world I really don't think that an average master league player has the slightest chance to win a Bo7 vs a GSL Code A player, played in the most imba MU in the most imba spots on the most imba map according to blizzards masterleague+ stats. If Blizzard takes only tournament games and GM games then there isn't enough data, which goes back to the aforementioned quotes. | ||
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dukethegold
Canada5645 Posts
Glad they removed scrap station, that map is too twisted for my taste. | ||
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SuPerFlyTNT
United States145 Posts
On July 26 2011 06:16 Zoia wrote: 2v2 Removed: Monlyth Ridge (4) Gutterhulk (4) Omega Sector (4) Red Stone Gulch (4) Carried over: Discord IV (4) High Orbit (4) Khaydarin Depths (4) Scorched Haven (4) The Ruins of Tarsonis (4) Tempest (8) New: Tyrador Keep (8) The Boneyard (8) What is Omega Sector? I don't have that map in my pool.... never did? EDIT: I just looked it up in the Create a Game section. Now I do remember playing it on ladder, but it has been off of the map pool for a while. I'm looking on EU, which still is in season 2, and its not in the map pool. They did this before where they said they were removing a map that had been gone for months at the last season switch. | ||
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Bluerain
United States348 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On July 27 2011 01:14 Gamegene wrote: If Blizzard takes only tournament games and GM games then there isn't enough data, which goes back to the aforementioned quotes. then they don't have enough data. | ||
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Special Endrey
Germany1929 Posts
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Toadvine
Poland2234 Posts
That's what they say, but they fail to clarify what they mean exactly. Even if you had a ladder environment, where really good players consistently play serious games, it'd still be a bunch of Bo1s, which isn't indicative of tournament play. Besides, for all we know, they might as well be including Master league in their "highest levels of play", which is a total joke skill-wise. Tournaments stats are the only thing we have close to an objective measure on how SC2 plays out "at the highest level", and it definitely doesn't point to any kind of imbalance in Metalopolis 1.1. I wouldn't be surprised if tournaments keep using it despite Blizzard's claims. Also, the standard deviation of 296 coin flips is around 3%, not 6%. 6% is the margin of error for a 95% confidence level, and is roughly equal to two standard deviations. So, in essence, there's a 68% chance that the true value is within 3% of the measured one, and a 95% chance that it's within 6%. This isn't too bad imo. Especially combined with gameplay analysis, which doesn't find anything particularly egregious about Metalopolis without close spawns. | ||
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RandyScrandy
15 Posts
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Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
On July 27 2011 01:20 Big J wrote: then they don't have enough data. So is Blizzard supposed to wait patiently for the next 10 years, trying to get enough games in to satisfy their needs in order to make a patch or map change? Yes, I understand your concern that "Blizzard is just catering to the noobs" or "Blizzard doesn't care about the community map choices" or even that this asshole on TL is attacking the fucking greatest map ever that is Tal'Darim, but at the very least Blizzard devs are also watching the GSL, NASL, DH all those tournaments, but they have to move slowly and deliberately because it affects the entire system and listening to professional input. And the point I'm trying to get at is that there's no point in assuming that Blizzard is doing everything completely wrong; we have to take the arguments against Blizzard's policy towards multiplayer to the at least half the level Blizzard is experimenting at to even have a good argument. | ||
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n.DieJokes
United States3443 Posts
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n.DieJokes
United States3443 Posts
On July 27 2011 01:14 Gamegene wrote: If Blizzard takes only tournament games and GM games then there isn't enough data, which goes back to the aforementioned quotes. Not there's almost certainly enough data. 200 GM players per four servers all playing 100+ games is a very good sample size. Split by map and match-up they should still have more than enough games to gauge balance | ||
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Heavenly
2172 Posts
On July 27 2011 00:14 therealmcgee wrote: cool take out probably the most balanced map youve made blizzard, good idea... Lmao yeah, the most balanced map, with a 60%+ winrate despite close positions. And close positions was a joke if you were a protoss facing roach/ling allin. | ||
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Arcanefrost
Belgium1257 Posts
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ronpaul012
United States769 Posts
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