EPTIf you exclude what is at the moment the top players from this and separate the leagues then it's gonna stay with GSL as major league sc2 and NASL & rest random minor leagues. Especially if out of the few koreans that come some will win NASL while being Code A/low Code S.
NASL: Koreans? Top Koreans? - Page 65
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
dakalro
Romania525 Posts
If you exclude what is at the moment the top players from this and separate the leagues then it's gonna stay with GSL as major league sc2 and NASL & rest random minor leagues. Especially if out of the few koreans that come some will win NASL while being Code A/low Code S. | ||
|
JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
On March 17 2011 00:43 hifriend wrote: Pro teams might be financed primarily by sponsorships but a team that doesn't win things obviously isn't going to be sustainable.. No player, team manager or sponsor would want to put time money and effort into a team that isn't going to win tournaments. I think you don't have to win tournaments to attract good sponsors in the west. Even if the Koreans will be dominating the League, if you show that you are one of the few "local" teams that stand a chance against them and hence create a special tension in matches between your teammembers and the dominating Koreans, that should be enough. That is of course only if the Koreans are dominating in the long run. | ||
|
pAzand
Sweden539 Posts
| ||
|
garlicface
Canada4196 Posts
On March 17 2011 00:07 Rob28 wrote: The league is located on the internet. LAN tournies and such will be isolated to NA, sure, but the league itself is accessable from anywhere an internet connection can be established. And generally any organization that includes a place in it's name has membership confined to that place. Find me an example of one where the majority of members are from outside the location that the name specifically refers to (as it would be were NASL to have unrestricted access by Korean gamers), and I'll retract my statement. Get over it. It's founded by North Americans, and the finals are played in North America. Your nit picking is borderline trolling. | ||
|
flodeskum
Iceland1267 Posts
I always thought that was the main reason for limiting korean participation. | ||
|
Pokebunny
United States10654 Posts
On March 17 2011 00:24 papaz wrote: What kind of storyline do you expect that Painuser (no offense to you Painuser, i watch your stream all the time and fan of it  ) to have that will make you wanna watch or pay for watching NASL?Are you interested in hearing player storyline in the perspective of gaming or in the perspective of reality show where you see the players house like in MTV cribs, you get to see what clothes he weares and his favourite hamburger? Because if the storyline and background of the player in the perspective of gaming how about the background of golden mouse winner July's storyline? I bet there is a lot more to tell about his background than for example Pokebunny's. Why are people using me as an example of someone who'd be in the league if there weren't Koreans? I don't think I would be. The person who mentioned people like Sheth/Darkforce was on the right track. | ||
|
JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
Not sure how tightly packed the games in the NASL will be, but I think a player has to play more games in the same amount of time in the GSL compared to the NASL. If you consider that, and the fact that the GSL is so much superior in the "total prize money over time" ratio ($170 000 for a single season) you cannot really blame the Koreans for demanding players to move to Korea, in particular if they also have free housing and high seeds for non-Korean players. | ||
|
simme123
Sweden810 Posts
| ||
|
infinity2k9
United Kingdom2397 Posts
On March 16 2011 22:21 Velr wrote: No english = no drama = no fun. About 5 are fine tho. I have to question why are people like you even watching Starcraft? What 'drama' is there even in the foreigner tournaments exactly? OH MAN IDRA REALLY WHINED ABOUT BALANCE AFTER THAT GAME, EPIC On March 17 2011 00:43 hifriend wrote: Pro teams might be financed primarily by sponsorships but a team that doesn't win things obviously isn't going to be sustainable.. No player, team manager or sponsor would want to put time money and effort into a team that isn't going to win tournaments. I'm afraid some people have to not win. If what you are saying is true then the entire scene is completely unsustainable. However its probably not true, not every BW team won proleague and only a small minority have ever won a Starleague. | ||
|
papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
On March 17 2011 01:03 Pokebunny wrote: Why are people using me as an example of someone who'd be in the league if there weren't Koreans? I don't think I would be. The person who mentioned people like Sheth/Darkforce was on the right track. Hehe, sorry about that. I wasn't bashing on you personally. I picked a random name after I "bashed" on Painuser and your name popped up my head. I was just merely trying to make an example were I was showing that the gaming background of top korean players are a lot more interesting if we are talking about a storyline from gaming perspective. If the storyline is however in terms of "MTV Cribs" then it's a whole different case. | ||
|
Pokebunny
United States10654 Posts
Tyler: I'm mostly interested in the games not involving Koreans. Matches like Ret vs Naniwa, Jinro vs Morrow, and Huk vs Hasuobs, are all matches that could easily be the semifinals or finals of a major tournament. I'm of course cheering for my teammates and think they will win all their matches. I'm also looking forward to some really refined strategies and plans since players have a lot of time to prepare for a specific player, matchup and map set. Strelok: And also I think that success of Koreans is pretty bad for TSL, because for example I, as spectator, really prefer to watch very nicely prepared non-Koreans against each rather than watching the usual games of Koreans, many who don't care about this tournament. If I want to watch Koreans play, I'd go to GomTV.net. It's not the same tournament, but it echoes my thoughts. | ||
|
underdawg
United States399 Posts
i saw this dude's stream once. he asked everyone if they had heard of him. no one had.  also not counting jinro as "korean" because he is white is pretty fucked up i also don't think it's possible for players to put on their unbiased "spectator" hat. | ||
|
JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
On March 17 2011 01:11 Pokebunny wrote: Oh, and anyone notice Tyler and Strelok's answers on the TSL interviews? :D Tyler: I'm mostly interested in the games not involving Koreans. Matches like Ret vs Naniwa, Jinro vs Morrow, and Huk vs Hasuobs, are all matches that could easily be the semifinals or finals of a major tournament except the GSL . I'm of course cheering for my teammates and think they will win all their matches. I'm also looking forward to some really refined strategies and plans since players have a lot of time to prepare for a specific player, matchup and map set. Strelok: And also I think that success of Koreans is pretty bad for TSL, because for example I, as spectator, really prefer to watch very nicely prepared non-Koreans against each rather than watching the usual games of Koreans, many who don't care about this tournament. If I want to watch Koreans play, I'd go to GomTV.net. It's not the same tournament, but it echoes my thoughts. fixed. ^^ Well Jinro can be in a GSL finals, there is no doubt about that. And Huk as well, his games were really good: his two base Protoss vs five base zerg, his excellent decisions in his PvP matches (micro not top notch though). Ret maybe not, his ZvZ has always been his achilles tendon. For the others, I don't know. Anyways, it all comes down to personal preference, I guess. According to the poll, the majority seems to prefer to see games with the utmost skill possible, rather than games with history behind it. Though, if we start letting Koreans participate in non-Korean tournaments, maybe they can create a "history" over time? I do hope so. :-) | ||
|
xbankx
703 Posts
On March 17 2011 01:11 Pokebunny wrote: Oh, and anyone notice Tyler and Strelok's answers on the TSL interviews? :D Tyler: I'm mostly interested in the games not involving Koreans. Matches like Ret vs Naniwa, Jinro vs Morrow, and Huk vs Hasuobs, are all matches that could easily be the semifinals or finals of a major tournament. I'm of course cheering for my teammates and think they will win all their matches. I'm also looking forward to some really refined strategies and plans since players have a lot of time to prepare for a specific player, matchup and map set. Strelok: And also I think that success of Koreans is pretty bad for TSL, because for example I, as spectator, really prefer to watch very nicely prepared non-Koreans against each rather than watching the usual games of Koreans, many who don't care about this tournament. If I want to watch Koreans play, I'd go to GomTV.net. It's not the same tournament, but it echoes my thoughts. They are also tourney players who are fighting over the same prize pool. There is going to be a bit bias. | ||
|
Pokebunny
United States10654 Posts
| ||
|
Jnai
United States442 Posts
It's very exciting and I watch it every year. But, while I'm watching, I know that most of those guys will not be NBA players and the game is fundamentally different. I think there is an argument to be made that the NASL should be non-Korean. It depends on the goals of the NASL. If the organizers want to hype drama and the foreign scene, they have every right to limit the participant pool. But, if the organizers want to be able to say, "This is the best Starcraft 2 in the world", then inviting top Korean players is critical. And, personally, as a spectator who has bought every GSL ticket, I think watching the best players play is much more fun than watching some other subset of marginally worse players play. Code S games are more fun than Code A games (yes, even when Tastosis were casting both!) because the players were better. Personally, I like to watch the evolution of the metagame and the strategies and the amazing micro and let the drama fall out of the gameplay. I don't really care what MC says to MVP after or before the match. =) | ||
|
goiflin
Canada1218 Posts
On March 17 2011 01:11 Pokebunny wrote: Oh, and anyone notice Tyler and Strelok's answers on the TSL interviews? :D Tyler: I'm mostly interested in the games not involving Koreans. Matches like Ret vs Naniwa, Jinro vs Morrow, and Huk vs Hasuobs, are all matches that could easily be the semifinals or finals of a major tournament. I'm of course cheering for my teammates and think they will win all their matches. I'm also looking forward to some really refined strategies and plans since players have a lot of time to prepare for a specific player, matchup and map set. Strelok: And also I think that success of Koreans is pretty bad for TSL, because for example I, as spectator, really prefer to watch very nicely prepared non-Koreans against each rather than watching the usual games of Koreans, many who don't care about this tournament. If I want to watch Koreans play, I'd go to GomTV.net. It's not the same tournament, but it echoes my thoughts. Can you blame them for not giving the foreign scene much thought? Our top players routinely lose to their mid-level players. Many of them can't qualify for the GSL, and tournament results from FXOpen and IEM are just further cementing that thought in their minds, that foreigners aren't playing at a korean level. I do hope that all the koreans get eliminated from the NASL early on, so that they'll put more stock in the idea that we're not that far from them. If it ends up being like BW (1st 2nd 3rd taken by koreans), then I really doubt any korean would take the foreign scene seriously again for a while. | ||
|
Louuster
Canada2869 Posts
On March 17 2011 01:11 Pokebunny wrote: Oh, and anyone notice Tyler and Strelok's answers on the TSL interviews? :D Tyler: I'm mostly interested in the games not involving Koreans. Matches like Ret vs Naniwa, Jinro vs Morrow, and Huk vs Hasuobs, are all matches that could easily be the semifinals or finals of a major tournament. I'm of course cheering for my teammates and think they will win all their matches. I'm also looking forward to some really refined strategies and plans since players have a lot of time to prepare for a specific player, matchup and map set. Strelok: And also I think that success of Koreans is pretty bad for TSL, because for example I, as spectator, really prefer to watch very nicely prepared non-Koreans against each rather than watching the usual games of Koreans, many who don't care about this tournament. If I want to watch Koreans play, I'd go to GomTV.net. It's not the same tournament, but it echoes my thoughts. But how do you differentiate between Ret, Jinro and Huk who all lived/still live in korea and received korean training, and the other korean players? There shouldnt be a distinction simply because they are non korean. As starcraft players, they are exactly the same thing as Zenio, TOP or MC. Also note that a guy in team liquid pointed out 3 matches involving people also from team liquid, which is understandable. Im sure you would be more interested in games involving VT players for perfectly understandable reasons. | ||
|
underdawg
United States399 Posts
GSL doesn't have a "care about korea" requirement to play. in fact, it's almost appalling how little korean even people like artosis know considering how long they've been there. does GSL care that the foreign players there don't speak a lick of korean and thus need translators? no. does jinro get special treatment because he named himself after a soju brand? no. it's just another stupid stereotype (koreans have no souls, they are APM and $ machines) when people are really grasping at straws because they don't want to play with the big boys. | ||
|
underdawg
United States399 Posts
On March 17 2011 01:26 Pokebunny wrote: It had nothing to do with whether they want koreans competing against them. Tyler specifically said the other matches were more interesting to him and Strelok said he'd rather not have them as a spectator. goddamn you're a retard User was warned for this post | ||
| ||
